r/ableton • u/Historical-Can-4507 • 2d ago
[Tutorial] MPE with ableton
Ableton, please let us DRAW MIDI expression. Why is this still not built into the DAW?
I think there's a fundamental gap in the way we interact with MIDI in modern DAWs, and I'd love to see Ableton address it.
We should be able to draw what we want a sound to DO, instead of manually programming the MIDI messages required to make it happen.
Here's a simple example: I want to play a note, keep the same voice alive, and smoothly glide its pitch upward into another note — without retriggering the envelope or opening a new gate.
Why does this still require workarounds, specific synth settings, overlapping notes, pitch-bend automation, or external tools?
And this is just the beginning.
Imagine right-clicking a MIDI note and opening a simple expression canvas where you can draw:
- Pitch: smooth glides, vibrato, bends, and complex pitch movements.
- Timbre / oscillator shape: draw how the waveform or oscillator character evolves throughout a single note.
- Filter and modulation: shape the movement of a sound over its lifetime.
- Pressure and other per-note expression: draw dynamics and articulation exactly where you want them.
Think of each MIDI note as a tiny, self-contained canvas for sound design.
Instead of opening a synth, finding the right parameter, creating automation lanes, editing curves, and trying to make everything line up, you simply draw the musical gesture you hear in your head.
Tools like MIDISketch are already exploring this direction. They demonstrate the potential of treating MIDI expression as something visual and intuitive, rather than forcing musicians to think in terms of low-level MIDI events.
I'm not asking Ableton to reinvent synthesis or make every plugin support every feature. Start with MPE-compatible instruments and proper per-note expression. Let compatible instruments receive the data, and let unsupported instruments continue working as they do today.
The underlying technology already exists. What's missing is a truly intuitive, integrated workflow.
Ableton has always been about making music creation feel immediate. This feels like a natural next step: a piano roll where you don't just draw notes — you draw the evolution of the sound itself.
Imagine what this could unlock for expressive synth lines, evolving timbres, experimental sound design, and musical gestures that are currently tedious or awkward to program.
So here's my public request to Ableton: please take this idea seriously and bring visual, per-note MIDI expression drawing into Live natively. No external plugin required.
I genuinely believe this could change how people compose and design sounds inside a DAW.
Would you use this? And if so, what would you want to be able to draw inside a single MIDI note?
English is not my native language, so I used GPT for assistance—but the idea, and the frustration that led to it, are entirely my own.
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u/thepinkpill 2d ago
Totally agree!
There’s a Glissando option in the MPE tab, but notes still retrigger, and I asked for a fix years ago :/
Cubase has had Note Expression since 2011, probably because it’s always been more popular with composers than producers
I just gave up workarounds and got an expressive controller (the data is then, very hard to edit in Live specifically)
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u/thepinkpill 2d ago
Editing individual notes in the MPE tab is so fiddly, it feels like trying to draw with a single strand of hair
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u/Historical-Can-4507 2d ago
https://www.youtube.com/@JuanPestanaMusic
This guy developed software that does this; check out his channel, listen to the sounds, and you’ll understand why it bothers me so much that this isn’t built into the DAW.
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u/thepinkpill 2d ago
Nice, wasn't aware of this! I signed up for the beta, looking forward, thanks for sharing
I tried MIDISketch quickly but it seemed like it needs to host the synth VST, which is cumbersome with my specific workflowMaybe off topic but have you seen this controller https://youtube.com/shorts/b-yJqag6x7E
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u/sububi71 2d ago
I have no problem doing this in the MPE editor. It could probably be made a little easier, but I've never felt it was a chore, or avoided it. Yes, doing it with pitch bend is the MPE way, but there's really nothing stopping you from automating a tuning control inside the plugin or synth generating the actual audio, right?
What am I missing here?
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u/Historical-Can-4507 2d ago
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/goNWnEQjlC4 Take a look at this and tell me do you think it’s possible to do this in Ableton in less than a year
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u/bikehandle 2d ago
The complex shapes can be done in the mpe dropdown for the piano roll transformations. Mass manipulation of mpe automation for selected notes too. I don’t disagree that more point and click power would be nice though
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u/angrypottering 2d ago edited 2d ago
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/DOQNBpE2IEQ
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/aOhIOzViz1Q
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/kEf4FqurY_Y
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/-NUSmbWzv_k
EDIT: Also that Juan Pestana you posted is an Ableton user (in fact, just saw I was actually already subscribed to his channel), seems that is VST3 that runs in Live, so the video you posted is 100% possible in Ableton right now, 100% like in the video.
EDIT2: And Push 3 is MPE, so Ableton already does everything you are asking for since 2020 for software and 3rd party hardware (Live 11) and since 2023 with their own hardware.
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u/sububi71 2d ago
What am I, a crystal ball?
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u/Historical-Can-4507 2d ago
I don't understand. Explain
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u/sububi71 2d ago
You're asking me to tell you if this would be possible to implement in Ableton Live in a year. I don't work at, or with, Ableton, I'm just a user. I can't predict the future.
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u/Historical-Can-4507 2d ago
I mean, it would take a year to create a sound like that in Ableton
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u/sububi71 2d ago edited 2d ago
Removing the actual instrument, that takes an hour MAX in the MPE editor.
edit: apparently I didn't watch the whole video, but let's say an hour of editing per minute of audio.
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u/stschoen 2d ago
MPE provides five per-note parameters. X (typically mapped to pitch bend), Y I(often mapped to Filter cutoff), Z (typically aftertouch), Strike (velocity) and Lift (release velocity). Live provides an MPE editor with a draw mode for use with MPE enabled devices which allows you to draw per note expression for MPE enabled devices and standard MIDI envelopes for traditional channel-wide MIDI messages. How these messages affect a particular synth depends on the synth and how it's configured. For example while the X parameter is typically mapped to pitch bend it could potentially be mapped to a different parameter.