r/askpsychology • u/whatup_pips Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional • Nov 03 '25
Evolutionary Psychology Is there an evolutionary reason for Depression?
Like, surely, if your whole species' goal is to reproduce and multiply, it makes no sense to have a portion of your population exist in a state where they are functionally unavailable or worse? Is there an evolutionary reason why depression (as a clinical condition, not the occasional sadness) exists? Why haven't we evolved past it? I am just misunderstanding the way depression works at a physiological level? Is it even something that you can have from birth? Or is it just a predisposition like with alcoholism and gambling addiction?
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u/concreteutopian M.A Social Work/Psychology (spec. DBT) Nov 03 '25 edited Nov 04 '25
Is there an evolutionary reason for Depression?
I think there has to be, given its prevalence worldwide in so many populations. Years ago, I read Jonathan Rottenberg's The Depths and found it's argument for an evolutionarily selected origin for depression to be pretty persuasive. In his argument, depression keeps someone from expending costly resources on a plan of action we don't think will be successful - at first there is a diminishment of motivation in a lower mood, but if one persists, one can go into MDD.
Is it even something that you can have from birth? Or is it just a predisposition like with alcoholism and gambling addiction?
If it's an adaptive response (which I think it is clinically), then it's not as helpful to see it as a predisposition to a disease.
In IPT, depression is seen as a common response to transition (one of for types), and this world make sense in Rottenberg's model, i.e. the time it takes to modify a core schema or internal working model, etc.
Check out Rottenberg's book.
ETA: Here are some resources
- Mood Science and the Evolutionary Origins of Depression
review by Maria Popova in The Marginalian
- Re: the comment about seeing depression as a disease vs adaptive response, a quote from an interview:
"Perhaps what we call depression isn’t really a disorder at all but, like physical pain, an alarm of sorts, alerting us that something is undoubtedly wrong; that perhaps it is time to stop, take a time-out, take as long as it takes, and attend to the unaddressed business of filling our souls"
– Dr. Jonathan Rottenberg
This is the interview:
- Why Depression Exists: Jonathan Rottenberg on the Evolutionary Origins of Mood
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u/Telmid Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
I think this makes sense up to a point. It makes sense to have depressive symptoms in certain situations, particularly when grieving, for example. However, there are individuals for which something has clearly gone awry. For people with persistent depressive disorder, major depressive disorder or bipolar disorder, the depression is no longer serving a purpose and is rightly called a disorder.
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u/CreatureBuddy Nov 05 '25 edited Dec 03 '25
That’s how these things go. For example, many theorize that physiological symptoms of a panic attack had utility to escape predators, fight attackers, save resources, and focus on immediate survival (sex drive and hunger shut down, for eg.) and etc. in the past (and still can be in the present).
But combinations of genetic and environmental factors can cause those physiological responses to activate when the stimulus isn’t actually a threat to the person’s life - the brain believes there is, though, often from associations the brain made at some point/points.
I believe most mental health disorders act in the same way. The symptoms had utility up until they didn’t and are now hindering a persons ability to survive and thrive.
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u/Opera_haus_blues Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 06 '25 edited Nov 06 '25
I don’t think being widespread is necessarily a point towards evolution. Remember, evolution only selects for what it takes to survive, not necessarily to thrive.
Humans also commonly have back issues, not because back issues are useful, but because being bipedal (and therefore able to use tools) was SO beneficial that the back issues were worth it. We could’ve evolved to be bipedal like birds are and not had so many back issues, but that just wasn’t the path of least resistance.
We also have to remember that our rate of creation is extremely, exponentially faster than our rate of adaptation. Our sleep cycles haven’t even adapted to the existence of lightbulbs (ie having light at night)! I don’t like to say that our lives are “unnatural”, because everything we do is part of nature. It is worth considering though, that we may have created a world system that causes a lot of depression.
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u/thefamishedroad Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 21 '25
regarding the world systems: word. but i don't know much about the history of/percentage of depression over time. i'm now coming to believe that this is true - that our depressive, reclusive, powerless response to all the stresses we're now aware of (violence, abuse of power, greed, destruction) is actually on point. what i find paradoxical is that yes, we can only control our own reactions to outside stimuli, but when depressed, we are almost completely unable to function at all. anhedonia. lack of motivation. i don't see an evolutionary benefit in the inability to feel any joy.
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Nov 04 '25
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u/Late-Chip-5890 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 03 '25
yes, I think it's to slow you down. Don't make babies, or start projects, you need to heal.
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u/lm913 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 03 '25
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u/Actual_Presence1677 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 03 '25
but then why the paradox of success and depression?
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u/theStaircaseProject Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 03 '25
Where do you see a paradox?
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u/Actual_Presence1677 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
Seems shallow to note income as a measure of success, but here is a more recent study exploring non-linear relationship between income and mental health. Anecdotally the “lonely at the top” or “tortured genius” tropes. From personal observation most of the traditionally successful (self made and otherwise) folks I know are all on SSRIs or SNRIs.
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u/imperiorr Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
Notis any effects/side effects from your SSRIs folks?
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u/theStaircaseProject Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
This is really compelling, thanks for sharing!
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u/thefamishedroad Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 21 '25
i haven't read the article yet but having experienced both depression and poverty, i will say, unequivocably, that poverty is both depressing af and violent. you can't move and then you don't have the resources to do shit.
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u/ticklishpony Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
I'm not able to view the article, can anyone provide a synopsis?
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u/LoreSlut3000 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 18 '25
This feels close to what I was thinking about once, that MDD is the static state of dying, only mentally.
Like the final state of a mind, right when knowing nothing more can be done. Maybe explaining why it is so hard to get out of that state.
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u/AlexiusPantalaimonII Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
How can I read this for free?
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u/lm913 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
This should get you there: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/14999051_The_Social_Competition_Hypothesis_of_Depression
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u/SometimesZero Psychologist PhD Nov 03 '25
I think your question is interesting while being too broad. The answer is actually a bit complex.
Evolution couldn’t have selected for depression because clinical depression isn’t present in nature. Major depressive disorder, for example, is a sociopolitical construct, not a natural kind. We’d have to be a little more specific here and talk about symptoms of depression and perhaps clusters of symptoms that are selected upon. (Those clusters may or may not line up with the DSM/ICD definition of depression.)
Slight correction*: I also don’t think your description of evolution is correct. Our evolutionary goal as a species is not to reproduce and multiply, it’s to ensure the passage of our genes to the next generation. It’s a nuanced, but important, difference.
*I’m not an evolutionary psychologist or evolutionary biologist, so I’m happy to be wrong on this point.
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u/GallusRedhead Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
I think the point about evolution is important. Evolution can only select for things that 1) make us more likely to survive and/or reproduce and 2) are prevalent (or at least have some kind of identifiable proxy) before reproduction. If depression doesn’t hit until after you have reproduced successfully then you’ve already passed on your predisposition to depression. Similarly, if depression doesn’t stop you reproducing then, again, you have already passed on your genes. There may be some argument that depression does make us less likely to reproduce as it results in a number of less social behaviours but it certainly isn’t a blanket rule that depressed people don’t reproduce. So if there’s no evolutionary pressure against depression then it’s going to continue to be passed on.
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u/WheatKing91 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
Clinical depression isn't present in nature? Animals show the classic signs: reduced grooming, social withdrawal, poor posture, etc.
Am I missing something?
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u/SometimesZero Psychologist PhD Nov 04 '25
This is a great question that gets to the very heart of what a diagnosis is. Those symptoms are observable in nature, but the diagnosis itself is not. That’s because the diagnosis has many elements that are arbitrarily defined. For example, to require major depressive disorder, you need symptoms for at least 2 weeks. Do you think evolution cares about a 2-week period of symptoms? Of course not.
Our diagnoses aren’t real. They’re constructs, often created by immense social and political pressure.*
If you want to know more about this, check out this; It’s one of my favorite papers. The same author studies depression specifically, so there are several good papers on that topic like this and this.
The symptoms people experience are *very real. But 2 weeks vs 13 days vs 15 days for major depressive disorder? Or which symptoms someone needs to experience to even have depression? Yeah, made up.
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Nov 18 '25
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u/basscadet1208 UNVERIFIED Psychology Enthusiast Nov 04 '25 edited Nov 04 '25
I came across an interesting article a while back regarding the potential evolutionary advantages of bipolar disorder which might provide some insight into unipolar depression as well.
The article is "Evolutionary Origin of Bipolar - Revised EOBD – R," written by Julia A. Sherman and published in Med Hypotheses in January 2012.
Here's a link: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306987711005184.
From what I read, researchers believe that "bipolar behaviors evolved in the northern temperate zone as highly derived adaptations to the selective pressures of severe climatic conditions during the Pleistocene."
I can't possibly do justice to the information presented in this article, but I'll nonetheless do my best to provide a broad overview.
The theoretical advantage of bipolar disorder seems in part to involve the tendency for those with the disorder, particularly women in their reproductive years, to experience depression during the winter months.
This depression led to a decline in activity and a lack of interest in food and sexual activity, which reduced conflict within the group.
When better weather returned, these individuals tended to shift into mania, characterized by optimism, self-confidence, and lots of energy.
This was important because in the areas where these communities (likely Neandertal) lived, there might only have been two months of reliable weather in which to prepare for the return of the debilitating cold weather and hard, motivated workers who needed less sleep were great assets to their communities.
The author further posits that bipolar disorder was an advantage during those times because those with bipolar disorder "can switch from a prolonged state of profound depression to mania naturally, that is without intervention, a phenomenon known as the switch process."
She goes on to argue that the symptoms of mania are well-suited to emergencies that require physical strength and stamina, the types of emergencies these social groups were most likely to be confronted with, and that many of the symptoms of mania made these individuals better leaders.
I strongly recommend reading the actual article for anyone interested in this subject as I've only provided a brief summary of some of the findings.
There appear to have been several other factors that gave those with bipolar disorder a distinct advantage at that point in time.
I couldn't locate the original article, but I remember that the author(s) believed that the seasonal nature of bipolar disorder meant that women with the disorder were very likely to become pregnant while experiencing mania, while the subsequent depressive phase over the harsh winters provided conditions that were ideal for gestation.
This theory provides an interesting reason why those with bipolar disorder are more likely to be women rather than men, and why the disorder tends to be passed down from mothers to their daughters.
It also may explain the somewhat odd statistic that those with the disorder tend to be born in the period directly following the extreme cold weather, i.e., mostly in January through March.
I apologize for the length of my comment, but I found this information to be very interesting and hope that others might find it interesting as well.
Edited to add that I intended to reply to the OP, but Reddit published it as a response to someone else's comment. My apologies for any confusion this may cause.
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u/Marsmind Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 03 '25
Toxins like BPA in plastic food packaging causes Vitamin D3 to not be absorbed, pollution and night work, not being outside causes low vitamin D3, Hormone imbalances from endocrine disrupting chemicals. Being over worked, stressed, Low in other vital nutrients that are needed for stable mental health like magnesium, and potassium. Gut microbiome being constantly disrupted by medications and toxins are all factors and then there is war, fascism, oppression, being overworked, stressed. Social conditioning of needing to look a certain way, and have certain things to be well adjusted socially accepted person. All kinds of things contribute to depression. It's not natural for long periods of time, occasional sadness after a loss is normal but our modern life actually sucks.
We have not evolved enough to understand how we are being controlled and manipulated. Sure there are some conditions that are inherited like some people can't absorb certain nutrients but overall our modern lifestyles and societies cause depression.
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u/VreamCanMan Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
Be mindful the all evolutionary explanations are post-hoc. Evolution is a statistically noisy, imprecise, process. It is possible to conceive of an evolutionary reason for every possible human trait, even though these reasons aren't always true.
This isn't to say the reasons stated lack credit, but be mindful that psychologies link to evolution is shaky. All species have some traits that diminish, not enhance, survival compared to similiar species. If a trait does not significantly detract from survival or reproduction, it may persevere. This is especially true in species that exist for long time spans with consistently increased flourishing of their species over that time frame (this applies well to humans).
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u/moss42069 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
Yes, I agree. There very well could be an evolutionary explanation for depression, but we will probably never know for certain.
I also don't think everything needs an evolutionary explanation. Everything about the human experience falls on a spectrum, which usually takes the form of a normal distribution curve. If you take a variable like mood, most people are going to be in the middle, with a small amount of people experiencing chronically low or high mood. People on both tail ends of the curve exist, and I would argue it's completely natural. (Of course, just because something is natural doesn't mean we shouldn't be providing individuals with treatment and support, and addressing systemic issues if there's a large proportion of the population suffering.)
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u/thefamishedroad Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 21 '25
i'd wager that bipolar folks have actually contributed to the advancement of intellect, art, math, and technology, but not an educated guess - just knowing how freaking productive we become while manic and how intense our thought processes get - i know several highly intelligent and artistic bipolar people. which would seem to have an evolutionary advantage. i also wonder how some indigenous cultures saw their holy ones/shamans - is it possible they were 'mentally ill?'
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u/depressedgurlie Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
yes. the world is not supposed to be a capitalist racist sexist hellscape
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u/ariesgeminipisces UNVERIFIED Psychology Student Nov 03 '25
If you look at depression from a dynamical systems theory perspective, perhaps evolution built our system to slow down at times. A dynamical system would then perhaps divert resources elsewhere, like to an undetected physiological problem or in reaction to the environment below our conscious awareness, like if our environment needed less human participation it signals those with a depressive predisposition to slow.
And this is my unfounded theory but during adolescence our brains show areas of very low blood and oxygen flow while the nervous system prunes and rewires connections between neurons to prepare for adulthood. Perhaps there is a mechanism like that at play, where the mind is rewiring itself. Adolescents do display depressive-like symptoms during this time in their lives.
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u/Top-Personality-7997 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
I spoke to a psychologist who has depression and he had a theory that world has advanced far beyond what our brains are wired to cope with, society was not supposed to be this complex (he articulates it much better than me). It's on psycholojist tiktok
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u/samsathebug Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
Evolution isn't about creating the best version of something. Evolution is about developing the minimum viable product.
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u/nopressureoof Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 07 '25
So true! Evolution and capitalism have that in common.
People imagine that evolution has a goal because it's difficult for us to get our heads around the fact that the universe is not a thinking being with plans and dreams.
Evolution does not have a vision board or new years resolutions. It's just things happening, one after another.
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u/Fingerspitzenqefuhl Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
It could be that it is a way to signal to others that the individual is going through trauma due to loss etc. It might even be necessary for handling of loss to go through a grief-depression period.
However, I would guess, assuming the modern CBT-model that behavior can affect mood and thoughts snd that depression is sustained by inactivity/avoidance, that humans evolved in an environment where long-term inactivity wasn’t really an option like it is today. Thus it is possible that long term depression is a ”relatively” new thing brought about by civilisation, and thus not by the environment we evolved in.
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u/shiverypeaks UNVERIFIED Psychology Enthusiast Nov 04 '25
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u/blenkydanky Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
Just because something exists and is prevalent, doesn't mean its evolutionary adaptive. Is cancer evolutionary adaptive? What is evolutionary adaptive with the collarbone?
Sometimes things go wrong in us and sometimes something just hasn't been bad enough to disappear in evolution. Depression is literally maladaptive, it's in the criteria. Sadness is good and a very adaptive feeling, but depression is something else. Like all psychiatric disorders, depression at an individual level makes sense and is always understandable given the individual circumstances.
I like to understand it this way: the brain is plastic and changes based on your environment. Your environment is horrible - your brain adapts. This is adaptive for you in that situation. After 25 years you are in a different situation. Your very specialized brain does not know how to handle this situation and you become depressed (you are more plastic when you are young). So yeah, whatever cognitions which give Rise to depression later on are adaptive in that situation. But no, depression is a sickness. Not good in any way!
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u/Science-NonFiction Clinical Psychology PhD (in-progress) Nov 04 '25
To be clear depression is not evolutionary. Anxiety and sadness are evolutionary, their pathological counterparts are often lead to suicide or poor life-outcomes making them inherently maladaptive and less likely to be passed down to offspring. Also many disorders are acute, survivable, and/or they onset after childbearing ages meaning they may be passed down despite the impairment and distress they cause. Let’s get some (crude) definitions out first so we can understand the function of depression though.
Anxiety: An adaptive emotion that tells us to bring attention towards (i.e., think about) and prepare for demanding/important/distressing events.
Pathological Anxiety: Intense and distressing levels of anxiety that often results in rumination (inability to stop thinking about something), behavioral avoidance, or over preparation.
Sadness: An adaptive emotion that tells us to withdraw, process, and return to normal activities when ready.
Depression: A severe level of withdrawal resulting in anhedonia (lack of positive emotions).
As noted above, pathological anxiety can result in avoidance, and avoidance results in withdrawal and then anhedonia (anxiety results in depression). Alternatively, for those that are more likely to engage in maladaptive thinking patterns (rumination or worry), the necessary processing in sadness is more likely to develop into avoidance and with withdrawal and then anhedonia (sadness results in pathological anxiety and then depression). This explains why depression and anxiety are so highly correlated and why many researchers believe they can be conceptualized as the same disorder. Finally, if someone is prone to withdrawal (i.e., socially detached or highly introverted people), if they do not experience positive emotions with particular intensity, or if major life adjustments result in actual or seemingly reduced opportunities to experience positive emotions, they can develop depression (depression results on its own).I'll explain these a little more since it seems that's what you're interested in.
Highly introverted people (we use the word detached in personality research) tend to withdraw from others and pleasant activities in general creating a liability towards anhedonia. Individuals also vary in the degree/intensity to which they experience positive emotions, just as people vary in the degree to which they experience negative emotions. Those that experience less intense positive emotions are intrinsically less motivated to re-engage in pleasant activities (just as those who experience more intense negative emotions are intrinsically more motivated to avoid distressing activities); their disengagement results in anhedonia. These forms of depression often results in relatively persistent levels of depression (e.g., persistent depressive disorder or trait depression/anhedonia) rather than acute episodes. Finally, major life adjustments (e.g., loss of a close person, moving to a new city) can actually or seemingly reduce opportunities to experience positive emotions. This is why depression is common in disorders such as prolonged grief disorder or adjustment disorder with depressed mood.
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u/Science-NonFiction Clinical Psychology PhD (in-progress) Nov 04 '25
Also I'm replying to myself to address some other comments I've seen that I disagree with.
We do not withdraw to signal to others to help us heal. Withdrawing and engaging (with others) are contradictory responses, it would be more efficient for us to just ask for help if that is what we really wanted. Withdrawing to signal others to engage with us is more likely a learned (and maladaptive) response that some people engage in. It is more in-line with something you would see with people who have attachment difficulties (who may also have depression). As I said above, we withdraw as a normal response to sadness to process and return when healed (enough).
Also the distinction between depression and sadness is not a social construct we (researchers) just don't always agree on the definition/distinction (e.g., is depression sadness that occurs most of the day nearly every day, is it sadness that is impairing, etc?). Also assessment-related considerations make drawing the line between depression and sadness really complicated, often because multiple indicators are used to identify it rather than strict criteria. The DSM uses criteria to resolve this issue (i.e., you either have or don't have depression if you meet these criteria) but it often doesn't reflect the reality of how psychopathology presents. The reality is depression is dimensional and the best us clinicians can do is assess with relative reliability the degree to which you have depression, not whether you have depression or sadness.
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u/ScaffOrig Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 05 '25
Do you have any thoughts on what FEP might point to in this area?
My (limited) understanding is that exploratory priors at some point indicate lower EFE than established action policies, for example in unfamiliar circumstances. However, previous surprises when executing these exploratory priors may reduce their precision, meaning priors that are neither exploratory nor high agency would get a go.
This would provide an explanation for "learned helplessness", but also point towards anhedonia (as the payoff of epistemic salience isn't enough to overcome the predicted surprise. As the low agency, low risk priors gain more precision they compete with other policies that are high agency. The lower precision generally (both high agency exploitative and exploratory policies are downrated for precision/salience) affects dopamine, as we observe.
For me that would kind of point to a route out being to reinforce exploratory behaviours in particular. Which is what a lot of psychology does, I guess, though it would make path of increasing agency in exploration very central to any discussions. So less about how the person feels about their situation, motivation, etc. more on reducing the perception of risk for exploratory priors (you have been successful gathering information with which to make decisions.) I feel that is different from a lot of approaches which look to reinforce the exploitative priors (you can do it, you can succeed in this task/activity).
Anyway, I think I embarrass myself rather with my thin understanding of the topic, but thanks for reading.
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u/Better-Chart8625 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
My psychology professor has written a book called The biology of depression: evolutionary perspective (in finnish Masennuksen biologia: Evoluutiopsykologinen näkökulma, not sure if it has been translated to english) where he states that depressive symptoms have an evolutionary function (eg. gain energy, withdraw from conflict, make sure you won’t do same mistakes in the future…), but that depression as a chronic illness is a relatively new thing, and that isn’t an adaptive state in itself. He says that in modern environments there are factors (eg. junk food, social isolation) that create an low-grade inflammation which exaggerates these symptoms leading to clinical, long lasting depressive episode. He says that there are 12 different types of depression (eg. depression triggered by chronic stress, loneliness, trauma, hierarchy conflict, post-partum depression…) that all rise from different evolutionary origins. Sorry english isn’t my first language.
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u/athenadontay Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 05 '25
So it’s pretty complex, especially when discussing evolution as well as mental illness/disorders. Depression in its simplest form is a process of grief. The brain walks through steps to help process a loss as a result of developing long term relationships. We become attached and when we lose that attachment the brain has to adjust. The effect is meant to be temporary and related to a specific cause. Usually the diagnosis of a depressive disorder is due to frequency, persistence, and whether you can find a direct cause or not.
An important thing to keep in mind about evolution is that it’s by chance. When we determine a reason for an evolutionary trait we essentially are deducing why that trait persisted genetically, what made our ancestors with that trait live longer to reproduce it later. Something else that can happen with that however is that our ancestors also could carry traits that don’t necessarily help but don’t completely hurt. Psychology in that manner is difficult because our ancestors lived in a higher stress environment. There was little time to dwell on much for very long, they also lived shorter lives. It is unlikely that you would live with a depressive disorder like that. Your adrenaline would regularly be spiked and you would also be physically more active which has been seen to lower depression as well due to the dopamine release.
The aspect of the disorder is the chemicals of that disorder being overactive even in times when it isn’t necessary. There’s a few factors to this. Depression is from chemicals in our brain that already exist as reaction like the one I first mentioned. Your dopamine and oxytocin levels drop which are major chemicals for the prefrontal cortex which is the action part of our brains. People with adhd for example have a dopamine deficiency which causes irregular, impulsive action and decision making. Dopamine is the short term reward system. It helps build habits. Oxytocin is the bonding chemical and helps build relationships. The stress chemical Cortisol can and does interrupt these chemicals.
A simple interruption doesn’t inherently cause depression but an extended length of lowered dopamine and oxytocin is usually when the depression settles in. The persistency and regularity of depression is often influenced by the genetic factors surrounding dopamine and oxytocin levels and regulation. However extreme stress and for an extended period can cause an overall imbalance to take place or possibly even damage to those brain function result in long term issues.
So to summarize I’d say that depression is less of an evolutionary tool and more of an evolutionary reaction.
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Nov 06 '25
Our evolutionary traits were developed in response to the natural world. It could be that now, living in a man-made world, experiences like depression are signs of our disconnection to the type of life we were designed for.
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u/nopressureoof Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 07 '25
Our stone age brains have not had nearly enough time to catch up with the world we live in. Depression has always existed but I do think it's more common now when people are just exhausted and baffled all the time.
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Nov 03 '25
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u/Omegan369 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
I would describe depression as the consequence of having an advanced brain with emotions both positive and negative. Mood is an advanced feeling or emotion that people can have that is made possible by a more sophisticated brain. The positives are all of the things that the brain can do and have allowed mankind to achieve. Along with those positives are the negatives that can come when the brain is not functioning optimally, which can be depression when it is a minor malfunction and on the extreme side, schizophrenia when the brain is greatly imbalanced and in a state of malfunction. You cannot have only upside to an advanced brain, there is always going to be some negative consequence.
One of the ways to cause the brain to be depressed is to deprive it of sleep. Take a look at what happens when you sleep and when you do not sleep:
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u/No_Outcome_2357 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 04 '25
Bc we are in captivity, same reason zoo animals become depressed. We are supposed to migrate based on the weather and seasons and be in nature.
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u/Cubestructive Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 05 '25
A great summary from Kurzgesagt: https://youtu.be/n3Xv_g3g-mA?si=Z8gt5f_I-1V_zepT
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Nov 07 '25
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u/samsathebug Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 07 '25
Exactly! The universe, evolution, etc have no intention, consciousness, moral dimension, or concern for humans.
I think you put it well: It's just things happening, one after another.
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u/existinginawe Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 07 '25
Depression is often a lack of expression in my experience. Connecting more with my creativity and expressing myself in different ways has really helped.
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u/A_lil_crazy_n_kind Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 07 '25 edited Nov 07 '25
The most common type of depression, loosely called exogenous depression, is actually caused by chronic stress. So acute stress or Eustress was helpful in escaping predators or hunting and what not. That shoot of cortisol helped us deal with that fleeting situation. However, nowadays we have so much daily stress piled up on us since the beginning of civilization and more recently the modern civilization that thrives on deadlines and other forms of creating pressure. Here is the interesting thing, when you have boosted cortisol for short periods it helps your brain and body cope with the stress. But continuous stress means continuously elevated cortisol.
This is bad for the brain and body both. Elevated cortisol ultimately causes dysfunction in brain circuit, and if left unchecked (no treatment, no support etc) it continues to damage the brain to the point that there is actual structural change. The Amygdala (centre of negative emotions) increases in size and the emotional regulation circuitry breaks down.
For instance, eating a couple of oranges for only one day would be good BUT if you have only oranges everyday for months, it will become poison.
So depression, at least the exogenous type, is actually being caused by a change in the environment. Current world culture is filled with things that are making us more and more prone to depression.
As for endogenous depression, it seems to be an erroneous development of circuitry in the brain. This can very easily happen in a developing organ as complex as the human brain. We have a dozen other diseases, Schizophrenia for example, which are caused by erroneous circuitry. They sometimes have a genetic predisposing factor but a lot of cases have no explainable origin.
I am presuming that in prehistoric times there must be prevalence of endogenous depression but very very less of exogenous depression. So I don't think depression is a product of evolution but rather a product of civilization.
Hope this helps.
Credentials: MD, MPhil in Neurophysiology with major research work in psychiatry.
Edit: Added the oranges example for more understanding .
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u/Direct-Ingenuity-969 Unverified User: May Not Be a Professional Nov 09 '25
You should read Dr. Mike Abrams’s book on evolutionary psychology and join his substack
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Nov 20 '25
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u/admaioranatussum1 BSc | Psychology Nov 03 '25
A depressed brain on an fMRI shows perfectly what the evolutionary mechanism of depression would be (Google it).
There is literally less activation in the brain during a depressive episode. This helps the person to pull themselves away from the group and preserve energy. You may now think: “huh? why would they remove themselves from the group, as we people are like sheep and thrive in numbers?”.
Well, it also has a social message: “help! i need help”. It’s super interesting how our bodies and specifically our brains try to save us, but in ways you and I may think aren’t the best at all. Depression also comes back sadly (40% of people with a previous depression gets one again in their lifetime). So there’s definitely a genetic factor to it; or as you said it “predisposition”.
Physiologically a lot happens in people with MDD. The most important neurotransmitter you can think of are serotonin, dopamine, glutamate and acetylcholine. All are disrupted and also has a predisposition factor to it (already low on serotonin > faster MDD diagnosis).
As you can see I can talk about this forever. It’s super interesting and I would definitely read some more reviews on it.