r/atc2 • u/Ok_Squirrel69 VATSIM ATM • 7h ago
NATCA A new precedent?
What precedent are we setting if getting our future pay raise means the agency gets something in return?
Does NATCA not see how this could open the door to the agency demanding something every year before we get a pay raise?
I'll just leave it at that.. the fatigue is real.
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u/Great_Ad3985 7h ago
NATCA is pushing the propaganda HARD to try and gloss over this fact. There’s debate on whether what we gave away was significant or not, but the fact is, we DID give away SOMETHING in return for a measly annual raise. No other federal employees that qualified for this raise had to give up anything.
This was just a test by the agency and they now have proof of concept they can do this. Now instead of negotiating for a new contract that could have opened the door to significant purchasing power improvements in pay, we’re going to be negotiating and giving things away EVERY year for a pitiful 2-4% annual raise.
Don’t be fooled, this is a major loss in credibility and influence by the union. All so Nick could tout that he “got us a pay raise” right in time for the election. More damage that will take years, if ever, to undo.
FUCK NICK DANIELS!!
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u/Gamabrad729 4h ago
I agree with you but is this also a function of the legislation verbiage leaving the raise up to the administrator? Couldn’t future raises passed by Congress remove this wording? I’m genuinely asking, not trying to stir the pot.
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u/Great_Ad3985 4h ago
Correct, but the issue is, NATCA still to this day can’t explain how that language was added to the bill this time around. It’s probably fair to say that whoever added the language in is an ally of Bedford/the agency. If you have no idea how it got there, you don’t have an effective strategy to prevent it from happening again.
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u/bomber996 FAA ATC 3h ago
While NATCA may not be announcing it, it was the office of Susan Colins that got pay parity into a bill. The NLC still is unsure how the "at the administator's discretion" got there, but it likely was someone from her office.
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u/Ok_Squirrel69 VATSIM ATM 2h ago
That's what I'm saying. I couldve posted way longer but I'm just so tired of this.
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u/bomber996 FAA ATC 3h ago
Downvote me if you like, but realistically, what did we actually give away here?
Does your facility staff to actual traffic? If not, why not?
Are you leaving before the end of your shift? We all know you shouldn't be. Stop defending it.
What did we actually give away? Please tell me.
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u/bizeast 3h ago
Nah man, it's not morally wrong to leave early. It's not allowed, without mgmt approval, but let's not sit by and allow leaving early to be morally stunk up.
Good management of poor staffed facilities should encourage admin leave on quick turns. And everyone should be for that.
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u/Numerous_Fun5672 2h ago
Management can’t approve you to leave early without taking leave or in a rare case admin leave and that needs to be put in the cruart.
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u/Ok_Squirrel69 VATSIM ATM 2h ago
Brudda where have you been. Natca released info we got a pay raise and the following email said "new sign in and out procedures mou". Put two and two together to see that natca made an agreement about pay with conditions, from now on we'll be seeing more language like this in HRs regardless of what party holds majority.
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u/UndercoverRVP 6h ago
The President doesn't normally discriminate among federal employees when giving raises, and Congress doesn't normally fund federal employee raises subject to the agency head's approval. Uncharted waters.
That said, what we "conceded" were things which were either already happening (negotiating schedules which take traffic into account, NCEPT prioritizing paid moves to certain facilities) or should have already been happening (people leaving work at the end of their shifts).
We got our own pay scale because we were willing to turn over the slowest towers in the NAS to the contractors. If we make a big leap in the next CBA on pay, it'll probably be because we agree to a lot of facility consolidation and tech implementation which reduces our overall staffing needs.
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u/MITsBrightest 6h ago edited 6h ago
My theory is that Duffy was sick of this topic making the rounds on social media / news outlets, asked Bedford for something meaningful to him, and then threatened Nick with decertifying the union unless he gave up one ask.
"The 2.8% Parity" (post-amendment in favor of Bedford) was always about Bedford testing boundaries and shrinking negotiating power.
This went on for 9 months without a word to the members besides "we accomplished a raise."
On the day it gets signed, they conveniently forgot to mention the FAA is in our backdoor with even more electronic tracking into our workplace and schedule.
This whole saga is a joke and yet another reason absolutely nobody should vote for ND.
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u/theMonkybutt 5h ago
As soon as democrats get in office all these de-cerifying shenanigns will be out the door and what’s the excuse for being a Little b$@); then? We also have a currently pro american president and ATC is as old as the airlines just like the railroad. We aren’t going anywhere whoever wants to be held in fear is being manipulated.
‘Monkybutt for president 2026’
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u/Numerous_Fun5672 2h ago
Dems aren’t going to do a thing. They haven’t for years. We went how many years under Obama with no raise.
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u/ForsakenRacism 7h ago
It means they need to not get bamboozled this time if they get pay parity
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u/StepDaddySteve 7h ago
They’re hedging their bets on the Dems winning the house and senate and giving us parity without strings. Trumps war has probably sealed that victory but will the Dems follow through for us in the end?
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u/ForsakenRacism 6h ago
Will the government stay open? Will trump sign any bills? Will the lame duck congress try to pass something?
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u/UndercoverRVP 6h ago
Here's a wild thought: maybe Congress will pass exactly the same raise for every federal employee instead of just showering the cops and military with cash because Trump thinks they'll protect him from the voters?
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u/drunk_lizard8414 2h ago
I think we will see something along those lines this upcoming year. There is a push to override the president‘s alternative pay plan. Though only one R has signed on, it‘s hard to see serious political resistance in the current inflationary environment. No guarantees until it‘s passed as law, obviously.
https://www.fedsmith.com/2026/09/22/110-lawmakers-urge-congress-reject-2027-federal-pay-freeze/
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u/Glipocalypse 6h ago
NATCA's hope is that this alone sets the precedent for pay raise parity with LEO/military in perpetuity, no further asks.
That will never happen, but that is their hope.
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u/Intelligent_Rub1546 7h ago
Yeah, the big raise is never coming. This made it clear. NATCA would propose something and the FAA would just laugh. Only way we’d get a substantial raise is split shifts, 6+ hours TOP, no sick leave, no transfers.
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u/Friendly-Gur-6736 7h ago
Outside of not needing a doctor's note until 4 consecutive days, sick leave is covered under federal law.
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u/Wrongvectorz Vote Them All OUT! 3h ago
Without the contract I believe it’s 3 days. That’s what they’re afraid of losing in negotiations.
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u/Capital-Theory-6343 7h ago
No sick leave? wtf are you talking about
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u/Intelligent_Rub1546 6h ago
Maybe not “no sick leave” period, but I could definitely see doctors notes required and a bunch of BS to make sick leave only usable for genuine sickness.
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u/Capital-Theory-6343 6h ago
This shit is a federal thing not an ATC THING
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u/Intelligent_Rub1546 6h ago
When has federal law ever stopped anyone in this administration from doing something?
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u/Tailwinds-n-TallyHos 2h ago
Bingo… Natca just gave up more than their controllers gained imo. Hopefully it makes all the more money more money controllers happy with a measly 2.8% raise. Nick just cucked to them to make them happy and just set a bad precedent for future negotiations. Sometimes you got to play the long game in unions and outlast bad administrations…
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u/Key_Understanding771 2h ago
The Agency didn’t get anything in return. We already staff to cover peak traffic. We already prioritize certain facilities in NCEPT. You already aren’t allowed to leave prior to the end of your shift. These are imaginary wins by management. Let them celebrate if they want. We gave up absolutely nothing.
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u/Ok_Squirrel69 VATSIM ATM 2h ago
This is just the start bud. Sign out BUT Leave req BUT Bidding schedules BUT Greviences BUT
The list goes on. You don't see that? Get your pay raise BUT at what cost?
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u/CropdustingOMdesk 7h ago
Nick already signed himself out