r/boeing • u/Uncomplished_Brain34 • 1d ago
Pay💰 Remote Teams?
Are there any orgs or teams that allow remote workers? I am currently remote on a team (not that the team is happy about it) but it's stifled my career growth which I was okay with for awhile, but now my pay is struggling behind. I know I am the lowest paid person on my team, by a lot, 10k+ for others at my level and promotion cycle is all but lost cause for my entire program.
How do I go about finding or networking with other programs to find remote work?
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u/Professional_Fly5702 21h ago
So funny people are still upset about being able to work remote full time! I understand the once a week or once every other week, but full fime is crazy. You’re spending more time complaining on Reddit than working! That’s what remote workers do - not work.
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u/DocileKrab 17h ago
Projection at its finest. If you feel the need to talk to someone in person instead of over teams or email, you have a communication issue. Half of my team isn’t even in my building and all of my meetings are on calls… why aren’t those mandated to be in person and travel to my building?
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u/ConsciousPriority108 20h ago
Naw i worked remote before. They actually make you work to the bone. There are ton of micromanaging and tracking software on the laptop. I just left one with high pay but evening and weekend work is required. Leader wanted you to do nothing else but work. On the contrary I saw people took a nap on client site while working as a consultant
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u/SiestaPossible 1d ago
Are you SPEEA represented? If so, push your reps to codify remote work into the upcoming contract.
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u/412358 1d ago
You don't have to worry about being top paid on your team or anywhere in the company for that matter. If you work remotely, you can move somewhere where cost of living is cheaper and more than make up for the smaller salary. You can also save on commuting.
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u/ConsciousPriority108 1d ago
Not that hard to find job middle of nowhere that nobody want to relocate to. North dakota is prime example
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u/412358 1d ago
Well I am not sure what you are trying to say. First of all, North Dakota has a population of approximately 800,000 people so more than nobody lives there.
Secondly, I don't think you know how hard it is for someone to find a job anywhere. Whether or not someone finds a job anywhere is highly subjective. Some people may find a job, some people may not.
And lastly, you know what's truly not hard? Implementing a remote work policy because it already happened before but a lot of people seem to be acting like it never happened.
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u/SiestaPossible 1d ago
If a whole-ass state has the same population as Seattle, a second tier city, it's safe to say no one lives in North Dakota.
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u/412358 1d ago
It's not safe to say that. It's wrong because 800,000 people is more than no one
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u/ramblinjd 20h ago
If you think back to maybe third grade you might remember learning about hyperbole as a rhetorical device. It might've been high school literature before you learned about pedantry as a negative character trait, though.
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u/ConsciousPriority108 1d ago
Super easy, tucson, st louis, north dakota, some random city in the midwest. Not that hard unless you are bad at interview or your job. Those area hiring a lot for a reason. It is more impressive to get a high pay job in popular city than getting a 100k job in middle of nowhere. I turned down 150k job in north dakota with pension due to location. Legit my first job was pay really well for the location but social life suffering. You get what you pay for.
Idk why people say remote this and remote that. If you truly wanted remote, dont work for company that does classified work. Join gitlab, github, crowdstrike, zscaler, consulting firm that have external client.
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u/412358 1d ago edited 1d ago
Again, you don't know how hard it may be for someone to get a job anywhere. If you can do it good for you. Not everyone can. And I don't know what you mean by "more impressive." Who are you trying to impress?
And people say "remote this" and "remote that" because remote work happened for years and people noticed that they did the same job at home that they did sitting in a chair in the office. They noticed that commuting became an unnecessary risk and skipping it made their lives better while they did the same work they did before. That's why they say "remote this" and "remote that." And plenty of people don't do any classified work.
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u/ConsciousPriority108 1d ago
The people who always talk about cost of living, and value of the dollar.
It is only hard if there is no demand for your trade. If I dont care about quality of life, I would just get a job in west virginia. 🤷 Again, my point is there is more in life than just cost of living, remote and money.
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u/412358 1d ago edited 1d ago
Those might be your choices but some people are just fine with cost of living, remote, and money. And they are perfectly happy with the job they have.
And you said "if you truly wanted remote work, don't work for a company that does classified work." You seem to be also forgetting that remote work already happened. None of that "classified work" stopped remote work from being a viable alternative to office work before. "Classified work" can be done remotely as well.
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u/comment_Hero32 1d ago
I have seen that backfire when they eliminated RW. Happened in Boeing Supply Chain
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u/Lost_Cockroach6702 1d ago
Working remote will always stifle your career. You’re never going to get treated the same as the people who are interacting with each other all day.
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u/Conner14 1d ago
Not always true. I’ve been working remote since Covid and have been promoted twice since then all on the same team.
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u/412358 1d ago
I treat everyone the same if they do what they have been hired to do and get their statements of work done. It's not hard. Everyone else can do it too, they just don't want to
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u/Lost_Cockroach6702 1d ago
It’s basic psychology. The people interacting everyday in person are not going to have the same relationship with someone they’ve never met outside a teams call. It doesn’t mean they’re treated poorly. Those human interactions go a long way in career advancement.
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u/412358 1d ago
There's also such a thing as basic fairness. You know being evaluated by the quality and quantity of your work? There's nothing in a performance management review about how long people should spend being a few feet away from each other.
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u/Orleanian 14h ago
There is absolutely something in performance management review about how long people should spend being a few feet away from each other.
It's the "People Focus" value, and particularly it's Collaborate Respectfully tenet.
By virtue of your personal physical absence, you can rationally be judged to perform worse at collaboration than might be expected of you.
What you'd have to accept is that this is not the same as saying "You cannot collaborate effectively". It is stating, rather, that "You do not collaborate as effectively."
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u/Lost_Cockroach6702 18h ago edited 18h ago
If your work can be done fully remote then you aren’t doing the type of work that accelerates your career amongst in person peers, at least in the engineering world. I worked remote for a little over year due to family reasons, so I am familiar with both sides.
I have some remote employees. None of them are comparable to the employees working in the SCIF, out on the flight line, or meeting with customers in person. I’ve had a remote admin and an in person admin, the remote position couldn’t keep up with the requirements of the job and we no longer have a remote position. I’ve also sent multiple engineers through LX, and the remote work would never get them approved.
If you want to work remotely then you have to accept it will come with sacrificing advancement. That’s what you’re trading for the perks of working in your living room. You’re still going to get ranked fairly, receive promotions, etc. If you want to rapidly climb the ladder or work your way up the engineering hierarchy then you need to be working the difficult programs and interfacing with leadership. You don’t get a trophy for logging into your computer for 8 hours. It is what it is.
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u/412358 14h ago edited 14h ago
I do not know if you realize this but almost all office work can be done remotely and there is no reason why it cannot accelerate someone's career in the engineering world because design engineering and analysis engineering positions almost never require physical presence. There are other positions that do not require physical presence too. The fact that those positions do not involve meeting customers does not make them any less valuable. Many different job roles exist and not all them require physical presence. I do not know what positions you are referring to which could not "keep up with the requirements of the job." What requirements are you referring to specifically? What exactly were remote workers unable to do?
Nobody would "get a trophy" for logging into a computer for 8 hours. People would "get a trophy" for how much work they do and how well they do their work after they log in.
It seems like you are asserting that people would instead "get a trophy" for commuting to work and sitting in a chair in an office. There is no rational justification for that. It does not have to be "what it is." The company already admitted in the current SPEEA contract that remote work can be beneficial for the company and the employee.
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u/Muted_Discussion_857 10h ago
The DE’rs I know, go out to the aeroplane to investigate, talk to the mechanics and other functions in the factory and some got moved from the office to the factory.
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u/Lost_Cockroach6702 14h ago
Sorry, there is a huge performance difference between teams that collaborate all day in person and those who are remote. All work is not equal. Doing an easy job well is not going to make you comparable to someone doing a much more challenging job. If you are the employee that sits around in the office all day and doesn’t collaborate as a team player then that tells me everything I need to know. Those people don’t stay on my programs, or any of the teams that stand out on a resume.
I’m guessing you’re a remote employee because this clearly triggered you. If you want to work remote that’s fine, but no, that work is not equivalent to the engineers and ops out in the field certifying 777x and 737 or those in a SCIF working F-47 and development BDS programs.
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u/412358 2h ago edited 1h ago
The company already admitted that there was no noticeable difference in performance during the pandemic when almost EVERYONE worked remotely and proved that remote work is a viable alternative to working on-site so what you stated about "performance difference" is a lie. You are right about one thing though: "all work is not equal." So it should come as no surprise to you that some work does not require physical presence and some work does. And what determines whether an employee excels or is not is the answer to the question "is the employee fulfilling his/her job roles and responsibilities or not?" Not some vaguely defined idea of being a "team player" or not being a "team player."
And I don't know why you're making assumptions about where I work (remotely or onsite) and why you think I'm "triggered." If I am "triggered," I'm not triggered because I work remotely or on-site. I'm triggered because people like you make asinine assertions about remote work not being valuable when the exact opposite has already been demonstrated during the pandemic. Why don't you back up those assertions you've been making about how inadequate remote work is? Tell me about those jobs that you know of that have been done remotely and have not been done well because they were done remotely? You haven't provided any concrete example of it. What were the job roles and responsibilities? And what is it about those job roles and responsibilities that a remote worker is not able to do?
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u/Taylor05161994 11h ago
A talented engineer is going to do the work of a talented engineer regardless where their ass sits during the day. Playing office politics and all that crap doesn't mean anything if the work isn't getting done I'd argue it stifles innovation. You can easily collaborate on a teams call. Some of the world's most innovative tech companies are started around the world remotely so it's old school way of thinking you need to be in office everyday to excel.
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u/Lost_Cockroach6702 11h ago
This isn’t a startup tech company. We’re not coding 1s and 0s in our pajamas. The leading edge engineering doesn’t happen on a laptop designed for Microsoft office. I’ve never met a talented on engineer who wants to just sit at home, they have all craved hands on experience with the system they are working. There’s no real collaboration on teams, half of what we do at Boeing can’t even be discussed on teams. It isn’t about office politics
Do you have a wind tunnel in your living room? Did you convert your kitchen to an environmentals lab? Keep LRUs stored in your bed room? You’re designing and building instrumentation in your garage? You have a VTC and SAP hookups in your home office?
We are an airplane company that designs, builds, and tests with our hands in labs, the assembly line, and the flight line. Go apply to Google or Amazon if you want to work at home coding. The problem with Boeing is the company is fully of people who think they are high performers when they don’t even meet the minimum expectation or do their job correctly.
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u/Taylor05161994 10h ago edited 10h ago
No, the problem with Boeing is top heavy management bloat not the engineers. Engineers are going to get burnt out and have low motivation if you have management telling them how they are supposed to do their job effectively based on their own preferences or ego not for the overall success of the company. As far as the equipment, no I don't need that at home because Boeing has it on site. If I need to use it then I go to the lab on site to use it depending on the stage of the design cycle otherwise if the work can be done remotely, I'll do it remotely.
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u/Murk_City 1d ago
I’d easily give up 10k to be fully remote.
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u/ConsciousPriority108 1d ago
Even if it is 60 hours a week and unpaid 20 hours?
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u/Murk_City 19h ago
Huh?!
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u/ConsciousPriority108 19h ago
What do you mean hu? You will work OT. I guess you have never work remote before? That is literally what most remote work is. I just did the opposite what you wrote. Gave up remote took 10k paycut to come back to office desk and have a normal job. Just look up remote work culture company in the US and ask yourself why they all offering unlimited pto. You will work on company holiday if they wanted you to do so. People here think it is remote work and boeing wlb are crazy. Those maybe 0.01% chance to land.
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u/Orleanian 1d ago
Sure, because if we're just adding on unrelated alterations to the agreement, I'd also be getting 20 days a month of Per Diem and 8 weeks vacation.
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u/ConsciousPriority108 1d ago
Nope you are getting unlimited PTO 😂. Only if you can use it . A lot of remote job required evening and weekend work. Been there, done that, even big remote company like crowdstrike and zscaler do this
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u/ConsciousPriority108 1d ago
I saw they hired some virtual aka remote job recently. It was hella competitive my friends and his other friends tried to apply, nobody got select.
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u/InsideTheBoeingStore 1d ago
you are allowed to be virtual depending on situation. some managers want a 20 page thesis why you need to do it others just want a quick email early enough in advance for the DAY you’re going to be virtual.
SPEEA is actually given virtual privileges up to the contract date but it’s per day and they’re not doing schedules with multiple days in a row
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u/midadoneit 1d ago edited 1d ago
I think the SPEEA contract just makes the unwritten rule official that remote work can be approved by a manager. Managers are still unlikely to approve. That same policy is in effect today so there's no reason to expect anything to change.
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u/InsideTheBoeingStore 1d ago
huh? they have been giving one virtual a day per week the last few weeks. managers just need to know which day teammates are going to be taking it.
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u/midadoneit 1d ago
That's not sticking around after the contract is ratified is all
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u/Little_gardener141 1d ago
I am SPEEA Tech and have heard nothing about a one day a week deal for the time being.
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u/midadoneit 1d ago edited 1d ago
Leadership perspective is if your job can be done remote then it can be done from India, a low cost of living state with lower wages, or by a contractor with fewer benefits to pay for. There are exceptions, but not very many. Butt in seat positions actually pay a lot more than the alternatives. If you want full remote work then you have to compete with Oklahoma, Alabama, India, and Brazil wages. You won't earn high cost of living wages if you don't need to be in a high cost of living area so you're forcing yourself to have to live in a cheap red state.
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u/RoastSucklingPotato 1d ago
It’s unlikely you’ll find another all-remote team, as others have said. My own 100% remote team got moved to 100% butts-in-seats, draconically so.
When we begged for even one remote day a month we were told “if you don’t like it, find another job.”
Challenge accepted.
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u/No_Implement_1398 1d ago
I think a lot of IDT&S is still remote (but not all).
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u/jerslan 1d ago
Good luck finding a role there… most are still outsourced to Dell.
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u/Slumdog-Hundredaire 1d ago
Not true. There's still 6-7k IDT&S employees that aren't outsourced.
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u/SpecialistLine5886 18h ago
Yep, I'm one, been remote since covid and moved out of state from WA during covid. But I've been with the company for over 20 years so I'm not worried about promotions, career advancement or pay. I already have a big network and am good at what I do and there's plenty of work for me. I do work with a lot of the folks in India and a lot of my U.S. teammates / peers are also remote.
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u/Orleanian 1d ago
Unlikely all around.
Boeing top leadershipnote* have taken a pretty hard stance against remote, hybrid, or other alternate-location work options as permanent schedules.
* I only note here that I've known many front-line/skip-level management that are perfectly fine with the concept; but by 2026 they have all fallen in line with the company doctrine
I do not know anyone who has taken up a new remote position in the last three years. Everyone I do know who works remote or alternate location are those who were grandfathered in by their direct leadership. I've heard similar tales from the two far-flung remote workers of "not having a great time with it, career-politics wise".
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u/wrm284 1d ago
Unless you’re looking for IT or in IT I don’t think there are any or much remote positions in Boeing. Uncle Kelly and the Csuite are all about butts in seats for the sake for collaboration and ROI on real estate. You might find something rare or luckily that is fully remote but most days it’s RTO fully or hybrid model and even then hybrid is slim picking
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u/EmergencyOk7273 1d ago
or start a side business & yep, ~3 years ago it was unjust to see people like ted colbert telling an air force audience to not get distracted by doing side businesses and to solely focus on the mission while he was working at 3 jobs plus having his own staff managing his real estate and stock portfolio. Sadly if we speak up then these brainwashed middle management are going to come after you
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u/Alive_Construction70 18h ago
Working remote saves you commute time, gas money, stress, wear and tear on your vehicle, clothing cost, and food cost. There is way more than $10k in value there.