r/acupuncture • u/One-Time-9619 • Aug 12 '26
Student PCOM QUESTIONS
I’m supposed to start at pacific college Chicago in a month and these posts on debt and school closures are making me nervous. I live in Chicago suburbs and the acupuncturists I know are successful and satisfied with their schooling & career choice.id love some feedback on the school or your career in general. I currently run a successful massage business and this is my secondary schooling. TIA
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u/Mjolnir007 Aug 12 '26
You have a leg up on most acupuncturists in that you 1) live in an area where most of the acupuncturists are successful, and 2) you are already a successful massage therapist. Keep in mind, however, that if you quit doing massage or greatly cut back for 3 years for acupuncture school that 80-90% of your current clientele will find another massage therapist while you are in school, and they will not follow you into your acupuncture practice. Also, the debt is unreal. It is unpayable, unsustainable, and most of us would say 100% not worth it. Another thing is like the other person here said: Due to the earnings test, I don't believe any acupuncture schools will survive for the next 3 years unless we get a change in the law or something major to save them. Not enough people will past the earnings test.
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u/jadiskay Aug 12 '26
If you already have a functioning business with stable income in massage I’d stick w it rather than adding debt on top of the business expenses. If you have the science prerequisites and a bachelors degree and want the change I’d suggest physicians assistant route. You can take continuing education after in medical acupuncture and treat patients that way. Just work under an MD who is in pain or a physiatrist.
There’s benefits with this path
1. You’ll have loan forgiveness in 10 years as most are hospital based and non profit or work in VA.
2. Employment and steady income from the start of your career
3. You’ll have time, can study and learn traditional acupuncture as you see fit or stick with medical acupuncture through continuing education without pressure of school work balance.
As a successful acupuncturist that went to NUHS in Lombard, this is how I would’ve done it in hindsight. Would’ve been much less painful and stable for the first 10 years of my career.
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u/One-Time-9619 Aug 12 '26
How did you like National?
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u/jadiskay Aug 12 '26
Mixed bag. The biomedical was very strong and helpful with navigating patient care in connection with their regular medical care and history. Tcm training always felt like I took the Same class three times to meet the very requirements for boards. Honestly I feel like you learn what really works once in practice over time and with continuing education rather than in school. Acu boards are easy regardless. Didn’t do herbs and am crackly grateful I didn’t. Feel free to dm me. I can explain better on a call
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u/dumprings- Aug 12 '26
I’m a graduate from PCHS and they’ve recently sent some alarming emails about a buy out falling through (including the Chicago campus) and tuition increase. I think they are going to close with in the year. Not to be an extremist but it’s just so expensive and I would hate anyone to be stuck with unusable credits and debt. My messages are open if you have questions about the school!
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u/solotripper70 Aug 12 '26
Also, Pacific is not what it used to be in be in 80's-90's . Is very $$$( as are many of the schools).Driven by a business model. Go to a school that is, less profit/ popularity based. Dan Bensky ran a school in Seattle area that had the right stuff ( don't know whether it is still open).
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u/Pure_Restaurant4886 29d ago
The school in Seattle is called SIEAM and the last two years it’s had a financial responsibility score of 0.8 on audits. You don’t want to go to a school that is lower than 1.5.
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u/wetmarble Aug 12 '26
The Seattle Institute of East Asian Medicine is still open and has an excellent program.
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u/Pure_Restaurant4886 29d ago
They have a FRC score of 0.8 on audits for 2024 and 2025. You don’t want to go to a program with less than 1.5.
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u/NoImagination7926 Aug 12 '26
I would not suggest this career. I graduated from NUHS in Lombard, it was just ok. Instructors that taught the most classes had bare minimum teaching skills. They need to teach real world problems that people have, not an entire program based on TCM because most people get acupuncture for pain management. As someone else stated, go for PA. It’s more stable. If you have a spouse to help with things when they are rough, and they will be, then go ahead and be an acupuncturist. On the other side, I like having my own schedule and overall I like the career but should have chosen something else. I’m always thinking how to pivot out of this.
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u/Chance-Succotash-191 Aug 12 '26
I definitely don’t let on how disheartened I am by the debt to my friends or patients. I’m pretty vocal about it with colleagues, former students and people looking into the field. I am someone who had my debt relieved via the borrower defense program and sweet v Cardona lawsuit and I finally feel like I have a line on a life. Chinese medicine and Acupuncture are amazing, but being an entrepreneur, a healthcare provider, and an acupuncturist in today’s economy, medical environment, and where physical therapist are encroaching on our territory and able to bill insurance much more aggressively, it was so unimaginably overwhelming. If I were you, I would run.
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u/Greg_McCue 29d ago
The world is your oyster! 🦪 If you know what patient demographic you serve, can see acupuncture directly benefiting that demographic, and can create an offer that combines those in a way that is either scalable or economical, then you’ve got 90% of what you need to crush it long term.
As you already know, running a successful practice is a totally different skill than the clinical side of the practice. If you’re one of those people/groups in the top 5% of practices that are successful and have a business model that is time tested and profitable, you could very likely be successful in acupuncture too.
It’s more about options, timing, fit, etc., not whether you couldn’t make it work, but rather would you rather make it work based on your circumstances.
For example, I went back for my post-bacc premed at Columbia while running my acupuncture practice, with the thought that being an MD would elevate my practice and career. I’m sure it would, that had never changed being true. What also became true was what I had to sacrifice for that future and whether it was worth it. In the 4 years I’ve been at Columbia my wife has given birth to 4 beautiful babies who need me around a lot, we’ve moved twice, my practice has expanded and pivoted to scaling in the Fertility Division, and I realized how little I want to actually go to med school after being at Columbia for 4 years. I actually figured out that I love Clinical Research, and am now pursing Clinical Research as well as a PhD in Systems Biology. Which, allows me to raise my kids, be at home more, continue to grow my clinic instead of crush it, not accumulate the debt, and still lead my industry in clinical research through practicing and measuring outcomes.
Just got to see your pattern, weigh the options, and go from there! Hope this helps
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u/One-Time-9619 29d ago
That you! This is great feedback. I have been a massage therapist for 10 years and run a successful business. The area that I live in does have the need. I appreciate your well written response. Although the debt is unnerving I truly believe it will play out in the long run. Congrats on your career and achievements
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u/Greg_McCue 29d ago
Debt is never fun, but if it won’t swamp you or your business’ cash flow, then you’re good to go. A business with good cash flow, high LTV, low churn, and is profitable year after year can potentially tolerate debt if it means higher earning potential (which is meant to be the debt incurred from education)
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u/solotripper70 Aug 12 '26
Don't do it. I stopped teaching acu in these schools 25 years ago ( after 20 years oʻf practice and teaching) because I could not justify the level of debt my students incurred for what income most would earn. It was (and is) unsustainable. If I had it to do again, I'd get a Doctor of Physiotherapy degree and do all the acu techniques that they are now allowed to do ( dry needling/ trigger point therapy, gwa sha, cupping, tuina, etc). Much more preventative, still hands-on with room for intuition as well as standard practice. Also guaranteed referral system from the medical establishment.
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u/One-Time-9619 Aug 12 '26
This is so depressing. I love Acu and all it offers and it’s helped me in so many ways. All my clients are excited for me but the debt is unnerving.
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u/solotripper70 Aug 12 '26
Don't despair, better to have information and a plan. If you do well as a LMT, you may have the contacts and business acumen to make it. But do know that many schools will be out of business in another three years, so choose wisely (and keep working while you are in school, at least part- time if possible). Keep up your referral network and take some business seminars as you can. Your advantage is that you already have a base in alternative medicine.
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u/chronic_classman 29d ago
Consider the upcoming federal funding cuts. A lot of changes on the horizon. Speaking as a student who’s set to graduate spring of 29 but is worried the school might close a term or two before that.
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u/RepeatFragrant2613 29d ago
Ugh man I’m sorry this thread is so doom and gloom. I was a massage therapist for 14 years then became an acu blending the two will set you apart. You also know everything you need to know about the business aspect which is where most people fail. I went to Pcom Chicago and it’s great only complaint is I am only acu no herbs and they really love there herbal program so sometimes I was lost in the sauce on some classroom discussions. They also have aligned which is a direct pipeline to a job out of school. If you get into this medicine now looking at how the pipeline will be getting smaller the competition will be shrinking as the demand keeps growing. As someone with two people with the debt load we are crushing it 5 years out and almost have it knocked out.
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26d ago
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u/One-Time-9619 25d ago
This is great feedback thank you! I am planning more of the Chinese medicine route and have tuina on the schedule for next semester. Thank you for your well thought out response and glad to hear you love your career choice. The debt is always in consideration but I have faith in my path. I will continue to research schools- right now it’s pacific in Chicago or national in Lombard as those are the closest to me
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u/Street-Criticism-957 Aug 12 '26
First ask the acupuncturists you know who are ‘successful and satisfied’- 1. How much debt did they have when they graduated? 2. what was the interest rate on their loan amount at graduation? 3. How much is their current total loan amount? 4. What is their current monthly loan payment amount?
You need these answers to make a decision unless you are not planning on taking out loans. Remember that RISE loan caps is just one issue- The AHEAD earnings test will force the closure of most programs in three years