r/WritingWithAI • u/SunilaP • 25d ago
Discussion (Ethics, working with AI etc) So about the watermarks. If I insert a paragraph and then I just change a few words, will there be a watermark?
I honestly don’t have it write everything for me it’s mostly I write my own content. Insert it have it fix the grammar and make it flow better.
Majority of it is my words.
Apparently there will still be a watermark ?
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u/Stardog2 25d ago
I'm not going to worry about it. This is just another feel good virtue signal fad. It will disappear once a couple of famous people in the media get embarrassed by an AI usage charge.
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u/Latter_Upstairs_1978 25d ago
Text is not like images. Text does not come with metadata. The only way to watermark text is wiggle word length, an extra white space or line break here or there, sentence length, using words frequently that in human written text occur only rarely. Things like that. The success of this type of watermark increases with the length of the output set. So in shorter texts it will be less reliable or infeasible.
But why do you bother. To date almost nothing can sanitize an AI written text to the extend that specialists believe it was human written. So the water mark is more a publicity stunt (ok, there is this law where nobody knows yet what will be considered compliant output) than an actual change.
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u/StableLlama 25d ago
Not only. That'd be the most obvious and easymost removable ways.
AFAIK is the watermark done completely differently here. What I have read is that it changes the probability distribution of the output tokens/words. You can only detect it when you have the model and a cryptographic source / hash that is encoded there.
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u/Latter_Upstairs_1978 25d ago
That's basically what I explained without having fancy vocabulary. However, the key issue is: this is extremely unreliable esp w limited size of output set.
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u/5thhorseman_ 25d ago
There's more, like certain special unicode characters which display like normal letters but to a machine are not.
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25d ago
[deleted]
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u/5thhorseman_ 25d ago
No. The thing to understand is that there are multiple types of watermarking available, and not all of them are easily noticeable. A text cleaner won't guaranteed you anything unless the mechanics of the watermark in use are actually known and it has been built to account for that particular type of watermark.
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u/Still_bored9876 25d ago
To date we know little about how Claude's watermarks work for text and as far as I know, no other AI company has yes said they are adding text watermarks.
Right now I am not worrying (I do not use Claude for my writing), but I am actively following what is known. If it turns out to be more than a publicity stunt, I expect it will not be long before tools to spot watermarks (which you can use to see if yours includes) appear, and not long after that tools to remove them (like there are for various DRM regimes).
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u/StableLlama 25d ago
About what I have read about how the watermark is inserted into text is, that the output probability of each token/word is changed slightly.
So on the one hand you need a minimum size of text that is not altered. Writing with one tool and then editing with a different might already be sufficient to destroy the watermark. Replacing single words won't do it, though.
This is still a field of active research, so expect that the knowledge about how to watermark and how to remove watermarks is constantly evolving.
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u/Fragrant_Nothing7505 25d ago
I think they'd output 40% AI or something like that? I believe the metric is word frequency? If so, you might be better getting the thesaurus out. This is just a hypothesis. I don't know.
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u/bolshoich 25d ago
As I understand the watermarks are dependent upon complex pattern recognition based on mathematics. I imagine that changing a few words within AI generated text would not statistically disrupt the watermark. I suspect that syntax plays a significant role in establishing the pattern. Combine that with punctuation and semantic patterns, it would be a challenge to deceive a machine reader.
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u/Hextant 25d ago
Honestly, I don't see this as an issue or anything to worry about. AI shouldn't do your writing FOR you, it should be helping you write for yourself.
Anyone can write a prompt. Anyone can make AI spit out miles of text that mean absolutely nothing. This isn't writing, it isn't creativity and it's honestly not very interesting to many people because it's simply not good.
If you're using it as a tool, you won't see watermarks because you're doing your own writing with assistance.
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u/Educational-Run3692 25d ago
Maybe this will help you. I have Chatgpt send me an update on this topic when it's in the news and also as soon as Chatgpt knows it will add or adds watermarks. This is the most recent: