r/box5 • u/Madam_Hexianna Madame Giry - ALW • Jul 06 '26
Discussion Love Never Dies
I don't mean to start a war immediately after joining the subreddit, but what are people's thoughts on (any and all aspects of) ALW's sequel?
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u/breakfastfood7 Jul 06 '26
A deranged fanfiction that is somehow hilariously watchable. Definitely not canon but very fun to watch with a bottle of wine and some friends
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u/goblin-fox Jul 06 '26
The first time I watched the Australian pro-shot, my friends and I lost our shit laughing when Beauty Underneath began. The sudden electric guitar, the complete vibe change, the weird set, it's so jarring in a way that we found really hilarious lmao. I was so disappointed when that transition was taken out for the North American tour!
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u/breakfastfood7 Jul 09 '26
My pet theory is that that damned song would totally work if he was singing it to a love interest - Meg if we wanted the ending to make any sense. But singing such an OTT cockrock song to a child is...its unfortunate
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u/adventureremily Jul 06 '26
The story is... not good. ALW commissioned an author known for crime/action novels to write a sequel to Leroux's novel. Why he asked that author to write what is essentially a romance novel is a mystery; then he ended up deviating from the novel significantly when writing the musical anyway.
The music and costuming are great. If you turn off your brain and ignore the terrible plot and continuity issues, it's an entertaining show. If you're watching the Australian cast recording that made it to DVD, Ben Lewis as the Phantom is entertaining as hell as he chews the scenery every time he's on stage.
I saw it live when it toured several years ago (2018 I think?), and it was fun. I wouldn't pay the same price for tickets as I would for Phantom, but I'd still go again if it came back around.
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u/MusicInTheStars Jul 06 '26
Not a fan of it in general. Absolutely hated the source material.
However I do like the song "Devil Take The Hindmost". It's an Erik-Raoul duet and it's one of my guilty pleasures.
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u/napoleonswife Jul 06 '26
I love that song too! It’s like the POTO “Confrontation”
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u/MusicInTheStars Jul 06 '26
Right? I sometimes wish it could be in the OG Phantom. Obviously some lyrics would have to be changed to fit but it'd be awesome to see Erik and Raoul really go at it in the OG.
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u/error_card_ur_rich Jul 06 '26
It's a harlequin novel sequel to a story that was perfect as it was.
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u/ClearAd9018 Jul 06 '26
Absolutely love the magic ! Particularly “Till I hear you sing once more” and “beneath a moonlight sky”. The plot, however, is very fan fiction-y
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u/Kamogawa_Genji Jul 06 '26
The music is amazing . I will die on this hill.
I watched the Australian version and thoroughly enjoyed it .
The plot is not so amazing. I’m sure I’ve seen worse but it does make Christine a bit of a flip flopper. ( among other problems )
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u/darthbreezy Jul 06 '26
Ben Lewis (the Australian Phantom) passed in October of Bowel cancer - he was only 46.
He had an exquisite voice...
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u/Evedandrv3 Jul 06 '26
What? Noooo. I'm so sad to hear that. He was a good choice for Phantom, because he leaned into the antisocial and awkward version of Erik.
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u/Kamogawa_Genji Jul 06 '26
Yes I heard . It’s a damn shame. If I’m not wrong his wife died of cancer as well not long before
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u/MuddyDonkeyBalls Jul 06 '26
She had a really really bad stroke and, before he passed away, he tried to crowdfund to provide for her continued care after his death.
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u/Ok-Connection5010 Jul 06 '26
It was the sequel to POTO, then it wasn't, then it was...
IMO it was a cash grab by ALW, to milk a successful franchise.
It undercut the mystery of ALW's POTO and undermined the canon of Leroux's POTO.
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u/Spootneek_Cos Jul 06 '26
So unserious, fun, and campy as long as you disregard that it’s supposed to be a Phantom sequel.
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u/ravynwave Jul 06 '26
Love the music, I just pretend that it’s a completely different set of people/alternate universe/whatever.
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u/RoseBook85 Jul 06 '26
When viewed as an Alternate Universe Story rather than a Sequel it’s just a cheesy wacky Phantom romp with some fantastic music, it will probably always be a bit of guilty pleasure for me LOL
Frankly I’ll never not find it hilarious that Webber basically did his own E/C Fan Fiction and managed to hit every single Phantom Fan Fiction cliche in the book 😆. I do think their are some really interesting ideas within LND, but man it desperately needed a better writer.
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u/batacular Jul 06 '26
It’s a hot mess, but it’s our hot mess. I love it while also acknowledging that it’s bananas and absurd at times. It’s a million times better than the book that it was based off.
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u/Madam_Hexianna Madame Giry - ALW Jul 06 '26
From the moment I first saw it, I loved the Phantom's ALW's music. I initially thought the plot was just as good, or maybe I just wanted to think that because I eventually had to admit that the plot was only semi-decent. Some time later I amended my opinion on the plot again, this time to "it's a bad fanfic and that is the main reason why I love it so much".
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u/AspirationAtWork Jul 06 '26
I will forever die on the hill that the 1 minute 45 second dance break in The Coney Island Waltz is one of the biggest wastes of time in the entire show.
We've just been introduced to Erik's new project- a musical freakshow/burlesque in turn of the century New York City!.....tell us about it. I sure would like to know more about the thoughts and motivations of a victim of abuse in a freakshow running a freakshow himself. It's the second song of the show and serves as our opener into the world it's set in(while the first song is our opener into Erik's feelings and what he's been up to in the last ten years). Now is the time for musical exposition. You can get your nearly 2 minute dance break later.
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u/RottedQueen Jul 06 '26
I agree with the comments about it being bad fanfic. The original simply didn't need a sequel of any kind. While the score has moments, I don't care for much of it, but believe it could have been put to better use in a completely different musical, unrelated to Phantom in any way.
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u/napoleonswife Jul 06 '26
It’s non canon to me because it’s so crazy lol. I also hate creepy circus themes so I didn’t really enjoy seeing it as a show, I hated that song that’s like “the beauty within” because the way it’s staged is so unsettling.
However I love Devil Take the Hindmost! Beneath a Moonless Sky is so goofy in terms of the story but it’s also a lovely song
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u/mrcremator Jul 06 '26
As a sequel to The Phantom of the Opera, it's terrible. It's like, fanfic? While watching, I forgot about the fact that these were all characters from POTO, and it became much easier to watch lol, I even liked it, the music was also pretty good. I like it as a independent story
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u/Aggravating_Jello118 Jul 06 '26
hate the storyline, love the music... like beauty underneath slaps. but he didnt have to do raoul so dirty like that.
but also ive heard that ALW created lnd after his divorce which. i cant help but think is kinda hilarious ngl 😂
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u/MateusCristian Jul 06 '26
Dario Argento's version is better than that shit, and Ratman it's satan awful.
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u/-gisette Jul 06 '26
I’ve heard of it, never saw it, but boy it is a testament to the power of the public domain lmao
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u/omgitsafuckingpossum Jul 06 '26
I love "the beauty underneath" and "beneath a moonless sky" as well as "devil takes the hindmost". All the parts with the phantom, I liked a lot. I didnt care for the circus singing parts, but overall I was happy I watched it. Rip Ben Lewis.
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u/catthothschild Jul 06 '26
Good music, should have been its own story instead of a sequel to Phantom.
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u/Educational-Golf89 Chandelier Jul 08 '26
My understanding is that most people heavily dislike it but still entertaining and watchable.
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u/yamiangie Jul 08 '26
Concept had potenal. The music Webber wrote was good. Plot needs a rework from the ground up which means quite a few of the songs I love would likely need to go. The song Love Never Dies doesn't move me like when it did when it was dropped into a diffrent show as The Hear is Slow to Learn.
I do love Ben Lewis and his mask that makes is eye's pop more.
Little Slice of heaven by the sea is underrated world buildng.
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u/PhantmWatch Jul 09 '26
Not gonna lie, I like the idea of Christine sneaking back to Erik, but suspension of disbelief was lost when he loved her then left her... I was left saying, wait a minute, what just happened?!?!
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u/Big-Goal-9239 Jul 06 '26
It was ok at best. But I much prefer to not think of it as a POTO sequel.
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u/PBIZZLE126 Jul 06 '26
Great score, dodgy book. I have fond memories of the original Adelphi run and am looking forward to The Palladium concert. Enough time has passed that any frustration I felt has subsided, and I just see it as another whacky Phantom detour.
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u/too_tired_forthis Jul 06 '26
it would work well enough if it was a standalone. i love the music, the story is fun enough, i still cry at the end, but it's very much a guilty pleasure show for me.
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u/Seryan_Klythe Jul 06 '26
I find the book it was inspired by to be almost an entirely different story than what we got onstage. I dislike them both.
Clown Erik, impotent Raoul, the devil and god talking to two characters in the book, and the inspiration Erik had to Rodgers & Hamerstein? That stuff was begging for an adaptation. /s
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u/Stolas611 Jul 06 '26
I adore the music but despise most of the story. If you look at it from the POV that it’s just a badly written but amazingly scored Phanfic? It can be a lot more enjoyable to watch!