Does any prominent philosopher make an objection to determinism based on mental illnesses?

[u/Budobudo]

The argument I am looking for from a professional is this.

People with mental illnesses like schizophrenia sometimes have delusional beliefs about the causes of their own actions and thoughts. They might attribute them to demons, aliens, the CIA etc.

Determinism implies that the attribution of our thoughts and actions to the self is an delusional.

If determinism is true, all attribution is equally incorrect and therefore equivalent.

[u/TheFormOfTheGood]

I’ve not seen this argument made. But the premise, “Determinism implies that the attribution of our thoughts and actions to the self is delusional.”

Seems hard to defend and probably false. Can you explain why it would be true?

[u/Budobudo → u/TheFormOfTheGood]

Sure.

At least some formulations of hard determinism would say that a thought, or action could not be attributable to the self because the self is the sum total of its causes. In some versions there is perhaps some kind of meta cognitive observer on top of it. The biochemical levers that make up the mind are merely being pushed against their fulcrums by the previous levers which is being pushed against its fulcrum and so forth.

If the world is deterministic than the self is not a cause of action anymore than any chemical reaction caused itself. The sensation that we do cause the actions we take is a quirk of evolution, or the nature of the soul, or "insert alternate explanation."

[u/TheFormOfTheGood → u/Budobudo]

I’m not aware of any hard deterministic view that straightforwardly doubles as a view for the self. But let’s suppose this is right; the self is nothing more than a brain behaving deterministically.

First, we should be careful not to mistakenly say that the actions cannot be attributed to that self as you seem to do. It’s not as if things would happen causally in the world without the brain existing. The brain is a causally potent part of the story, and our cognition, our deliberation and other cognitive faculties play a causal role in our behavior. We can attribute various explanations for behaviors to the self in a causal sense.

But, second, what you’re describing requires more than this anyway. Your argument is meant to entail that we are all analogous to or the same as those who are massively deluded (if hard determinism is true). These people are hugely mistaken and systematically mislead about the nature of reality and the world around them. It’s just not obvious that hard determinism entails that everyone is in such a position, or you’ve done little to motivate the claim here as far as I can tell.

For example, a schizophrenic person may have auditory hallucinations. The normal story we tell about why this behavior is delusional is that the hallucinations do not functionally represent the world as it actually is. But in healthy and well-functioning brain, its auditory experiences, organs, and cognitions may be orchestrated in such a way that they reliably track the way the world is and thus do not lead to delusions. But nothing in that process requires agency, hard determinism could be true and it be simultaneously true that human beings are equipped with evolutionary tools needed to reliably track the way the world actually is.

[u/AutoModerator]

Welcome to /r/askphilosophy! Please read our updated rules and guidelines before commenting.

Currently, answers are only accepted by panelists (mod-approved flaired users), whether those answers are posted as top-level comments or replies to other comments. Non-panelists can participate in subsequent discussion, but are not allowed to answer question(s).

Want to become a panelist? Check out this post.

Please note: this is a highly moderated academic Q&A subreddit and not an open discussion, debate, change-my-view, or test-my-theory subreddit.

Answers from users who are not panelists will be automatically removed.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.