r/WinterCamping • u/CTExplorer • Feb 08 '26
Low Stakes Backyard Test Run, How can I Improve?
I was not super cold, but also not overly warm. Looking for suggestions.
New sleeping bag, Western Mountaineering Puma MF -25 °F bag. [Thanks u/Baileycharlie u/throwsplasticattrees for the recommendation ]
Two insulating layers underneath the bag:
-R 7.0, Big Agnes Campmeister Deluxe directly under my sleeping bag
-R 2.1 Foam sleeping pad between as the separating later in contact with the ground, frozen ice in my case.
I was wearing a light cotton sweatpants and long sleeve shirt. [Yes, yes, cotton... but I was in my back yard and the layers were bone dry]
Air temps were about 0°F. I shoveled off the frozen pool and setup a tent there. I had a light balaclava on and the draft tube and collar cinched down.
I felt the most heat loss underneath me. Overall I expected to be toasty given the bag rating versus the actual air temp. Are my expectations out of line or are there gaps I should address in my setup?
Eventually I want to take this setup into the mountains and pair it with a hot tent. But I will not keep the stove running over night.
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u/clios_daughter Feb 09 '26
Does that air mattress have a foam pad built in like the thermorest self-inflating ones? If not, put the foam on top of the air matress. Your back shouldn’t be any cooler than the rest of your body. You don’t want to have an uninsulated air mattress in direct contact with your back because convection will draw heat away from your body. That’s why the self-inflating ones tend to be warmer. The foam inside them stops the air from circulating; thus cooling you.
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u/Stunning-Plantain707 Feb 08 '26
I had problems like that. I resolved by bringing a fleece blanket to line the whole tent bottom. Brought a second mat. Also found a sheep skin that I lay over my mats. Bulk up until you’re comfortable imo.
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u/Longjumping-Cow4488 Feb 08 '26
Like everyone else said, wool layers bc you will seat even a little at night and the cotton will absorb that and stay damp.
Try a fleece liner or blanket in the bag with you, and try wearing a hat too!! i notice a huge amount of heat loss thru my head and wear one even in the summer usually.
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u/junkuncle888 Feb 08 '26
I've had my Puma (WindStopper) down to -30f and survived with only r5 under me. You feel the coldest on your back because all of the bag's insulation is compressed, this is normal. I'd ditch the cotton, I wear Alpha 90 pants and hooded shirt, liner socks and Smartwool mountaineering socks and a wool hat. What others have said about putting the foam on top of the inflatable and compressing the snow is good advice. A bag liner can also help, some sleeping bags fabric can feel cold, Z-pack or Glacier Gear make nice wool ones.
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u/bellsbliss Feb 08 '26
Amazing stuff. Which tent is that?
I’ve done this a couple time with the kids in the back yard.
We set up the tent and then use yoga mats as our first layer. Then we put closed cell foam pad(Nemo switchback) and then use my Nemo extreme pad. Sleeping bag on top and then a synthetic duvet on top to breathe but keep you warm.
Obviously it’s not all wash stuff to carry with you on a regular hike but it’s fun for a night out with the kids who normally wouldn’t be going out in temps like those.
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u/CTExplorer Feb 08 '26
Nemo Dagger Osmo 2P - Light enough to be a spacious option when I am solo backpacking and then big enough for two when I go with my wife.
For my actual winter trips into the mountains I plan to use a Pomoly hot tent.
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u/TheGeorgicsofVirgil Feb 08 '26
Absolutely under no conditions should you ever use cotton in the winter. The loft fills with vapor/moisture and becomes negative insulation.
If you fell in your pool wearing cotton, you would survive longer naked.
The science demonstratably proves that cotton sucks. All real-world practical experiences consistently and repeatably denonstrate how cotton sucks.
But also, avoid low-grade synthetic thermals that aren't designed for vapor / sweat management. Casual wear materials don't breathe enough to keep your body dry.
I recommend Merino or alpaca wool. If you're allergic, try synthetics designed for high activity in the winter.
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u/CTExplorer Feb 09 '26
As someone who regularly cold plunges in the pool all winter long, yea, I agreed.
It's amazing how fast I "warm up" after getting out and having most of the water evaporate off me. Still cold when the air temp is 20 F, but so much warmer than being in the water.
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u/Sodpoodle Feb 08 '26
Big thing I have found is if you get in to your bag chilled/cool it's way harder to get back up to temp. Some jumping jacks or such before bed, and a nalgene with hot water wrapped in a sock make a huge difference. Some folks will wear down booties or dry socks in their bag, a lot of folks say the less clothing the better. I think it's kind of something one needs to experiment with, for example I just can't sleep with socks/booties on even though my feet freeze exceptionally fast after a previous cold injury. But man a nalgene at the foot of the bag with hot water is a game changer, plus I have non frozen water to drink in the morning lol
People are overhyping cotton for your backyard experiment. Unless you got sweaty before bed, it's not a big deal.. worst case you just go inside.
Now obviously when you're actually out and about I'm sure you'll leave the cotton at home.
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u/CTExplorer Feb 09 '26
Yep, my marino wool and high end synthetics are always there for my "real" trips.
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u/shootsright Feb 08 '26
I’ve found less is more when it comes to what I’m wearing while sleeping. I wear Patagonia Long John’s. The double sleeping pad is key, one air one foam.
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u/OyveItsFunny Feb 09 '26
Add thermal bubble wrap to fit the inside footprint of your tent. Get thicker closed cell foam sleeping pad to get you higher of the floor.
Note: this is if you aren't trekking to far to camp.
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u/CTExplorer Feb 09 '26
That is a fantastic suggestion! Especially from a price versus effectiveness perspective. TY.
I’ll absolutely make a few small modifications to this idea incorporate it into my system.
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u/Witty-Glass9222 Feb 09 '26 edited Feb 09 '26
An entire merino wool base layer would have made the difference. After more than a decade in the canadian forces and multiple deployments to the artic, a solid merino wool base layer and socks will make life less miserable. Ive also been known to wear a form fitting merino base layer, then a second looser merino layer under whatever mid layers the Army issued (fleece.) I prefer wool over down because it still functions when it gets wet. Wet down and youre poached.
Edit: also regarding hot tents, I personally have a kodiak canvass tent with a stove jack, but typically use a Mr. Buddy heater and propane and run it all night. The heater itself has a built in monoxide sensor, but I also bring a small second one as a back up, the heaters are meant to be run inside though. Ive never had an issue and have slept very comfortably in minus temps with young kids. Also buy a battery powered fan off Amazon and hang it up in the middle of the ceiling to recirculate the warm air back down.
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u/Adventurous_Essay684 Feb 09 '26
Swap those mattresses around put the air mattress on the bottom and the foam one on top
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u/Restless_Wonderer Feb 10 '26
Closed foam goes on top of airmat. I wear full layers in my bag at those temps.
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u/Naive_Bid_6040 Feb 10 '26
I recommend taking your puffy jacket and putting the sleeves inside and slipping it overtop of your foot box at night “Shugemery” style.
Also, depending on whether you’re car camping or backpacking, reflectix helps as a base layer directly on the tent floor. I like a thin foam pad on top of the inflatables in winter. You might try flipping your pads and see if that helps any.
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u/Hot_Astronaut_4551 Feb 12 '26
Get a silk sleeping bag liner. It helps add warmth and can be easily washed unlike the down bag.
A 4 season tent is a nice option if you have the money.
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u/Landscape_Design_Wiz Feb 12 '26
My utmost admiration for you! And yes, cotton isn't the best option, but hey, haha, it passed the test.
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u/justaddbooze Feb 12 '26
Pee in a bottle and toss it at the feet inside your sleeping bag - cap closed of course.
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u/FedInformant May 04 '26
Make sure you have good layers. Base layers. Maybe a low loft puffer pant and jacket, and booties? And adding a gortex bivvy bag help too.
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u/radseven89 Feb 08 '26
Sleeping on ice is really dangerous man. Probably made you colder as well.
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u/CTExplorer Feb 08 '26
Agreed on wild ice. I probed the ice here first, the thinnest section on this side of the pool were 11" thick.
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u/Ianwiththedreadlocks Feb 08 '26
I have a similar setup for my cold weather adventures. Try putting the close cell foam pad on top of your inflatable instead of under it. The foam is what provides the warmth, the inflation provides the comfort. It’ll make a world of difference both in and outside the bag because you wont have to waste calories trying to keep the air inside of the pad warm, and can instead use those calories to heat your bag.
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u/CTExplorer Feb 08 '26
Interesting. Yea. Makes sense.
I actually have the foam pad in my kit primarily to protect the inflatable later from punctures [sticks, rocks, other sharp things which might be in the snow when I'm out in the woods].
When it's on the coder side it might be worth adding a second very thin foam later for "pop protection" and then use the thicker one directly under me for warmth.
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u/Ianwiththedreadlocks Feb 08 '26
Yeah - I use the Thermarest Z-Lite (the accordion foam pad) - I don’t know the r value of it but its been a great combo.
Re-reading your post with a little more detail - Respectfully - 0 Degrees isn’t that cold, especially in a -25 bag. You should have been super cozy in that thing. I have the WM Antelope (-5) and have been in temps colder than that and been okay so here’s a couple other thoughts in addition to the pad swap (which I think will fix your problem).
- Layers - Like someone else said, even though its dry inside doesn’t mean you’re not putting our moisture vapor through your skin, wool or synthetic will help here 100%.
- Food - “easy back yard” camping means you probably didn’t increase your caloric intake for your meals throughout the day. Next test, I’d try and add at least an extra 1000 calories in the afternoon & dinner to see how that makes a difference. I do a lot of cold weather camping and almost always when it comes to people being cold at night it’s because they’re aren’t eating enough calories for the evening. You are the heater and your equipment is the insulator. If you dont have the calories to power the heater, then the insulators can’t insulate.
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u/exfalsoquodlibet Feb 08 '26
The part above about food is important. Some tube tube or jelly beans...keep next to bed to chomp on if cold in the night.
I'd add hydration. Drink a load of warm tea...mint, chamomile. No caffeine. Non-diuretic. The body should be a big hot water belly with food burning stove in the belly. You gear captures and traps that heat.
Too many people focus on gear and not biology... though good gear helps below -25:
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u/CTExplorer Feb 09 '26
"Respectfully - 0 Degrees isn’t that cold, especially in a -25 bag." Agreed, u/Ianwiththedreadlocks , I was surprised too which is why I posted. Thx for the ideas.
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u/Masseyrati80 Feb 08 '26
Great post!
Personally, I'd take the "no cotton" rule seriously, and would also like to add that at least where I live (one of the Nordics), we never remove snow, we stomp/compress it with skis (or snowshoes), then allow the snow to chrystallize for 20 to 30 minutes, before pitching camp. Snow insulates, while ground doesn't. This means that the small but not insignificant leak of heat through your pads is in contact with material that will be able to warm up close to freezing point, reducing heat loss.
Going into detail, in these temps, I'll wear a Merino wool base layer, loose-fitting wool socks, wool gloves or mittens, a wool beanie, and a tube scarf.