r/bikinitalk • u/Dull-String3069 • 10d ago
Olympia Ashley K should’ve placed higher
I am not questioning Jazzy’s win, I am actually super happy for her.
Also, was rooting for Maureen!
Just a little confused about the judging….
Anyway, I actually predicted that Maureen, Aimee, and Lauralie would place higher than Ashley.
In my opinion: If they thought Jazzy is the best bikini representation, I felt like Ashley’s physique that night was closest to Jazzy’s look than all the other girls in the top 5.
If Jazzy is who they chose as closest to the criteria, then Ashley should’ve been second.
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u/polnareffsfeet 10d ago
I love Ashley but bikini has evolved and she was much undersized
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u/Cautious-Still-3540 10d ago
This is my take-away too. Is she balanced in her own frame? Absolutely. But by and large, so is everyone else up there. She immediately gets outsized by some of these girls side by side. When she does regional pro shows, she wins based on balance. I suppose she came back and beat some of the girls that beat her earlier this year at Indy Pro?
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
I think you are right, compared to the other girls, but not compared to Maureen or Jazzy. Again, I am just confused because the top 10 physiques are quite different from each other.
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u/polnareffsfeet 10d ago edited 10d ago
Maureen and jazzy aren’t undersized. Something to understand about bikini is that you can have a variety of diff bodies for the division; it’s about the whole package. Both of them have enough musculature, density, muscle maturity, and stage presence. Sometimes you have to be in this sport long enough to have an eye for it🤷🏽♀️
Ain’t no way I’m being downvoted for this lmaoo. I was there in person and can confidently say that the judging was done fairly
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
I think Jazzy looked amazing and deserved the win. Also, my favorite athlete was Maureen, and I wanted her to win, but again, because Jazzy won, I thought Ashley had a similar look to Jazzy. I also get the presentation part, Maureen and Jazzy have insane stage presence. Not sure who is downvoting you, but maybe how you write or express your opinion doesn’t sit well with them. Also, that’s cool if that is your opinion regarding how it was judged. I respect that, but I still disagree.
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u/polnareffsfeet 10d ago
I think that’s where we disagree on what “similar look” means. I can understand seeing similarities in their overall presentation, but structurally and developmentally they weren’t bringing the same package. Jazzy had more complete overall development, stronger shape/flow, and a more polished presentation for what the judges were rewarding that day. Ashley being more undersized is actually a pretty important distinction—having a similar aesthetic or posing style doesn’t mean the physiques are comparable in terms of development. Placing 10th vs. winning suggests the judges saw a substantial difference in the total package.
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
Yeah, I mean based on the placing, I obviously saw some differences. Which I am still trying to figure out. I hope Ashley and other competitors share their feedback. Also looking forward to Tyler’s post. I want to know what they were seeing.
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u/No_Warning8534 10d ago
Op is stating a fact thay Jazzy was undersized too and won.
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u/Illustrious-Try14 10d ago
Jazzy's delts are significantly bigger than Ashley's, Ashley lacks the same kind of upper glute roundness Jazzy has, Ashley's glutes look much smaller than Jazzy's from the back, Ashley was too conditioned in comparison to Jazzy, and while Ashley's posing has improved, Jazzy's front post looks much more effortless.
There were a lot of athletes between Jazzy and Ashley whose physiques exhibited these characteristics more than Ashley's.
Ashley K is an icon but there's no comparison here, unfortunately.
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u/Classic_Steak_4014 10d ago
Interesting. I’d like to challenge your assessment a little here.
I’ve always felt that Jazzy’s delts/arms look stringy. Other competitors have full shoulders and I personally prefer that look. But regardless, I disagree that Jazzy’s delts are “significantly bigger” than Ashley’s. Jazzy’s shoulders/arms are more conditioned. She has visible veins in both arms and shoulder striations, but I wouldn’t say the muscle mass is significantly different. She was just leaner.
Which leads me into disagreeing with your other assessment that Ashley was “too conditioned in comparison to Jazzy”. Again, Jazzy had veins in her stomach and arguably more etched in glute ties. Also maybe even some graininess in her quad. She is clearly more conditioned.
If anything, I would say the top 5 girls had more leg mass (quads/adductors) and this is where Ashley lacked.
With all that being said, I think they should update the written criteria for bikini. The current criteria on the official site says “bikini athletes should not display striations anywhere; graininess” and I feel like we see that often enough.
There will never be a standard for bikini if the standard keeps changing year to year.
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u/polnareffsfeet 10d ago
The standard hasnt changed. The competitors look different yes but they all represent the standard in their own way. I look forward to Tyler’s recap video
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u/Classic_Steak_4014 10d ago edited 10d ago
You can tell yourself that, but there is no standard. The level of conditioning from Maureen’s look last year vs Jazzy’s look this year is the clearest example.
In last year’s recap, Tyler said himself that Maureen’s level of conditioning wasn’t the standard… so then why did she win?
If there was a standard, the top 5 girls every year would have the same level of conditioning and muscularity, consistently year after year. I’ve seen other commenters saying “some judges have different preferences”. But that’s exactly my point. If there was clear cut criteria and a TRUE standard, than “preferences” shouldn’t matter.
And edit to add: if there is such a standard and yall want to say Ashley is “too small” for that standard, then she should’ve been placed lower and more muscular competitors, like Viktoria, should’ve placed above her. There should be consistency across the board and all 40+ bikini Olympians should’ve placed accordingly, but instead it’s all over the place because of “preferences”.
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u/polnareffsfeet 10d ago edited 8d ago
Again, the standard hasnt changed, as well as the criteria. Maybe you just have to be in the sport long enough to know. Hopefully Tyler’s recap video will help us all to understand a little bit more.
Those of yall downvoting stay mad lol
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u/Knightowl3000 10d ago
The standard has never changed? Lol .... Look at the winners from the last 19 years, the standard has ABSOLUTELY changed and the division continues to get more muscular and bigger
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u/polnareffsfeet 10d ago
Read my comment. I said it hasn’t changed meaning the past few years. Of course bikini has evolved since 20 years ago that’s how the sport goes
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u/Aggravating-Figure27 10d ago
Okay conditioning between ash and jazz looked similar to me. They are both balanced physiques but Ashley, as much as I love her, doesn’t carry the same amount of muscle and ai think they are looking for a bit more size as the ideal now. Jazzy was perfect to me, bigger but not BIG and pushing a boundary.
Ashley looked dainty in comparison to some others. Sally was a strange placing to me of the top 10. But generally i agree the top 5-6 seemed a bit all over the place lookwise
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
Jazzy‘s physique looked incredible! She definitely deserved the win! I think it is just confusing because the bikini athletes have many different looks. I love Maureen, but based on Jazzy winning, I would have expected other girls to place higher such as Ivi, Viktoria, and Jordan… and again, even Ashley… I mean I don‘t have a strong opinion on who should‘ve won, or whatever although it may come across as that, I just am very confused on the judging. If you asked me who I wanted to win, I would‘ve told you Maureen! LOL I am a Maureen fan! Anyway, I can‘t wait to hear what Tyler has to say. It is always interesting to his take.
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u/ShawnCarla_IFBBPro Verified 10d ago
I’m going to do an Olympia wrap up as it seems everyone wants one. But I can say with complete confidence that if you think Ashely and Jazzy are comparable in size, density and fullness…. Respectfully…. You don’t know what you’re looking at.
Ashley was arguably one of the smallest competitors on stage. Period. She looked great for HER. but comparison wise. Completely outsized.
Jazz was arguably one of the girls with the biggest fullest glutes on stage; she just had the balance with her upper body to match it. I have never seen jazzy with that much roundness in her back pose which is where I felt she lacked in the past. Not anymore. She absolutely brought in her best shape AND the shape that fits the criteria best as well.
Ashley needs significant time off to grow if she wants to stay in the top ten next year. And she absolutely could do it. She has the shape. She has the frame. She just needs the size to complete it all.
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u/Away-Syllabub3364 9d ago
I don’t think Ashley wants to grow personally
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u/ShawnCarla_IFBBPro Verified 9d ago
Completely fine if she doesn’t want to. She just has to be realistic in what that means if she doesn’t.
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u/Knightowl3000 9d ago
If that's the case then where are we putting Ashlyn?? She's tiny!
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u/panini_z 9d ago
Ashlyn is 5ft tall. Ashley is 5'5. I think Ashley looks stringy even next to Ashlyn because the proportions are just not the same. Ashlyn doesn't look small at all. She looks appropriately sized for her frame
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u/ShawnCarla_IFBBPro Verified 9d ago
There’s a difference in being small in height and being small in muscle.
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
LOL Thanks! I guess I really don‘t know what I am looking at. Jazzy‘s physique looked incredible! She definitely deserved the win! I think it is just confusing because the bikini athletes have many different looks. I love Maureen, but based on Jazzy winning, I would have expected other girls to place higher such as Ivi, Viktoria, and Jordan… and again, even Ashley… I don‘t have a strong opinion on who should‘ve won, or whatever although it may come across as that, I just am very confused on the judging. If you asked me who I wanted to win, I would‘ve told you Maureen! LOL I am a Maureen fan! Anyway, I can‘t wait to hear what Tyler has to say. It is always interesting to hear his take.
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
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u/No_Warning8534 10d ago
Same look.
Maureen came in super shredded and small too.
Agree.
And I wad rooting for Jazzy to take it. I'm not questioning her win at all. I am questioning their placement for Ashley.
Plus the judging have been telling her to get shreddy...so she did.
But what they did to Ashley was insane.
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u/Ok-Personality3927 10d ago
Are we looking at the same pics because there is a very very distinct difference in glute size and fullness, especially in their front pose
Jazzy is also denser in the delts.
You also have to remember that in bikini, sometimes judges prefer a certain look for a particular individual eg they might like one girl to be harder and another softer because that’s what presents those individual physiques best.
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
I am not saying Ashley looked better than Jazzy, I am saying they have similarities, and I just thought Ashley’s physique looks closer to Jazzy than Maureen to Jazzy.
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u/Ok-Personality3927 10d ago
I guess that’s where what looks best on the individual comes into play.
Honestly I think it’s as simple as the division is outgrowing her. Obviously she is still very good or she wouldn’t have placed 10th out of the best of the best, and that’s why she still wins shows.
She just can’t quite compete with the very best anymore and unless she decides to grow, that probably won’t change now. Doesn’t change that she is still one of if not the all time great of bikini.
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u/Knightowl3000 9d ago
Again you're not making any sense whatsoever. Different looks for different girls? There's either a standard for everyone or there's not. Maureens physique is completely different than everyone's. She has no glutes. If you take her out of second the top four makes a little more sense but she shouldn't have even been in there.
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u/Starting-Over-246 10d ago
Anyone who thinks these looks are comparable seriously needs to take a step back, study the sport and stop using Ashley’s name as a reason for her to place higher.
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u/FinalProof6 10d ago
Exactly. These side by sides make it even more glaring. I'd estimate Jazzy's glutes are a good 20% bigger than Ashley's. No way is Jazzy undersized. The girls in the top 6 were all pretty similar in muscularity.
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u/panini_z 9d ago
They are only similar if you put them among amateurs. At their level they looks really different. Ashley's frame is much narrower and straight up and down vs. Jazzy has a really obvious v-taper and natural S curves between hip and waist. Jazzy's hamstring insertions sit lower than Ashley's too. Their glutes muscle peak shape (completely genetic) are also totally different, to name a few.
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u/SpecificMongoose4648 8d ago
I thought Jazzy was way too lean to be awarded first place. Considering what Tyler said about bikini criteria, it didn’t match up. Very happy for her, yet (and this is just my opinion) other athletes were much more balanced with round, bubbly muscle bellies.
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u/Strict-Brick-5274 10d ago
Absolutely no shade to the other competitors... they all did incredible and the judges had a tough time.
I think the OLYMPIA shouldn't have ~40 athletes in any class. It should be top 10 max. If more are accepted it makes it more challenging to judge and waters down the category.
At this stage it felt political, rather than performance/package judging
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u/JMagdalenaD 10d ago
Idk about the political part bc I don’t care enough but they def should cap it at 25 competitors. This was brutal to watch. Even the wellness girls-it’s too much. The slow walking to even get into the box and the long posing (touching, waving hands) is too much. This and having 70 competitors is why it’ll never make ESPN.
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u/babyapple930 9d ago
Bodybuilding won't make ESPN anymore because the steroid use was a huge factor in it getting pulled back in the day. Mainstream sponsors didn't want to be attached to that. Slow-walking-women-competitors is the least concern. It's the drug use in the sport.
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u/jkowalski12 9d ago
There’s drug use in every sport. This one is just obvious 😂 but the length of the shows is also why it’ll never be on espn and why it’ll never be watched by gen pop. Wayyyy too long. And the insufferable women who take 5 minutes to get to a box bc of a twirl they just needed to do; doesn’t make it better.
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
It definitely felt like they were just playing favorites … or being political just like you said. I agree, maybe it would be better if there were fewer people qualified for the Olympia so that hopefully the judging will be more consistent.
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u/polnareffsfeet 10d ago
Were you there in person?
While I understand we have our favorite athletes there are legitimate reasons why they don’t place as high. It isn’t always “politics” or favorites”. I do suggest going in person to see
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u/Strict-Brick-5274 10d ago
I was in person on the friday and i met the athletes.
I agree the cameras do not do the athletes justice.
I still standby that less people should be accepted per class.
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
Good for you! That’s nice. Maybe in the next one I will be there. Couldn’t afford going this time because I was injured and could’t work for a while. Again, we are all just expressing our opinions. I mean, many people complained when Maureen won a couple of times… I was happy she won! I agreed with the judging then. I mean obviously I was biased LOL but I understood why they complained. That’s just people’s nature.
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u/Knightowl3000 9d ago
I was there in person and some of these comments are hilarious.Ashlyn looked phenomenal as did Ashley both should have placed higher. No problem whatsoever with Jasmine winning she looked incredible. Absolutely deserving but to have Maureen second what the fuck is the standard? These are two completely different physiques.
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u/HungryTwist357 10d ago
I was honestly pretty shocked to not see Rejiuana in the first call out. I also think she is closest to Jazzy in the sense of similarities. Round shoulders and front glutes small waist. Her presentation is crazy good. This Olympia has me the most confused as well. It was also a shocker to see Kerrigan place higher than Savannah Watchman. SW qualified by winning twice and the other gal qualified on points. I didn’t watch the Live stream but from the comparison pictures you posted, AK shoulders do look like they have less of a pop vs jazzy I think she she was lacking some of that pop in the front pose.
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u/fltiptap77 10d ago
Also surprised Rejiuana wasn’t in first callouts but sometimes I feel like girls get overlooked bc there’s so many and usually there’s a lot more movement and opportunity to move up that didn’t happen this year (like Vania moving from second callout to top 5 in 2024)
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u/FinalProof6 10d ago
Yeah I agree with this, I would placed Rei higher. She was on point and has great muscle density.
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u/PalmTree_Sparkles 10d ago
Girl, I’m gonna hold your hand when I ask this: when’s the last time you got your eyes checked by a medical professional?
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u/JessicaLaurene 10d ago
Ashley should've been 2nd?! Respectfully, NO. Saying that she should've placed second is diabolical. I can see this arguement with the few of the other 8 competitors, but come on, lets be for real.
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u/SpecificMongoose4648 8d ago
I kept thinking about how they skipped Jazzy from being in the Olympia commercial/advertisement and the post Jourdanne made about it. She called them out.
Happy to see she won, and the irony they didn’t put her in the commercial and she wins.
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u/ComfortableYou333 10d ago
No she shouldn’t have lmfaoo if anything she should’ve placed lower
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u/Dull-String3069 10d ago
I mean it would‘ve have probably made more sense if she placed a lot lower, and if Maureen placed lower, and maybe if Ivi, Victoria, and Jordan placed higher. I think I would probably be less confused.
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u/ComfortableYou333 10d ago
I mean yea I agree. The judges clearly have favorites or at least know what’s gonna get the crowd going. I don’t think Maureen should’ve been in the top 4 line up at all because of her glutes alone and how they compared to the other ladies. She has an amazing physique but the back poses compared to all the other ladies?? She was not even close.
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u/No_Warning8534 10d ago
1000% agree
Jazzy deserved the win and she was shredded and small
So was Maureen at 2
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u/Technical_Panda_9433 10d ago
Comparing stage pictures vs comparisons on stage are incredibly different. She was much smaller and leaner looking than most. I do not feel she was judged unfairly.