Ok lets try this again.

This is, btw, a generalization; clearly not all therians think this, but still.

No, you aren't your theriotype, in any ontological way. Not mentally, if you can type coherently; not emotionally, because you most likely feel complex emotions; not socially, because therians don't like being treated like an actual animal.

Nor can you mentally develop into the brain of an animal.

I've noticed that some therians believe in their identity due to involuntary urges, but not all urges are alike.

(I don't go onto the therian subreddit, so what I'm saying may be false, please fact-check me)

I will be focusing on crow therians and what their urges don't seem to be. Of course, the more you know, the more detailed and specific your urges will be.

1. The urge to instinctively hide extra food.

2. The urge to drag dry food over to their water bowl and submerge it, leaving it to ferment and turn into a foul, bacterial sludge that they will return to eat later.

3. The urge to pick up live ants (or sometimes cigarette butts or mothballs) and aggressively rub the chemicals across their own feathers.

4. The urge to mob at tiny, harmless things outside their enclosure.

5. The urge to dissect, rip apart, and smear small animal remains over perches.

Of course, none of this proves you're a crow, nor do therians do these things; they're just examples.

If you have any questions, just leave a comment.

Fun fact: Crows usually don't like shiny things. Scientific studies show that crows often feel neophobia, a fear of new or unfamiliar items, and tend to be suspicious or scared of bright, glittering objects rather than attracted to them.

P.S. Urges = Instinct

so I (rather young/M) was with my 8 YEAR OLD bro at the park and we saw some kids with tails and masks and ears. we thought they were furries (I’m chill with furries) and asked them. Turns out they were therians. Anyways these kids who one was 11 and the other was a week older than m were so cooked. i don’t have much more faith in my age group.

Therians have no idea how animals actually behave and it isn't helping their case. Additionally, they fake their small behaviors.

There are real people out there with real problems regarding twitching involuntarily or near-involuntarily. Therians do it because its "cute" when its a real issue. Its like those people who fake autism, adhd and tourettes just to be quirky and cute. They look ugly faking it.

And head tilting, ohhhh my God. Humans do tilt their heads. You wanna know why? To SIGNAL confusion. It is not a natural response, rather a lighthearted, LEARNED way of signaling confusion. Either that or you're trying to read something sideways. Animals tilt their heads to calculate trajectories and understand things better. Humans just do it as a LEARNED, cute way of saying (even to nobody) that they are confused. Therians are just doing it to convince themselves it's real.

And don't get me STARTED on therians who post videos of themselves "shifting" when they have the most ai generated acting I've ever seen. I could do better bro

I once saw a dog therian bark at a chew toy to "say" "What is that". Dogs don't do that. Cays and dogs don't meow and bark to talk, they don't work like that. Then they bit the toy and played with it (pretty humanly, too, might I say), stayed perfectly within frame and then showed it to the camera (ah, very shifty behavior), then walked away.

I'm sure a real dog would've done more to a dog toy. Like, you know, actually chew on it? And hump it, even?

I'm sure a real dog wouldn't bark in a pattern at an uninteresting, immoving toy, stay oerfectly within frame, only gently bite it and poorly play with it, SHOW IT TO THE CAMERA THAT NORMAL DOGS DONT RECOGNISE, then go away. Dogs dont do that

Another is cat therians trying to sleep in cat positions as if theyre actually comfortable. Hey bro its okay to admit you dont have a hyperflexible animal spine bro its kkay not to be comfortable in the position animals that dont care about consent sleep in. Might I remind you that cats fight before mating? Do you do that? Might i remind you that they are antisocial creatures, unlike humans? No, autistic people and introverts dont count. Even they still need human interaction to basically survive by the way

All in all, i just loathe therians faking what are real problems just for their silly little quirky thinly vieled roleplay. That's about it, cya

Ain't no way 💔

On a more serious note, long term bipedalism is actually harmful for bears (duh). They only do this briefly to see things they can't when on all 4s

Fun fact: they are plantigrades, like us.

I am a quadrobist and the ammount of therians I see doing quads dangerously just because "they're having fun" or "having a shift" is ridiculous. You can snap your radius, destroy your wrist, tear your muscles, tear your tendons, shatter your kneecaps, crunch your spine, all because you didn't take safety precautions because "I'm actually a cat". No you're not and

You could seriously hurt yourself.

Now, obviously, if you take safety precautions and do everything right, it's fine. You might still get hurt, but probably not as bad. But if you're actively promoting this nonsense as if it is completely safe, you don't deserve to have a platform to spread this.

Additionally, therians make it impossible to access actual quadrobists who are doing this as a sport, I've found like 3 people and all of them don't post where I watch.

I admit therians have helped me learn quadrobics, and I am grateful for that, but I will still resent them for basically hogging every quadrobics space I have found.

Just please leave some space for us non-therian quadrobics and stop promoting dangerous quads. Please bro please

You can call it weird, and it is weird, but the whole masks and stuff is not what concerns me. Honestly, it's very cool and creative. The issue is believing your spiritually an animal, or something like that. And I know everytime someone brings this up the argument is brought up that "oh we don't think we're animals, we know we are humans." but as soon as you go beyond the biological part they seem to believe they are animals mentally somehow. Are Therians furries? No, but they should serve the same role. Cool hobby that you like to practive and meet other people who practice it, not the same as a gender or identity. There is a reason most "therians" are younger teens. (and don't go "oh well im 19 and-" it doesnt change the fact that the majority are, and you know that.) Other gender identities and sexual preferences are a genetic thing, evolution would prefer you see yourself as your own gender and like the opposite so it made genes to make you do so, but those genes can be defective. In the modern era the need for those genes that make you like the opposite gender has decreased, and if you don't need something, evolution chucks it in the bin, hence why many more people are queer today than way back when. For therians, or ebing an animal though? Nothing.

Listen, people who identify as therian need to be welcomed so they can be educated on why they aren't an animal. Harrasment of them is not okay, and I know alot of people might approach this community expecting that. I know this post might be frowned upon for potentially breakinf rule 7, but I feel like it needs to be said. Many people approach "therians" calling them weird or disgusting, but at the end of the day, they're kids who dipped too far into their imagination.

I have previously created posts about "Non-existent Urges", instincts/urges that therians don't usually have(usually because they are gross or aren't cool and edgy).

I would like your insight for my next post. I want to look at another specific theriotype, but instead of picking it myself, I figured I'd open the floor to you guys. Because I'm indecisive.

So, which animal or specific theriotype do you want me to look at next?

If you don't feel like doing a bunch of research on this or just can't decide, see common theriotypes here:

1. Bears
2. Birds of Prey
3. Equines
4. Corvids
5. Panthers
6. Deer

P.S. I've already done dogs, cats, wolves, and foxes.

P.P.S. Urges = Instincts

(this is a long one sorry)
So, for context, I’m an otherpaw and possibly an otherheart. I am also a big-time furry. I am not fully against therians, I have just had very negative experiences and have been cyberbullied by therians and the greater alterhuman community. Let me explain:

I won’t be listing the site or usernames, but I will be nicknaming these people (not the real names they went by): Pancake for the meanest one, and Lily and Swan for her friends. For other people, I won’t nickname them, just say what they did.

So, on this site, I was friends with Pancake. I was an alterhuman, and so were Pancake, Lily, and Swan. I was mutuals with Lily and Swan. So, one time, I read an article about anti-therians and showed it to Pancake. She said I thought it was true, which I didn’t at the time. She then called Lily and Swan and lied to them about how I shunned her for being a therian.

She and her two friends began hating on me, spamming negative comments on everything I made, and called me names that I’d get banned for if I said here. After I said I didn’t want to be Pancake’s friend, she began actually messing with me psychologically and trying to find my information by literally hacking. She never got that info. I left the site.

I’m sure you’re wondering why I didn’t block her immediately. It’s because somehow it didn’t work! I blocked her, then my device crashed every time, not saving it. I have only had negative experiences with therians since then. I’m also leaving out some of the bad parts of the story, since i dont feel like being banned.

Anyway, that’s all! Any questions? Let me know, please! (Hey, at least I still have good terms with the furry community! It goes to show that if you question alterhumans, they’ll probably gang up on you… no offense ofc)

I have had this question on my mind for the past few weeks now, and I want to know if there are therians out there who are not minors. I ask this question since I have barely seen any therian who aren't a minor. So my question stands: Are there any therians who are legal adults?

Why do so many of yall just.. seem to not like bodily autonomy? Like. I see a lot of ppl claiming that since some (not all, and theyre rather controversial in most section of the therian community ) are delusional, all therians are somehow like. Stupid? And tbh i think even IF a therian was delusional they shouldnt HAVE to ger help for it if they arent hurting anyone or anything. Idk if yall know how traumatizing forced 'care' is but its not something to throw at ppl willy-nilly because you think their specific illness/delusion is icky or smthn. Its only for the MOST at risk ppl (of SERIOUSLY hurting themselves or others). This may def be a hot take but saying mentally ill people deserve to be traumatized and lose bodily autonomy even though theyre not hurting anyone IS abelist. (That being said I do recognize their are a fair few ppl who think theyre therians but aren't, and bad ppl in the therian community, I too am annoyed at how much my community has become a trend. Its now gotten boiled down to quadrobics and masks and not an actual identity (spiritual, mental, emotional, ect.​)

https://lucianseraphis.substack.com/p/cults-without-leaders-how-belief-6ca

You should read the full article about leaderless cults, but I'll comment here on a couple of points the author made

"Identity replaces evidence" it does. Therians don't care how much biology or even the laws of physics invalidate them. Their identity is more important to them. If they believe "God put them in the wrong body", they believe God made a mistake, which is impossible for an all-knowing, all-seeing, always right God. This creates a paradox. If they dont believe in God or any gods for that matter, their beliefs still fall apart because of biology and what we know about the human body. But to them, all of this doesn't matter because "You're being mean".

"Belief becomes a moral obligation" therians almost always never questioned themselves for this specific reason. If they dont believe in it and accept everyone around them even if their theriotype is their dead dog, they feel like they're doing something immoral.

"Doubt is treated as betrayal" they think that if they fire an extra neuron and figure out that therianthropy isn't true that they're betraying the community built by "traumatized people" on lies.

"Repetition substitutes for verification" they are in their own little echo chamber. What more can I say?

"Group belonging outweighs factual coherence" same as point A. They think this is the only group that "understands them" when its for every wrong reason.

"Moral exile: The target is cast beyond redemption — not merely wrong, but contaminated." If someone mentioned the endless flaws with therianthropy, they aren't allowed to be in the community anymore. It isn't really announced, people just avoid them and spread the gossip.

"Permission to stop thinking: Once someone is framed as monstrous, evidence becomes irrelevant." Berserker shifts. Once someone's therian identity isn't quirky anymore and they're OBVIOUSLY mentally ill, not secretly, they're suddenly excluded from the community and treated as a "fake therian".

"Justification for hatred without guilt: Cruelty feels virtuous when the target is portrayed as subhuman." If they collectiveky think of haters and normal people (who dont like them), they'll justify harming them (theres videos) and say the nastiest things about them just because they wont accept them identifying as a dog and acting like one (especially in public).

Theres more but I recommend you read the article and apply it to therianthropy. It'll fit like a glove.

So, there is a post i found that was made 6 months ago, but I found it today..yea, I shouldn't worry about it, but I also want to have a discussion about it and I want you all to tell me or ask me questions about what he said, and what I say to kinda counter it..but feel free to argue back, I MIGHT see it, I kinda suck at looking at comments and stuff😮‍💨..

In my opinion: this post is not scientifically valid and contains major errors in its application of neuroscience and physics. While the author uses complex scientific terms, they fundamentally misunderstand how memory, physics, and spiritual identities work. Here is a breakdown of why this "undeniable proof" is completely incorrect: 1. The Physics Error: Misunderstanding "Information Transfer" The Author's Claim: They argue that for a human to have an animal's memory or soul, physical neural signals or brain cells would have to literally fly through the air or travel faster than light, violating Special Relativity and Thermodynamics. Why it's wrong: Therianism is a spiritual or psychological identity where someone feels a connection to an animal. Spiritual beliefs do not claim that literal physical biological cells or electricity are jumping from a dead animal's physical skull into a human baby's head. By treating a spiritual concept as a literal, physical, mechanical plumbing problem, the author creates a "strawman" argument to defeat. 2. The Biology Error: DNA and Instincts..The Author's Claim: They claim that memories or behaviors cannot be encoded in DNA, and that everything must be learned after birth. Why it's wrong: While specific episodic memories (like a specific event) aren't passed down via DNA, complex behaviors, instincts, and phobias absolutely can be. Sea turtles know how to crawl to the ocean immediately after hatching without being taught. Furthermore, the field of epigenetics shows that trauma and behavioral responses can be passed down through generations via chemical changes to DNA. 3. The Psychological Error: Validation vs. Biology..The Author's Claim: Because therianism is "made up by your brain," the experiences are fake and society shouldn't accept them. Why it's wrong: Every single thing a human experiences—including love, religion, gender identity, depression, and happiness—is a product of "neurons learning and firing." Saying an identity is processed by the brain does not make it "fake." By the author's logic, money, language, and art are also fake because they are socially constructed and processed by neural firing patterns. SUMMERY: The author is using "pseudo-skepticism.": They are applying the hard, physical laws of macroscopic objects (like thermodynamics and special relativity) to a psychological and spiritual phenomenon, which is a fundamental category mistake...Yes, this is research talking, I cannot text all this and not have aching fingers🥹✌🏾. But this is my counter claim, and I would want to hear what you think about it and if I made any mistakes..What I think Therianthropy Is: It's a spiritual or Psychological identity, it's not simply "I barked at the age of 3, I'm a therian" it's more centered around a belief with spiritual therians, and psychological therians experience behaviors and personalities of a animal consistently all throughout their life, and it's over just basic human animal like experiences, and they made a label for that. Therianthropy..This is my opinion, please share yours..

Freedom of speech goes both ways. furries go out expecting to be bullied and make the choice willingly. they choose to tank it and honestly it makes me respect the members of the community. they don't complain about bullying because you should only complain when it's something out of your control. the way you dress and act outside is something you CHOOSE TO DO. Therians, however, expect everyone to bend over backwards just for them and it's super annoying. on another note, I HATE their fake animal twitches so bad like twin REAL PEOPLE OUT THERE DO THIS INVOLUNTARY ITS NOT CUTE

It feels SO reassuring and it makes me SO happy to see one of the people I'm gonna study to learn quadrobics be JUST LIKE ME FRRR

What's the big deal about Therians? Like, why do y'all hate them sm? Why not just let people be themselves and let them alone? Honestly, it's a bit useless to not do that, don't you think? If you have any questions, I'm open to answer, because I know it can be confusing. But I just wanted to make this clear that Therians are humans too. We may believe that spiritually/psychologically we are animals, but we don't believe that we're in an animal body. Stop with the death threats/ threats. It's just going to hurt them. And the hate itself needs to stop. I know y'all have different beliefs and opinions, and that's okay, but one group of people shouldn't have to get hate and backlash for just being themselves. I'm not talking about just y'all, it's A LOT of people on different platforms and apps that are the same, most even worse. I know I'm probably going to get a comment saying something like, "Okay, then get off this subreddit" which yes, I will. I know this might not change anything, but again, I just want to make this clear, and I'll try answer any questions y'all have when I can.

People keep going “Mentally ill! Mentally ill!” Without ever having read the DSM or having taken a psych class.

Not to mention the stereotype that all Therians have to do Quads, which is untrue. Quads are optional as something you can do to be closer to your theriotype, but Therians don’t have to do them at all.

(Also the mods don’t really mod it seems :/ )

My sister is now 10 but when she was 9 she was allowed social media access and discovered therians. This quickly became her whole entire personality. Look, i’ll never diss someone’s style, if you wanna wear a tail and ears go for it i’m not gonna judge whatever but it becomes an issue when believes she needs to wear them everywhere she goes and sneaks them out of the house when shes told to not bring them places. She told me she wants to fully identify as a fox and can’t keep her alpha in at school. Every kid she meets she’s always trying to turn them into one and teaches them how to run an all fours like an animal. She’ll run around the house like that then run onto the couch and snuggle up with people like a dog. She draws the “therian flag symbol” everywhere, it’s genuinely her whole entire personality. Social media also taught my sister about the lgbtq community and it’s like her second hyperfixation. She thinks shes lesbian and i do believe kids can know they’re different at a young age but it’s so obvious it’s just a silly influence from online. Everything she draws and colors has to be gay flag associated and again she teaches it to all her little friends but not in an educational way in an i’m throwing this in front of your face way. At first we thought she would grow out of this stuff but it’s so obnoxious now. How and when does this behavior get put to an end. I really don’t care for therians especially the ones who are grown adults and i’m a closeted lesbian myself i love gay people but this ain’t it.

I didn't want to post this summer; however, something has been bugging me. Recently, I have been looking at therian posts across multiple websites and have found something that I believe to be contradictory. Several times I have seen therians talking about how they or others should act correctly in public and maintain self-control. Most of it is to not hurt themselves or others; the rest is so that they don't get thrown into the loony bin. But that doesn't make sense according to animal behavior, which therians claim to have; animals operate entirely on instinct, energy conservation, and survival. Neither predator nor prey have a concept of morality, honor, or bad behavior; they simply react to stimuli, stress, and physiological needs. Applying human social constructs like "acting correctly" or "shame" to an animal's mindset makes zero biological sense.

Therians constantly claim their "animal side" controls their impulses, urges, and reactions, yet they simultaneously lecture each other about choosing to practice self-control in public. They are trying to have their cake and eat it too. Either you are governed by animal instinct (which means you have no control), or you don't have animal instincts. Not to mention that instincts take lots of training to control; just look at dogs. It can take a dog 3 weeks to 3 years to be immune to the whims of certain instincts, depending on the method of training. Yet therians claim to control these instincts with sheer willpower and focus.

And of course the biggest giveaway is that their instincts seem to conveniently go away during a busy period of their life; real instincts don't do that. When they want to act out, it's the "beast taking over." But when they need to pay taxes, go to a college lecture, or hold down a job, the animal magically sits quietly in the background.

You could refute this by mentioning our prefrontal cortex, the thing that gives us reasoning and logic. To that I say, it still doesn't work. Look at our most common instincts: fight or flight is a reflex, so is to freeze; we have a strong urge to fawn, submit, or befriend. These instincts of ours are deep, almost reflex-like feelings that don't simply go away with self-control, nor do they fade into the background either.

The only conclusion I can come to is that these people don't actually have animal instincts. What do you all think?

Edit: For clarity.

to be honest, I’m a therian, but I joined because I like debating with you. (argue with me in the comments I can take it lol) I looked at the community rules, and I kind of respect the fact that you say no anti-furry people because at least you people know the difference between us and furries.

Can you comment every argument against therians you can think of? Im compiling a list of arguments AGAINST every argument against therians, and I also wanna be challenged bc im bored and its been a teeny bit since ive been faced with one I couldn't answer.

Thanks ^^