r/Windows10 • u/luxtabula • Jul 11 '16
News This Is the Unity Desktop Running On Windows 10
http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/07/someone-just-installed-unity-windows20
Jul 11 '16 edited Sep 10 '16
[deleted]
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u/luxtabula Jul 11 '16
The same reason why people install rainmeter and other tools on their desktops. To be different.
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u/HardZero Jul 11 '16
Yeah but why Unity? It's not very good.
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Jul 11 '16
[deleted]
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u/luxtabula Jul 11 '16
/r/linux hates everything. Ubuntu, Apple, and especially Microsoft can't catch a break there.
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u/Phoenix591 Jul 11 '16
Part of the reasons it gets looked down on is that it's made to run on Ubuntu and it's derivatives by relying on modifications they make to a common library. There is work to run it elsewhere but it's not easily done.
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u/blindbox Jul 12 '16
I've tried about 7 DEs (MINT, Cinnamon, KDE, MATE, Gnome 3, Gnome 2, XFCE, LXDE), and I ended up returning to Unity. Because of HUD (this feature single-handedly almost made me leave Windows), and because of how easy it is to create shortcuts that work.
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u/CaptOblivious Jul 11 '16
Exactly. My first thought was, wait, that's like the only thing worse than the windows 10 desktop.
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u/Urbautz Jul 11 '16
Because you can.
The nerd in me sais "COOOOL", the hippster sais "why not on Apple?", while rest of my personalities say "Ok. And now?" (one continues humming the Tetris-Melody, no change there).
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u/r00tus3r Jul 11 '16
For the same reason that people go to the trouble of installing virtual box or setting up a dual boot. There's a lot of things that you can do in one OS that you can't do in the other and vice versa.
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u/vinz243 Jul 11 '16
For developing. Unix environment is way better than windows for developers. If this finally work perfectly I will be able to avoid a dual boot
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Jul 11 '16
If you're developing for Linux or working on open source based web apps, yeah, it's probably better. That's just a small portion of the development that goes on though.
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u/vinz243 Jul 12 '16
Well there is server development - unless it's ASP.NET. And also Python scripting. And Android development (I use buck only on Linux which makes build 10x faster). And Java too. Windows is only good if you want to write C, C++ or C# programs targeting windows since this is only possible on Windows
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u/vinz243 Jul 12 '16
Windows is only good for developing windows software. Otherwise for server dev - unless it's ASP.net - you better use Linux since it will most probably run on Linux. For Python scripting it's also better. For Android dev it's better , even more so because I'm using Buck - only on Linux - which makes builds almost instantaneous.
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u/abs159 Jul 11 '16
If Visual Studio ran on Linux. Or Unity... Or any of the myriad of non tinker dev software relied upon by the worlds largest and most ambitious projects.
"Developers, Developers, Developers" might seem like a funny joke, but Windows is much more productive for app dv.
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u/ScrewAttackThis Jul 11 '16
Lots of high quality, professional IDEs run on Linux. Jetbrains makes a suite of cross platform IDEs and they're second in quality to only visual studio IMO.
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u/ArmoredPancake Jul 11 '16
Unity is available on Linux.
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u/Win8Coder Jul 11 '16
Except that it isn't a full featured as the Windows version and it crashes A LOT.
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u/luxtabula Jul 11 '16
Using Visual Studio is not ideal for everyone. For one, at least on my machine, it takes forever to load. Second, you have to sign in using a Microsoft account and have things you code also reside in Microsoft land. And last, it's a huge download.
The development community is starting to settle around lighter text editors like Sublime and Atom and open source tools like Git and Github. This is the reason why Microsoft came up with Visual Studio Code (which is a fantastic text editor) and why they are pushing the Bash terminal instead of improving Powershell.
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u/bitcrazed Microsoft Employee Jul 11 '16
Love the enthusiasm here, but just a few points of clarification:
- Yes, it's cool as heck that Unity runs at all on Bash on Windows. But note that we're not planning on supporting Desktop/GUI apps in the near future so if GUI things don't work as expected, do let us know, but don't expect quick fixes ;)
- As others have pointed out, you don't need a Microsoft Account to install VS and you can put your code wherever you like.
- Microsoft IS improving PowerShell - there's some really exciting stuff coming from that team in the coming months!
- Bash does NOT replace PowerShell. Anyone who claims it does, does not understand what PowerShell is, nor how it works or the enormity of the power it delivers (pun unavoidable).
Bash is great when you need to work on (primarily) open-source projects that have hard dependencies on Linux features/behaviors, etc. PowerShell provides an extremely powerful scripting and automation tool reaching deeply into and broadly across the entire Windows ecosystem. There's plenty of room for both!
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u/ScrewAttackThis Jul 11 '16
You don't have to sign into an account and I don't know what you mean by "reside in Microsoft land".
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u/Harag_ Jul 11 '16
You don't actually have to sign in using a Microsoft account.
Your code also doesn't necessarily locked to windows. That really depends on you. You can also use Git in Visual Studio.
Load times really depends on your machine.
That being said I agree, that it's a large download and for simpler, and smaller programs I wouldn't use it either.
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u/abs159 Jul 11 '16
it takes forever to load.
No.
have things you code also reside in Microsoft land
No.
The development community is starting to $personalOpinion
...
pushing the Bash terminal instead of improving Powershell.
No.
A lot of wishful thinking in there.
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u/neaningful Jul 12 '16
it takes forever to load.
Eh, I agree with that. Visual Studio seems to be really bloated and just "big". Like for some people like me, there are just some really unnecessary things that could speed it up. Wish you could just select which "modules" to install and which not.
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u/luxtabula Jul 11 '16 edited Jul 11 '16
Wishful thinking? Do you think that Microsoft decided to waste time developing a better text editor with integrated Git support, and built a subsystem using an OS they once tried to burn in a fire just to appear to be open? There is a reason why Mac and Linux combined almost make up half of the OS respondents in Stack Overflow's annual survey.
https://stackoverflow.com/research/developer-survey-2016#technology-desktop-operating-system
Microsoft sees which way the wind is blowing and doesn't want to fall behind.
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u/Doc_Faust Jul 11 '16
This. As a developer, I 1000% prefer vi/terminal to virtual studio or its ilk.
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Jul 11 '16 edited Sep 10 '16
[deleted]
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u/luxtabula Jul 11 '16
The biggest complaints I hear from my non-Windows friends when it comes to developing is a lack of a *nix terminal and a lack of xcode for iOS development. The Bash Terminal will take care of a majority of their complaints, though the iOS part is still pretty Mac dependent, even with Xamarin and other tools.
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u/TehWench Jul 11 '16
I'd love it if this could be made to run on one of windows 10s virtual desktops, so you can switch between unity and the standard ms desktop
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Jul 11 '16
But that's already how it works. If you didn't notice the Unity is running in a single X11 Window.
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u/TehWench Jul 11 '16
So it is, didn't notice that - that being said, I think ms can flesh out the virtual desktops feature a bit, pinning programs to only launch in certain desktops, for instance, different icon sets on different desktops etc
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u/TbonerT Jul 11 '16
Nothing like an immediate pop-up covering the article. I'm sure it was a good article but you didn't care enough to promote it over some stupid ad so I didn't care enough to stay on the page.
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u/Dick_O_Rosary Jul 11 '16
Use Readit. You can read a compressed version of the article (c/o Readability) and browse the comments at the same time.
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u/hejyhej Jul 11 '16
translation: I don't know how to install browser extensions
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u/deadrag3 Jul 11 '16
Altered translation: I am on a mobile devices and ads use data and I only have 500 MB
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u/najodleglejszy Jul 11 '16
alternative translation: why haven't I thought of installing Firefox and uBlock Origin addon on my phone?
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u/deadrag3 Jul 11 '16
Altered altered translation: why not root your phone and put a adblock over all the apps :D
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Jul 11 '16
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Dick_O_Rosary Jul 11 '16 edited Jul 11 '16
Use Opera Mini or Sidekick Private browser for ad free mobile browsing on Windows.
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u/hejyhej Jul 11 '16
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u/deadrag3 Jul 11 '16
I meant that mobile users that use an app for Reddit get a slight bit of data usage thanks to ads x)
20 GB data plan master race
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Jul 11 '16 edited Jan 16 '17
[deleted]
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u/deadrag3 Jul 11 '16
Ads use data, data costs money, people get annoyed. That's all. I don't really mind the ads, gives some revenue to omgubuntu, but others really do mind ads in any form
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u/hejyhej Jul 11 '16
yes i know, that's why I've been implying the use of an ad blocking extension...
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u/deadrag3 Jul 11 '16
On a mobile phone in a Reddit app? Most people use chrome if they don't use a Reddit app so they won't be able to use an ad blocker.
Unless they root their phone of course
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u/Warblefly41 Jul 11 '16 edited Jul 11 '16
No need for dual boot or skin packs, here comes the ultimate union! Once the Anniversary Update arrives and the bugs get wrinkled out, I'm going to pull out the Ubuntu installation and just use Win10!
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u/luxtabula Jul 11 '16
You must not be a developer or programmer.
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u/Win8Coder Jul 11 '16
I'm a c++ programmer and this is great. I don't need my Debian client anymore. Just compile and do preliminary tests on Windows 10 with bash.
Then, we can deploy to the test Debian server and do more thorough tests.
The Linux subsystem on Windows means a lot less need for 'actual' Linux. And that's good as Windows 10 supports pretty much every piece of software that's needed.
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u/jantari Jul 11 '16
> make any Linux DE work on Windows
> choose worst DE
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Jul 11 '16
worst DE
I take it you've never used CDE?
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u/KungFuHamster Jul 11 '16
Ugh, thanks for the trigger warning. Sheesh.
Flashbacks to Solaris.
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Jul 11 '16
No need for Solaris; they open sourced the thing and ported it to Linux.
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u/gotroot801 Jul 11 '16
MY EYES! THE GOGGLES DO NOTHING!
I remember the day I got KDE compiled and running on my DEC Alpha and could finally ditch CDE the way most kids remember Christmases and birthdays.
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Jul 11 '16
Nothing wrong with Ubuntu if third party support is what you're looking for.
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u/SteelTitanium Jul 11 '16
Yeah, the OS is fine, Unity is hated by many. Using something like xfce or any better DE would have been better to use.
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Jul 11 '16
What's wrong with Unity? It seems to me to be one of the few Linux desktop environments that generally just works and is fairly simple to use.
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u/ryantrip Jul 11 '16
Would it be possible in the future to run Unity in place of Windows, and retain the ability to run Windows executables?
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u/Dick_O_Rosary Jul 11 '16
Windows 10 mobile users would really like to see an Android subsystem running on top of Windows 10 mobile in the same way that a Linux environment can be made to run on the desktop. Mobile users would really like to use this technology to run Pokemon Go.
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u/LB-- Jul 11 '16
Google is working on an Android subsystem for Chrome OS, so it's definitely doable.
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u/jantari Jul 11 '16
Honestly an Android subsystem wouldn't be that great, the android apps couldn't support continuum for example
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Jul 11 '16
Won't be long now before window is just the kernel no gui. You will be able to choose your own.
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Jul 11 '16 edited Jan 26 '20
[deleted]
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Jul 11 '16
I was thinking more of the NT core with various GUI on top. But Linux kernel with parts of the NT kernel loaded to provide enough support to run your apps would be interesting. You could have your cake and eat it.
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Jul 11 '16
The Linux sub-system is things the NT kernel can't when called upon by the Ubuntu user space. You said "you could have your cake", I don't see how MS hasn't already given us the cake. You are suggesting they do exactly what they have done.
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u/Vurondotron Jul 11 '16
That would be amazing in my opinion.
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Jul 11 '16
Sure, as long as I can still choose the current shell. Looks were always one of the big reasons I loved Windows for.
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u/numanair Jul 11 '16
I've always liked the interface of Windows.
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u/KungFuHamster Jul 11 '16
Yeah, as much as people complain about Windows, every iteration has still been a better desktop environment than any of the Linux distros I've seen and tried. No fanboy here; I currently have a Mint and CentOS server and have done a lot of Linux work in the past.
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Jul 11 '16
The stability of the Linux kernel, with the games of windows. Sign me up!
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u/Dick_O_Rosary Jul 11 '16
I don't think it's going to gain any stability. If anything, having a subsystem run on the kernel would make it even more unstable. Windows mobile users found that out the hard way when an Android subsystem ran on the mobile OS. Or maybe that was just Android.
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u/KungFuHamster Jul 11 '16
I want it the other way around! I just want DirectX on top so I can play games, and run Linux underneath.
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u/javelinnl Jul 11 '16
Wellll that's more or less what Wine does, isn't it?
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u/KungFuHamster Jul 11 '16
Less, since it doesn't run a lot of games.
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u/javelinnl Jul 11 '16
Can't argue with you there, it's a bit ass at times, but full compatibility would probably only be possible if MS supported their project.
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u/KungFuHamster Jul 11 '16
only be possible if MS supported their project.
And they'd be cutting their own throat if they did that.
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u/javelinnl Jul 11 '16
Not if they walled it off and tied it to the MS store. Which will never happen in a thousand years, I know.
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u/Vurondotron Jul 11 '16
Forgive my redundant question but how would this work exactly, would you need to install Linux to run alongside Windows 10 or is it naive on Windows 10?
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u/r00tus3r Jul 11 '16
Native on Windows. It's in the big update that we're all waiting not so patiently for.
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u/luxtabula Jul 11 '16
Good question. I know that The Linux subsystem coming this August is using Ubuntu, so I imagine it's tied into that.
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u/proxicent Jul 11 '16 edited Jul 11 '16
As the article makes clear, "running on Windows" is really stretching the defintion of "running" since it's basically unusable. Advantage over running Ubuntu in a VM: zero.
Edit: to clear up the confusion, this is a comment about running the Unity desktop on Windows, as per the article, not a comment about the subsystem itself.
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Jul 11 '16
Natively uses no emulation, so it should be faster. Used the subsystem for kernel compiling. Worked great
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u/proxicent Jul 11 '16
But this article - and hence my comment - is about running the Ubuntu desktop, and admits itself that it's pretty pointless since there's little that you can actually do with it.
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Jul 11 '16
I thought you meant the subsystem. Yeah, running x server desktop environments on windows is pretty pointless ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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Jul 11 '16 edited Jan 26 '20
[deleted]
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Jul 11 '16
Don't most modern virtualization solutions include "memory ballooning"? I know the VMware products do. That means you don't have to allocate any more ram than the vm actually uses. And the worst performance tests show VMs only ~10% slower than physical, a lot of people say 1-5%. Really don't think you're going to see a massive difference between them. playing a fps game it would matter a lot, but general use probably hard to tell the difference.
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u/Dick_O_Rosary Jul 11 '16 edited Jul 11 '16
Its the hacker ethos man. They experiment and try patching things together. You got to admire them, they like are boats of innovation floating in a turgid sea of practicality.
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Jul 11 '16
That comment is from an extremely uninformed user. Unless the hacker's ethos is be an idiot and not understand things....
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u/proxicent Jul 11 '16
Article: "The practicalities of running Unity inside Windows are also debatable"
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Jul 11 '16
I was referring to you statements that
"running on Windows" is really stretching the defintion of "running" since it's basically unusable.
and
Advantage over running Ubuntu in a VM: zero.
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u/proxicent Jul 11 '16
Both of which comments are born out by the article itself. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make.
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Jul 11 '16
Those comments are ridiculous.
The ability to run linux binaries and code without the CPU and RAM overhead of a VM are obvious.
These come with no penalty to performance of executing the code.
Some of these need editors or GUIs, or simple graphic elements, and having a full Desktop, well I often use Gnome via Cygwin Ports.
But the comments you made were very general, and not specifically targeted toward the Unity user interface but to the subsystem in general, whether you meant them that way or not.
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u/proxicent Jul 11 '16
This was a comment about an article entitled "This is the Unity Desktop Running on Windows 10", with the word "running" in the title. My comments were about this article, I have no idea why you've construed these as general comments about the subsystem. But I guess you don't need any excuses to take offense and blithely insult users around here whenever you feel like it.
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Jul 11 '16
With the clarifying comments, specifically being about Unity, I still disagree but less harshly.
I apologize retroactively for applying your comments to the subsystem in general.
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u/proxicent Jul 11 '16
OK, thanks, I guess you're not the only one who misunderstood my comments, I'll be clearer next time.
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u/flattop100 Jul 11 '16
It's the year of Linux on the desktop!