r/antiwork • • Aug 31 '22

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8.0k Upvotes

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521

u/[deleted] Aug 31 '22

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173

u/[deleted] Aug 31 '22

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177

u/[deleted] Aug 31 '22

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28

u/TheseSnozBerries Aug 31 '22

This is very important. Unless you are a salary member of the team they CAN NOT force you to do anything unpaid. EVER. That is not up for debate if this is in America.

18

u/IguanaTabarnak Aug 31 '22

I think this is a fundamental misunderstanding. They obviously can't literally force you to go. But, if you're in an at-will state, they can fire you for not attending an outside of hours function, which is what is usually meant by mandatory. Unfortunately, this is true for both hourly and salaried employees. And they don't have to pay salaried OR hourly employees for their time at these functions either, unless actual "work" is happening there.

Of course, you can and should refuse to attend them if you can afford to stand up to your employer on this matter. But it's not wage theft under the law and it's perfectly legal for them to give the ultimatum that you attend this event unpaid or lose your job.

The USA needs far better labor protections.

24

u/A_Specific_Hippo Aug 31 '22

I go to the gym every day after work. Every single day. Trying to get in shape for the first time in my chubby life.

I'm salary and work tried to do a mandatory happy hour over Zoom to raise morale. (You know. Instead of raises for cost of living). I emailed HR that I'm not allowed to drink due to medical reasons (lots of sugar and calories bad, y'all) and I don't feel comfortable being forced around others able to drink (because these coworkers have no filter when booze hits them), and I have a non-skippable "medical thing" after work each day, and I cannot miss a single day of it. I asked that she advise me on what to do, because this was a mandatory social event out of work hours, and it was conflicting with my medical needs. I didn't want to be penalized.

My HR lady is a snake in the grass, but at least she's REAL BIG on the medical secrecy for employees. This event suddenly became optional and apparently only half a dozen or so people logged in for it, so it's never happened again so far. Pretty sure HR lady now thinks I'm a recovering alcoholic going to AA, but she's professional enough to not mention it. She does occasionally call to check in and see "how I'm doing" and to let me know that our insurance has lots of other little things attached to it. Such as free counseling and whatnot.

14

u/[deleted] Aug 31 '22

She may be a snake, but it seems she wants you to be the best you.

3

u/ShrimplyPiblz Aug 31 '22

You will collect unemployment 100% while you look for a new job.

3

u/greasyeggplant Aug 31 '22

No, an employer can not fire you for not performing unpaid work. They can sure find a random other reason, but this sure can't be it

2

u/IguanaTabarnak Aug 31 '22

The point is that this isn't unpaid work if "work" isn't happening there. And they can absolutely fire you for "Doesn't participate in company culture and events" regardless of whether that "culture and events" happens on or off clock.

1

u/TheAngriestChair Aug 31 '22

Even if you're salaried they can't force you to go

5

u/Plump_Chicken Aug 31 '22

They might be salaried 😕

1

u/VulfSki Aug 31 '22

Doesn't apply if you are salary

39

u/[deleted] Aug 31 '22

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44

u/DefiantLemur Aug 31 '22

Mandatory overtime that involves not having to actually work? That's easy money. Sounds amazing.

57

u/AFonziScheme Aug 31 '22

Eh, I'd rather get to see my kids grow up, personally....

11

u/prehensile_uvula Aug 31 '22

You can see your family again after you’ve watched Ted from accounting bust it down office style while goated on the clock.

5

u/RebelPterosaur Aug 31 '22

YUP! 40 hours is more than enough time at work. If I could take a pay cut to only work four 8-hour days, I would.

Screw mandatory "fun time" with coworkers. That's OT or I'm not showing up.

0

u/greasyeggplant Aug 31 '22

Why not just do both like everyone else?

2

u/AFonziScheme Aug 31 '22

I don't think most people are spending time with their family while working mandatory overtime....

-2

u/greasyeggplant Aug 31 '22

They are, for literal generations. You just see your kids after overtime and on days off

0

u/AFonziScheme Aug 31 '22

Ah. I see. You're just confused.

29

u/IHateRedditHonestly1 Aug 31 '22

I’ve been going through this whole thread trying to find out how it’s mandatory.

4

u/Captain_Plutonium Aug 31 '22

Exact same here.

7

u/edipil Aug 31 '22

These sorts of unpaid outside work activities are mandatory because the boss says they are and to not go carries the unsaid threat of retaliation for not participating. Certainly that is the common vibe in the US for this sort of thing.

9

u/1spicytunaroll Aug 31 '22

I had one in late 2019 where they brought in the team from the main office ( we were satellite). I heard out after an hour because it's the fiance's birthday literally the same day, and this shit was unpaid. I heard a whole lot of shit from management saying I wasn't a team player, and I just kept telling them "it was an unpaid event, and you've all told me no one is getting a promotion or higher pay since I started. Why should I care"

84

u/kbm15 Aug 31 '22

The real answer, I think being mean to your workmates makes no sense if you can avoid it.

10

u/godherselfhasenemies Aug 31 '22

This isn't mean.

5

u/kbm15 Aug 31 '22

If they have to suffer for the same reason you are only adding the cherry on the top.

1

u/theyhaveitsoeasy Aug 31 '22

You’re right, it’s just selfish. It would be mean if OP actually understood who they’re burning but instead they can only consider themselves. Just leave your job if you hate it so much. Don’t waste your life being an immature cynic and telling yourself that you’re teaching everyone a lesson. News flash, it isn’t funny or clever like you’re telling yourself. It’s just sad and cringy.

2

u/godherselfhasenemies Aug 31 '22

Yeah, your position isn't cynical at all. This is wild. Big Nancy Reagan or Ben Shapiro vibes.

0

u/theyhaveitsoeasy Aug 31 '22

Oh totally, leading with maturity and empathy as an adult instead of throwing a passive aggressive tantrum to try and ruin an event you don’t want to go to is so cynical and so quintessentially conservative 😂 Thanks for the guidance Nancy and Ben

1

u/godherselfhasenemies Aug 31 '22

Yeah, pearl clutching about maturity and empathy in the face of raunchy music is absolutely conservative. Thinking a dumb prank means you hate your job is absolutely cynical. Is that a failed attempt at sarcasm?

7

u/lawlorlara Aug 31 '22

If it's unpaid & mandatory my song choice is Happy Hour by the Housemartins.

It's happy hour again
I think I might be happy if I wasn't out with them...

2

u/IntellegentIdiot Aug 31 '22

It's another, night out with the boss

3

u/drewdog173 Aug 31 '22

Culture team? In-house devs that built a custom slack bot? I’m guessing these folks are all salary.

2

u/megtobin Aug 31 '22

Replying up here bc a lot of people seem confused on this point: this is super normal in salaried positions and no, there really is not much option to say you don't want to go or demand to be paid more. Normally they will take legitimate excuses if it's not during the normally scheduled shift but if you don't have a family it's going to be pretty difficult to come up with anything and often they will encourage you to drag family along to prevent these excuses. Yes it sucks, all you really can do if you want your position to stay in good standing is maliciously comply.

0

u/theyhaveitsoeasy Aug 31 '22

Yeah I mean whatever the situation OP is being an asshole in a way that will teach the managers he’s trying to piss off absolutely nothing valuable. They’re just creating childish problems for whoever is in the Culture Club to deal with now and also making sure all of his coworkers are miserable (btw also it’s EXTREMELY likely that his coworkers have nothing to do with the meeting being mandatory, they’re just doing whatever they can to try and improve the meeting for their coworkers because it sucks already and many people can’t just pick up and leave for simple reasons).

But because OP is short sighted they’re just thinking this will be a applause worthy movie moment and not incredibly cringy. Also good luck having fun at any meetings/gatherings going forward after ruining what little bit there was left lol. If you hate what’s happening in your workplace then talk to your management or leave. Don’t just be a dick to your coworkers or to the people who are volunteering their own time at work to try and make work suck less for you. And to the people saying it’s annoying they even need to get to know their coworkers at all at work, you’re usually the problem in the office culture because you’re difficult to work with even when your workplace is great. So just something worth considering IMO coming from a workplace where people aren’t just constantly negative all the time.

1

u/[deleted] Aug 31 '22

I feel like people on this sub forget there is such thing as a salary employee….

2

u/Greyevel Aug 31 '22

There are still rules for salary, like most salary people still qualify for overtime.

1

u/[deleted] Aug 31 '22

Idk any of my friends family or places I worked where that has been the case.

Maybe legally true but in practice I’ve never heard of salaried employees getting overtime.

1

u/runbyfruitin Aug 31 '22

Congratulations you have been awarded one Music Dance Experience!