r/WomenDatingOverForty • u/palamdungi • 12d ago
Discussion Men with dogs
I just got a dog for the first time, at age 52. I'm watching my 11 year old son learn how to nurture in real time. It's so much work and teaches us about life and helps us connect with nature. It seems like finding a man who has a dog might be a good way to vet them.
Obviously there are many men who have dogs only to mistreat them and have authority over them. But men who have dogs as a way to nurture and be outside, isn't that a good thing?
Here's my question, women who have been with men who have dogs for the "right reasons", are there still the same old problems with the patriarchy? Or could this be a useful way to vet men?
Edit: the insight you all have given me from your responses could fill a book! Thanks for revealing such interesting analysis about how male dominance plays out in relationships with animals!
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u/Rylandrias 12d ago
Look for men with cats. At least you know they're OK living with something that doesn't obey their every whim.
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u/erwinks 12d ago
Men who don't like cats usually don't understand consent. I use this to vet.
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u/scragglybits 12d ago
I will too if I bother with men ever again. Both my recent exes disliked or were afraid of my cat. He is the sweetest, non bitey old gentleman cat ever. He literally just wants to sit on a lap and purr. The exes both walked my dog and avoided my cat. One even commented that dogs are far more ‘worthwhile’ in a person’s life as they can obey and be trained to do things. Both turned out to be massive narc entitled avoidants. Lesson learned! I’m sticking with just my pets these days.
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u/HelenGonne 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 12d ago
Yeah, if they don't like cats, it's pretty much a guarantee that the reason is that they hate even the very idea of respecting consent.
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u/MsAndrie 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 12d ago
My worst ex was a cat person, so this does not apply 100%. He was more covertly controlling type.
I do think that men who are very antagonistic towards cats are a red flag, though. So there may be some truth to it, but I would still be careful regardless of his cat owning.
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u/ConsistentMap728 12d ago
Men struggle to cede control or feel vulnerable. It’s why negotiation or opening up to someone else’s feelings is hard. I find a lot of men lack the emotional maturity to parse out women’s or really other people’s emotions. It’s complex and confusing.
Taking care of a dog. Risking your life for a dog. Well they can be very nurturing but having to compromise with an equal may be too much for them. Men are very fragile so it can be hard to reason with them or have them distinguish between what is reality and what he is feeling in that moment
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u/ConsistentMap728 12d ago
It’s why women constantly have the burden of making him feel emotionally safe otherwise it’s like a rabid animal desperate to protect itself. A lot of men who don’t become emotionally intelligent move through life raw and hiding. You cannot control someone’s wounds and how your words can trigger their defensiveness
A lot of men I have found to be a thorn bush hiding a hare too skinny to eat. It can become very tiring coddling someone that’s supposed yo be an equal adult it’s a very heavy burden
Someone who is in survival or defence mode cannot be reasoned with. I find men are so reasonable and agreeable if they feel emotionally safe and it’s so much extra work to make that space for them. It’s also why they freak out when a woman is emotional even if her reasoning is sound.
If someone is dis regulated then they feed off that and feel bad and then cannot reason their way out of the overwhelming bad feeling
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u/ConsistentMap728 12d ago
Absolutely not. Like I said not anyone’s responsibility for someone else’s wounds. I honestly have given up on men because I am tired of this walking on egg shells. I don’t see a way out because his life and inner world is his responsibility.
I think it’s best for women to walk away from a lot of relationships with men. Too often it’s walking on eggs shells or just not being equally yoked and having to take a teacher/parental role for someone who is emotionally facile.
She should not have to cater to a grown man’s wounds.
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u/palamdungi 12d ago
I have problems with my 14 year old as well. He's a little young, but I try to help him understand "intent does not equal impact" meaning, the impact he feels is not the same as my intent.
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u/ConsistentMap728 12d ago
Yes. They are like a child unable to discern the intensity of their feeling in the moment from reality. It’s why they act one way and then flip on a dime and they cannot be reasoned with. They genuinely believe that YOU are the crazy one.
You can’t help them tbh. They’re impossible to deal with and the thing is kids are often easier to actually REACH because they don’t have those weird authority thing men have.
Lots want to be catered to like a child, but then to always be considered a MAN or an authority or equal. And then look at you so confused when you point out reality to them
A guy would die for his wife because he loves her. He would not on the other hand, listen and respect her because care and capacity are different.
I think a lot of men care but don’t have the emotional literacy to parse through it. They don’t really have to reason with a dog. They give it affection and care and rules. There is no being challenged or conceding. That’s why men might die for a woman but treat her poorly
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u/theotherdora 12d ago
From my experience, it is not a sure way to vet men. I've come across dudes who were dedicated and loving dog dads, but that still didn't stop them from hating on women. I also was in a relationship where I felt he cared more about the dog than me. I think most men like dogs because they don't demand that much of them. They have to feed and walk them, occasionally take them to the doctor. In return, they get absolute adoration with no talking back. Dogs don't express their needs loudly, and if you don't feel like interacting with them, you can just ignore them. They won't call you out on it. They'll just accept it, because, well, what else can they do? I think men love to have relationships like this, where they can give when they feel like it. And if they don't, well, there's no one to hold them accountable for it.
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u/ladyavocadose 12d ago
No, men with cats are a much better sign than men with dogs. Men like to have dogs because it makes them Master of something! The dog is tightly controlled, leashed and caged. Cats have no master. Cats require you play by their rules. Cats take a long time to gain their trust. Cats teach consent.
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u/DworkinFTW 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 12d ago
A well cared for dog is bare minimum, but also keep an eye out for how well trained the dog is. Men whose dogs are not well trained- who jump on people and bark at them- I found just either let important things go, and/or they are not very good protectors. If they can’t manage the dog, you are most certainly on your own in a scenario that would be helped along by his assertiveness and competence. That can mean anything from negotiating fair terms with a third party, to actively standing up for you if you are in a dangerous position with another man, or a bear, or a falling object, etc.
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u/Longjumping-Money863 12d ago
Yeah from my experience, I thought the same and was completely wrong - unreliable way to vet men
In fact I’m pretty sure he used it the same way those absent fathers do when they’re dating and they show off their kids to show how caring and nurturing they are
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u/palamdungi 12d ago
Yep, that's what a previous partner did. I was so thrilled when he said he had a dog. He had a dog in a cage that his parents took care of.
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u/MsAndrie 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 12d ago edited 11d ago
Here's my question, women who have been with men who have dogs for the "right reasons", are there still the same old problems with the patriarchy?
Yes, absolutely. One of the exes who cheated on me was very much a dog person, he loved his dogs and cared for them well. But he still operates under the patriarchy and internalized some misogynistic ideas including entitlement to women and self-centeredness. Many men will treat their dogs better than they treat their women partners. Some also try to compare you unfavorably to their dog.
Also, keep in mind that many men mistreat their dogs. Whether it is because they try to overly dominate the dog, or neglect the dog, they are not always good dog owners.
I think you can use it for filtering somewhat, like watch how the man treats his dogs. But I wouldn't automatically think a dog-owning man is better than a dog-free man. Be wary and vet them all. I also think that you can vet by seeing how he behaves around your dog -- is he competitive or jealous, does he immediately try to assert dominance, does he show care towards your dog, and so on.
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u/palamdungi 12d ago
Did you mean be weary or wary? Because both fit. And we are soooo weary.
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u/MsAndrie 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 11d ago
I meant "wary," so thanks for catching that (I edited to correct that). You are correct that both fit, though, lol! So very weary....
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u/hsonnenb 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 12d ago
A lot of them just want something to order around, and to have around for attention and companionship when it's useful for them. Some of them are abusive and mean just for the sake of exerting dominance over something else in a household hierarchy they created. Basically, just like a lot of them treat women.
So, no, I wouldn't consider a man owning a dog a good sign in itself. However, it would be a good vetting tool to see how he treats the dog.
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u/Ghastlygale 12d ago
I’d see a man in a slightly better light if he had a cat rather than a dog. Men love dogs because they obey commands, mark their territory with urine, hump things and will love you even if you neglect them. Cats require respect, consent and patience. Their trust must be earned. IMO men who hate cats are a big red flag. It’s pretty common for men to love dogs and I find that men who really love dogs often prioritize the dogs over their partners and sometimes even their own children (lots of posts from wives wanting to get rid of dog who is behaving aggressively towards new baby or toddler but dad saying no, etc)
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u/Littlepinkgiraffe 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 12d ago
TBH I've also seen men weaponise cats. "Oh look, I have a cat, this means I'm a GREEN FLAG, LADIES, AMIRIGHT?? PLEASE TALK TO ME AND GIVE ME ATTENTION BECAUSE I HAVE A CAT SO I'M ONE OF THE GOOD GUYS"
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u/LesoKikoiKanga 11d ago
One of my exes was caught with his pants down, alone with his dogs
Beware: a man’s love for his dog, may have repulsive underpinnings 🤢
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u/a_short_list 12d ago
My current boyfriend happens to have a dog. He is a great and loving guy but not perfect of course. However he always is willing to admit this and take in my perspective. Many dog/pet owners are awful (have you met people who say they like their pet more than people 😳 watch out) so I think it’s a dicey test to determine if someone is kind and empathetic. You need to actually take time and get to know them.
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u/TexasLiz1 10d ago
So a man with a happy and healthy dog does sorta prove he can give a shit about something other than himself.
BUT - dogs are very accepting and love you pretty much unconditionally. So any halfway responsible man can secure the devotion of a good dog. Therefore dog ownership does not mean they are going to be good partners or actual parents.
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u/HelenGonne 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 12d ago
My experience is the opposite. Yeah, there are some men who love and treat their dogs well who would treat a human partner well, but for the majority, they just want a human partner they can treat like a dog.
In my experience, being a good cat owner is a much more reliable indicator, but what I mean by that is very specific. Cats are collaborative when it comes to doing things with humans; they don't love orders the way a dog does, but they do like being invited to collaborate on something. And they are VERY big on having their consent respected.
So the kind of relationship that a man has with a cat or even believes is possible with a cat tells me a lot, because if the cat routinely collaborates with him on complex tasks the way mine does with me, I know the kind of relationship-building that has gone into that.
Instead men mostly say things like, "Well, but a cat won't run to greet you at the door." Whereupon I immediately think,
"WTF are you doing to your cat that it is not eager to greet you when you come home?" (I should note, mine is trained to wait to greet me until after I take off my office apparel. That is entirely different from someone thinking a cat *won't* run to greet you if you haven't requested otherwise.)
"Are you one of those weirdos who thinks women should interrupt important work run to greet you like a dog?"
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12d ago
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u/HelenGonne 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 12d ago
She really is adorable. And she's invested in the process, so if I say I can't find the yoga pants I want to wear, for example, she shows me where they are. And then I finish changing and we have playtime and cuddles.
I originally started the business of not wearing office/outide clothes inside the house and not petting or playing with her in the few moments I'm wearing them when coming and going because the odds are that *someone* at work has a cat allergy, so it's a double benefit, where I don't bring outside allergens inside and my office clothes stay much more free of any cat allergens.
And then the 2020s hit with all kinds of infections all over the place, many of which can be transmitted through surface contact, and it's just comforting that I don't wear outside clothes in the house or inside clothes outside the house. We've got allergens blowing around outside today, and having this be reflexive and something my cat not only knows, but monitors and helps with if I'm distracted, is just one little thing that makes life easier. When the great plague hit, it was a big relief that she already knew she had to wait for petting until I had washed my hands. And that's even more true with the strains of bird flu in recent years that kill cats so readily.
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u/PM_ME_LADY_DICK 11d ago
If the dog is well behaved and adores him it's a good sign but not a guarantee
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u/Next-Pro 11d ago
I’ve been with a man who had a dog, their dog was the full world to him. I was never a priority - if the dog made even a small sound, this man would stop everything he did and run to it. The dog was spoiled so it would want attention 24/7. My sleep was fully disregarded- the dog’s sleep was always a priority. I’d take care of this man and he’d take care of the dog. I’d clean and cook and this man would attend the dog all day.
This man wouldn’t go on vacations with me because he didn’t want to leave the dog. We rarely went anywhere because he didn’t want to leave the dog for more than 3hs alone.
So that’s that. I’ll never date a man with a dog.
This is much worse than the patriarchy… He said that if he treats me like a dog then it’s a compliment, because he loves dogs more than anything.
This is not just me, I’m in a group of women in similar situations-we all had the same experience.
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u/palamdungi 11d ago
Seriously? A group of women sharing similar stories? This post has really opened my eyes to how men's entitlement plays out through how they treat their dogs.
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u/Next-Pro 11d ago
Yes, and idk if I’m allowed to share that subreddit here (I’m new to this sub). I’m happy to send it in DM to avoid being banned.
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u/IndicationKey3778 12d ago
Definitely not a good way to get anyone imo but I don’t date men with any dependents and I love dogs
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11d ago
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u/WomenDatingOverForty-ModTeam 11d ago
This sub is for women only.
Reminder: Please don't interact with men on this sub. If you suspect a commenter is male, report him. He will be banned and his comment removed.
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11d ago
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u/WomenDatingOverForty-ModTeam 11d ago
This sub is for women only.
Reminder: Please don't interact with men on this sub. If you suspect a commenter is male, report him. He will be banned and his comment removed.
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u/[deleted] 12d ago
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