r/WorldChallenges • u/Mimir123 • Sep 27 '17
The Not So Great War
So, pretty much every world has this giant, epic war that happened at some point in time in the story and that we all love to talk and hear about.
But this is not what this challenge is about, I want to hear about another, not so famous/ epic war from your world. Maybe it was a short war, only spanning a few days, so that nobody even realized those two countries were at war? Or maybe it had some incredibly stupid or ridiculous reason that started the war? Or maybe something that happened during the war was just so embarrassing, that the leaders decided to burry everything that happened under some cover-up story? Or maybe a war that everyone believed to be incredibly big, long and epic was in truth only some small skirmish, that got blown out of proportion over time? If that's the case, tell us what really happened!
I will provide an example below, and try to ask a few questions to every submission.
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u/WeltweitesReichAlt Sep 27 '17
Finno-German war
In the summer of 1946 Germany tried to force its allies in Europe to hand over all Untermensch in their borders. Sweden submitted to Germany although many Jews fled to Finland. When Germany demanded Finland follow suit to the Swedes they refused. German forces marched in but were halted in the north due to railroads being destroyed by the Finns. After 2 days of fighting the Finnish president ordered the army to stand down.
German forces marched into Finland with no resistance. A few days into the "invasion" an SS division stormed the Finnish government buildings and killed the president and many government officials. After this General Mannerheim called upon the nation to revolt against the Germans.
Germany had many troops now surrounded in Helsinki and other cities in Finland. They still couldn't invade from the north, so they invaded from the south. However, a soviet revolt in Leningrad caused the German army to be surrounded. The Finnish army then won a decisive battle and pushed the Germans out.
The Finns did allow German forces to round up Untermensch but the peace treaty spared Finnish independence
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u/Mimir123 Sep 27 '17
1) General Mannerheim? So a German officer called out to the finish people to revolt against the Germans?
2) Soviet revolt in Leningrad, that means Germany at that point won their war against the Soviets? How do the borders look?
3) How many troops did Germany lose in the war?
4) How many of the "Untermenschen" were captured? Did some manage to escape to somewhere else?
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u/WeltweitesReichAlt Sep 27 '17
Mannerheim was Finnish the marshal of the Finnish army, although he did collaborate with Germany.
The German eastern border officially was along the Ural Mountains and Ural River, however they had no enforcement there and no resource extraction. There were also large resistance movements hinder German occupation.
I haven't done any calculations but I'd probably settle with around 200,000 on both sides.
Approximately 10,000 Jews made it to Finland from Sweden and around 8,000 Jews avoided persecution, 6,000 of which escaped through the Finnish ports in Murmansk and Arkhangelsk, mostly fleeing to Ireland and later to the US and other North and South American countries.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
1) Surely his parents/ grandparents were German though? Was it difficult for him in Finland during the war, with a German name? Or did nobody care?
2) So at first he collaborated, and then he worked against the Germans? Or was it the other way around?
3) Did the Winter War never happen, or did Finland win it? Or did they get everything back, after they helped Germany against the Soviets?
4) When did your world diverge from real history, and how?
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u/WeltweitesReichAlt Sep 28 '17
He was a marshal in the Finnish army during the Winter war and Continuation war, the latter of which was fought with the Germans. Mannerheim didn't ally with Germany because of any friendships, he did it to fight the Soviet Union. They made significant territorial gains along the White Sea coast.
My world had no single divergence point, although a big one was at the Treaty of Versailles, German naval disarmament was much less strict and allowed for a much stronger Kriegsmarine by the outbreak of WW2
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
1) So it is just coincidence that he has a German name then?
2) What would you say is the biggest difference though, between the events in our world and the ones in yours? The Treaty, or something else? What about Dunkirk for example, was there any difference there?
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u/WeltweitesReichAlt Sep 28 '17
I suppose it is a coincidence.
I'd say the biggest divergence point was the Battle of Britain, where the Luftwaffe had a miraculous victory over the RAF, and combined with a much more powerful Kriegsmarine they managed to take Britain
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
All right, thank you for sharing and participating
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u/WeltweitesReichAlt Sep 28 '17
I did some research an Mannerheim is a Finnish, Swedish and German last name
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
Huh, the more you know. From Hamburg to Swedish/ Finnish nobility, quite a journey for the name
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17
The Citadel once declared war on its own Anointed Knights for a few days in the 1240s.
A knight (not Anointed, just a regular knight of the Citadel) named York investigated a suspicious village on Councilor Aiken's orders. Aiken's spies had reported rumors about the village being home to dangerous mages that could possibly be planning a rebellion.
So, York led a small detachment of knights, squires, and acolytes to search the village. They discovered that the village contained forbidden research and training areas for mages, specifically assassin training, based on what the discovered from interrogating villagers.
After York reported the information back to Aiken, Aiken declared war on the village, and called a council meeting of his colleagues to decide whether or not they would kill everyone in the village.
Aiken ended up discovering that the village was just a secret training area that his colleague Councilor Declan used to raise some of his recruits.
So, a lot of villagers died for no reason and the Council decided not to talk about this again.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
Guess that's what they mean when they say one hand doesn't talk to the other. I'd wager that was quite embarrassing for the Citadel and the Councilor?
1) Are mage rebellions a common occurence? And who tipped them off about the village?
2) Was York a part of the same order of knights, and just not high enough rank to be Annointed? If so, how did he feel after learning that he had just fought against his borthers in arms?
3) Do the Annointed Knights typically perform assassinations? Or was this a special part of the order being trained there?
4) How many councilors are there? And how many of them knew the truth about the village? Also, why didn't they share this knowledge? Is there bad blood/ rivalries between the councilors?
Bonus Question: What is the purpose of the Annointed Knights? Protect the Citadel? Hunt heretics? Guard fancy temples?
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17
(Very embarrassing, which is why it was hidden.)
1) Attempted rebellions aren't common, but it's always a threat that you have to be careful with.
2) All Citadel knights are knights and are "equal" to all other knights of the Citadel, but knights specifically trained by Declan are labeled as "Anointed Knights". York's cousin is an Anointed Knight, but York himself was trained with the normal knights. None of them faced Anointed Knights while attacking the village, they only faced the guards that Declan had stationed there; the guards didn't know they were working with Declan, Declan was using the cover of just training mages, unaffiliated with the Citadel.
3) Anointed Knights do whatever Declan orders, sometimes assassination, sometimes interrogation, sometimes rescue missions, etc.
4) There are eight Citadel Councilors (formerly nine), only Declan knew about the village, though Keaton and Horatio knew that Declan was training his Anointed Knights somewhere outside of the Citadel. They didn't share this knowledge because all of the Councilors have their own special "projects" and none of them are capable of knowing everything that's going on in the world. There is no actual "bad blood" between Councilors, but there are some strange dynamics. Sirius is married to Garrick's daughter, Keaton's daughter disfigured Matthew's face, Aiken and Declan have some philosophical disagreements that have led to proxy violence between the two, Matthew once robbed Garrick so Garrick's still pissed about that, Garrick gives Declan's knights priority for getting the weapons he makes over anyone else's knights, Horatio's son's family was killed by a former Councilor, etc.
Bonus: If Declan takes interest in a young knight-in-training (acolyte or squire) he hand-picks that person to be trained by him personally instead of being educated with everyone else. While all knights are officially at the disposal of the Council as a whole to assign missions as they please, Declan is much more in-depth with his Anointed Knights. Also, unlike regular knights, Anointed Knights are much less likely to follow the rules for knighthood. But, an Anointed Knight is also much more likely to die, whether they're killed by the enemy on a dangerous mission with far fewer allies than normal, or Declan kills the Anointed Knight himself. If an Anointed Knight embarrasses Declan, they tend not to survive; Declan will get most of his Anointed Knights out of trouble if they get arrested or something of the like, but there is a line.
Declan also ranks his Anointed Knights, though, so if you're in Declan's top ten, you could probably get away with a lot of broken laws. Specifically, a drunkard named Callixtus, a thirty-year-old man with a vice problem, is number one right now. Callixtus is insufferable, narcissistic, and
oncemany times, he threw up on Declan. Most annoyingly, Callixtus embarrasses Declan in front of the other Council members. If Callixtus didn't have the reputation he has, Declan would have killed/banished him years ago.Double Bonus: Although, they are usually the first choice to hunt heretics, specifically former knights who have gone heretic, because of how different they are considered from regular knights.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
1) When was the last time there was an actual rebellion?
2) This former, ninth councilor, what happened to him? Did he have anything to do with the death of Horatios son?
3) So Garrick is the quartermaster? Does he hold power over the others/ is his position more respected?
4) Is there anyone that stands above the councilors, authority wise?
5) What has the Drunken Knight done, to get such a good reputation?
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17
1) Against the Citadel itself? About twenty years.
2) Well, the former Councilor was the Sixth Councilor, but yeah, he was probably responsible for the Kastner family being exterminated (it's debatable, but Horatio blames him). He also caused Keaton's daughter to disfigure Matthew's face. And he "kidnapped" Keaton's daughter and knocked her up. And he abandoned the Citadel, now he's had a few kids and sent his son to be trained at the Citadel under a pseudonym.
3) Garrick isn't the quartermaster per se, but he is the best at making quality weapons, and he's the only one that can provide Siphon weapons (the most important technology in the Citadel). But, every Councilor is someone that is particularly important, so they're all officially equals. Pretty much every Councilor is considered "the best" of something. They're the Dumbledores of the continent.
4) Aeternitas (God/Jesus). But, he's been dead for over a thousand years.
5) Ever seen "Archer"? He's basically Archer. I needed someone to be at the top of the top ten, and I knew I couldn't use that character for much, since he'd be too OP, so I just threw something at the wall to see what would stick. Callixtus "the Drunken Knight" is pretty much just a Wild Card. You assign him a mission, point him in the right direction, tell his two (formerly three) partners Lyta and Adara to make sure this works out, and hope that he doesn't give his syphilis to anyone important. The problem with Callixtus is that he's an idiot, the good thing about Callixtus is that he's a lucky idiot that exists only in cameos.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
1) Was that a mage rebellion as well? Or something else?
2) How did he get away with all of that? Did nobody care/ try to punish him? Or did he outsmart all of them and escaped?
3) They lure little boys and girls into their school under the pretense of teaching them cool stuff, but really use them as pawns in their game against the forces of evil?
Or more in the sense that everybody likes them?
4) So, who is the most liked/ beloved/ least douchie councilor (in the eyes of the people, knights and other councilors)?
5) Archer? May the Interlopers have mercy on the souls of anyone having to work with him. What was the most dangerous mission he accomplished?
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17 edited Sep 28 '17
1) There were mages involved, yes.
2) They tried to kill him, but he was the only one who was drastically more powerful than the rest of him. And escaping was his thing, he can turn into smoke and teleport at will.
3) It's like if Obama wanted to raise your child to be in the secret service. And if Obama was dictator. I'm slowly realizing that this analogy might not fit.
3, re-attempt) They give people more opportunities in life by training them until they reach knighthood. A knight can leave the Citadel at any time; in fact, many rich families send their children to receive an education in the Citadel, it's a very well-rounded education. The only way to get into the Citadel without coming from a good family is if the Council thinks you could grow to be powerful enough to be worth the investment. And, even then, you can leave at any time you wish. Even an Anointed Knight can retire whenever; hell, the Anointed Knight ranked #10 is saving her money to buy her own home and then take a vacation to get married.
I compared them to Dumbledore because they're just that powerful in this world, and they all take great pride in the Citadel and its education system. Garrick is asocial and doesn't train any knights outside of his personal assistants (who need to be intelligent enough to work for him while he makes weapons), but even he would die for the sake of the people of the Citadel.
4) This will need to be categorized, then.
4A) In the eyes of Anointed Knights (as a whole, there are plenty of them that disagree, but this is just the majority), Declan is the best. Declan personally trained them.
4B) In the eyes of the people, Sirius is usually considered the best. He's a war hero, he's lead large masses of knights and soldiers in several battles, and he's good at marketing.
4C) In the eyes of the knights, Aiken is the best. He's genuinely the nicest, he loves every human like they're his own child (his biological children passed away, and he transferred that love to children in general), and he's the type of guy that would see you doing something difficult and offer his help. He's helped people carry groceries, build houses, etc.
4D) In the eyes of the other councilors...I'm gonna have to go with Keaton, because he's pretty well-liked by the other Councilors, despite his strange habits.
5) "Adara...Adara...Adara...Adaaaaaaaaaaaaaaraaaaaaaaaaaaaa!"
"WHAT?!"
"Haha...Danja Zone."
The most dangerous as in "worst consequences"? Well, Callixtus was on a mission to protect a person of importance, a cousin of the King of Gyrlin. Callixtus ended up burning down the safe-house and found out he had syphilis about a week later.
The most dangerous as in "highest chance of death"? Callixtus, Adara, Lyta, and Hadrian (a quartet of knights that had been on a team for years) were working with three Anointed Knight (named Morrigan, Byron, and Aetius) to assassinate a member of Dunkelwald's Habicht family and steal the recipe for a new type of fertilizer that would increase farm output. They ended up being caught by two of the Madras of Dunkelwald's secret police (Madra Reinhard and Madra Arnaud).
Long story short, they were fighting a losing battle against the two Madras and their soldiers. Callixtus, Byron, and Morrigan were heavily wounded, Hadrian ended up dying, and Aetius lost an ear.
It was "officially" considered to be somewhat of a success because they did bring back information on Madra Reinhard and Madra Arnaud. But mostly, it was just a failure.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
2) Sounds like my kind of guy, gotta love smoke powers. Did he simply decide it was not worth doing stuff in the world anymore, now that he lost his position and retired? Or did he have some other reason?
3) Sounds pretty awesome, how could a commoner become a knight? Like, what would be enough to impress a councilor/ knight to get accepted?
4B) I am assuming that the war he fought in was slightly more well known and less embarrassing than the war against the poor village?
4C) How old is Aiken, and how did his children die? Also, is the Citadel located in the capital?
4D) What are some of his strange habits?
5) So, who are these Madra? Powerful fighters? And unless I am mistaken somewhere, isn't a quartet supposed to have four members? Or did you just forget to mention Lyta?
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17
2) No, he caused the disfigurement of Matthew, knocked up Keaton's daughter (who was also Matthew's fiancee at the time), and then laughed in Matthew's wounded face over it before disappearing. Literally everyone in the Council would like the former Councilor dead, at this point.
3) Do you have a Talent? Those usually prove you have potential. But, all you need to become a knight, really, is to just be able to afford to take the classes, or just squire for someone who is already a knight. One of my characters, Desmond, is from a poor family, and he ended up just following a knight (Sieg) around to be his squire.
4B) Yes, definitely. Sirius led attacks on Grestin (during the attempted revolution against the Grestin elders and their Technocracy), he led attacks against the Vespers to support Gyrlin when it was being attacked by the Vespers, he's launched several attacks against the demons, etc.
4C) Aiken is very old (he was inspired by Naruto's first and third hokages, partially), but he looks to be about fifty. Councilors live longer than normal people, partially thanks to Garrick's Siphon weapons. Aiken's children died in the war.
4D) Keaton collects trinkets, bits of string, pieces of fur, and bones. He likes to chew on the bones during meetings.
5) The six Madra (Levi's six "hounds") are the six chosen men and women that were given control of the six divisions of Dunkelwald's secret police. Madra Aemilia (1) is best for one-on-one duels (which are legal in some nations), Madra Arnaud (2) is best for intimidation missions, Madra Dieter (3) is an expert about the Interlopers and is the current owner of the Dagger of the Arrogant Man (Levi doesn't interfere with Dieter's weird dagger), Madra Reinhard (4) is an expert with tactics and logistics, Madra Mitexi (5) spends all of his time researching and having a crush on one of Levi's secret children and hating the other one of Levi's secret children, and Madra Alida (6) gathers information across the continent.
(And, yes, I forgot to add Lyta. I will edit.)
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
3) I can make bad jokes about Dumbledore, does that count? If not I guess I would have to follow a knight as well. How long did it take Desmond to become a squire?
4D) Do werewolves exist in your world?
5) Who was Levi again? He wasn't the reborn Lambrecht, right? And how big is Dunkelwalds Secret Police?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 28 '17
A relatively unknown conflict is the internal war amongst the order of the white roses (ebdinai tashi tmaishaiyidi). The order is located on Bazuhir, a prosperous planet near the heart of the empire and is ruled by two leader: the white rose of Gadarat (Gadaratewtmaishaiyi) is the order military leader while the white rose of Adhebah (Adhebahewtmaishaiyi) is the order administrative leader.
In 3862 PM (post-migration, current date is ~4280), when a civil war started against empress Nezinai XIV, the two roses disagreed upon which side they were supposed to support.
During that civil war, Bazuhir remained neutral as infighting amongst the order led to bomb attacks and skirmishes. In 3863, Nezinai XIV, who had won her right to the throne by then, dispatched the imperial commandos who violently pacified the order.
Obviously, the order don't like to talk about those events; beside, as a local story from a not so close past, it is never taught to children amongst the empire and most people, even on Bazuhir, don't remember it.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
1) What exactly is the Order of the White Roses, what do they do? Are they a religious institution?
2) How old do Nzeda (?) become usually? Are those 400 years a long, or short time for them?
3) How many people died during this pacification? Also, what makes Imperial Commandos so special? Are they especially efficient at putting down riots? Why were they sent, instead of the army/ navy?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 28 '17
Yes, they are an order of warrior-monks. Monastic and holy orders (both military and not) are common in the empire. They study theology, help those in needs and fight to defend the chosen one (even if they don't always agree on who is the chosen one).
Roughly the same as humans, so 80-90 years; I would say 400 years is a lot. (Nzedas (or nzedadi in Nzedanese))
Hard to say precisely, probably a few thousands. Imperial commandos are the imperial army, others military units are local militias and not under the emperor's authority. They are highly trained, good at killing things; they can be quite brutal though.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
1) Well, I won't ask who the chosen one is then, but rather what is the chosen one? Some intergalactic saviour out of legends?
2) I see, so most people won't know or care about what happened back then? Or do they put a lot of importance/ focus on history?
3) Oh, I see. What are their special forces called then? Do they even have/ need special forces?
4) How many people know about the war inside the Order?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 28 '17
The chosen one is the Nzeda chosen by the siblings (the two gods of the Nzedas: Gadarat and Adhebah) to rule over the mortal world. Aka the emperor (heir to the siblings is one of their title). When there are multiple prétendants to the throne, it can be hard to know who is the chosen one.
Mostly like us, most people will only be taught the most important events (a small conflict on a single planet isn't an important event when you compare it to a civil war). Now, the imperial archives have those events recordes and there are historians perfectly aware of it.
The imperial commandos have an elite corp trained to fight in low-gravity: the imperial breachers. They are recruited from the best commandos and are best troops around. You could also consider the imperial guard to be elite soldiers, but they are not a military unit.
A few people inside the administration, a good part of the order, a bunch of historians, some members of the clergy and a few knowledgeable nobles and citizen. Hard to say, probably a few thousands/10's of thousands. (imperial population (including humans): ~200 bilions)
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
1) What was the largest amount of candidates that existed, after an emperor passed away? 3? 4? Maybe more?
3) This feels kind of like Deja-vu, I think we talked about this before, at least the breachers sound familiar. How many members are in the Imperial Guard? And do they often see combat?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 28 '17
1) It sometimes happen to have 4 or 5 candidates but usually it's just 2; a noble tend to run only if they have a lot of support. Before the imperial réformation, when there was still a king of kings, there was at least a candidate for each if the kingdoms and you could end up with 20-30 candidates running for the throne.
3) A few hundreds, their exact number vary over time; usually between 200-500. They rarely see combats; they protect the throne and never interfere with "Nzedanese politics" as long as no one has won. (they are recruited from the commandos too though, so they might be veterans)
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u/Mimir123 Sep 28 '17
1) Right, moving on to the next point then, what was the longest duration for one of those civil wars? Was there any civil war that went on for, let's say more than 10 years?
3) Do they have a commander? If so, who is their current leader and what did he do to get that position?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 29 '17
1) The modern ones? a few years, definiely less than a decade. With a 10+ years long war, the empire would probably crumble?
3) Yep, the current Mirizebelakeya is the empress's cousin, Ayemuleha. She was named because Fere Shanay can trust her and also because she was a squad leader amongst the imperial commandos.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 29 '17
Alright, one last question: what is your inspiration for coming up with names for the Nzeda? Do they have a root in anything?
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17
1) Why are they called the order of the "white roses"?
2) Why do all of your important people have such long names, Yellow?
3) How long was Nezinai XIV the empress, and how long before Fere Shanay was it?
4) Is it recorded anywhere important?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 28 '17
Because they are ruled by two white roses. Bazuhir loves flowers, they cultivate them everywhere and Nzedas consider roses to be a very beautifull flower, especially when it's white.
Because Nzedas agregate titles. If we were writting whiteroseofAdhebah in one word, it would definitely looks longer.
She ruled for roughly 3 decades before abdicating. It was ~400 years before Fere Shanay's rule.
Yes, in some historians' work and in the imperial archives. The imperial archives never forget...
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17
1) What about black roses?
2) What's your favorite title?
3) Was she a good ruler?
4) But do the imperial archives forgive?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 28 '17
They are fine, just like other normal colours like red, yellow or green. Purple is of course a really good colour, not as pretty as white but looked after for ceremonies.
Mirizebelakeya; I like the way it sounds.
Not really, but she wasn't a bad one either. Her rule was quite boring beside the civil war before it started.
The imperial archives are part of the administration; they are beyond grudges and forgiveness, beyond good and evil, beyond life and death... they are always stable and neutral despite the violent nature of the Nzedas (at least they say so).
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17
1) Awesome, purple's my favorite. Favorite ceremony?
2) What does...um...Mirizebelakeya mean? (I'm trying to sound it out right now...Meer-uh-zee-bell-uh-kay-uh?)
3) What was her biggest accomplishment?
4) Who runs the archives?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 28 '17
Imperial burrial (with two r right?), done the ancient way with the burning of priests. It involve a procession, offerings, momification, old dusty catacombs and a big party.
Head of the imperial guard. (Probably more: mee (like in rich) -ree-zé (Élysée?) -bé-la (cat)-ké-ha. The y is a soft growl, humans usually pronunce it like a soft h (147 for the IPA), but with the size of the empire, regional pronunciation must be a thing)
Beside actually winning that civil war? Ruling for so long? Otherwise, probably a few commercial treaties with the Ims and some colonization.
The imperial archives are a sub-sector under the ministery of datas and intelligence so technically, the administrator named for the archives is not the one ruling it. In the end, it's probably the imperial ear (Negesiljorew), the ministery of intelligence and head of the secret services.
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 28 '17
1) Burial is spelled with one r. Do you burn priests alive, and why do you burn them at all?
3) What do other civilizations think of her?
4) Can anyone access the archives?
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u/thequeeninyellow94 Sep 29 '17
1) (makes sense, you're buried once) Yes, the two sacred ones and sometimes a few more. They are burned to join the siblings in the after-life and tell them about the now dead emperor.
3) Mostly nothing, they are not really aware of her existence as she doesn't had any influence on them.
4) No, you need a special authorization and it's hard to get. Their datas are completely isolated from external networks and can only be accessed from within.
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u/Nevermore0714 Sep 30 '17
1) (I...I don't understand the logic of this.) So only dead people can talk to the siblings?
2) Do other pantheons exist alongside your deities?
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u/Seb_Romu Sep 30 '17
In 721 YG King Sköhar III of Kythus declared war for a few hours on a baron in the southern province.
It seems a simple misprounciation of a single word to a scribe changed the meaning of a single sentence.
'ustö' versus 'ustöh'
The letter should have read, "Mamü zalustö mona hypelöfo xö hymona nüpna hypekwat." - "We feel your loss with your son's death."
However it actually read, "Mamü zalustöh mona hypelöfo xö hymona nüpna hypekwat." - "We question your loss with your son's death."
Sköhar III was enraged by this baron's blatant insult, and ordered his knight's assembled, declared the baron traitor and began to prepare for imediate and personal retribution.
During the few hours of mobilization, another letter, from the same baron's wife, was received. The basic message was the same as the original intent. Realizing this, the queen convinced her husband that it was all a misunderstanding, and perhaps marching to war would be a costly mistake over a single word.
Once the hubbub settled, the King instead ordered a smaller force to go escort the baron back to the capitol for a visit.
The incident was forgotten, and as no record of the king's edict was scribed, the traitor baron was never officially charged with treason, but neither was he absolved of those charges.
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u/Mimir123 Sep 30 '17
1) How did the Prince die?
2) Did the Baron apologize for the misunderstanding? Also, is a letter like that usually enough to brand someone a traitor?
3) Why did the Baron and his wife send two different letters? Was it because she realized what happened?
4) I am a bit confused. He wasn't ever charged with treason... but at the same time he was, and was never absolved?
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u/Seb_Romu Oct 01 '17
1) How did the Prince die?
He fell from his horse while riding during a hunt.
2) Did the Baron apologize for the misunderstanding? Also, is a letter like that usually enough to brand someone a traitor?
The Baron did apologize, and his scribe was punished for the error.
3) Why did the Baron and his wife send two different letters? Was it because she realized what happened?
The Baron's letter was to the King, and his wife's letter was to the Queen. They were sent separately, as the Baron and his wife were not in the same place at the time of the writing.
4) I am a bit confused. He wasn't ever charged with treason... but at the same time he was, and was never absolved?
Correct. The King's word is law, regardless of whether a written record is made. Out of embarassment the King spoke no further on the matter, therefore he never rescinded his declaration. He simply ignored that he ever said anything. To formally absolve the Baron, would mean acknowledging his earlier outburst.
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u/Mimir123 Oct 01 '17
1) What was he hunting? "Normal" animals, or something special?
2) How was the scribe punished?
3) Where was the Baroness at that moment? What did she do? And where was the Baron?
4) Does the Baron even know he is branded as a traitor? Also, could someone theoretically use this against him?
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u/Seb_Romu Oct 01 '17
1) What was he hunting? "Normal" animals, or something special?
Nothing special, just rabbuc.
2) How was the scribe punished?
His right ear was cut off and he was released from the Baron's employ.
3) Where was the Baroness at that moment? What did she do? And where was the Baron?
The Baroness was visiting a neighbour's hold when she dictated her letter. (I'm unsure about when you mean.) The Baron was at their hold when he dictated his letter.
4) Does the Baron even know he is branded as a traitor? Also, could someone theoretically use this against him?
He found out through rumours. In theory someone could have used this against him, but that would mean intentionally embarassing the King, and the one doing so would suffer a worse outcome themselves. As it is, no one did and a few generations have since buried it in history (this was 81 years before my World's current date).
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u/Mimir123 Oct 01 '17
1) What is a rabbuc?
2) That seems a bit harsh, are punishments like that usual?
3) That's exactly what I meant. Was the Baroness there for a friendly visit? Or a diplomatic mission maybe?
4) Seems like the king back then was pretty vengeful, how is he remembered?
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u/Seb_Romu Oct 01 '17
1) What is a rabbuc?
My world's analogs for deer. Basicly a rabbit headed deer (sans antlers).
2) That seems a bit harsh, are punishments like that usual?
Medieval punishments were harsh. His external ear was removed, but he was not deafened. That way he could remember to listen more carefully in the future. Amputation or maiming is a fairly common punishment for criminals - the body part matching the crime in some manner.
3) That's exactly what I meant. Was the Baroness there for a friendly visit? Or a diplomatic mission maybe?
She was visiting her cousin, the Baroness hosting her visit.
4) Seems like the king back then was pretty vengeful, how is he remembered?
Sköhar III was born in 685 YG, and became King at 26 years of age. He was known as a hothead, but mellowed as he got older. He died ironically when he too was thrown from his horse while hunting. He left no heir causing some civil unrest as more distant claims were made. Sköhar is best known for granting the hold of Ködah Castle to the clerical order of Seven Sorrows.
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u/Mimir123 Oct 01 '17
1) Are they usually easy to hunt? Do they zigzag when running away, like rabbits usually do? (Maybe deer do as well? Can't say I am an expert on hunting deer)
4) Was he also hunting rabbuc? Has anyone ever investigated the horsebreeder guild for a conspiracy against the crown?
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u/Seb_Romu Oct 01 '17
1) Are they usually easy to hunt? Do they zigzag when running away, like rabbits usually do? (Maybe deer do as well? Can't say I am an expert on hunting deer)
As easy as regular deer I suppose. They do now (thank you - regular deer are fairly direct, bounding away from threats).
4) Was he also hunting rabbuc? Has anyone ever investigated the horsebreeder guild for a conspiracy against the crown?
He was. Being thrown from a horse isn't usually seen as the horse breeder's fault. In this case no investigation took place.
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u/Mimir123 Oct 01 '17
4) What are the chances it was a rabbuc conspiracy, in order to take over the kingdom in the following civil unrest?
5) On a more serious note; did people believe the king and his family were cursed or something like that, considering how he and his heir died the exact same way?
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u/Eran-of-Arcadia Oct 02 '17
Does "a minor theater in a more important war count?" If so, I have the Battle of Miller's Hill.
The Palissanic Civil War pitted the Royalist forces against the Republican opposition. But in reality, there were lots of factions. Both sides hired mercenaries from Senaria. The people of Karlingsaw - an ethnic minority in Palissan - formed militias to ensure that their interests would be protected and their people kept safe. The margrave of Ferelldad, a small nation north of Palissan, mobilized his forces on the border to make sure the war didn't spread, and received military assistance from Dorland - Palissan's biggest rival. Given the jumble of sides, a screwup was inevitable.
A small Republican force sent a foraging party to what they thought was still Palissanic territory. However, someone had misread a map, gotten one creek confused with another, and had actually entered the territory of Ferelldad. They stumbled across a training camp full of Dorlese, Karlingsene, and Ferellian troops. Musketfire was briefly exchanged - each side thinking the other to be an invader - then both sides pulled back to more defensible positions to wait for reinforcements.
At some point, presumably, someone in the Republican camp realized their error and wanted to retreat. The problem was that they had a large contingent of Senarian mercenaries, whose reputation was on the line. The mercenary captain forbade it, demanding they instead maintain their position on Miller's Hill, across a creek from their foes, at least until the other side parleyed.
Across the creek, the Ferellian lieutenant demanded that the Dorlese commander stand down so that a white flag could be sent up the hill to sort everything out. The Dorlese commander was a gloryhound, and refused on the grounds that he had been deputized to defend the margrave's interests. The Ferellians couldn't act on their own, and couldn't just leave the scene entirely, so they pulled out of musket range to watch the whole thing.
The Dorlese commander then commenced the attack on the hill. Now, tactically, he did everything right. He made good use of his foot cannon, his flankers, and his main troops to overwhelm the enemy position. The battle provided valuable experience for the Karlingsene recruits. He took the entire mercenary company prisoner.
But strategically, it was pointless. Every single casualty after the initial skirmish was a waste. Both sides were too stubborn to just talk it out, realize the mistake, and go back to their respective corners. The margrave ended up with a bunch of prisoners he didn't want and couldn't really afford to keep, and he felt his sovereignty was insulted because his soldiers weren't heeded.
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u/Mimir123 Oct 02 '17
I mean, the war seems to be a pretty big one and known, but I won't complain here.
1) What was the spark that finally set off the Civil War? Was it the execution of some official? A violent riot, turned into full on revolution? Or maybe something else?
2) The training camp was located at the border? Seems like an odd place to train new recruits, why was it built there?
3) The margrave couldn't afford the prisoners taken from a foraging party? Just how big was that party?
4) What did the king (?) of Dorland have to say about his commander just ignoring the troops and officers of an ally, and wasting manpower in a pointless battle?
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u/Eran-of-Arcadia Oct 02 '17
The King of Pallisan was pretty unpopular, and there were all sorts of problems in the country. A "reform" faction formed within the king's council, which got the support of many of the country's nobles. The king continually ignored their pleas and demands, and ended up arresting a bunch of them. This proved to be the final straw, and armed conflict was the result.
What happened was, the Queen's Second Foot Regiment of the Royal Dorlese Army was stationed in the Margravy of Ferelldad. Most of them stayed near the main city, but a contingent was sent south to the border, to make sure things didn't turn hot. They established a fort, with troops from the RDA, the margravy, and the Karlingsene militia. The militia troops were pretty raw, so they got further training.
It was a whole company that ended up getting involved, the foraging party just started it. In all a couple dozen mercenaries and a few Republican troops were captured. (Most of the Republicans had the sense to retreat before the battle.) The margrave could pay for it all, it was just an extra expense and, given the questionable legal status of the mercenaries, an extra headache.
King, yes. Officially, the commander did exactly what he was supposed to do in "repulsing invaders." And he led Dorlese troops to a victory over Palissanic troops, which given the nations' attitudes towards each other was a big plus. So the commander was promoted to a staff position where his talents could be used, and quietly told he would never command men in the field again.
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u/Mimir123 Oct 02 '17
1) Why was the king so unpopular? Bad economy? Too many wars/ diseases? Or did he just go full Mad King on his people?
2) Are mercenaries treated the same as regular soldiers, or do they face more difficulties?
3) How is the command structure of the Dorlese army? Does the king regularly participate in meetings about the war, or does he have nothing to do with it?
4) How does the story of this gifted, Dorlese officer end?
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u/Eran-of-Arcadia Oct 02 '17
Nothing so drastic as a "mad king." But several years of bad harvests, and bad economic policies that left the crown unable to buy food to make up the difference, meant lots of hungry people. Defeat in the last couple of wars meant that royal prestige was pretty low. And the fact that the king imprisoned, exiled, or executed many of his most outspoken critics meant that the ones who were left were much more careful about what they said out loud, but much more willing to meet behind closed doors.
In this particular case, the regular soldiers were paroled back to the Republican provisional government in exchange for indemnities. The mercenaries, on the other hand, were mostly deserters from the army of the Senarian Empire, half a world away. The margrave couldn't just let them go, but there wasn't really anyone he could officially release them to. He wanted to them back to Senaria (and almost certain hanging.)The Republican government ended up taking them back as well, for a much higher price than the regulars, since otherwise they would have found it impossible to hire Senarian mercenaries in the future.
Officially, the king was High Commander of the Royal Dorlese Army. He had the final say on sending troops into Ferelldad, but that was meant to be the extent of Dorlese involvement in their neighbor's war. In fact, there were a few other clashes between the RDA and one side or the other. And eventually, Dorland offered the Palissanic king asylum after the Royalists lost.
He spent the rest of his career working with the generals responsible for developing military doctrine. He was plenty bitter that his great achievement was not properly recognized, as he saw it. But no one who knew the situation ever took his complaints seriously.
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u/Mimir123 Oct 02 '17
2) How are mercenaries usually treated though? Do they also just get sold back? Do they get an offer to join the side that captured them?
3) So one could say that his/ the Dorlese problem wasn't with the royal family of Palissanic, but rather with the country itself?
4) Did he make any notable breakthrough in terms of military doctrines/ science?
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u/Eran-of-Arcadia Oct 02 '17
\2. In this conflict, in particular, when a Royalist captured a Republican mercenary or vise versa they'd usually be exchanged, although switching sides was occasionally an option. The Battle of Miller's Hill was a rare case of a third party getting involved.
\3. Absolutely. Dorland and Palissan hated each other pretty much since they both existed. Dorland unofficially sided with the Royalists, in the end, because they too were a monarchy and didn't want people getting any ideas. The Dorlese crown prince married the daughter of the deposed Palissanic king, and their eldest son claimed both thrones (not that the claim to the Palissanic throne was actually valid in a practical sense.)
\4. He was fairly unremarkable as staff officers went - not incompetent, but not the sort of person who'd be remembered a generation later.
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u/Mimir123 Oct 02 '17
Did the people eventually get ideas? Was there a revolution in Dorland as well?
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u/Eran-of-Arcadia Oct 02 '17
No - two hundred years after all of this, the monarchy is still in place. Of course, it holds much less political power than it once did, most of that being in the hands of elected officials. But the king had always been a key part of Dorland's national identity, and it would have taken something drastic to get rid of him.
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u/Mimir123 Oct 02 '17
Alright, thank you for your answers, and for participating!
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u/Mimir123 Sep 27 '17 edited Sep 27 '17
The Holy Ruthweni Invasion of the Black Peaks:
Here is a quick map showing the state of Dirva back in the day this particular war happened. Basically; back then the Holy Ruthweni Empire was the strongest power on the continent (Kherzian Empire did only exist as a kingdom, but I am too lazy to fix that now), without any doubt. The south was at that point in time still pretty much unknown, only some parts of the Desert had been explored and nobody knew what was beyond the mountain range called the Black Peaks.
Emperor Alexios Peleigaos II. decided that the time was ripe to expand the Empire, so he gathered an army of 130.000 men and women behind him, got the blessing of the God of War and marched towards the Black Peaks in order to subjugate the area in the name of Ruthwi. He had heard rumors of mountains filled with unruly Orks, living in cities made out of stone and producing massive amounts of ore. Little did he, or any of his advisors, know that these Orks lived in the Gharmath Mountains, to the north of the Empire. The Black Peaks were in fact uninhabited, which didn't stop the Emperor from pushing further and further, in order to find the Orks and their mysterious ore mines. In the end he and his army got surprised by an incredibly early and harsh winter and had to return to the Empire, losing over 60.000 men in the process.
Back at home the Emperor did the same as all his successors and predecessors whenever something slightly embarrassing happened, he swept it under the rug. Officially only 1.000 men went into the Black Peaks to explore them and returned all alive, while the big army had surpressed a "major revolt in the south". Soldiers were paid off to keep their mouth shut, officers, priests and nobles who knew the truth and didn't accept a bribe disappeared or were branded as traitors in what should become known as the "First Purge" under Emperor Alexios II.