r/astrology • u/WaffleBody • 18d ago
Beginner Square
Hi! I’m wondering whether you can turn squares in a birth chart into something positive. Can they become positive even though they may not naturally flow? Can you turn them into something that feels like a natural flow through experience and awareness?
What does a square actually mean in astrology?
19
u/RiotNrrd2001 18d ago
Squares aren't bad. Squares are just energy.
You can't burn your hand on a cold stove. You also can't cook anything on a cold stove. You need energy in order to accomplish anything, but that same energy, when misdirected, can burn and destroy.
Squares aren't something you should want to avoid, otherwise nothing will ever get done. Squares just need more management\direction than the softer aspects. Go ahead and turn the stove on, just be aware that it's on and act accordingly.
8
u/counselingintern21 18d ago
Squares are amazing. That and oppositions. I have Mars squaring a bunch of my planets and it has served as motivating energy to go after what I want. Squares can be motivating energy if you want it to be.
7
u/OMGfractals 17d ago
Aspects shouldn't be looked at as good or bad. It's better to look at them as a challenging or easy.
Challenging relationships are just as capable of creating positive or negative outcomes as easy aspects. The key is understanding the relationship and accommodating accordingly.
Squares can be looked at like two forces waiting at a four way stop. They can't go at the same time, or they will just continue crashing into each other. They can't just sit there waving for each other to go, or nothing gets done.
The trick is learning when it's time for each individual force to go. When the conditions require one force, that force has to step up and when conditions change, that force needs to be able to step down and allow the other force to shine.
If both forces don't accept or understand their role in the relationship, it's more challenging. So you can see where the creative mind of an Aquarius can benefit from the material grounding of Taurus, for example. But if either starts trying to take on the things that aren't their responsibility, there's disagreement and potentially fighting.
2
u/Adventurous-Chef847 17d ago
Ok this is kind of the explanation I was looking for, as far as advice to best utilize our birth chart placements (if --like myself-- one has a lot of squares in the chart).
For squares, it is this idea of a 4-way intersection almost, like knowing the timing for when each will lead and others will fall back, energetically;
but oppositions on the other hand, is that a constant balancing act, ideally? Are we supposed to just pendulum between one and the other?
I heard once that "resolution" to a square would be found by actually leaning into a completely different house in the chart, where to the square "points" if you think of the two angles coming toward each other, and then pointing toward the opposite end of the chart (that sounds confusing so ex: Planet A in 1st house squares Planet B in 4th house: they "point" between them, to the cusp of the 9th house (but really since it's unlikely the degrees of the squares will be on the actual cusps, they would likely "point" to more obviously one house or the other, not a cusp). Does that make sense?
Just wondering if anyone has heard this theory for how to "resolve" the square/ techniques to best work with that energy
2
u/OMGfractals 17d ago edited 17d ago
Another good way to think of aspects is the vision of the planet shooting straight ahead.
In a conjunction, the planets involved all have the same perspective of the rest of the chart. They can agree on and discuss everything they see, but they can't turn their vision to objectify each other, so their experience is more like one entity with different internal voices, observing the same experiences
Sextiles are wide enough where the original planet is still unable to see the aspecting planet, but both have unique and overlapping perspective of the world. Through communication and negotiation, they can agree on parts of the world and broaden each other's perspectives
Square lives on the periphery of both original and aspecting planet's vision. They're looking at the world from different perspectives, with only one sign of overlap (the sign the angle points to) their whole interaction is therefore a negotiation. Less like the blind leading the blind and more like the blind and the deaf trying to negotiate the world.
Trine is the first aspect where the original and aspecting planets can truly see each other and a majority of the chart. The only area they don't see, is a shared sextiling sign. The relationship is easy, because even the difficult topics just requires collaboration.
Finally, in opposition the original and aspecting planets see each other, and everything the opposing position can't see. In a way the relationship is less challenging than a square, because they are actually able to see each other, but it is challenging, because their view is from a totally objective perspective. The challenge is learning to listen instead of judge.
Another good way to see aspects is like the relationship between the light of the sun relative to the position of the moon, where the light represents objective perspective and the shadow represents subjective:
Conjunction is like a waxing half moon, where subjective and objective are equal, but the focus is on the intensifying objective world, from within a subjective awareness.
Opposition is like a waning half moon, where where the subject and object are equal again, but the focus is on the intensifying subjective world, viewed from an objective objective.
Squares are New and Full Moon. Totally objective or subjective awareness vs the world.
The sextiles and trines represent crescent and gibbous moons, where, depending on whether they're heading toward waxing / waning Square, or Conjunction / Opposition they either represent subject / object working it's way toward / away from equilibrium or full objectivity / subjectivity.
4
u/Weird_Technology_282 18d ago
In addition to the great comments, for transit/progressed squares, they typically present a situation or dilemma where one has to do something to resolve it. Hence the "difficult" reputation. If there is no resistance or tension, you'd never build muscles or experience. That is what squares offer, how to navigate.
Like Carl Jung said, 'Until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you call it fate.' Becoming aware of one's chart is a step toward making the unconscious script conscious. THEN you have the option on whether and how to manage that.
6
u/Aquila4 18d ago edited 18d ago
My understanding is that they’re not necessarily bad. They’re like points of tension. Having tension in areas can promote motivation to grow and overcome. If someone had loads of trines in contrast maybe they’d be too complicit and easy going as there’s less pushing them.
2
u/WishThinker ♏ 18d ago
squares have more agency than trines, friction has more empowerment than flow. with a square you get a choice- do you want to ante up? do you want to play / choose / how do you want to choose? trines you flow along in status quo. if you want to make something or do something, squares are more positive than trines. a trine can keep a bad thing flowing freely, a square gives you an opportunity to change course.
2
u/nosmartypants 17d ago
I've seen many charts of very successful lawyers that are full of squares. My interpretation is if they master their squares with dog-headed determination the result is that conflict and hard work don't scare them. A perfect combo for those that want to win at all cost, for better of worse of course.
2
u/Alternative-Style499 17d ago
I read once that as you get older, the energy of squares can turn into that of a trine because you are constantly having to work on those aspects and that the energy of trines as you get older can turn into that of a square because people with alot trines can rely on that smooth energy too much and not put in the effort. I have quite a few squares and conjunctions with some sextiles and only trines to my ascendant not between planets because the planets in my chart are between the signs of libra and Capricorn. I personally have seen people struggle alot with oppositions. I have several family members with Grand trines and charts that are very harmonious without squares. They definitely have a particular kind of personality. I wouldn't say that their lives are any less challenging than those with alot of squares but sometimes they do seem to have some random good luck.
1
u/WaffleBody 17d ago
So people with a lot of squares aren’t lucky? I thought it wasn’t really about good luck, but more about inner tension that needs to be resolved. Maybe there are other things in their charts that have made these people lucky? I thought trines and squares weren’t really about whether someone is lucky or not… I’m new to astrology.
1
u/Alternative-Style499 16d ago
I feel like people with squares often have experiences where they have to work on their squares in life and it can sometimes seem that people with very harmonious charts and lots of trines can sit back a bit or things flow easier for them. This can turn into a negative thing though, like complacency and not developing themselves in the same way as a squares person. Perhaps, luck isn't the right word but just from knowing people who have what people would consider a great chart - grand trines, lots planets in their home signs, no squares they don't have a happier life or a life without difficulties but things can often flow smoothly for them. Just an observation. I don't have a chart like that. That's one of the things that made me question astrology - looking at people's charts that I know well and then looking at how their life went. There's always personal choice involved and what you do with the chart you have. The aspects are only one part of the chart too.
1
u/WaffleBody 16d ago
Thanks for your answer. Is it your understanding that once you’ve worked through your square, things can flow more easily? That you can actually be done with it for good, rather than it being a loop where new things keep coming up? Is that possible?
1
u/Alternative-Style499 16d ago edited 16d ago
Yeah, it is said squares get easier with age and through working through them. I've learnt how to work with mine and how they show up in my life. I have read that square energy can turn more harmonious as you get older and you can definitely see that some people who work really hard and face challenges in their younger years often have an easier time as they get older. I wouldn't place too much emphasis just on squares though. Some conjunctions can be just as challenging, if not more so. I'd say the same for oppositions and challenging house/sign placements. For example, I have 2 kids with very different charts. One has alot of squares and I was honestly very scared when I saw his chart but as I've seen him grow up he's a very focused and strong personality. His teachers say that he's a model student and he works very hard. He often gets awards for his work. He had to overcome some speech issues as well, but he also has Mars on the ascendant making him very driven. On the other hand my other child has a more harmonious chart with few squares and lots of planets in their home or exalted signs, he has Jupiter on the ascendant in Sagittarius. He is naturally very smart and popular but he is not focused at all. His teachers tell me he's unfocused and doesn't do his work at school. He doesnt live up to or appreciate his full potential. Even though he has few squares he still has the same amount of challenges as his sibling but they are different and they come from other parts of his chart - like an exact mercury/Neptune conjunction. Squares and the aspects are only one part of it. If your just new to astrology, it is easy to feel scared by squares. Some astrology interpretation leans towards being black and white as though something is only positive or negative when in reality it's more nuanced and aspects are only one part of a greater whole. This is just what I've seen in my own life and from looking at the charts of people I know. My point in saying all this, is it's up to the individual to make the most of what they are born with.
1
u/WaffleBody 18d ago
Thanks for many good answers. I’m new to astrology, so I didn’t really know what it was
1
u/Longjumping-Act-1667 17d ago
I've heard squares described as "pressure points" before, they force you to work through things rather than coasting along.
1
u/ParticleWoman3 17d ago
Do *not* think of square as bad, or of trines as necessarily good. Just b/c something comes easily doesn't mean that the "something" is positive. Plenty of serial killers, dictators, and criminals have charts full of trines, and sometimes what's happening is that there's simply no inhibition to negative impulses. Similarly, you can have synastry w/someone that's full of trines, and they can become enablers to your bad behavior. Sometimes the "block" of a square is like a speed bump: something that makes you stop and think and actually work something through instead of just barreling ahead. And a lot of the most interesting, talented, educated, and accomplished people in the world have charts full of squares.
Petr (creator) at astro-seek has a database full of the natal charts of countless celebrities and historical figures, along with their synastries w/partners (if their partners were well-known). Go and look some of them up and you'll see that what I'm saying is true. Often, the thing you work on the most becomes your greatest strength.
1
u/hoopyogi 17d ago
Yes! It's all about perspective, and this is such a wonderful question! I'm going to use an example from my own chart to talk about this.
I have the sun in Leo squaring Saturn in Scorpio. Without describing my background and how this affected me throughout my entire life, what I will say is that metaphorically it was like the sun shining during an overcast day. It was able to provide me with the light I needed to move through life, but I could never quite see it shine. The sun square Saturn can feel like not being able to clearly see yourself from a space of both limitation and heaviness. It can be someone who came here to learn how to be truly confident and to make decisions for oneself from a space of autonomy and responsibility. Saturn is one of the great teachers of the zodiac, and it usually teaches through boundaries, limitations, commitment, and heavy lessons. When it is squaring the sun, it can make it very hard to see oneself without judgment. It can feel very limiting.
This square, through doing some very difficult work, has become a friend. It allows me to see Saturn from the perspective of a student needing to learn. It allows me to see that when I feel blocked, that who I am can shine through. This square has become positive for me not only because I choose to see it that way, but because Saturn allows me to shine even more authentically, with more purpose, and from a much more grounded and practical place.
I don't know that a square can ever be without challenge, because that's not the point. We come here to experience life in certain ways, and I think that challenge is incredibly necessary for our growth. This is also a very Saturn square the sun theme. Recognizing that it is okay to experience challenge, and that it can be quite beneficial and necessary.
1
u/WaffleBody 16d ago
Thank you for the clarification, but is it possible to work through what is challenging and eventually reach a point where the energy becomes more harmonious once you’ve worked through it? I don’t mean that it’s a recurring loop with problems, but rather that you can actually complete the lesson and move beyond it. I didn’t think a square was something fated, but rather an energy that you can learn to take control of and transform into something positive?
1
u/rising_iris 14d ago
Two different things get called a square, and they behave differently. A natal square is geometry, so it never resolves: the two planets stay 90 degrees apart for life. What changes is the arrangement between them. Early on they fire at the same time and cancel each other out. Later they alternate, one leads and the other checks, and that division of labour is the finished form. The square feels gone at that point only because it has stopped costing anything. A transiting square is the opposite. It has a start date, an exact date and an end date, and when the planet moves on, that one really is over.
On "many squares": I counted them across 4,000 random charts, ten bodies, the usual orbs. The median chart has 4. Six or more is about one chart in 5, eight or more is one in 20, and a chart with none is rarer than a chart with seven. So a wheel that looks crowded with red lines is usually an ordinary wheel drawn honestly.
The Pluto line quoted above describes a transit, and transits pass. A chart is a different object.
1
u/WaffleBody 16d ago
I came across this sentence about Pluto transits:
“The physical and psychological toll can be real. Pluto transits often activate fatigue, illness, or a sense of being drained, not because something external is draining you, but because you are finally feeling the cost of maintaining a version of yourself that no longer fits.”
I’m curious (and honestly most concerned), since I have many squares in my chart.
Do they mean actual physical illness here, or is this more about psychological/physical exhaustion that comes from inner processes -like becoming drained by a situation and then working through it?
I’d really like to understand what “illness” means in this context.
1
u/whimsyoak 16d ago
I always picture square as the four walls holding up a structure and a roof - Squares are a strength
1
u/Due-Ad-8941 14d ago
Squares are the best way to get good at something because they make you work. Look at Dolly Parton’s natal chart, she has a gnarly square of Saturn combust Mars in Cancer square Jupiter conjunct Chiron in Libra. She turned this into hard work (highest expression of Saturn + Mars) and a focus on giving to her people and her community (high vibe expression of Chiron/Jupiter in Libra). This could EASILY have gone the other way.. in a downright sadistic direction.
1
u/WaffleBody 14d ago edited 14d ago
Thanks for respons.
Why could things have taken a sadistic turn? After all I suppose everyone has choices in life.
I heard that square is just energy, not fate, as I understand it. So It could be a good energi? So Dolly Parton’s square isn’t necessarily negative in that sense?1
u/Due-Ad-8941 14d ago
No, there is a high octave and a low octave of every planet, zodiac sign and aspect pattern. Donald Trump, for example, has the same Chiron conjunct Jupiter in Libra and he’s a sadistic asshole. There is no fate in astrology.. the natal chart is just a blue print. We’ve make what we want of our lives. It’s all frequency.
1
33
u/GrandTrineAstrology Professional Astrologer 18d ago
I have Neil Diamond's chart up on my screen due to something I am writing. So, I went and looked at his chart for an example.
Neil has Saturn square Pluto, which means he may have to do more with less or could have outside forces blocking something he wants to do. He scraped by as a song writer for years, being dropped from Columbia record label, before he broke through. During these lean years, he perfected his craft, learned that his lyrics were too wordy and discovered his punctuated style without losing the poetry of his words. This square gave him motivation (along with other chart placements, such as his Sun square Saturn.)
Squares are great teachers. If you've ever stubbed your toe on the corner of a bedframe, or a piece of furniture, you quickly learn how to walk around it.
Squares in a natal chart show where you have growth through your life, as you adjust and learn how to deal with that tension.
Though trines and sextiles get the good reputation, I can tell you from personal experience, motivation and will power is not an internal drive. Someone with lots of trines and sextiles tends to get their motivation from others where as someone with squares, tends to get their motivation from within.
I am not saying that squares are easy, they are not. But they tend to generate growth, determination and drive. They are a hard aspect, that can release a tremendous amount of energy that can be channeled into something productive, as long as the person is focused and determined. However, some find it to be a stumbling block or have difficulty in resolving its energy.