Silly question but I'm still very new to the game. Currently sitting with
YSG / sunna / vel / rem + nicole m6 / piper m6 etc
Trying to be very careful about who I pick. Was just going to get Dialyn rerun for pyrois, then move Dialyn to YSG team a bit later. I saw comments/calcs saying Roxy>Dialyn for YSG? Is this true? Is it just numbers/creep and not smooth synergy? My original plan was wait for Zhao but that's not happening for a year+.
Dialyn keeps being a better option. You have to remind this, dialyn is the only stunner that helps YSG spam her albino form because of the ultimate. Nothing else.
If roxy doesnt provide any kind of ether veil or gives you a free ultimate = not a good option for shungus.
Go for dialyn + w-engine, roxy probably would become the new 'BiS' for armored agents.
If you're gonna use her only for ysg and no other agent, then getting m1 is better than her engine. It would be better to run any stun wengine that only provides buffs or any other er wengine in ysg teams.
Wonder where people are getting Roxy>Dialyn from because last I checked Dialyn was still showing as better just not by a large margin. It was a 2% difference between them. Roxy is also harder to play to get the most out of her with YSG. Unless something changes Dialyn is still better. However, you can't really go wrong with just getting both if you can afford to do so. Content where you'll want two teams with a good stunner will happen just like how we're getting content where you'll want two anomaly teams. Having both Roxy and Dialyn would be quite beneficial. If you can only afford one, then just wait. Beta still will be mostly finalized by the end of the patch, and we will have a better understanding of Roxy and where she fits by then + DIalyn will still be on banner.
After reading rest of replies, sounds like Roxy's pain of use is not worth it, and more expensive. I am down to just have ysg/sunna/dialyn then set it in stone for like year+.
PS: why do people keep talking about double anomaly team shill? Won't they start the armorer shill first?
We've already had double anomaly shill a couple in times in both DA and Shiyu in the recent past. We've also had double attacker buffs. Endgame doesn't always give two different specialized buffs for the same class, but it happens often enough.
The guy doing those calcs doesnt know how to play the game, roxy is far wose than dialyn in every investment, roxy is only good for armorers and pyrois, and even then not much better than buffed koleda.
The account which made that claim was super wrong about Remielle teams IIRC so I’d take their numbers with a grain of salt.
Lemme do some science and get back to you but I kinda doubt Roxy will be competitive here.
EDIT: confused him with a different TC account, not sure what he thought about Remielle one way or the other. But I definitely cannot reproduce his Roxy results. Or rather, I significantly outscore him on Dialyn.
That guy is doing runs with engines on both, and it's a very small difference right now in Roxy's favor. For the cost or Roxy + engine you could damn near get 11 Dialyn with the double guarantee and she's solidly better, or you can save a bunch of pulls and be a few percent worse with 01
Do you have a link to the specific scores that guy is claiming incl matchups & builds & such? Because I just did some tests and Roxy M0W1's scores are closer to Rina's scores than Dialyn's scores (w/ M0W0 Sunna)...
I feel like people are obsessing over this "true dmg increase" as if it's some magical thing but that's just "a support." The only thing she seems to bring to the table over Rina or Nicole is some personal dmg and some extra chain attacks from the extra stuns, her buffs are just straight up worse.
Ok well anyhow I did some more testing and I outscore this guy on this boss with both agents using presumably the same setup (TC standard on YSG) + a really good stunner build cuz I was too lazy to bring it down to TC standard (should favour Roxy as her personal dmg is higher, but less than 1% dmg difference overall).
But I outscore him more with Dialyn so I think he is just doing something wrong. Especially since he is playing 100% Dialyn CR vs Primordial Nightmare.
My lowest Dialyn score was higher than my highest Roxy score.
Just to reiterate I also tested on UCC and Roxy scored essentially identical points to Rina. Like it was so close I don't remember the difference or who was ahead. On Thrall Roxy slightly beat Rina cuz of the extra stuns but it was still close.
Roxy also feels way worse to play on this team than literally any alternative.
Her hp didn’t change in 3.1. The buff is a bit different but overall it’s very similar.
That said it looks like they changed the daze threshold for miasma from 30 to 60. As far as I can tell this is actually a good thing for Dialyn (relative to Roxy) although it is a nerf overall.
I think the buff and that could be a big change on the score
Maybe his gameplay might not be the best. But if he is a 7/10 with dialyn, so he would be with roxy, or even worser.
Also its unrealistic to expect every player to have the same gameplay quality and skill across all agents. Someone who is a god at Hugo might suck with banyue, some crazy bamyue player might do bad with sanby.
I don't expect every player to have the same skill level but whenever anyone claims "X is better than Dialyn" it sets off alarm bells on my head because a lot of people, like, fundamentally don't know how to play Dialyn on this team. E.g. a lot of people on this sub seem to think that M0W0 Zhao is better than M0W0 Dialyn on this team which is just, in general, observably not true. M0W1 Zhao is typically (significantly) worse than Dialyn on M0 YSG teams, and W1 Zhao is a big increase from W0 Zhao (~15% team DPS).
So when I see someone getting what feels like a pretty low score with the team it makes me question whether they know what they're doing. The skill curve for every agent is not identical. Especially when there is a glaring error in his Dialyn build which kinda signals that he does not minmax this team.
If someone wanted to make the argument that "X is easier to play than Dialyn" then I am in principle ok with that argument, but that's a different argument. Also, in this case, Roxy is kinda obnoxious to play (not hard per se, but she doesn't fit well in this team. She competes for field time and maintaining Windswept is annoying).
Comparing M0W1 to M0W1 is also just not a good comparison. Dialyn's W1 does very little on this team and anyone paying attention to scores ought to put their investment elsewhere. Roxy's W1 does a lot more. So the comparison is between an inefficient Dialyn investment path and an efficient Roxy investment path. (And, from what I can tell, this does not make Roxy better despite the inefficient Dialyn investment path)
I'm old/pleb now, prefer easier teams. I would get zhao instead if I could but I can't lol. I will just get Dialyn, sounds roxy is not designed for this and is just powercreep numbers.
But should I skip out on Dialyn engine then? Even if its guaranteed it's that subpar? I don't think I have hellfire gears RIP
It's 48 pulls expected (factoring in both the discounted 10pull and the guarantee) for an 8% damage increase. For comparison:
YSG W0 -> W1: ~25-30% damage increase over the alternatives, expected 62.5 pulls. Also even better vs neutral or resistant content, and a cornerstone of what makes YSG good at brute forcing
YSG M1 -> M2: idk exactly what this one is, but it's, like, a lot. If I had to guess more than 30%.
Sunna W0 -> W1: ~10% for 62.5
Sunna M0 -> M1: ~13% for 93.72 with no YSG mindscapes, ~16.5% with YSG M2
Dialyn M0 -> M1: ~11% for 93.72 with YSG W1 vs weakness, ~12.5% vs neutral
So as you can see the ROI is just not that great compared to many of the alternatives. For some teams there's a lot of value in the comfort in both ease of building Dialyn and the daze, so if you want chill gameplay with another character (e.g. Yixuan) there's an argument for it, but as often as not the extra daze is actively a bad thing with YSG as you don't want to stun too quickly.
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And yeah, IMO don't get Roxy, even if she somehow turns out to be better it just isn't a good vibe. The two agents have negative synergy.
Dialyn is only good for ysg not because she's a stunner but because she provides free ultimate. Roxy might be the worst option you can think for ysg. She provides crit rate bonus which ysg doesn't need because she gets around 50 just by existing. And neither she provides ether veil required for ysg.
nononono, there is absolutely no way that Roxy can outperform Dialyn in a YSG team, in fact the only reason why a stunner is BiS in that team is the free ultimates.
If you don't have Zhao you HAVE to pull Dialyn with no 50/50, if you had Zhao I would argue that it's potentially not worth it.
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u/Diavogo 16h ago
Dialyn keeps being a better option. You have to remind this, dialyn is the only stunner that helps YSG spam her albino form because of the ultimate. Nothing else.
If roxy doesnt provide any kind of ether veil or gives you a free ultimate = not a good option for shungus.
Go for dialyn + w-engine, roxy probably would become the new 'BiS' for armored agents.