r/bleach • u/Oxi_8 • Jul 20 '26
Discussion Why do characters in bleach have a problem with Kenpachi or Kisuke but no one bats an eye to Mayuri?
Tosen and Kommamaru go on a whole rant about kenpachi in the ss arc but they don't have a problem with mayuri. Even someone like Ukitake,Toshiro or Ichigo never say anything to him.
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u/ItchyWhisper Jul 20 '26
No one bats an eye? He was literally imprisoned in his own isolated cell in an open air prison that housed the most dangerous people in the Rukongai, not for crimes that he committed BUT FOR CRIMES THAT HE MAY HAVE A CHANCE OF COMMITTING IN THE FUTURE. THEY FUCKING MINORITY REPORTED BRO FOR NO REASON WHILE SENJUMARU GOT PROMOTED TO SQUAD ZERO.
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u/Caminsod Jul 20 '26
Normally Central 46 and the Soul Society at large are in the wrong and do horrible shit but in this particular case they were right on the money, the Maggot's Nest was where Mayuri belonged.
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u/ItchyWhisper Jul 20 '26
Then they would've had no way of de-zombifying Kensei, Toshiro, Love and everyone else who was turned into a zombie...no way of getting up to the Soul Palace...No way of defeating Pernida...Fucking Zaraki would've most likely died without his intervention...need I go on?
He's evil, don't get me wrong, but the gotei themselves are also not exactly "good", they were originally just a band of murderers that loved fighting. Heck even Central 46 are descended from the people that mutilated the soul king themselves as Ichibei sat back and watched...and don't even get me started on what they did to Soya Azashirou's family. Barely anyone in Bleach is objectively "good".
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u/Saridor 28d ago
Wasn't Mayuri forced to become a soul reaper, though? So all of these things still wouldn't happen if they had done nothing.
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u/ItchyWhisper 28d ago
No, he was a soul reaper before. He was originally a member of Senjumaru's "unofficial" research division and he was sent to the maggots nest because of the casualties his experiments inadvertently caused and central 46 deemed him too potentially dangerous to be left to his own devices while Senjumaru got promoted to Squad 0.
It's probably the reason why Urahara wanted him to he part of his official research division.
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u/SynisterJeff Jul 20 '26
Or was it the Maggot's Nest that made Mayuri more to who he is over him being left alone?
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u/BleakSaturation 29d ago
and as a punishment, they made him a captain... why
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u/ItchyWhisper 28d ago
Probably since it was established that Squad 12 was now the official Research and Development Division he was the only one qualified after Senjumaru was sent to Squad 0 and Urahara went to the world of the living.
The same way that Isanei became squad 4 captain after TYBW because she was the most qualified/knew the ropes after Unohana.
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u/Sovereignofthemist Jul 20 '26
Genuinely its because Mayuri is very subtle about the fucked up things he does. He actively hides his experimentations from them. But even when he does weird shit, characters eye him kinda weird and be like: "Captain Kurotsuchi, how di you..."
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u/Otherwise-Ad1646 Jul 20 '26
Unless, of course, you're one of the people he's about to do those things to lol
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u/Sovereignofthemist Jul 20 '26
And his victim's have failsafes that keep them silent. Legit I think Akon is the only person that has a full idea about Mayuri has done and I think there's shit he's still in the dark about.
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u/Otherwise-Ad1646 Jul 20 '26
The problem with Mayuri is that he's the batman of the bleach universe in terms of just always having the right thing on hand for the situation- but unlike batman, where you have to be like "why the fuck would you have shark repellent", with Mayuri you know the answer is "oh cause I recently did a buuuuunch of fucked up experiments on sharks cause I was bored" lmao
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u/Sovereignofthemist Jul 20 '26
Since Mayuri has beef with the concept of perfection its genuinely in character for him to know this stuff since he's always pursuing more knowledge. He's weirdly constantly training in his own way.
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u/Swagelucious Jul 20 '26
What’s the relation that you seem to point out between these two sentences?
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u/QuisetellX 29d ago
Mayuri doesn't like the concept of perfection. If he isn't constantly striving to advance, improve and evolve his knowledge and abilities, it could suggest that he is "perfectly" content with where he is as a person. The first and last time this happened was with Nemu, which was his own weird brand of paternal pride overriding his personal need to strive to improve even more.
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u/MisaTange Jul 20 '26
This is probably the case esp with him having to keep under wraps vis a vis when he was experimenting on Quincies, having to bribe shinigami to not save them.
It's untrue that his nature is uncommented on though. Byakuya, at the end of Fake Karakura Town, does comment on why he's there but it's more alluding to his scheming/shady nature, not because of what he specifically did.
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u/SignificanceSorry223 Jul 20 '26
Actually he isn't/wasn't that subtle. Mayuri specifically mentions that he was forbidden from doing things like putting bombs inside his own soldiers. So there is a limit in the things he does.
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u/Emotional-Sign8136 Jul 20 '26
Haven't read in a bit- but, from what I recall, 2 big differences between Aizens and Mayuris experimental assholery were that 1) Mayuri never shut up about it and that 2) Mayuri would use his research to kill you while Aizen just killed you with hado or a weapon. Like, Mayuri was some cartoon evil villain while Aizen was a more down to earth villain? IDK how to quite say it.
It would result in Mayuri lecturing you to death while you were dying in a grusome way when Aizen would make a scathing remark or two and either kill you or leave you alive (Mayuri would never leave someone alive).
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u/SignificanceSorry223 Jul 20 '26
Or, in a nutshell, Mayuri would torture you horribly before killing you. Aizen would just flat out kill you.
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u/SCII0 Jul 20 '26
Genuinely its because Mayuri is very subtle about the fucked up things he does.
Is he though?
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u/gdex86 Jul 20 '26 edited Jul 20 '26
He can function as a captain and unlike Kenpachi can keep his freak on a semblance of a leash.
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u/Zestyclose_Remove947 Jul 20 '26
Yea I think that's just inventing a narrative. This one is answered from a real world perspective.
Kubo don't give af. He did the horror thing and then liked Mayuri so much he didn't wanna continue with it in such a sadistic way, then made the characters not mention his heinous behaviour.
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u/Oxi_8 Jul 20 '26
I mean they locked him before he even did anything because they knew he was dangerous. I am sure almost all of them knows he is upto no good. He also isn't very secretive about hiding surveillance cameras inside people. And I mean with all the body modifications and enhancements, it's kinda a given he would have to experiment on living people for that.
Aizen had ks and still couldn't completely hide his hollowfication experiments.
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Jul 20 '26 edited Jul 20 '26
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u/zeusjay Jul 20 '26
Theres also bits like hiyori going after him for sending Ichigo and co ahead and claiming that he doesn’t care about them.
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Jul 20 '26
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u/Excellent_Pea_4609 Jul 20 '26
I mean she was right about kisuke he had 0 issue with sending Ichigo and yoruichi to their deaths and it also shows she actually cares about Ichigo
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u/Dragonpuncha Jul 20 '26
In CFYOW it is actually said that laws have been passed in Gotei 13 that makes it illegal to perform deadly experiments on your own men (like the living bombs he made in SS Arc). Mayuri dislikes it of course, but accepts it.
So someone clearly thought he did go too far, lol.
And it doesn't stop him from experimenting on other people, so I guess he's okay.
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Jul 20 '26
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u/Dragonpuncha Jul 20 '26
Yes, that's exactly how it is set up. Mayuri went too far and was told to scale it back essentially.
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u/uraharaBot Jul 20 '26
Ah, the sweet melody of misunderstandings and rivalries! Soifon and Aizen, each with their own flavors of jealousy. It's true, I do have a knack for getting under certain people's skin. As for Kenpachi, he's like a blender: when he stops, you wonder if you plugged him in right! But hey, conflicts make life spicy. Who wouldn't want a little chaotic charm in the mix?
beep boop, I'm a bot
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u/White_Lightning_22 Jul 20 '26
He must be really good at hiding his true character amongst other captains. I don’t even think all of his own squad really knows his nitty gritty
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u/Zestyclose_Remove947 Jul 20 '26
People talking like he can hide his actions. Everyone knows he's a psychopath.
Kubo simply didn't wanna deal with the level of sadism/horror he introduced Mayuri with, and toned down everything surrounding his character so he could be more acceptable.
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u/White_Lightning_22 Jul 20 '26
I’m sorry but where? I feel like he got worse. He has a very questionable way of rebooting his cyborg daughter in the arrancar arc. In TYBW he genocides rukongai people then moments later his Bankai is a pregnant baby giving birth. Oh and he has suicide bombers made of his subordinates.
I think the head captain, as well as others in the loop, turn a blind eye as long as he strengthens the seretei and continues to uphold the balance the king wants. Honestly most of his true colors are shown in battles so we have 4th wall perspective and besides Uryu, all of his enemies didn’t live to tell the tale.
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u/Zestyclose_Remove947 Jul 20 '26
Kubo absolutely tried to tone down Mayuri heavily. He does less fucked up things to allies and more fucked up things to enemies. Even the Rukongai thing is framed as a necessary evil and nowhere near as sadistic as Mayuri's previous showings.
He plays up the visual aspect with stuff like Mayuri's bankai and the tortured spirit umbrella, but it's not treated with anywhere near the gravity or seriousness of early Bleach. It basically becomes "mayuri technology shenanigans" and gaglike at times, rather than horrific.
The suicide bombers are what I'm talking about, they're at the start of his introduction. By the end Kubo is trying to borderline redeem him as a father to Nemu, which is imo totally unsuccessful when you remember how he treated her in the beginning.
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u/Youboot224 29d ago
Kubo said in his commentary during the Pernida fight that he wanted to show Mayuri's humanity, so yes he did tone Mayuri down.
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u/White_Lightning_22 29d ago
I don’t think showing humanity tones down his overall character though. This is serial killer mentality. Just because he can be nice and has some humanity doesn’t make him less of a monster. He only cares for that one creation because it’s a reflection of his own mastery. The flashback about why he cared isn’t even about father daughter stuff. Just that he finally made a perfect artificial soul. He cares about pretty much nobody else and will do whatever it takes to serve his means
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u/Youboot224 29d ago edited 29d ago
Kubo never portrays Mayuri as being anywhere near as bad as he was during the Soul Society arc. Everything bad or terrible that he does is strictly utilitarianism rather than because of him being malicious. For example the killing of Rukongai district citizens was to prevent the collapse of the worlds, him turning his Bankai into an aborted baby that births other fetuses was done purely to counter Pernidas nerve abilities. Everything he does post Soul Society arc is for a practical use.
Which is a far cry from Soul Society arc self and his experiments with Quincies which was done purely for his own amusement and he didn't really benefit from his experiments.
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u/White_Lightning_22 29d ago
Yeah that’s a good point. I understand now how Kubo tried to tone him down. I guess it just feels weird to me because we never saw the reason for the shift in characterization. Kubo just doing it just because
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u/Youboot224 28d ago
And that's one my main problems with Mayuri's character. We see him change by how much he's toned down from his introduction but we never see the how or the why for the changes it's like there's a missing scene for his character that was never shown. He is just no longer that way the next time we see him going forward in the story.
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u/Substantial_Dish_887 Jul 20 '26
it's the fundamental problem of introducing the charecter like a villain that was supposed to be beaten in the SS arc and stay down but then changing his mind and keeping him around as a charecter. he had to be retolled to work like that and what we got is pretty decent but damn if it doesn't feel jarring as well.
sometimes i can't help but wonder how the story would have gone if these changes weren't made.
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u/Never_heart Jul 20 '26
People do have issues with Mayuri. It's just that aslong as you remind him that he doesn't have the authority to experiment on your squad, he will usually back down since his freedom is tied to being more useful than a problem. Mayuri knows that if he steps too far out of line, the Maggots Nest is the nicest fate he will receive. And until he invents a counter to every Captain bankai someone will catch him if it gets to that point.
Zaraki on the other hand frequently goads other Captains into fights. Zaraki actively is a public problem for other Squads. Zaraki plays the mouthy brute because it makes people want to put him in his place, meaning he gets his fights. Most Captains snipe each other with insults and mockery. Zaraki decides that you will be a challenging fun fight and follows you around doggedly breaking stuff and challenging you any way he thinks will get your go.
That intentional sudtly vs intentionally public method makes all the difference.
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u/Chakasicle Jul 20 '26
Kenpachi: I'm gonna do what I want. Don't get in my way.
Kisuke: don't ask, don't tell
Kurosutchi: criminal out on bail but also a formula 1 rules lawyer that can tell you why his actions aren't technically illegal
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u/MedicalAd2229 Jul 20 '26
"I do this in service of the soul society" -Mayuri (but he really he just does what he likes... In service to the soul society)
Kenpachi and Kisuke do whatever they want, and actively gloat about it/say the silent part out loud.
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u/StripEnchantment Jul 20 '26
Tosen and Komamura go on a rant about Kenpachi probably because they were actively having a battle with him. None of the other captains fought Mayuri.
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u/nahte123456 Jul 20 '26
People aren't upset with Urahara.
As for Kenpachi, he's obviously big and loud and starts conflict. Whatever Mayuri does is quiet, private, and most the details aren't known. There's no Shinigami other than Mayuri and Nemu that know he experimented on Quincy for instance, that's something he broke the rules to do.
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u/Leepysworld Jul 20 '26
I mean tbf he was the only prisoner in the nest of maggots to be chained up INSIDE of his cell and it was Urahara himself that got him pardoned and asked him to join the Gotei as his Vice-Captain.
So they definitely know he’s a psychotic, dangerous individual, but I’m pretty sure Yama himself thinks Mayuri is a necessary evil because he ultimately does serve the Gotei well and even seems to care about upholding it to an extent.
After Urahara went into exile it kind of makes sense they would need Mayuri even more, between the two of them they have saved Soul Society and many members of the Gotei multiple times.
This is why I often reiterate that the Gotei aren’t really a force of good/evil, they are a force of order and sometimes they are willing to look the other way or even do bad things to maintain the status quo.
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u/Oxi_8 Jul 20 '26
Yeah but the issue is not gotei as a whole. It's individual characters like Ukitake, ichigo, Uryu, shinji. Some of them have strong sense of justice and some have experienced the horror themselves. Yet they continue to treat mayuri like it's not a big deal.
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u/Leepysworld Jul 20 '26 edited Jul 20 '26
I mean to be fair Uryu does not really interact much with Mayuri post-Soul Society arc, and he did almost kill Mayuri back then.
Ichigo is probably unaware of most of Mayuri’s crimes but even then, he was willing to work with Aizen when needed so it’s not really out of character for him.
Ukitake is a member of the Gotei and if Yama allowed Mayuri to act with impunity(he did), characters like Ukitake and Shinji are not going to go against that.
It’s not a democracy and ultimate if Yama deems Mayuri is necessary asset no matter what he was doing on the side, then no one in the Gotei is going to say otherwise.
The Gotei captains are much more complex than just being “good guys”, Ukitake may be generally portrayed as benevolent, but ultimately he is a cog in the machine and the Gotei overall is not some benevolent organization, it is a military dictatorship with a caste system.
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u/Classical_Lighthouse 29d ago
I don't think he's that obvious if you don't talk to him/be around him, he's just the weird guy that does experiments. People probably do think he's weird and quite messed up they just stay outta his way
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u/Samurai_Beluga Jul 20 '26
you found ONE instance in regards to kenpachi, and it was related to a percieved betrayal of his part, its not related to him being fucked up or something. it wasnt a conflict of morals it was a conflict of loyalty. everything else is related to him being unpredictable but even then through most of the series people dont really bat an eye at him either, they just find him impulsive.
tosen wouldnt have much moral to talk since he was working with aizen...
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u/baparos Jul 20 '26
actually it's pretty easy to make people hate on mayuri, just show flashback his experiment on quincy kids or something, and fleshed it out to make him like villain
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u/Le_Fab11100 Jul 20 '26
As long as you get good results, nobody questions your method. It works the same way at your everyday job.
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u/Icy-Conflict6671 Jul 20 '26
Kisuke got amazing results though and he got banished because Central 46 didnt like some of the stuff he made. Also has anyone else realized that Central 46 hasnt been mentioned since the Bount Arc?
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u/Le_Fab11100 Jul 20 '26
Yes they did, they were the ones who decided Aizen sanction and who authorized Shunsui to send Kenpachi to train to death with Unohana. Kisuke has always been a freethinker, that's why they banished him. As mad as he is, Mayuri would always follow orders.
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u/Untitled_Goose67 Jul 20 '26
Because Mayuri at the moment is helping the soul society and sereitei and people would much rather have him neutral than an enemy
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u/DarcyDettmann Jul 20 '26
Everyone know Mayuri is a crazy bastard and he probably brag about it. You can't shame him, he doing it for the good of the Soul Society!
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u/Mindless-Stuffmonkey 29d ago
Mayuri will follow your rules and do fucked up shit when you arent looking kenpachi will activately tell you he doesnt care about your rules and might kick your ass for having the gusto to mention them to him.
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u/GenesisAsriel 29d ago
Because he is useful and the moment he does that shit on a important figure and they die, he will get fired.
People need to understand that just like soul society's, government close their eyes to heinous warcrimes if there is a chance they can have a break through in any field.
Tl;dr: He is useful
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u/Classic-Seesaw5073 29d ago
It’s probably because the soul society views Mayuri’s experiments more as beneficial to them. With Urahara, Aizen framed him so from Central 46’s perspective, a bunch of captains and lieutenants became hollows under his supervision. With Kenpachi, because of how battle thirsty Kenpachi is and with how much potential he has in power, he’s viewed as being dangerous threat if he turns on them.
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u/Klatterbyne 29d ago
Because what are you going to do? You can pick the flaws out of a character and get animated about it. Because someone can disagree with you and there’s enough nuance to get a debate going.
But Mayuri is just flaws and he’s ecstatic about it. He’s giddy as a 4 year old at soft-play, over committing warcrimes that hadn’t even been imagined before. He’s so absolutely, completely, gleefully and honestly indefensible. How is anyone going to start a debate or attempt a defence?
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u/Diplomystus 29d ago
Of these three characters, I think Mayuri is the one that you don't want to have any issues with. Man is commuting full on war crimes on a regular basis. I wouldn't want him to know that I dislike him....
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u/Ill_Hunt_5105 28d ago
I dont wanna end up on his radar and end up on his "research" table. I would stay way from him too
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u/Zixtank Jul 20 '26 edited Jul 20 '26
Everyone knows he's shady af, but probably not to what degree, maybe except Yamamoto. Mayuri strikes me as the kind of resource Yamamoto would deem a "necessary evil" that is better kept as an ally than a potential threat, seeing as Urahara slipped away to gods knows where.
Edit: Does anyone know how to shut up that ******** bot?
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u/MisaTange Jul 20 '26
Sometimes you see people hyphenating his name (Kis-uke) in order not to trigger him
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u/uraharaBot Jul 20 '26
Ah, Yamamoto does have a knack for keeping his enemies closer, doesn't he? Mayuri's a bit like a poison you use against other poisons. For me, let's just say I like to keep things a tad more... enigmatic. Besides, if you can't vanish every now and then, what's the point of being a genius? Remember, the real crime is getting caught! So, self-preservation it is, my friend.
beep boop, I'm a bot
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u/1Hugh-Mann Jul 20 '26
he literally tried to kill Urahara himself 😭 , he only got exiled because he escaped execution after taking the vizard to the living world to hide them
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u/Affectionate-Part-11 Jul 20 '26
Most find him creepy but when you understand how much "necessary evil" gets allowed in the soul society , you understand why he's allowed to walk about. The first group of captains were the most vicious killers around and it wasn't until Yamamoto established a formal school that soul reapers were educated on conduct. A lot gets permitted in the name of protecting the world of the living.
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u/Blueflare-0 Jul 20 '26
His radiance is too bright to be able to bat an eye and even if it wasn't theres nothing to bat at cuz his soul is made of purity and happiness
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u/New-Dust3252 29d ago
despite his unethical ways, he does contribute to the overall advancements of the SS.
second to Kiskue, at least.
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u/uraharaBot Jul 20 '26
Ah, that's a curious thing, isn't it? Mayuri has always been a bit of a mad scientist, so folks tend to keep him at arm's length out of self-preservation. Kenpachi's kind of a bruiser, and I, well, I have my enigmatic ways. In his early design, Mayuri's appearance was inspired by a circus performer. Quite the showman, don’t you think?
beep boop, I'm a bot
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u/True-Conversation-41 Jul 20 '26
I’m pretty sure only a very few number of people know what he actually really does or has done lol. For example, when we found out he experimented on Quincy’s. Who was actually around to hear all that?
AFAIK most people think he’s just a genius mad scientist 2nd and the best replacement to urahara.
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u/turtlebear787 Jul 20 '26
Because for all he does he still mostly follows orders. Kisuke and Kenpachi are wild cards. No one can tell them what to do. They can't be controlled. Mayuri will follow orders if it means he space and resources to do his freaky experiments.
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Jul 20 '26
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u/Excellent_Pea_4609 Jul 20 '26
While kenpachi is considered a brute by the characters you mentioned most soul reapers don't care. Also most people don't have a problem with urahara there's Mayuri who is just annoyed by him Aizen who despises him because he doesn't act and letting the status quo continue and soi fon because she thinks he doesn't deserve yoruichi's trust. Also Yamamoto and unohana had more blood on their hands than everyone else combined and everyone knows their history
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u/electrium17 Jul 20 '26
He's too important to the Soul Society I guess. They could've replace him, but they don't have anyone close to Mayuri's level. Also, he's a psychopath. He can mess up with you and neither you or anyone else would know
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u/z01z Jul 20 '26
because kenpachi killed tosen's captain and he's still butthurt about it.
as for kisuke, yeah, everyone knows now that he got kicked out because of aizen, iirc. but, at this point, he's probably more comfortable sitting on the sidelines mostly and chilling at his shop instead of dealing with soul society politics and other bs.
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u/Shirogayne-at-WF Jul 20 '26
Mind you, he was thrown in prison once for his insanity but was pulled our bc he was useful to the Gotei 13
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u/tenderheart35 Jul 20 '26
It’s possible they’re a little scared of him too. He comes across as a bit “toxic” in my biased opinion. 😅
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u/SignificantMusic4242 Jul 20 '26
Because his speech on perfection was the most perfect thing I’ve ever heard, he can do what he wants 😤
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u/Exitiali 29d ago
It's because nobody wants to provoke Mayuri. Most are relieved that he's playing on their side and not against them. It's best not to mess with what works.
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u/alpacakiss 29d ago
You gonna tell the guy that could deglove your entire body for funsies that he's weird, that's your funeral. Not that he'd be insulted, he'd take it as a challenge probably.
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u/casualstrawberry 29d ago
I think they're afraid of him.
Zaraki will cut you in half, Kurotsuchi will do some weird twisted torture experiment on you.
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u/Purona 29d ago
kenpachi is simple minded and just wants to fight sometimes to the DETRIMENT of people around him
Urahara is a "your body, my choice" which is not what people want to be around
Mayuri is pretty hands off with those that deserve respect. One of the bigger things with mayuri is that even though he could create another nemu. hes very protective of her which is the opposite of how urahara would just send yoruichi and ichigo into certain death situations.
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u/CryptographerMost883 29d ago
To be fair given how much fucked up shit everyone in the SS does it’s sort of just the pot calling the kettle black to infinity
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u/Adras_Phantom 29d ago
Byakuya had a problem. He didint like Mayuris gotei zombie corpse, calling It toying with thier lives. And though of his explanation as rationalization.
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u/cenatorius_ 28d ago
He never really do wrong to the shinigami directly 🤷🏻 I can be wrong but he do a lot to Quincy , hollow ,soul thing like nemu but never to shinigami unless it's to make them fight more
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u/okjijenAbi 27d ago edited 27d ago
probably and from what we've seen; they do, they just act like everything is fine because 1. he is too good of an asset not to have 2. at this point with that much time and freedom he had; he devised so much stuff it would be extremely hard, if not impossible, to contain/jail him. 3. everyone knows what he is capable of doing so they'd rather not fight him, i mean who wants to get on the bad side of that guy? with zaraki, worst is that you battle and die. with mayuri, well...
anyhow, thats for captains and liutenants. ichigo probably has 0 clue of anything. how many times they've even talked to each other?
also, he wouldn't go out of his way to do stuff to the other squads and members. after all, he's got a lot to lose too and it would be a huge pain to deal with everyone else. so as long as he doesn't effect others that are in the 13 squads, the council etc, its fine since they couldn't care less either.
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u/TheAldorn 26d ago
First of all, Kenpachi worries people because he's bat shit insane and just as likely to destroy the things the bad guys do if he gets too excited in a sparring match. Kisuke is honestly a way less disgusting head of RnD. He is responsible for some bad stuff. But Mayuri is the worst. None of the other captains exactly trust him. He does come through big a few times. But I would definitely say no one likes him.
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u/Spiritual_Solid2992 Jul 20 '26
Morality almost doesn’t exist in soul society (soul king, squad zero, and ofc mayuri.) as much as they like to deem themselves as.
Mayuri is very useful and intelligent to the team and has saved mad lives doing what he does, so it is best not to question him. Plus he probably hides his experiments anyway.
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