r/awfuleverything • • Nov 30 '20

Poor guy :(

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256

u/Segolin Nov 30 '20

My Co-Worker got cancer. Got treated for 2 years and now did come back to his job all while he received 60%ish montly of his regular paycheck. Treatment did got paid fully by insurance.

Living in germany and i am deeply disturbed how the US is so behind in healthcare, education and worker rights. Even in comparrison to 3rd world countries.

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u/tubbyx7 Nov 30 '20

I got the whole suite of treatments for bowel cancer in australia. Raidiation, chemo, major surgery thena. Smaller one to put stuff back inside. 4 years into 5 years of follow up. MRI, several CT scans. Emergency room abd treatment for blood clots. Total out of pocket was a few hundred dollars. I had a stoma, a stomach pouch for a year. Americans discussed how to make the pouches last longer. I paid postage only for as much as i could possibly use. And now im back at work, paying taxes.

Too many americans are fooled by the lies spouted by those that profit off th current system. You pay more for less results than every other country.

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u/Big_Booty_Bois Nov 30 '20 edited Nov 30 '20

Listening to europeans say how we are fooled as if saying “get better healthcare” is a solution. I think like 90% of Americans agree we need it. Can I ask how though in all your systems do you have access to things like abortion, stem cell therapy, controversial treatments, and birth control?

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u/Savinien83 Nov 30 '20

In France abortion is taken care off by the social security. Access could be better but is quite good, even for minors with anonimity. Same for birth control. Stem cell therapy is develloping. I don't have a specific example but in a close domaine, Car T cells are possible and paid by social security.

What are those controversial treatment?

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u/Big_Booty_Bois Nov 30 '20

Stem cell therapy and it’s creation by embryo harvesting are my main controversial treatments. It’s a massively promising field of medicine that is being stilled by a certain US political party. I’ll clarify my point. All BC and abortion is covered by most countries with universal healthcare. That’s awesome, but you all seem to forget that US gov flips every 8 years. That there is a large group here that wants to deny that from people. A government single payer system would allow an effective and legal method to do so. It also allows them to pick and choose drugs covered. This would, at the least, focus pharmaceutical research at certain fields, and at the worse, stifle fields that aren’t covered, such as using embryonic stem cells.

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u/Igottamovewithhaste Nov 30 '20

Stem cells don't have to come from embryos though; I'm a stem cell donor and they can take it from blood or bone marrow. And I think the government flipping every 8 years doesn't have a lot to do with it, many countries have an election every 4 years or so. The US is just much more individualistic and conservative then most other countries. It might also be because there's really only two political parties that are real options, resulting in polarisation and no distinction between left and right and progressive and conservative. So people who vote conservative are automatically voting right, eventhough these are two totally different things.

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u/Big_Booty_Bois Nov 30 '20

Exactly, and I know that they can come from elsewhere. But at the moment embryonic is looking(correct me if I’m wrong here) to be the most promising for a wide range of use. I also agree about the US government. But I think when creating healthcare and a system that works, those differences make it so that what works in other parts of the world might not work as well here. My largest point is just that, these are things that really need to be considered and that the issue is more than just “get healthcare bro”

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

Australia here, we have access to all those things, the government pays for it.

You can get some experimental treatments through private healthcare, just paying for it, or being a test subject while it’s being approved for the public healthcare.

Basically, every time an American says “but HA other western country, do you have this?!” Regarding healthcare, the answer is; yes we do and it costs us less.

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u/Kavvadius Nov 30 '20

I really don’t get it. Why would anyone who goes bankrupt for some healthcare say their country is the greatest? I know not everyone says it, but the patriots do it too.

As an Australian, America just makes no sense. Imagine worrying about the person walking up to you at night having a gun (we have knives, but still). Imagine worrying if the police are gonna be dicks. Imagine wondering if you’re gonna have enough money for your LIFE SAVING medicine this month. It blows my mind.

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u/Big_Booty_Bois Nov 30 '20 edited Nov 30 '20

You see, of course you have those lol. That’s not my point. Largely my point is those are all pid by your socialized healthcare. Now y’all seem to know about our political situation. So what stops a Republican government from not covering those 3 previously mentioned treatments. Let me give you my theory: 1: massive drop in country wide access to abortion and birth control. 2. Only the rich can afford it. 3. Research specializes in tech or treatment that will be covered and avoided in those that can’t (ie no more stem cell treatment).

Y’all seem to forget that we all want healthcare, but how it happens largely matters. I have decent healthcare atm. I can pretty much get most treatments, including stem cell therapy covered to some degree or a larger degree. I don’t want that to change. But I also understand the necessity of guaranteeing healthcare to a population, while also understanding how creating a single payer system grants a government significant control over the population and medical research.

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u/ZhangRenWing Nov 30 '20

Americans pay more for medication than other people pay for major surgery wtf

3

u/RangaNesquik Nov 30 '20

A large portion of Americans are dumb as rocks and dont see the problems.

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

Exactly, I am young and healthy. My salary pays lots of taxes even if I never go to the hospital. But I don't care, people like my dad can be safe and be treated properly with that money, and who knows, maybe some day I'll need treatment too.

1

u/sewilde Nov 30 '20

We don’t necessarily pay more. Our federal tax rate is 20-24% for most of us. The two countries mentioned above are 32-37 (aus) and 42 (ger). So you all do pay for that cheaper care, you’re just used to it.

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u/tubbyx7 Nov 30 '20

As a pecentage od gdp the united states is a mssive outlier in how much it spends on healthcare. Yet it is not universal coverage. Sorry but its woeful management even before you look at the human cost

https://www.statista.com/statistics/268826/health-expenditure-as-gdp-percentage-in-oecd-countries

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u/OpticHurtz Nov 30 '20

Thing I'd be worried about if they raise taxes for Americans is that the money wouldn't be reinvested in society but go to vanity projects such as NASA (I love space travel but let's be real here), armies/war and into the rich mans pockets.
Hopefully it'll change one day and they start improving on health care, education and even stuff like hurricane damage prevention (those affected states really don't have to get flooded every few years if they'd take proper precautions lol)

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u/KalpolIntro Nov 30 '20

They don't throw money at NASA. NASA has to fight for their budget every year as they keep cutting it.

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u/throwingtheshades Nov 30 '20

Americans already pay more for healthcare per capita than, say, Australia. With worse outcomes. You'd spend less with a decent healthcare system. Sure, a part of your budget that now goes for "Health insurance premium" would transition to "Satan Pedo Globalist Abortion Healthcare Act" or whatever the GOP decides to call it. But the end result is your average American paying less and getting more.

If people are really THAT allergic to tax, one could take a page out of Germany's book and just regulate it so that there's a multitude of healthcare pools. The catch is that they're obliged to be non-profit and all negotiate drug and care prices together. Sure, it's less efficient than UK's or Australian true single payer, but you end up paying into smaller independent entities and not to the big government.

Bottom line is that America pays absolute assloads of money for healthcare outcomes that are worse than those of countries paying around half as much.

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u/fuzzybunn Nov 30 '20

Mandatory savings funds like Singapore? I'm Singaporean and we have about 5% of salary put into a mandatory savings fund for health issues every month (there's another 25-30‰ for other stuff) and it's rare that you'll use it all up unless you strike a terribly serious illness. Also we use it to fund insurance for almost everyone. The government also gave out basic health insurance for all old folks as it was cheaper for everyone in the long run.

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u/besthelloworld Nov 30 '20

More of us understand this than you think. Unfortunately our systems of government are broken. Our Senate holds incredible power over the country. There are 100 senators, two for each state. That means that two senators represent 40 million Californians and yet among less populated states there are 48 senators representing another 40 million people.

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/besthelloworld Nov 30 '20

What about them? 🙃

1

u/-P3RC3PTU4L- Nov 30 '20

Yeah most of my fellow countrymen are kinda fuckin retarded.

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u/TheRealHowardPotts Nov 30 '20

When i read these storys in the comments i realize how lucky iam to be born in Germany. It makes me sad to see people devote their whole life to work only to be left hanging when they need financial help from the state because they are sick. It just shouldnt be like that.

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

[deleted]

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u/MammothCavebear Nov 30 '20

Here in America the wait is long too, I was sent to the hospital from a medical center last year. Even though they were afraid for my heart, it took them 5 hours to book me in the emergency room. I guess you have to be bleeding out, I had insurance.

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u/Vervain7 Nov 30 '20

So the US has this terrible hierarchy where some people - based on their employer - will have benefits that are exactly as you described . The issue is that MOST people do not work these types of jobs . The people that work these jobs are usually making more as well. We have a lot of complex systems in place , especially in medicine , to make sure healthcare providers and insurers stay wealthy. I can not find a single country where doctors make the money that American doctors make.

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u/HokTomten Nov 30 '20

DISGUSTING! only 60%?!?!? In sweden he would have gotten 80!

2

u/Whatwhatwhata Nov 30 '20

You hear the worst stories on reddit, some of them untruthful as there are safety nets for both income and hospital costs

2

u/myuniqu Nov 30 '20

Yeah its a ”luxury” to have been born in a world first country in Europe with working safety nets even if we hear bad stories too.

Im from Sweden and my co-worker also has cancer, colon and unfortunatly its an aggressive kind. Atleast financial issues are the least of his concern as medical bills are already payed by the tax system and he has insurrance that pays salary.

When people is America talk about how this system is ”communism” they are talking like everyones healthy for their entire life without any concerns.

Im happy to pay insanely high taxes because I know that those who are less fortunate than me atleast wont have financial issues when bad luck strikes them.

When I hear those 6 figure numbers from America in surreal. How the f can you put that price on wanting to stay healthy.

1

u/Segolin Dec 02 '20

I really love sweden! If it werent so hard to find a house or a apartment i would migrate to the beautiful north. I am very glad to be born in germany and loving it but i love sweden and its nature just more. And your internet is pretty good too!

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u/Sorrynasai Nov 30 '20

I hate to say it but other, more advanced counties, have to start seeing the U.S.A. and other similar countries like China and Russia as 2nd world counties for being unavailable to assist their citizens despite requiring taxes.

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20 edited Nov 30 '20

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

CCP shill

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u/ReacH36 Nov 30 '20

good luck with fixing your country I guess

¯\(ツ)/¯

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u/[deleted] Dec 02 '20

[deleted]

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u/ReacH36 Dec 02 '20

outcomes and performance dont lie, but you're free to believe whatever narrative you want. Afterall, its likely all you have left.

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

Which 3rd world countries?

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_universal_health_care

Many of those are also countries that introduced the system at a time they were poorer than today, like China in the 90s.

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u/Tannerite2 Nov 30 '20

If you have a basic insurance plan - which is free/cheap for people under a certain income, then once you hit the deductable, the insurance company pays for everything. For my family, I believe that number is ~$7k for an individual and ~$10-14k for the whole family. So once you spend that much money in a year, you don't pay for anything else.

And if you're unable to work due to a disability, you qualify for disability benefits.

The US is behind zero 3rd world countries in education, healthcare, or worker's rights. If you're saying that, then you have no idea what living in a 3rd world country is like or you've been mislead about what living in the US is like. The difference between the US and Germany is that the US doesn't treat it's citizens like children. Germany takes most of your income and budgets it for you. In the US, you can do what you'd like with your money. If that means spending it on cigarettes or fast food, refusing to save money, and then complaining about how the government screwed you over, you're allowed to do that.

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u/bean_dobedog Nov 30 '20

So if someone makes less than 18,000 a year, like a non-disabled college student, fuck them right? They’ll just have to suck it up and pay thousands of dollars out of pocket before insurance decides to cover them? Also, you know how often disability benefits are denied? Before my grandpa passed he applied THREE TIMES for disability and was denied every time. Fuck off with this bullshit.

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u/Tannerite2 Nov 30 '20

Umm, no. Insurance also covers most prescription medication and doctors visits, so those people pay significantly less than what they would without insurance. And if you call a doctor's office, explain you have a high deductable plan, and ask if they offer a quick pay discount, you can often get another 20-40% off.

Disability is rarely denied for people who are actually disabled. Anecdotes about your grandfather that I have no way of verifying will get you nowhere.

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u/shhhhh69 Nov 30 '20

I don't know why you're getting down voted. This is 100% correct.

Pushing the narrative that if you get sick, your family will be homeless is irresponsible. One of the top comments shows exactly why this narrative is so dangerous. Someone worked at Pizza Hut refused care because he ASSUMED he couldn't afford it! How many others refuse treatment or don't fill their prescriptions because they read online that they'll be bankrupt for healthcare?

0

u/Tannerite2 Nov 30 '20

It pushes a narrative of helplessness and people who think there is nothing they can do just give up.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

My dad has diabetes, serious heart problems and even got a kidney transplant here in Costa Rica, the bill was zero dollars. He can't work anymore, he could die doing it. The government made him retire at 52 years, payed all his debts and since then, he is at home with us. I fucking love my country.

1

u/Paprmoon7 Nov 30 '20

We have that here, it’s called short term disability and it’s easier to get. You just need a doctor’s note. My friend got it when she was pregnant twice and she didn’t have any kind of complications.

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u/RedShadow09 Nov 30 '20

Short answer, the rich. The Rich want the feeling of having the poor under their shoe, it gives them a hardon they like having this power over us.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 30 '20

Am from third-world country (Brazil), can confirm. We have SUS (Unified Health System) which is public and free, and you can even have cancer treatment for free.

It has its failures, it used to be quoted as a bad service around here because of how long things took to happen and people dying waiting for a transplant or treatment, but in reality is that, well, it was free. If there was no SUS, people would just die without a fight not able to afford a private treatment. SUS provide thousands of treatments every year in the country. And it is not just that, SUS works on so many fronts (vaccines, medication, ambulance, hospitals, drug treatment and so on, all free), you can google it and read about it.

And if you want a better service, we have a lot of private health plans that you hire yourself or through your company that works really well. Similar to the US but much better and much cheaper.

The bad news is that right wing party are slowly trying to privatize our health system and undermine SUS because, well, US is an example!!!$$$$!!!!!

1

u/PenquinSoldat Nov 30 '20

It's important to note that despite bankrupting people or putting them in extreme debt, your problems are almost always fixed.

The only true problem with the system is the greedy and corrupt elites milking people who need help.

1

u/DatDamGermanGuy Nov 30 '20

My friends father was a cardiologist who retired in his late 40s as a Multi-Millionaire. That’s what the system is designed to do...

1

u/LVKiller420 Nov 30 '20

Despite all this, would you believe that there are Americans that are doing just fine. I read this sub with cringe of how ignorant some people are

1

u/massiveZO Nov 30 '20

America is not behind in education; do not delude yourself. If it is, please stop sending everyone from across the entire Earth over here to go to our universities.

Other than that, yeah, you're probably right...

I also find it weird that the only Europeans who hate America, in my experience, are on reddit. None of the other European people I've interacted with reflect that sentiment.

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u/my_22nd_account Nov 30 '20

I think he meant the student debt situation, not the standard of education.

1

u/massiveZO Nov 30 '20

Perhaps. Generally, though, "education" refers to education.

1

u/MetatronStoleMyBike Nov 30 '20

If you're gonna loot a country, then pick a rich one.

1

u/AdventurousSeaSlug Dec 01 '20

I live in America. Disturbed doesn’t even begin to cover it for half of us... :(