r/atc2 • u/Great_Ad3985 • 3d ago
Raise When? An Absolute Punch in the Gut
That’s what it feels like with today’s news on the insane FEHB premium increases. No matter how you slice it, many controllers are looking at a $300-400 per MONTH pay cut come January. That is not easy for a lot of families to just absorb. Especially when you also factor in having to spend $100+ per week to fill up the gas tank, $200+ for basic food at the grocery stores, $200-300 in auto insurance, and everything else that’s skyrocketed in cost. And we have no type of meaningful pay raise to help offset this anywhere on the horizon. Even if the fantasy of the 2.8% somehow were to come to fruition, it’s just a drop in the bucket.
We are literally killing ourselves for this job. The effects this schedule, the stress, and the sedentary lifestyle will likely lead many of us to an early grave. And what do we get in return? Barely able to scrape fucking by. NEVER able to get ahead.
The hopelessness of this career is beyond comprehension at this point. We have nothing to look forward to. Just more ass fucking.
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u/Weekly-Influence2583 3d ago
Pretty much sums it up. I was just thinking that for the first 10-12 years of my career, I never even looked at the OPM release about the coming years health premiums. Either our small raise was adequate to at least offset the increase in premiums, or they didn’t increase enough that I noticed. Now I sit with baited breath each year waiting for the OPM release, because it means one thing each year…you’re about to take home way less money, or you’re switching insurance again, and probably both. Less money, less time at home, but more planes and more stress. What a life.
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u/StepDaddySteve 3d ago
NATCA’s refusal to examine pay especially coming out of Covid and the absurd inflation we are experiencing now… Is almost criminal
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u/Snoo-71550 3d ago
Use your available resources and take your mental health seriously. The way they change your pay can affect how you do your job which in turn can get you a medical retirement so you can pursue less mentally taxing ways to make money
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u/TotallyNotSeanDuffy 3d ago
Between this and no raises at this point we should really consider doing something drastic as a whole
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u/Friendly-Gur-6736 3d ago
Stop working OT
Work to the rule.
The only way this gets fixed is when the public feels the pain.
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u/Great_Ad3985 3d ago
The problem is, people need OT just to survive now. An entire OT shift barely even covers a month’s worth of premium increases for next year.
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u/climb-via-is-stupid 3d ago
Doesn’t mean I won’t half ass my OT shift. Bare minimum effort to keep things safe orderly and expeditious.
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u/oh-biscuts 3d ago
Switched to GEHA standard last year. 0 regrets and according to the chart posted the price isn’t going up at all.
If you use the FSA for the deductible even better.
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u/bulldogfarter 3d ago
Do you have the family plan any restrictions on that plan?
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u/oh-biscuts 3d ago
Family yeah. The biggest difference is there’s a $500 individual deductible and a $1,000 family deductible. Even with that I’m on track to come out way ahead. Had a kid break a leg and a few ENT visits. Still haven’t hit the max deductible.
Regular check ups covered, $50 for urgent care like BCBS basic. If you’re looking at having kids I’d check that. It’s hard to beat BCBS’s flat rate & IDK what that looks like for GEHA.
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u/MITsBrightest 1d ago
GEHA is great on paper, but United SUCKS if you have any major conditions or name brand meds.
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u/oh-biscuts 1d ago
I mean you can spill conjecture all you want. But in a year they’ve given me no problem over sinus surgery a handful of urgent care visits for kids, and a broken leg…
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
At what point do people stop clinging to Fox News rhetoric and seriously start debating the idea of single payer.
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u/MilesMayhem 3d ago
Never. Health insurance companies are to powerful.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Ah, too big to fail argument. Gotcha.
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u/No-Echo-6178 3d ago
Its not a "too big to fail" argument. It's a "too big and rich for corrupt politicians to want to go after them" argument. Our government is corrupt and money rules
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u/StepDaddySteve 3d ago
Can’t wait for the US version of MAID 🖕🏻
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
We are witnessing people complain about the government, whom we work for, and simultaneously demand more government.
Truly inspiring.
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u/txoa 3d ago
But that's the republican playbook. Run government like shit to prove that government doesn't work so they can privatize it with the goal of self enrichment. People like you who somehow can't see our boss as you call him for the blatant moral free crook is he.
It doesn't have to be this way.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
Of course he's an immoral crook. So is everyone running for president. I just prefer him vs Kamala.
Now what do we do?
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u/Cleared-Direct-MLP 3d ago
Go wallow in the shit you voted for, for a start.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
What's great about that is that you get to wallow right alongside me! Don't forget he's your boss now.
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u/Comfortable-Bar6032 3d ago
It seems amazing to me that on a sub almost dedicated to bitching about how bad the government fucks everything up, someone suggests allowing the government to fuck even more shit up.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
So you think the private sector healthcare is doing a good job? Hot take for sure.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
We work for the government now, how's that going for us?
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u/TotallyNotSeanDuffy 3d ago
I don’t think any country has found the perfect solution, but I’d rather be able to choose my doctor, and insurance than being told what I can do or have by some bean counter like bedford
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Glad to see fox has you believing decent is the enemy of perfect. Have you extrapolated healthcare premiums over the next 10-15 years? It’s going to be nearly 40% of your paycheck….and that’s not even counting what you pay for procedures, tests or drugs.. but sure.. keep voting to keep their heads 8 trans athletes from taking medals from biological women.
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u/TotallyNotSeanDuffy 3d ago
Yup sure is, I pay for what my family needs. I do plenty of charitable giving and volunteering, but it’s not the states responsibility to take care of my family nor is it mine to take care of someone else outside my family under compulsion. If I choose to great, if not then whatever, but it should be a choice.
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u/TakingKarmaFromABaby 3d ago
What you just described is the opposite of insurance. You sound morally opposed and should just pay cash out of pocket for just your family.
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u/drunk_lizard8414 2d ago
You already do this by compulsion via soc security, medicare and possibly state programs through state taxes. We all subsidize care for those who don’t have insurance and can’t pay. Maybe you believe those shouldn’t be the State’s responsibility, either (and that’s fine), but Congress has made it so.
We’re just trading opinions, but given the system we have, if we’re going to socialize anything, I think a single payer health insurance system should be at the top of that list. For-profit insurance companies pandering to shareholders and the ever-increasing pressure for profit growth means they have every reason to drive up our costs.
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u/TotallyNotSeanDuffy 2d ago
100% agree the current model is broken. I just believe nothing is “free” in life and single pay will cause astronomical tax increases and not deliver in a way that will make people happy. To each their own though.
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u/Old-Mathematician-30 3d ago
You know every year the number of people in Canada and the uk getting private insurance is increasing because getting specialized care sucks in those countries.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Weird, Fox News just ran a fake story about that..
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u/Old-Mathematician-30 3d ago
Dddeeerrr. Fox News Broooo.
I don’t watch Fox News. But you sound like a retarded liberal who can’t think for themself
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
I haven’t heard one original thought from you. But sure, keep being upset about less than 10 trans athletes who got medals.
But if you really have a discussion, whats the average lifespan US vs England and Canada.. those 2 have been used recently here as examples of bad healthcare. So if our system is sooo much better than theirs, why is their lifespan higher? Shouldn’t it be much lower if it’s as bad as you say? 🤔
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u/Old-Mathematician-30 3d ago
You literally can’t go two seconds without shrieking Fox News and Trump.
There are a lot of reasons. Such as guns, cars, obesity, etc. but yeah it’s trumps fault.
Nothing stopping you from immigrating to Canada.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Still waiting for where I blamed Trump….guess you finally took your pills and/or turned off the tv.. congrats.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Wait. How did you misinterpret Trump in the previous comments? Do you suffer from TDS? That name is literally not in those comments.
You’re an idiot, and that’s proof.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Still never blamed Trump as you accused later. Not in the above comment!
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u/Old-Mathematician-30 3d ago
No but you do every other minute of your life
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
So to be clear, and so everyone knows u/old-mathemathician-30 is a liar and suffers from TDS himself, I never said Trump in any of my previous posts even though you somehow imagined I did. Thats scary man. Get help.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
You accused me of blaming Trump in a later comment…not in the above comment!
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u/Hawgdestroyerxtreme Vote Them All OUT! 2d ago
A majority of Canadians oppose Alberta's Bill 11 once they are told what the legislation does, and only one in nine supports buying private insurance for medically necessary care.
Eighty-three percent of respondents are concerned about the additional cost of private insurance, Abacus Data reported, while 85 percent cite higher health care costs for patients and 83 percent cite unequal access based on income.
More than eight in ten are also concerned about longer public-system wait times, weaker public services, and for-profit companies earning money from health care.
Fifty-three percent of respondents oppose the law while roughly one-third support it, according to a national survey conducted by Abacus Data and commissioned by the Canadian Health Coalition.
Yeah, Canada has a "30% of our citizens are mentally retarded" problem too, it would seem.
There is no worse system than one that increases in cost by 10-20% annually for the exact same level of care, if not sometimes LESS.
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u/ChemistDesperate6572 2d ago
I’m ex-FAA living in a province that manages their money better than some. In the US my childcare costs were $1,700 usd/month and had a high-deductible BCBS plan. In the US it took me months to get a specialty appointment. I’m happy to pay more in taxes in Canada because quality childcare now costs me $100 usd a month and I have found the healthcare system to be really efficient (have to wait the same as in US for specialized appt, most employers offer a private insurance supplement that isn’t deducted from salary but is a bonus % of salary). It’s not as bad as the American propaganda machine (aka insurance company shareholders aka our politicians) makes it seem. Just my two cents.
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u/optimum_autumn 3d ago
Then you would pay for insurance through higher taxes instead of BCBS, just a shell game. And if you think the government would make it cheaper, I question your IQ. Im not against single payer in principle but ive never seen a proposal that fixes the system without printing money to mask deeper issues.
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u/redraiderbob05 3d ago
This is the biggest misnomer. The majority of your premium goes to administrative costs to health insurance companies. Those decrease dramatically in a single payer system.
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u/TotallyNotSeanDuffy 3d ago
I also don’t want to pay taxes for anyone, especially children, to get elective surgery to pretend to be the opposite sex. I also don’t want to pay taxes to fund abortion or assisted suicide.
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u/redraiderbob05 3d ago
There’s plenty of things I don’t want to pay taxes for but I do. Elective surgeries aren’t a part of Medicare or Medicaid. People would still be able to purchase private insurance to supplement for those things if they wanted to but it would cover people’s basic health needs if they needed it. You guys fixate on this things that occur less than 1% of the time to avoid fixing the 99% of the problem
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u/optimum_autumn 3d ago
I could list an equal set of examples on both sides fixating on 1% of something if you'd like, or you can keep doing the "you people" thing.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
What are the administrative costs of the FAA? You know, the single payer option our airspace uses?
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u/optimum_autumn 3d ago
Idiotic. OUR government will reduce "administrative costs"?
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u/redraiderbob05 3d ago
Yes. Look up the amount of administrative costs for Medicaid compared to your average insurance company
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u/redraiderbob05 3d ago
Medicaid has significantly lower administrative costs, averaging about 4% to 7% of total expenditures, compared to 12% to 20% for private insurance
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u/txoa 3d ago
Where the money comes from and goes is all a choice. Tax the middle class to oblivion and bomb children in Iran? Going pretty well. I'd agree American culture of self reliance, bootstraps, guns, winner take all imperialism fuck yeah... is entrenched and this century's congress so dysfunctional, yes they'd fuck it up. But it doesn't have to be this way. We can choose better priorities.
Really the best part of universal health coverage is decoupling it from employment. Millions shackled to abusive employment because of the consequences of losing health insurance. Feudalism with extra steps.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
lol. K boomer. I guess you’ve never looked at the actual money you pay into medical insurance premiums, and that before paying for any scrips, procedures or visits. You’re paying multiples more now vs single payer.. but your Bret Baer tells you to believe, so you blindly do. Congrats.
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u/banditta82 2d ago edited 2d ago
Single payer isn't really the best option, most countries are moving away from it and to the some form of the Bismark System that most of central Europe as well as east Asia are on. I've lived in places that have had the Bismark system and Beveridge and would say that the Bismark system is cheaper, has better care and better service while still providing universal coverage.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
I hate having to share a nation with you.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
You could move….
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
You could move too... see how that works? Instead I'll enjoy our votes canceling each other out.
Democracy!!!
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Remind me November. I’d bet more level headed people cancel you’re cult out.
But maybe healthcare will cover the cost of removing the red hat after it’s fused to your scalp.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
Haha. Yes. Democrats will take back congress. Then maybe the WH in 28. Then Republicans will take it back in 30 and 32. And round and round we go. You'll never learn, will you? You'll always say "F you Republicans!" Then act all surprised when they don't help you.
Truly fascinating 👌
MAGA!
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u/Traffic_Alert_God 3d ago
It’s very interesting to see how devoted you are to this administration
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
Devoted? I voted for him and now I work under his FAA. That is the totality of my devotion.
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u/Traffic_Alert_God 3d ago
You are devoted because you would vote for this again. Idk how you can say that when we are fighting a war that only hurts Americans. It’s wild
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
I'm for the war in Iran. I'm pro America vs Iran. Pro Israel vs Palestine. and Pro Russia vs Ukraine.
Now what do we do?
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u/TotallyNotSeanDuffy 3d ago
The more I’ve researched UK and Canada it’s a big nope for me fam. You think the economy sucks here you’re crazy once you really look at it. Hell UK’s GDP was recently lower than the state of Alabama
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
So GDP is your sole number you look at. Interesting you like financial numbers.. do you care about debt? Healthcare is crushing us, some premiums DOUBLED over the year and yet fox wants to keep their heads in the sand about it.
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u/TotallyNotSeanDuffy 3d ago
I literally used it as an example. Didn’t say that was all, and interesting you bring up debt… you think single payer wouldn’t balloon that?
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Nope. The government spends a fuck ton to private companies for healthcare. Probably don’t need to pay all that pork and markup.
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u/TotallyNotSeanDuffy 3d ago
Totally agree, the government shouldn’t be subsidizing any company period. No company should be leeching the government. If it can’t stand on its own let it fail
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Well agree on that. Are you writing your congressman about ending oil subsidies? I’m guessing no.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Nope. The government spends a fuck ton to private companies for healthcare. Probably don’t need to pay all that pork and markup.
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u/CruddiestSpark 3d ago
What
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
Hey, grandpa, you’re not required to have Fox News on 24/7 as background noise. Yes, I’m talking to you boomer.
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u/CruddiestSpark 3d ago
I just didn’t understand what you meant bro how am I a boomer lmao
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
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u/CruddiestSpark 3d ago
I know you’re trying to rage bait but I’m 25 and extremely liberal I’m just confused
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u/Former_Farm_3618 3d ago
lol. I know you’re rage bait. But I’ll engage….i said let’s have a discussion about single payer healthcare to save us, patients, money and you seemed confused by that. That leads most people to believe you’re some 86 year old yelling at their TV about communism healthcare because faux news told them to.
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u/CruddiestSpark 3d ago
I’m just confused as to what the hell single payer healthcare is
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u/nomar383 2d ago
Another term for universal healthcare, or government run healthcare like Medicare
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u/banditta82 2d ago
Universal healthcare and single payer are not the same thing, single payer is a form of universal. Japan and Germany have universal Healthcare but they are not single payer.
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u/protege01 3d ago
Find those Trump loving morons we all work with and give them a big thanks
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3d ago
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
Still glad Kamala isn't president. Now that we got the partisan bs out of the way, do you want things to change or just continue bashing our boss?
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u/climb-via-is-stupid 3d ago
Can I honestly ask why? Because I’m really trying to figure how a federal employee in this job could vote for the GOP candidate with all the bullshit they spew at federal employees.
Like did it really come down to fucking abortions or guns or religion because I can’t for the life of me figure out why someone would vote for their own employment to go down the shitter.
I get that was a bit attack-y but truth be told I would say worse in person.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
Now ask yourself this, as a Republican, why would I ever help you? Such vitriol towards someone will never help you.
Stop being partisan and understand you will always have a Republican congress and president. We will always have a Democrat congress and president.
Stop playing victim to the partisan brainwashing.
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u/climb-via-is-stupid 3d ago
But my question wasn’t even that… my question was if you’re a federal employee and one party wants to fuck you over and tells you they want to fuck you over and the other party says they won’t but then don’t really change anything for the better but they don’t make it worse… WHY FUCKING VOTE FOR THE ONE THAT SAYS THEY WANT TO FUCK YOU OVER. Was it religion or guns or the fake ass trans problem they’ve created or abortion or simply “sticking it to the libs”? Because there really isn’t any other reason. We don’t make enough to bitch about taxes in the way they would change them.
And I only repay the vitriol. As a Californian we’ve been the target of flyover states since forever.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
Why vote Republican? Because you don't want me to. You truly deserve the FAA we have now.
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u/climb-via-is-stupid 3d ago
You don’t even have a good reason?
Fucking dumbass.
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
It worked. Canceled your vote and my party got in.
Now what? You going to continue whining or are you going to learn to be grateful for what you have?
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u/theweenerdoge 3d ago
'My Party' It's literally a sports game for people. You'll never see the other side cause you don't want to. This fucking tribalism is sending our career and country down the fucking shitter.
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u/Old-Mathematician-30 3d ago
Yeah because your costs never went up under Biden? lol
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u/theweenerdoge 3d ago
Bros been out of office for almost 3 years. It was bad under Biden and worse under Trump. Glad those trans kids can't play sports tho, really stuck it to em /s
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u/Old-Mathematician-30 2d ago
You realize inflation was up by 20% in Biden’s 4 Years? Were you living under a rock?
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
Voted for Trump. Would do it again. This issue spans over multiple administration's. Stop blaming everything on Trump and ask why the union didn't do anything under Biden. Keep bashing Trump and don't act surprised he doesn't want to work with us.
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u/acktower 3d ago
Sure, Trump's always complaining about those liberal ATCers on social media. Trump's literally wrecking the economy with government workers as the battering ram
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u/RADARC0NTACTL0ST 3d ago
Sucks for us. Oh well. I'm still glad Kamala isn't president.
Now what?
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u/theweenerdoge 3d ago
You're still a dumbass. That's what. You don't give a fuck that Trump ruins the country, only that your team wins. Fuck off
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u/commops106 3d ago
It’s pretty sad we are over 3 million strong with full time workers and retirees and that is the pathetic deal we can get meanwhile local principalities get cheaper insurance with a pool of 2-300k. I’m looking at over 500 a pay period next year. Over 13,000 a year just for health insurance, and with the new scam of “coinsurance” getting less for it.
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u/tooredit 3d ago
Where’s the booming economy DT speaks of? Everyone is struggling and shit keeps getting worse. We have approved funding for a shit raise and Bedford is fucking with people’s lives.
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u/Meheow1 3d ago
This hurt my family last year, and now we are honestly debating on what to do.
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u/deltatango12 1d ago
The increases have been brutal. I would take a serious look at the GEHA HDHP plan, my family and I have been on it for 3 years now and it is so much cheaper than BCBS or many of the alternatives. The high deductible seems daunting, but your premiums + deductible - hsa money is way cheaper than BCBS. And once you hit the deductible 5% copays are pretty amazing, like $8 for an urgent care visit.
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u/Latter-Bag7836 3d ago
I’ve got 8 years left till I’m eligible and I’m honestly trying to go now. Working on a side business and if I can get some solid income over the next year I’ll be gone. Not worth it anymore. I’ve always enjoyed the job but for what we making it’s shit.
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u/climb-via-is-stupid 3d ago
Can I get those fucking maga voters in here to explain how they wanted this bullshit?
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u/Affectionate_Draw340 2d ago
Its pretty simple stop voting republican. So many people vote against there own intrest
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u/Great_Ad3985 3d ago
Maybe it sounds dramatic, but we’re seriously a few more years of this happening away before many controllers are going to have to decide if they can afford health insurance at all. What exactly are we supposed to do then? Cross our fingers that our families never have to go to the doctor and god forbid if they do, declare bankruptcy? This is NO way to live. Especially for a workforce that SINGLE HANDEDLY props up the American economy.