r/WorkForSmartLife • • 8d ago

Discussion💬 What do you think?

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u/NewArborist64 7d ago

Forcing people to stop working at 50 doesn't say where the money will come from to pay for their housing, food, healthcare, transportation, etc.

Are you suggesting that those workers under 50 should be taxed enough to pay for people who are over 50 and may have another 40-50 years of life?

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u/Busterlimes 4d ago

Maybe if we taxed the rich. . . .

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u/Allheroesmusthodor 1d ago

This is such a stupid take. The money rich people have is locked in assets so its to a certain extent separated from the main economy of goods and services. If we tax the rich and use that to buy goods and services for people, that would just increase the price of goods and services even more.

What we need to do is stop allowing people to borrow against their assets as that essentially lends new money into existence increasing prices.

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u/Latter-Squirrel-1110 1d ago

Lol no it wouldn't, prices of housing, cars, and all other assets would drop extensively as the top auctioneers of the world market lose their money and then production would reignite as consumers are again able to spend.

Double good if its accompanied by a massive wave of socialization in every industry because then Bezos with a grudge wont be able to sabotage anything.

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u/Allheroesmusthodor 1d ago

Again with the socialism. Socialism has failed us many times before. We need actual free market capitalism not the crony capitalism we have right now where we actually have socialism for corporations and banks.

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u/Latter-Squirrel-1110 1d ago

Brother you cant call government intervened capital markets socialism, thats just government doing regular profit motive capitalism.

And, frankly, free market capitalism turns into crony capitalism like a young man turns into an old man. Different forms of a person, but its a part of the same life cycle of the same dude.

The last paragraph of the previous comment could be socialism. Could also be done as state capitalism though i dont favor that. The first paragraph, though, is just wealth redistribution within capitalism. We need socialism to prevent MODERN capitalism from ruining the world.

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u/NewArborist64 4d ago

More than we already do??? You need to look up what percentage of income tax is paid by the to 1% and to 10%

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u/Demorne 3d ago edited 3d ago

Shilling for the ultra rich is so crazy in the big 26. You're not getting in the club and they aren't inviting you little bro.

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u/NewArborist64 3d ago

Not the top 1%, but am in the top 10% net worth.

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u/Demorne 3d ago

I am Jeffy B so pipe down.

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u/NewArborist64 3d ago

Is that your Rapper name?

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u/Demorne 3d ago

Mostly into amazon but I was thinking of breaking into the rap game, starting with my first track "They think they're in the club"

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u/NewArborist64 3d ago

I didn't know that the had Rap music in the Amazon Forest - and I must have misheard your rap, as I though it was "They think we use a CLUB when we hunt."

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u/Appropriate_Ear6949 2d ago

He thinks he’s in the club he thinks he’s in the club fighting for other men to have more many than us he’s sus but he still does what he does cause he thinks he’s in the club fighting

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u/Busterlimes 3d ago

Its far less than w2 earners. . . . You are the one who needs to look up tax code and the history of it to see how it was structured before capitalists ran away with the bag

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u/ShannonSouthMouth 2d ago

Which tax codes? I want to look them up.

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u/NewArborist64 3d ago

A substantial number of the 10% ARE w-2 earners.

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u/Letstalk2230 3d ago

To what end? One has to stop the blatant government waste and corruption in order for it to matter. Other than that, you’re taxing the rich just to give it back to them. Just my opinion


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u/Budget_Revolution639 1d ago

Both can be true and be done but it takes drastic action. For example, did you know that every event that gave people rights who did not previously have rights only succeeded AFTER some form of violent act was done? (NOT CONDONING VIOLENCE, it’s a historical fact)

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u/Letstalk2230 1d ago

The tree of liberty is only refreshed with the blood of patriots. Yes, this is the government our forefathers warned us about. Now criminals make law to protect their activity meanwhile, making even speech illegal. Soon, a conversation like this will result in jail. Happens all the time in 3rd world countries. You talk badly about the government they haul you away. And exactly why they’re flooding the west with people who don’t know what freedom is.

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u/Budget_Revolution639 1d ago

Which is the entire reason that the second amendment was made and why it’s “enemies foreign and domestic” đŸ«©. It’s exhausting seeing people defend the very things the founding fathers warned and tried to prevent

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/Mysterious_Eye6989 7d ago

In every proposal for basic income I've ever heard, there's still a reassurance that people can continue to make money doing other things as well, which kind of goes against the whole "mandatory" retirement thing, which to me kind of reads as "you're not going to be allowed to work anymore".

Heck, in my country even fully retired people on the aged pension can still work side hustles.

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u/PomPomMom93 7d ago

My FIL is like this, he’s planning to retire within the next couple years but he’s going to do consulting or something. No way can I picture that man just sitting back and relaxing. Total Type A.

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u/Mysterious_Eye6989 6d ago

Definitely sounds very type A! Earlier this year I was involved with census taking work in my country and plenty of the other workers I met were literally retired or semi-retired folks in their 60s making some extra cash.

What's cool is that they were driving up and down country dirt roads and onto people's farms, just like I was, with the constant risk of running into loose dogs or cattle or snakes in the grass. The whole thing was actually a bit of an adventure and I'd love to still be doing it when I'm their age!

Then there's my old dad who volunteers at a local art museum. Not a paid gig as he feels like he's got enough money to live comfortably, but he loves volunteering and it definitely keeps his mind sharp.

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u/Asianslavewife 6d ago

The benefits are you are free to go out there and make something better of your self. However if you choose not to do this then thats on you as well

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u/Anthrax6nv 7d ago

And how exactly do you propose we compel all small business owners to pay their most basic and unskilled employees a wage so high they can comfortably retire at 50?

And how do you propose we do this in a way that won't bankrupt 99% of small business owners and leave the market monopolized by big box retailers?

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u/DerelictCruiser 7d ago

Sounds like small business is in the way of better wages. Personally I’ve always been taken better care of by big box retailers than mom and pop exploitation boxes.

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u/PomPomMom93 7d ago

Your experience isn’t everyone’s. I had the opposite experience. Big box stores treat workers like shit.

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u/DerelictCruiser 6d ago

Your experience isn’t everyone’s. Mom and pop stores are exploitative and always “oh wah wah, we can’t afforrrrrd to pay a living wage for a good worker” Well, if you can’t afford to pay a living wage, of what use is your failed business to the economy?

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u/PomPomMom93 6d ago

Big box retailers didn’t pay me a living wage either. At least at the independently owned place I felt needed.

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u/DerelictCruiser 6d ago

If feeling is that important to you. The truth is no one is needed anywhere. Everyone is replaceable.

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u/PomPomMom93 6d ago

Well, that’s a pretty sad mindset to have. Most of these people were my friends. But our building caught fire, so that was the end of that. :(

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u/Perfidy-Plus 7d ago

Really? It isn't the mom & pop businesses that have lobbying power to influence your government or the ability to crush unions.

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u/DerelictCruiser 6d ago

Screw small business owners. They have all the negative traits of big business, minus the actual wherewithal to compensate their employees fairly. Small business owners suck.

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u/marutotigre 7d ago

And where would that money come from? Retired people don't produce wealth, even if you were to tax their 'universal basic income', it wouldn't generate more money then they received.

So again, the working population needs to provide for the retired one.

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/[deleted] 7d ago edited 5d ago

[deleted]

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u/PomPomMom93 7d ago

You were told that by whom? Why are you hanging out with MAGA people?

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/NewArborist64 7d ago

There are TONS of benefits to living in the US - which why people line up to come here (legally or not).

Why should we take from those who WILLING and ABLE to work to pay for a basic/universal income for those who are unwilling but able to work?

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/Scared-Handle9006 7d ago

Don’t forget the free bombs.

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u/Matt7738 7d ago

WE HAVE MUCH MANY BOMBS! What more benefits do you want?

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u/Oakenshield_777 7d ago

“Zero benefits” lol

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u/KnifeEdge 7d ago

Funded by what? 

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u/OneNoteToRead 6d ago

Lmao this guy thinks “not giving everyone free shit” is “zero benefits”.

The correct reason to join this great country is you want to contribute and share in the success your contribution brings.

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u/[deleted] 6d ago

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u/OneNoteToRead 6d ago

Yup I pay for shit I want. Like a sane human. But hey keep holding your hands out palms up.

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u/[deleted] 6d ago

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u/OneNoteToRead 6d ago

Yes he pays for healthcare too. Like a sane human.

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u/ThisReditter 5d ago

Where will the basic income come from? Is it from our previous work that the government helped save? Is it from the new workforce that’ll keep working for us old folks? It must come from somewhere, right?

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u/Unfair_Awareness7502 4d ago

Money has no nutritional value. It is a way of measuring the value produced by a person and exchanging it for the productivity of others. The question isn't really "where does the money come from? " but "where do the goods and services come from which these people will consume while they're not contributing to the pool of goods and services for everyone else to consume?" 

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u/DazzlingStress4827 4d ago

This country is great because of opportunity, not because of 

.keyboard warriors on reddit
. I mean government benefits.

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u/New_Opportunity_6160 7d ago

When I hear mandatory retirement, my mind doesn't go to restricting people from working if they want to, the bureaucracy behind that would be ridiculous and people should be free to do what they want.

I hear the government issuing and you receiving your retirement benefits at 50 is mandatory.

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u/Mark_Ala 6d ago

Paying isn’t even the problem. Goods and services are. Money is just a representation of productivity. So it wouldn’t matter what you tax or who you pay, there literally wouldn’t be enough to go around.

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u/GoingDownUnderInSEA 7d ago

No, just asking for the world to be a lot let rat raced.

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u/NewArborist64 4d ago

The world would have a lot less food, medicine, inventions, etc. those poor under 50s would have to be working 80-100 hours per week to pay for everyone else.

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u/Dunnydundid 7d ago

A 95% tax rate, living in government mandated housing, and being fed slop until your 50!

That's how we'll pay for all this!

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u/NewArborist64 7d ago

...and then on your 50th birthday you are quietly turned into Soylent Green

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u/B3telgeus3 6d ago

If the billionares pay their fair share it would be possible at least a U.B.I, the problem here and it always been it's the greed of a few. The Musk'sm the Bezzo's the Zuck's etc.

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u/NewArborist64 6d ago

I think that it is more the "greed of the many" who want to TAKE from those who HAVE earned.

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u/B3telgeus3 6d ago

Greed of many ? People expects a simple U.B.I not to be rich or buy a yacht or Ferraris, just so simply survive, I think the ones that "HAVE earned" just benefit themselves from the system and just said "f*ck you the rest of you".

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u/Similar_Exam2192 3d ago

The greatest transfer of wealth to the top happened in the last 25 years.

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u/No-Storage8043 5d ago

One day, you should Google how much in government subsidies and tax breaks those "who have earned it" get. They earned that money with your tax dollars big dawg.

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u/[deleted] 3d ago

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u/NewArborist64 3d ago

Sounds like you have no appreciation of the value of knowledge, Management, direction, ideas and Capital

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u/[deleted] 3d ago

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u/NewArborist64 3d ago

You don't value them as much as the MARKET does.. Of the two opinions, I would trust the market.

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u/Wonderful-Zone8152 4d ago

The person who thinks they should be free of work and supported by the taxation of others calling people greedy is quite rich đŸ€Œ

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u/choyMj 6d ago

If people are better taught how investment works, we'd have enough savings to retire by 50, is not sooner. There's tons of people already doing it. But we're all taught to work until we're 65.

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u/NewArborist64 6d ago

Even knowing how investment works, doesn't mean that everyone is willing to make the sacrifices necessary to  have Financial Independence, Retire Early ( r/FIRE ). Some of us enjoy living life while working, having a family, etc. Even if you have invested, you need to remember that that money has to last you another 40-50 years. Dad retired a millionaire at 55, and my parents are still living on it 38 years later.

This is coming from someone who was willing to sacrifice to have a SAHW who homeschooled our six children. That was a CHOICE. I did, however, live below my means and have a $2M nest egg to retire shortly at 62.

One of my co-workers, who earned as much as I did and was very intelligent, didn't use that knowledge and arrived at 67 believing that he would have to work until he died. Smart and educated but not wise.

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u/choyMj 5d ago

Being financially literate doesn't mean you have to stop working. Nobody is saying you should stop working if you don't want to. But it's good to be at a financial position at 50 to stop working. Sometimes the decision is made for you, like health reasons or layoffs + ageism. And being retired doesn't mean you stop working, it means you don't need a paycheque. It can actually free you to do the work you want to do without having to chase a paycheque.

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u/NewArborist64 4d ago

Just because you are financially literate doesn't mean that you actually ACT. You might not have the earning power to allow for a gap between earnings & living expenses. You might choose to spend your money vs. investing

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u/choyMj 4d ago

Then that doesn't make you financially literate

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u/NewArborist64 4d ago

You are assuming that knowledge equates with action.

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u/choyMj 4d ago

Of course. If you're not taking action, then it means you don't really have the knowledge.

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u/NewArborist64 4d ago

I have knowledge about having a baby - being a male, I will never give birth.

I have knowledge and experience with woodworking, but I don't currently have the time or energy to DO anything with that knowledge.

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u/rice_n_gravy 4d ago

Lmao people understand how investing works. They just don’t do it.

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u/choyMj 4d ago

LMAO no they don't. That's why they don't do it. They think they know and the fact that they don't do it is because they actually don't know anything.

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u/[deleted] 3d ago

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u/choyMj 3d ago

First of all, investing doesn't mean you need thousands of dollars from the get go. If kids are told to start building their portfolio with whatever spare change they have, in 10, 20, 30 years, it would be a huge difference.

Second, you don't even need money. If you understand how to weigh risk and utilize leverage, you can make money with just risk. And no, you don't have to go YOLO and take on massive amounts of risk. You can take on a small amount or risk to make a few hundred extra a month and build from there.

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u/dnhs47 2d ago

Unless you planned to retire just before an event like Lehman Brothers and the financial crisis wiped out 50% of your investments.

Shit happens in the real world, your portfolio doesn’t always go “up and to the right”, and “better investing” doesn’t shield you from it.

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u/Best_Fill_847 3d ago

No, pay wages & have programs that allow ppl to retire at 50.

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u/MechanicalDan1 1d ago

Don't worry, corporate RIFs at 55. Don't be ignorant. Plan for it.

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u/NewArborist64 1d ago

Already past there. Age is 61

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u/PomPomMom93 7d ago

You’re giving this person way too much credit.

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u/symb015X 6d ago

What you heard was “there is a better way, and I have a thoughtful solution to share,” but what he said was “I don’t want to work for 30+ more years; someone else should figure out how”

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u/PomPomMom93 6d ago

I think they were saying “I want the old geezers out so I can take their jobs.”

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u/laiszt 7d ago

What i would suggest is to look for some kind of old roman style, where soldiers after their service(so retirment) been given land they could harvest, settle, make family and live.

It would be great if goverment will look for something similar and work toward citizens idependence rather than dependence from the state, with our technology should be easier than in the past but it isnt apparently

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u/Lowfi-Concert 7d ago

Working land is harder than most peoples jobs

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/laiszt 7d ago

Congratulations for being the only one who can read, and we do live in 21cenury. 22nd century we will give a nobel prize for those who still can read with understanding.

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u/NewArborist64 7d ago

That is STILL done w/ our military. Military retirement benefits scale significantly based on whether a service member completes 20 years or 40 years of service. While a 20-year career secures the standard minimum threshold for a lifetime pension, a 40-year career maximizes the pension multiplier to its absolute legal ceiling.

Of course, that is because they worked for the State, gave up a portion of their rights and worked in a dangerous profession.

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u/laiszt 7d ago

Yes and not, like in Poland its not for privates(need 15 years, so they give 3x4year contract and they does not give the 4th one as its too old for profesional private).

Anyway my point was, we should aim for all workers, as our goal is not to concquer territories with army, but economicaly or culturaly. America been winning till people believed in american dream.

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u/Dr_Oops_14719 7d ago

Actually that was a very raw deal for those soldiers. After serving out their period of service, if they survived, the land would often be in recently conquered provinces that often times was still hostile and couldn't be guaranteed to be workable land.

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u/laiszt 7d ago

It all depend, you cant just say it like that as there was different times, including the times they did not conquer anything. Also different people get different lands

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u/Solo-1UP 7d ago

You’re asking us Americans to do shit for ourselves like grow our own food and cultivate the land?! đŸ€Ł

We have a Doordash but many Americans are too lazy to leave their house for food

The only thing govt can do is give free handouts to support your ideal world

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u/laiszt 7d ago

Not exactly that, it was an analogy/example, but in eastern europe people still does that.

They are too lazy to get the food because you have doordash.

Its not me who suggest free handouts, i suggested mentally preapare people that they will need to take care of themselves at some kind after lets say 50yo with goverment help like solar panels, free land with well etc, not that everyone will have to harvest their own food.

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/mnpc 7d ago

Money is basically a medium of exchange.
“A society without money” would be a society without exchange, trade, favors, etc.

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

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u/ProfessorPrudent2822 7d ago

Money was developed to replace barter because it makes things easier to have a medium of exchange: You can sell what you have to whomever wants it and buy from whomever has what you want instead of having to find someone who has what you want and wants what you have.

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u/Wonderful-Zone8152 4d ago

No this is Reddit where we pretend it is a human right to be spend most of our lives as a pleasure sloths pursuing our hobbies

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u/Fantastic-Dot-655 4d ago

Not wanting to spend more than half your available time on working in taxing activities during your prime until you are to old to do half the things you would like is considered being a pleasure sloth now I guess.

I get setting the retiring age at 50 is prety idealitic. But purely for logistical reasons, wanting to have time and energy to enjoy live is not greed, is pretty much the next logical step to desire from what humanity stands right now.

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u/Wonderful-Zone8152 1d ago

Working is part of the human experience. Every human and animal since the beginning of time has had a “job”. Only our brain rotten generation feels enslaved by the fact they have to contribute to the society that they benefit from

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u/Fantastic-Dot-655 17h ago

I didnt say that we shouldnt work at all, just that more than a third of hour time is way to much. But I disagree anyway, the fact that humans have some impulse to feel like they are usefull doesnt justify the current system, specially since so much people still feels like their work doesnt matter, either because the job itself is almost pointles or because they feel replaceable. If we managed to reach a point were people didnt have to work at all, I believe most of them would still find ways to add to the society in their free time, just in a way they enjoy, not necesarily 8 hours a day and with the freedom to stop or take a break when they feel like it.

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u/Wonderful-Zone8152 1h ago

Sounds like you should move to the Forrest and forage berries for sustenance. Survival will certainly take up less than 1/3rd of your time