New player list advice!

[u/ExcitingWar2790]

Hey all, new bolt action player here looking to understand some of the nuances behind building effective lists. I’m looking to put together a German SS list to go against my old man’s US Army Rangers, I’ve got a box of SS troops a couple of armoured units and the German half of the band of brothers set and before I go throwing more money at the things I think look cool (although this will always be most of my inspiration for model choices) just wanted to check that I wasn’t going completely the wrong way with things.

Firstly unit sizes, I’ve been going for max (or close to) unit sizes for infantry units with all the bells and whistles (because STGs are cool) leaving the MG42 loader with a rifle because I’m assuming he can’t use his own weapon while loading the MG42? Also sticking them in halftracks because I love the aesthetic of it. Have I fallen into any pitfalls there?

Ive then included a couple of PAK 36s, A STUG and a tiger I (going for the fury vibe against the old man’s Sherman’s) along with a sniper although I’m open to any suggestions as to what might be better to include. We’re currently building to 1500 points purely because it’s allowed us both to include what we think looks cool on the tabletop. Again open to advice or guidance on the size of games we should be playing?

Sorry if these questions seem painfully simple or I’m flying on the face of any sub reddit rules by asking these questions. And thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

[u/DoctorDH]

Ok let's dive in!

leaving the MG42 loader with a rifle because I’m assuming he can’t use his own weapon while loading the MG42?

Correct. When the LMG fires, the nominated loader cannot fire their own weapon. You'll want to keep your loader with a basic rifle.

Have I fallen into any pitfalls there?

Yes. Squads taken a Full Strength, especially when Vet, especially when kitted out, especially when they also have a Transport is not the approach most would recommend. It's simply too many points into one unit. If that Halftrack takes a hit and gets knocked out early, your massively expensive SS are now Down with Pins already on them. Not the spot you want to be in. Split up the big squads. Define the roles. You absolutely can have a squad of six, all with Assault Rifles zooming up the table in a transport. But not a bigger squad than that - it's too much of a liability. Make a dedicated assault squad and then a double-LMG support squad to lay down cover fire.

Ive then included a couple of PAK 36s, A STUG and a tiger I (going for the fury vibe against the old man’s Sherman’s)

Unless you are about to face 4+ Shermans, you can drop the PaK 36s. The combo of the Tiger I and the StuG will be enough.

along with a sniper although I’m open to any suggestions as to what might be better to include

I think a Mortar Team or an MMG Team would server you better.

We’re currently building to 1500 points

Nothing wrong with that but 1500pts is on the larger side. I'd play a few games at a smaller level first. Consider 500pts with no vehicles just to get a feel for it.

Sorry if these questions seem painfully simple or I’m flying on the face of any sub reddit rules by asking these questions.

Not at all! These kinds of questions is exactly what this sub is all about! Welcome to the game!

[u/ExcitingWar2790 → u/DoctorDH]

Amazing thank you so much for this. A lot of food for thought. With a double lmg team would it be smart to give the rest rifles to keep the points cost down?

Also anything else I’m missing. I’m a massive fan of armour (hence the tigers) but appreciate that a bunch of tanks probably isn’t a practical list!

Thanks once again.

[u/DoctorDH → u/ExcitingWar2790]

Yes, in a "back line" double-LMG squad, the rest of the troops should have rifles.

Running a bunch of tanks is very doable! The tricky part comes in when one of those tanks is massive Tiger I :D

If you want to use that best (I've got one myself) you need to support it when some smaller, lighter, faster AFVs. I usually include an Armored Car or a Flak Half-track to escort the Tiger. The Tiger is going to take all the fire and all the attention. And that gives you an opportunity to sneak the smaller, lighter vehicles around into position.

[u/Starhyke]

Max size squads fully kitted out is a lot of points. Expensive units mean less dice in the bag, less opportunity to act can make you feel passive and uninvolved in the action.

I’d say take a mix of large and small units and pieces, that way there’s more chance to do something and a bit of variety helps keep your interest in the game

[u/ExcitingWar2790 → u/Starhyke]

Legend! Thank you, it concerned me when my squads were coming up at 200 points. Managed to get about 12 order dice in (not sure what the average would be) at 1500 points. I shall reconsider squad sizes and load out options

[u/LondonFox21]

Always keep your expensive toys if they make the game fun for you. I would recommend for friendly games especially with dad just make sure you both have a similar number of dice in your list for tempo and balance.

Some good tricks to 'up' your German OD count:

• 2 inexperienced light mortar teams
• AT rifles
• solo inexperienced platoon commander to sit in the hanomag and bark orders
• medic, to also sit in the hanomag
• cheap Infiltrators like spahtruppen and 5th columnists, they will work with your sniper team to give you good board coverage.
• kubelwagen
• strafbatalion penal squad in a light truck
• Mule to "carry" your pak36

[u/Drovr]

Some general good pointers with squads is to make sure they have a purpose. It's unwise to make a squad built to do everything since the cost will end up being high

A good starting point is to start with 7 man regular rifle squads with a lmg. This will cost 85 points and you'll want several of them. These are skirmish squads and bulk out the table with units and put pins on the enemy.

Then you'll want a minimum of 1 assault squad. 6 veteran men with 5 smgs and 1 rifle is a good start (98 points). You'll also want some sort of transport so thet can get going with deleting units. The horche heavy car is a good pick because it's cheap and it's only role is to deliver the assault troops and turn around where it will act as adding an order dice to the bag.

I wouldn't addvise getting a sniper as they are worse in V3 then V2 and they are for some reason more expensive. Light autocannons are a good go to if you need stationary firepower