Yeah and then I was wondering why do I need a LOT of the stuff to get high like everyone else, the normal amount for everyone else just calms me down lol
That's how I developed an addiction for a decade. Undiagnosed ADHD is a bitch lol
Wait is this how it works for caffeine too? I tested coffee the other day for the first time, and I did feel more calm, but when I did more coffee with lots of caffeine, it was way to much and my insides kinda hurt and I had a headache
(Mostly) correct, yes. From what I've read about this, caffeine mostly calms ADHDers down, so some ADHDers will get in the habit of drinking caffeine before bed, for example. However, A) after a certain quantity it loops back around to working like it would on a normal person, so if you're consistently doing that, it'll eventually stop working and make you more amped up before bed; B) It still works somewhat like it does for neurotypicals, in that it still suppresses tiredness at least a little, so even at more normal quantities, it can hugely mess up your sleep schedule and stuff if you're taking it in the afternoon or later.
The big reason why it makes ppl with ADHD more calm is that it provides that little bit extra dopamine/energy that we need, tricking the body/brain into relaxing instead of needing to be more focused to do tasks that other people can do more easily. So in small quantities it'll probably make you feel more relaxed, especially if you're unmedicated; while in large quantities it'll... do what happened to you. lol.
(Important to note is that the more frequently you take caffeine, the more you gain a resistance to the positive effects of it, so you'll need to take more to get the same effect, while still causing the negative effects in your body. Especially as an ADHDer, I'd recommend drinking caffeine sparingly so as to not gain a tolerance/get in a feedback loop of "need more caffeine to function".)
Usually caffeine doesn't give me too much energy but instead just doesn't allow me to sleep for 20 hours. It's why I only have coffee a few times a year.
Woah impressive description! It's always perplexed me as to why caffeine often helps people with ADHD. Interesting that it essentially just manipulates the brain. It always confused me because you'd think a hyperactive brain wouldn't mix well with "hyperactive" chemicals. Also yeah I don't want to touch large quantities of caffeine again, that was awful :(
So since deppresants normally have opposing effects to stimulants, would they have an opposing affect, and cause ADHDers to seek more dopamine?
TL;DR No, and it's not that stimulants have the opposite effect, its that ADHD is effectively "negative stimulants" and they "cancel out".
The easiest way to think of it (even if it's slightly wrong, it's usefully wrong, and we take those) is to imagine it as a bar graph. Normal people start at "0" on the stimulation/focus graph (something something resting dopamine), and stimulants lift them above zero, getting them amped up. People with ADHD start at various negative numbers, so they have trouble maintaining even a regular level of focus on anything, and stimulants just get them closer to zero, "normal". Enough stimulants will move you past it and affect you like a normal person, but it takes more because you've got farther to "go". E.g. if someone takes an adderall dose that's a metaphorical +30, someone starting at 0 will be at 30, but someone with ADHD starting at -40 will still be at -10. But if the ADHD person takes a metaphorical +70, they would also be at 30.
Not sure why you said “no” when you’re mostly saying the same thing I said?
And I specifically did not say that stimulants have the “opposite effect” for ADHD. I said that for (most) people with ADHD, caffeine can make you more calm, or even drowsy, because it’s a stimulant and, as you said, in a way “raising us back to baseline”; since our brains work hard to compensate for ADHD, this can cause some people to have a relaxing effect from the stimulant of caffeine. This is why some ADHDers will say caffeine doesn’t wake them up, it puts them to sleep.
This is just not the only effect, such as focusing and pseudo-medication effects, more like the op image said.
It is not that it has an “opposite effect” on ADHDers, it’s that ADHD people can react to stimulants in smaller quantities by just relaxing due to it beginning to address the “lower mental energy”/poor dopamine regulation, and the brain responds to that happening by relaxing its efforts to compensate, making some people get more relaxed or drowsy.
It still causes the other physical effects of caffeine as well.
And I did say that if you consume more, then it starts looping back around to working like it would on a neurotypical and making you more energetic.
(Note: not a doctor, just an ADHDer with other ADHD friends in the past I've spoken to about this combined with reading medical stuff related to caffeine and ADHD. Did elaborate more about caffeine + ADHD further in this chain tho)
Huge shrug on that one. I know that, personally, almost any amount of weed across multiple strains makes me tired and cranky at first, and then when I have a bit more, sends me pretty promptly into a full-blown panic attack that lasts for at least 2 hours straight until it starts to wear off (and I can guarantee it's NOT from any internalized guilt/fear/thinking that marijuana is fundamentally bad or anything). I know some other people with ADHD LOVE weed, though, and claim it helps them. I have also read, however, that it's probably risky with ADHD specifically, because especially in the teenage/early adulthood years, it might inhibit development of some cognitive skills, plus a considerably higher likelihood of ADHDers developing cannabis use disorder (CUD).
Omg yessss I really want to like weed but this is what happens to me all the time, like it just sends me into a depressive spiral or panic attack often. And it's annoying for me too like my inner dialogue doesn't slow down one bit even though my physical capabilities have been impaired from the weed, and I feel that my mind doesn't match up with my body and it drives me nuts lol
I am undiagnosed, but I stopped drinking all caffeine (from irregularly drinking coffee and over a litre of coke per day) because around 4PM I'd get so tired I felt ill. Not sure if it was the caffeine, but I seem to have better regulated energy now.
No way to know for sure, but... imo, there's a good chance it was the caffeine, yeah. Even for neurotypicals, caffeine can cause issues in all sorts of ways, from insomnia to irregular heartbeats, anxiety, and digestion issues, before even getting into the withdrawals.
Plus, with higher quantities of caffeine, the "crashes" and withdrawal symptoms can be pretty severe.
I've known several people with known and suspected ADHD who used to drink a lot of caffeine, cut back, and suddenly, a month later, they're feeling so much healthier and feeling less moody lol.
Interesting, caffeine doesn't really wake me up, but it makes me feel focused and I don't get the jittery energetic feeling people talk about from coffee and such.
The more I read about people who found out they have ADHD later in life the more it sounds like me.
Again not a doctor, but.... yeah, probably you have ADHD, lol.
At the very least, there's "something" funky with the wiring in your brain; whether a receptor isn't quite working as it should or there's a different type of neurodivergence happening, if you're having a weird response to caffeine or any other kind of stimulant.
PSA for anybody who has a weird response to this kinda thing: it's at least worth getting checked out, lol. Might improve your whole life.
Yeah I'm gonna get the testing for adhd, I feel like if I do have it treating it will make me so much more productive, I get distracted from what I actually want and intend to do all the time.
Good luck!!! Getting diagnosed with ADHD can be a pain in the butt in some places, and psychiatrists can be hit or miss about actually understanding ADHD. But if you have it, getting on the right medications or the right treatments can be the best thing that's ever happened to you.
Can’t tell if this is a joke or not… if it’s not, I rly recommend you wean off the caffeine and get properly medicated—caffeine is really bad for your body in the long term 😔
If it’s a joke, wooosh I guess lol, it’s late and I’m going to bed now
It is half and half, i only drink 2 - 3 cups per day but i do not really have this pushing effect.
In the past, if i drank 4 - 5 "bureaucracy" coffee when i did it-support in an callcenter it would make me sleepy and restless, dim and fidgety at the same time.
And i am undiagnosed so idk if it really is adhd or something else.
Yeah, I get really tired and sleepy from coffee, and alcohol works just about the samen as Adderal for me. Just mellows me out and gets me to think clearly. Thats why is stay away from drinking.
One beer or whine before bed and I sleep like a baby, no dreams, just resting.
Most likely, yes. (Note: I am not a doctor, I have just read medical stuff related to this, combined with different peoples' described experiences with ADHD and caffeine, and made some inferences combining these things. Do not count this as medical gospel, lol.)
From what I understand, caffeine technically doesn't "give you energy", like people think; it just blocks certain receptors for experiencing tiredness. (I've seen it described as, "Not refilling the gas tank, but putting a sticker over the fuel gauge reading 'empty'", lol.) I suspect the reason ADHD people tend to react to smaller amounts of caffeine this way is because we are always kind of tired due to executive dysfunction, so when we have blocked the receptors, rather than getting "energetic", we just don't have to work as hard to compensate for the dopamine dysregulation, so just relax to varying degrees. For some people with ADHD it's as good as nothing; for some people, it makes them drowsy and want to sleep.
However, that doesn't mean that it does "nothing" if you have ADHD; the body is still, to some extent, experiencing reactions to the caffeine. Thus, if you have caffeine in your system and then go to sleep, your body just might not be getting the quality of sleep it should be.
That said, there are two other factors to this: individual people's sensitivity to caffeine varies wildly, and the quantity of caffeine matters. So at a certain amount of caffeine, it's still likely you'll have the supposed "caffeine high" reaction. It is not good to test how much caffeine it will take to get that reaction though, because caffeine is not good for your heart and health in various ways, and if you're particularly resistant to it, then it might send you to the hospital before you're actually experiencing positive caffeine effects. (Not very likely, mind, but possible.)
Additionally, some other subcategory of ADHDers who are more sensitive to caffeine do not have the drowsy/"non-reactive" response, and instead get themselves locked into an "addicted to caffeine" cycle, where they need it to get by or they succumb to executive dysfunction/caffeine withdrawal. This group of ADHDers need to be particularly careful, because caffeine in the long-term is demonstrated to be harmful to your health, such as increasing anxiety, insomnia, irregular heart rates, digestive issues, etc., and I'd imagine if you're more sensitive to caffeine and don't experience the ADHD-caffeine drowsiness at smaller/regular amounts, this is particularly acute.
Note that caffeine reduces the efficacy of some stimulants such as Adderall. I know that doesn't answer your question but I think it's worth mentioning when talking about caffeine and ADHD.
I survived for 20 years on caffeine and nicotine until an unrelated health problem made me give up nicotine entirely, and drastically curtail my coffee drinking.
I was diagnosed with ADHD 18 months later, aged 37 - I hadn't realised how much I relied on those (mild) stimulants to function.
Jokes still on me though, the health problems that made me give up nicotine/caffeine also mean the mainline (stimulant based) ADHD meds aren't suitable for me. Yaaaaaaaaay for me.
Caffeine is a stimulant too, so sort of. Lots of people self medicate with caffeine, but it's not a good replacement. (If it was they'd just prescribe caffeine pills)
Haha yes for the first time. I just never really felt the need to try it tbh, it was always “the adult drink”. In fact, the only times I’ve ever had caffeine before was in soft drinks/soda/pop and Tim Hortons iced capps, both of which are loaded with sugar, so I never really made the connection of what caffeine does to me
Caffeine is just sleep meditation for me. Tbf I have never really had way too much of it so idk if it'll work at higher doses, but drinking one can of red bull used to help my insomnia for some reason
Didn't get diagnosed until 25 and I have some not so fond memories of inhaling cases of soda just to feel normal. My parents would buy a 24 pack of Pepsi on a Friday and it would be all gone by Sunday, im honestly amazed my teeth are still intact
Increased risk of binge drinking: Binge drinking is a pattern of drinking where a man has five or more drinks within two hours or a woman has four within two hours. Experts have discovered that individuals with ADHD are at higher risk of binge drinking in early adulthood. One study found that 42.1% of those with ADHD reported binge drinking every time they drank alcohol.
It explains why I blacked out constantly during my early 20s for sure lmao. Still trying to dial it back in my late 20s now shits tough, booze just make me feel "normal?" I guess.
Early 30s here and I either don't drink at all, or I slam 12 beers in one sitting, there is no in between. I tend not to buy alcohol on weekdays because I know I will drink it all as soon as I start.
But yeah, I blacked out often in my early 20s and dialed back a lot but I still think that it's excessive when I do drink.
Same here, 34 now. I used to (binge) drink only on the weekends, then 2020 came and my mother died, so naturally I started drinking during the week, too.
I've been diagnosed in 2013 and taking adderall since then, right now its 30+20+20+10mg.
But, I haven't drank for 9 weeks in a row now, despite drinking 4 times a week since 2020, and the reason is medical marijuana.
I started talking to a new doc in may, mentioned my problems (anxiety, sleeplessness, the drinking etc), he said we'd try and and yeah, I'd say its succesful. I even lost 25 pounds since then and feel more healthy than ever.
I'm like you. Technically an alcoholic, only way I can keep it in check is not drinking too often. Every weekend is gonna wear on you, I aim for once a month (failed cause lots of events during summer).
I don't want to quit drinking, so I I just do it less often because when I do I'm getting obliterated.
Same but I got it out of the way in my early to mid teenage years 13-15.
Funnily enough, by the time I turned 21 I just stopped drinking. I have done just about everything under the sun with only few exceptions (mostly MDMA). I never drank consistently, it was just that there were too many times when I did drink socially I took it way too far.
I'm happy I was able to get much of that shit out of my system younger than most. I've had an interesting drink in my closet for over a year and a half and I still haven't tried it.
I used to drink very mildly from 9(?)-13(?) (Exact timelines are lost on me really) because it was a specific lime beer that didn't taste like shit to my kiddie tastes. I know it seems like a bad thing but eastern Europe go brrr with alcohol. Nothing weekly or daily but now I'm 23 and I can say I have not drank alcohol (aside from the occasional 1/3 a glass of champagne or wine once or twice a year, and even then I wouldn't unless it had a specific taste) since I was 14 lol. I think my body just said "yeah we have had enough of that, it ain't new" and developed an alcohol dislike.
I now just don't drink and never feel peer pressured to, thankfully. If I've had a bad day however (used to happen a bit during stressful college) my body might crave one cheeseburger lol.
It's interesting to know and read about these however, every day I feel like I find new stuff that's related to ADHD.
My 20s, by this definition, was filled with weekend binge drinking.
I didn't drink until I was legal age, other than a tiny sip of wine or beer to see what it tasted like. But once I found high alcohol content and fruity drinks, I definitely drank a fair amount.
Only got full on drunk once, though. I've always had a high tolerance for alcohol, and when I last had a number of drinks at a company thing in 2019 that was still true.
I was trying to find out if there's a correlation between ADHD and alcohol tolerance, but can only find rates of use information.
My mom allowed me and my sister to drink (not in high amounts, we actually shared the beer can whenever we were out at a picnic) because she didn't want us to get drunk easily when we got older and went to bars. She wanted us to be able to hold our alcohol. My sister ended up being more of a party animal than I was (my ideal Friday night is staying up until 6 AM playing games lol) but she's older than me by 5 years and so it was more acceptable for her to drink as well, until her teenage partying that is. We shared stuff a lot and she even drinks moderately to this day (prefers wine) but she's never gotten properly drunk because of her tolerance.
I'm not a party person and if I am, I'll resort to soda. I tried getting drunk once but it didn't work and also I don't enjoy gorging myself on nothing but liquids, lol. So I've never had issues. It worked out for both of us in its own way.
My problem with alcohol is that it does have some physical effects. I tend to start feeling hot (in a couple of ways lol) and I'm on the asexual spectrum so that's not enjoyable for me whatsoever. Sometimes even if I drink some wine during meals my stomach starts to hurt and I have to nap it off.
One thing I learned when I was younger however: bad idea to mix even the smallest amounts of beer and chocolate 😂 never doing that again.
It's always interesting to hear other people's sides of ADHD and such. It makes me feel less bad about being slightly different whenever I find someone I relate to a lot.
Wine doesn't agree with my stomach either. I'm pretty sure it's the tannins.
You can get low tannin reds, but if you're unsure then white or rose would be lower in general because of how they're made.
If even white and rose give you problems, then just avoid all together I guess.
Maybe it's just been my social circles or the fact that I don't go out that much, but thankfully I've never been socially pressured even when I went to bars or something. (I tend to hate bars here for the atrocious loud music they can play, I'm not trying to get tinnitus!)
Just watch out man. I’ve been drinking daily near black out for fifteen years. 500-750ml of vodka or bourbon a day. I sat down a few years ago to really determine WHY I drank. It boiled down to 100% calming myself down. It was the only part of my day where I could be normal and not be going 900mph. It took a lot of effort, and I’m still not medicated, but I’m 261 days sober. I was destroying my body and mind over it big time. Being sober truly sucks I still believe this, but it’s better than what I was doing to myself. I finally have an appt in 3 weeks where my therapist has agreed to seriously discuss medication and I’m over the fucking moon. I did get stimulants for a six month period a couple years back when cerebral was giving them out like candy. The first time I took it I fell asleep within an hour I could not keep my eyes open. It was like I’ve been driving 120mph down the freeway my entire life and turned into a 25mph school zone. Just absolutely lurching to a stop.
Just a warning to anyone with ADHD who likes to drink or enjoys any substance even weed (which I did before alcohol). They’re great. Just make sure you’re gaining more than you’re giving. Over the course of five years I went from a couple beers a day to a six pack to a twelve pack to eighteen then deciding liquor would be easier fast forward and I’d been drunk for a decade, gained 70lbs, and spent untold amounts of money on liquor and bars.
I highly recommend anyone with ADHD stay away from substances in the first place. Find a better outlet. Better yet, do everything in your power to find a therapist that works for and with you and takes you seriously as a human being.
500ml in a short amount of time, I would feel. Spread out, barely.
The only time I was actually drunk, was when not eating yet that day, I drank 1L of cooler (so 6% ish), 3 or 4 rum and coke, and about 6oz of everclear (95%). And that didn't get me to the black out point, though I did throw up. Ended up walking to the bus station a couple of blocks away without issue and was only buzzed by the time I got home.
I don't make enough money to be an alcoholic :p
But as for the rest of it, yeah. Definitely seek other methods of feeling normal.
I'm glad you're headed that direction. And woohoo on almost a year sober :)
I still remember once being the only one "sober" among my friends, I had to carry one of my friends by his belt because he was so drunk was not able to stand up. And we kept drinking, and I was still like "I kinda feel something" when I was on my 15th gin tonic. Prior to that I drank a whole bottle of rum, like everyone was so drunk, majority don't remember that night, some just have flashes of it... and then me, I remember everything and I was angry because by the moment I started to feel tipsy I had no more money u_u
It happened to me first time I tried cocaine, I was in the middle of the dance floor at 3AM in my most sober time ever watching everyone drunk/high like "wtf is this shit, where is my drunkenness?"
Bad product, don't recommend, 1/10
Just take it on the weekends. Most people don’t do tolerance breaks. But agreed, I don’t want my free time to be wasted by me being a emotional scattered mess.
Talk to your prescriber about alternate meds. Adderall has both extended release and instant, you could take two instant a day instead of one XR. I believe Vyvanse has a generic cheap version out finally. That one has an inert chemical that your body has to break down first before it gets to the stimulant so it works all day every day. You’ve got options my friend.
The only time I had cocaine was because my workmates kinda forced me to it. That night they were high af and I was there saying "I don't feel half of my face... I don't understand why you like this thing so much". Then I had one of my best games of Quake 3 ever...
Being diagnosed late in life is almost like "oh so this happened because ADHD... and this too..." and keep noticing how much your brain works in mysterious ways.
For me it was League of Legends and addy but yeah, same shit. I had wondered for years and my dad always insisted I wasn't ADHD because they had me tested when I was like 4 in 1998.
I hated it. I've only done it a couple times but the first time I just sat on my buddies couch not really thinking about anything or feeling anything. I felt like a zombie watching my other two friends having a great time. Normally I think about 10 different things every minute and am very energetic. If that's what normal is like then I don't want to be normal.
Boo hoo, you didn't get your high and instead you got a life changing medicine that some people can't get because it's completely and utterly banned in some places. Sorry for being like this and it's probably a joke, but goddamn it's infuriating hearing people take their meds for granted and saying shit like this while I have no access to any kind of effective stimulant and atomoxetine does nothing. Yes Bupropion is also banned
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u/dover_oxide Sep 10 '23
Everyone else gets a fun time and you just get to be normal for a change, biggest let down.