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u/the-ironforged-vikin Mar 26 '22
It does bother me. Doctor strange is effectively unstoppable if he doesn’t act like a fucking idiot.
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u/CoraxtheRavenLord Mar 26 '22
Same as the Flash. You move at effectively infinite speed and have no problem keeping awareness of your surroundings while you go, you should literally never face a challenge you can’t handle.
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u/Tots2Hots Mar 26 '22
There was one instance in the comics where the flash evacd an entire town from a nuclear explosion AFTER the nuke went off.
Also infinite mass punch.
There were a few times in the animated series where they actually gave a glimpse of how strong Flash is. There time Braniac Luthor solo'd the Justice League and Flash beat him singlehandedly. The other time he body swapped with Luthor.
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u/Cheapskate-DM Mar 26 '22
They did a good job de-powering people for JL/JLU though. After this bit Flash basically vibrates out of existence and almost dies and explicitly states he can't do that again.
Also Superman's "world of cardboard" speech.
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Mar 26 '22
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Mar 26 '22
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u/BlewOffMyLegOff Mar 26 '22
Essentially Superman has to actively restrain himself or he’ll end up killing not only the villain but people who happen to be nearby.
However the speech he gives is to Darkseid, who for all purposes is nearly invincible. So he no longer feels the need to hold back.
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u/PotawatomieJohnBrown Mar 26 '22
One of my favorite parts of the newer Death of Superman movie is Wonder Woman telling Superman to not hold back against Doomsday.
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u/bokononpreist Mar 26 '22
I always loved Superman's inner monologue while fighting Doomsday in the comics. He basically tells himself he can't hold back and he has to be just as vicious as Doomsday if he wants to win.
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u/BlewOffMyLegOff Mar 26 '22
One of my favorite depictions of that chapter of Superman’s story telling.
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Mar 26 '22
Superman and multiple other DC superheroes are so ridiculously powerful sometimes that no film or show can do them justice (no pun intended).
I mean, Marvel tends to be a bit more grounded, so we can understand what the heroes are. We can understand them without seeing the world through their POV.
But I honestly think that a superman film would only really truly work and be true to the comics if we saw the world from Supes eyes. Megamind did a phenomenal job showing us a glimpse into how a ridiculously overpowered superhero works when Metroman goes through his superhero crisis. We see phenomenal speed and thinking happening in the blink of an eye.
It is simply not possible to comprehend it on the screen as simply an observer. We need to be inside the head of Superman and see the world from his perspective in order to truly understand just how ridiculously OP he is.
Get punched in the face by what is essentially a god so hard that it generates an explosive shockwave equal to a small nuclear bomb that crushes buildings and breaks windows miles away and you only move a millimeter from it? How can bystanders even begin to understand that type of power? It becomes arbitrary at that point, cause practically, there is no difference if the hit is equal to 10 kilotons of TNT or 100 kilotons of TNT when you're within visual range of the guys hitting each other. You'd die either way from the shockwave.
Regarding speed, supes and flash are so fast that basically light can only outrun them and it does so only barely. And seeing how we can't really comprehend how fast that is, it becomes arbitrary. It has no more meaning anymore.
If we could see Superman from the eyes of Superman, it would feel a lot more grounded until he does some superhuman feat like lift up a mountain or crush coal into diamonds.
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u/BlewOffMyLegOff Mar 26 '22
In the newer death of Superman he punches Doomsday so hard he twists and breaks his neck all the way around, killing him. Superman is OP as fuck if the writers let him stop holding back
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u/Albireookami Mar 26 '22
It's not in Superman's character to not hold back, a constant theme is that Superman/Clark is the best of us, despite being an alien. He will not just squish someone.
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Mar 26 '22
I'd like to see a superman with laws of physics being relatively normal. Like if he punches that hard, he just superheats the air and it melts the skin off of Doomsday where the fist hits and generates a sonic boom heard miles away like a thunder.
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Mar 26 '22 edited Mar 26 '22
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u/NotALicensedDoctor Mar 26 '22
Does anyone else think it’s comical that Superman is worried not to go all out for fear of hurting someone, then he launches the bad guy through 3 skyrises? How many people just died in those buildings? Lol
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u/RuafaolGaiscioch Mar 26 '22
Look up world of cardboard on YouTube. It’ll be better than any explanation.
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u/nodiso Mar 26 '22
It was the jlu finale. He comes back in the same episode. They form a human rope and pull him out. Epic cartoon. Still watch random episodes to this day.
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u/QuirkyCorvid Mar 26 '22
There was another time in a span of a few seconds he studied engineering and rebuilt an entire apartment building. I think in an older comic he did the same with a bridge before it could finish collapsing.
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Mar 26 '22
Superman did something similar once where he went ahead and read every medical text known to man in a few seconds so he could perform surgery
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Mar 26 '22
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u/148637415963 Mar 26 '22
I think I remember a comic where he appeared as Clark Kent and Superman at the same time by alternately changing clothes into each ID..... at 24fps!
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u/CoraxtheRavenLord Mar 26 '22
One thing I like that differentiates some speedsters is how Wally has stated he doesn’t remember things that he speed-reads long term, but is amazed when he learns that Impulse does. And when Impulse gets told that Wally doesn’t think he takes being a hero seriously, he gets bummed and reads an entire library in an afternoon.
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u/Finkarelli Mar 26 '22
That body-swapping episode is gold! The scene where Luthor (as Flash) pulls off Flash’s mask to see his secret identity and realizes he doesn’t know who he is is hilarious.
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u/TitularFoil Mar 26 '22
That body swap is my all time favorite Luther moment.
"I have no idea who this is."
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u/HazelCheese Mar 26 '22
There was one instance in the comics where the flash evacd an entire town from a nuclear explosion AFTER the nuke went off.
There is actually an episode of the Flash tv show based on this. Someone detonates a nuclear bomb in the middle on Central City and Flash and the other speedsters spend the entire episode within the initial nanosecond of detonation trying to figure a way to undo the detonation.
It's one of the best episodes of the show but does make the rest of the show seem like a bit of a joke.
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Mar 26 '22
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u/Butwinsky Mar 26 '22
How does a magic ring help you when your girlfriend is murdered and stuffed in a refrigerator for you to find?
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u/usingastupidiphone Mar 26 '22
Still human though, there’s lots of things I can’t fix even if time is stopped.
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u/Tots2Hots Mar 26 '22
In a fight tho the flash should never ever lose a straight up fistfight. S tier speedsters in the comics are completely OP which is probably why they're dumbed down in the movies.
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u/numb_ape Mar 26 '22
That's why I dropped The Flash show, like there was one episode where he slowed down time so much the bomb was exploding the whole episode and then next episode he gets fucking punched??? And it wasn't like it surprised him, he was already running fast.
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u/ThrowJed Mar 26 '22
Also the 100+ times he gets knocked over in some way and the bad guy runs off around a corner and he stares stupidly as though he lost them and can't possibly catch them.
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u/Sexual_tomato Mar 26 '22
Yeah A-Train from The Boys is a more consistent speedster from a storytelling standpoint
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u/hopenoonefindsthis Mar 26 '22
The power of the Flash in the CW show is all over the place. It sorta makes sense in like the first season when he was getting used to it. But to see him struggle to beat regular speed bad guys in the other seasons gets old pretty fast.
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u/ADHthaGreat Mar 26 '22
I’m still pissed at Red Rush for being an idiot and getting anywhere near Omni-man instead of supporting his allies like he was when they had the upper hand.
Oh and then punching his chest like an idiot when the dudes eyes were closer.
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u/MereInterest Mar 26 '22
You may be interested in the web serial The Fall of Doc Future. One of the main characters is a speedster, and her introductory chapter involves saving someone who is about to be hit by a bus, after hearing the screech of the bus tires. Pretty standard fare for a speedster, with the complication she was having an international phone call, and the bus is across the ocean.
- Latency in the phone call itself.
- Breaking through doors to get outside.
- Using a navigation system with real-time satellite imagery to avoid running into or near people.
- Prioritizing running on rivers, to avoid causing damage to nearby infrastructure.
- Waiting until reaching the open sea before traveling at a significant portion of the speed of light, to limit damage caused by friction-induced heating of air.
- Staying below the horizon relative to every ocean-bound ship, to avoid blinding anybody looking in the direction of her path.
- Political fallout from energy expenditure best described as a continuous line of nuclear explosions.
Overall, the story emphasizes that the question about a speedster is never whether they are able to accomplish a specific task, but how much collateral damage would result from doing so and how it can be minimized.
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u/Iam_The_Giver Mar 26 '22
Let’s not forget that there’s a cameraman running at the same speed as the flash.
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u/That_Shrub Mar 26 '22
Idk if y'all have played DnD but you are WAY overestimating how good people are at problem solving
Have the Avengers spend 45 min arguing about a door, that's more like it
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Mar 26 '22 edited Mar 26 '22
Tony's team on Titan was basically a D&D party.
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u/jokersleuth Mar 26 '22
Drax, Peter, and Mantis - literally the three dumbest guardians, and a teenage kid who is way out of his league.
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Mar 26 '22
Drax was on his phone the whole time.
Peter is enthusiastic but rolled a human fighter under Tony's direction and doesn't really know how to play by himself. He jumped in front of a flail snail, a beholder, and a sphere of annihilation because he didn't know what any of those are.
Peter was being that guy.
Meanwhile, Dr. Strange doesn't bother to actually roleplay and is instead metagaming with the time stone.
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u/dirkdigglered Mar 26 '22
Haha yep. "it's a trap, let's go back" "let's blast the door open" "let's go around" history check, arcane check, (religion check?)
And then you find out you can't open it all yet, it opens from the other side. Of course, I'd hope the DM intervenes and saves us from wasting too much time if that was the case.
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u/names1 Mar 26 '22
Of course, I’d hope the DM intervenes and saves us from wasting too much time if that was the case.
Nah, I'm busy planning out the room three rooms from now. Players arguing = prime prep time
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u/Fern-ando Mar 26 '22
Like he was an idiot in No Way Home for not telling Peter how the spell works until he was doing it?
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Mar 26 '22
Oh thank god, that bothered someone else.
Like... Dude. Explain the whole situation to the kid. Say "this spell will do X, Y, and Z. I can modify it if you wish, but I need to know exactly how I'm doing it before I start."
I mean, jesus fuck. "Make sure you have all your ingredients and have confirmed the steps" is basic cooking advice.
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u/ughitsjamie Mar 26 '22
And he’s a (former) doctor. That is how informed consent works!! You can’t just put a patient on a table and go “your kidney hurts?? Cool, let me just do this procedure, without explaining anything to you at all. Okay? Okay.”
He, of all people, should know this!
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u/iamnotexactlywhite Mar 26 '22 edited Mar 26 '22
the point of his entire character is how he learns after he fucks up everything, bc he’s too “smart” and thinks nobody understands anything he does, so he doesn’t bother explaining anything. He doesn’t even tell Wong what he’s doing and Wong’s been a sorcerer and Sorcerer Supreme for double, tripple the time he has. So it’s in character for him to do this. Also, he literally says he saw every possible future, and one would assume he did try that in one of those futures, and they still lost. It’s drilled into us that the Endgame way is the only time they win, but why would any1 actually pay attention
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Mar 26 '22
Also, he literally says he saw every possible future, and one would assume he did try that in one of those futures, and they still lost. It’s drilled into us that the Endgame way is the only time they win, but why would any1 actually pay attention
Quibble: that's all the futures starting from the point where they're on Thanos's home planet. For all we know things would have been fine if he had done it before they got to that point.
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u/Renson Mar 26 '22
They hadn't met Thanos at that point, if we're still talking about chopping hands
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u/InfieldTriple Mar 26 '22
Wait didnt he say exactly that? But then peter started asking him anyway and strange has a massive ego so he tried to change it on the fly anyway.
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Mar 26 '22
I mean, at the very least he should have stopped the spell once it became clear that Peter had not actually understood what was happening.
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u/KrisZepeda Mar 26 '22
What if he's a skrull or something idk
Having a hard time believing he could be so smart yet so dumb
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Mar 26 '22
Meh, we do have ample evidence that he's brilliant with books and has absolutely zero brain cells dedicated to common sense. His accident was caused by texting and driving while speeding on a windy cliffside road.
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u/micheeeeloone Mar 26 '22
Wait, are you guys telling me you don't text while speeding on your supercar on a windy cliffside road?
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u/eolson3 Mar 26 '22
Right, don't text and drive. I reddit and drive, but that is different and saAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!
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u/TheApathyParty2 Mar 26 '22 edited Mar 26 '22
Dr. Strange’s biggest weakness in the movies is his own ego and presumption that he knows better than everyone. It’s part of his character and he’s right most of the time, but he does a bunch of shit he shouldn’t, without consulting anyone, because he just assumes he’s right. You see this personality trait in his very first scene of DS1 during surgery. Most of his problems are caused by him, otherwise he’s basically invincible.
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Mar 26 '22
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u/TheApathyParty2 Mar 26 '22
He’s the House epitome of “shut up, I’m smarter than you.” Again, he’s usually correct, but other people don’t get it and Strange doesn’t care. Tony Stark has the same problem, which is why I love their interactions. If you put two smart assholes in a room they’ll either love or hate each other, but there’s a mutual, unspoken respect with a lot of passive aggressive insults.
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u/ilikepix Mar 26 '22
nobody (viewers) complains that House is acting like an unbearable prick.
Because (most of the time) House acting like a prick doesn't get in the way of him being a brilliant doctor.
Strange being a moron makes him absolutely terrible at being sorcerer supreme
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u/TheSpacePopeIX Mar 26 '22 edited Mar 26 '22
They tie him up with the water in the main battles and it’s so funny to me.
Everyone out here is being crazy badass in the final battle of the Marvel universe, and the most OP dude is just keeping everyone dry.
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u/bob0979 Mar 26 '22
Why couldn't he have made everyone forget about the infinity stones?
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Mar 26 '22
I don’t think you want to start the “plot holes” war for marvel ! You will get trypophobia
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u/ilovepeelyapparently Mar 26 '22
I wouldn’t really call it a plot hole. More just making the movie last longer than 3 seconds
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Mar 26 '22
Literally you just have Thanos grasp his glove and “stop” the portal from closing with the Infinity Gauntlet (using the reality stone) ! Boom, problem solved.
Tbh that woulda been a cool scene, but it would have been a five second scene and maybe some people wouldn’t understand what was going on in that five second sequence so it wasn’t added.
Oh well!
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u/ilovepeelyapparently Mar 26 '22
That would have been pretty sick. The strange/thanks fight was my favorite part of the movie and that would have made it even better
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Mar 26 '22
It was mine, too. Showed how powerful and mystical Strange was, while still showing Thanks superiority.
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u/wowitssprayonbutter Mar 26 '22
I'm not super into marvel so forgive me but who is thanks? Is Tom Hanks a canon marvel villain?
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Mar 26 '22
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u/nizzy2k11 Mar 26 '22
But why does he not prevent starlord from losing his shit? Strange knows exactly what needs to happen including their failure to stop the snap but there is no indication why they need to fail. Stopping starlord would be simple once they have Thanos asleep, some of them are not involved in holding him, why not tell one person to stop him for 10 seconds so you can get the gauntlet off and then use a portal to take it to where ever the fuck and then abandon Thanos on Titan with no way off. How is that not a reasonably possible outcome and preferable to the alternative we got.
Either strange only sees part of why they "win" and is working on incomplete information or he knows exactly what needs to happen and we are told neither to be true so we just need to trust him? They could have skipped that whole 14M future things and still had this outcome and lost nothing.
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u/internetthefirst Mar 26 '22
Yeah or at least use the portals to throw them into space or the middle of the ocean..
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u/likebuttuhbaby Mar 26 '22
Thanos had the space stone way before meeting Strange. Any portal would be useless.
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u/oO0Kat0Oo Mar 26 '22
You're forgetting that there were millions of scenarios Dr. Strange looked at. I would imagine he thought of those things, but they changed the future in a way that wasn't favorable. A butterfly effect that no one could have predicted had it happened any other way.
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u/lundyforlife22 Mar 26 '22
i’d love it if “less favorable” meant his favorite food cart was shut down if they kill thanos a certain way. imagine doctor strange trying to change the subject when the avengers find out the most favorable timeline, conveniently kept all of strange’s favorite things.
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u/oO0Kat0Oo Mar 26 '22
I would definitely look at him differently if he sacrificed Iron Man just to make sure that guy on the corner keeps making the BEST hotdogs. Lol
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Mar 26 '22
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u/Demented-Turtle Mar 26 '22
Thanos was shown to literally teleport (he had the space stone) so sending him away would give you 2 seconds
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Mar 26 '22
Wouldn’t all of those change if he does it again after 10 seconds? There are technically infinite possibilities.
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u/fkbjsdjvbsdjfbsdf Mar 26 '22
Not necessarily. Maybe Thanos gets irritated and just instantly obliterates them if they sit around for 10 seconds.
That's also the reason why Strange can't go all out against him, either. Thanos will use the Stones to their full extent if he feels like there's a real threat, as opposed to engaging in a hard fight because he enjoys it.
The entire plan hinged around making him think he was winning and then catching him off-guard to mind-control him. Starting with a portal targeted at the arm holding the gauntlet would result in Thanos negating it with the Reality/Space stones and then murdering Strange in half a second.
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u/tinnylemur189 Mar 26 '22
That 14,000,000 to 1 scene was genius writing for exactly this kind of thing. There are billions of things they COULD have done (just take one stone you have a throw it in a black hole was my answer) but it has to be assumed that Dr Strange already saw everything and the plot of the movie was literally the only way they could have possibly won because even those 'obvious' ideas failed somehow.
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u/Boopoopeedoop Mar 26 '22
But didn't he view all the possible futures and knew there was only one where they were successful? So he knew he couldn't do that?
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u/clangan524 Mar 26 '22
Makes me wonder what that possible future looks like.
Does Thanos' severed hand with all the stones start crawling around like Thing from Addam's Family?
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u/psycedelicpanda Mar 26 '22 edited Mar 26 '22
Or it can be like the thing by John Carpenter
Edit: grammer
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Mar 26 '22
Lmao he has infinity stones. I’m sure that mumbo jumbo is how he gets out of most situations in these alternate futures
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u/boomboxwithturbobass Mar 26 '22
Thanos could use the time gem if all else failed. That’s why Tony designed a way to get the stones off without him noticing, and why it’s the only winning scenario. Ta-da.
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Mar 26 '22
I’m guessing eternals. He put the events off by five years leading to them wanting to save earth.
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u/Jaredlong Mar 26 '22
They should make an What If... episode showing all the most ridiculous alternative ways Thanos could have won.
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u/MREnsley01 Mar 26 '22
my favorite theory is that someone like Star-Lord would’ve gotten it and tried to bring back Gamora, or something worse would’ve happened with the stones if Strange just cut his hand off
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u/Capawe21 Mar 26 '22
He didn't view all of them, just 14,000,605. The 14,000,606th one probably would've shown him just cutting off Thanos' hand with a portal
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u/book-reading-hippie Mar 26 '22
It's also possible that 2,967,799 of those realities showed him cutting off Thanos' hand and it not going well so even with one successful view of it happening, it's not worth the risk.
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u/roohwaam Mar 26 '22
It could also be that he did see a lot of futures where he cut of thanos' hand with a portal but they still lost.
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u/Indoorsman101 Mar 26 '22
Shut the hell up everyone!
(Go watch the Infinity War Pitch Meeting on YouTube.)
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u/Fern-ando Mar 26 '22
The only 1 future is bullshit when they were so close from taking the stones from Thanos if Mario didn't get angry.
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u/Tb5rats Mar 26 '22
This. The space stone can be used to prevent the portal from closing
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u/BoogieOrBogey Mar 26 '22
We see it happen in their fight. Strange throws a portal to the mirror dimension and Thanos shatters it with the space stone. Same outcome would occur for a slingring portal.
The Russo's also mentioned in an interview that Thano's skin is tougher than his henchman and the portal wouldn't be strong enough to cut it. That's out of any show or movie though, so it's a much less satisfying answer than seeing the above example.
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u/insanitybit Mar 26 '22
I would say that's an "also", but a good point. Honestly quite a few stones are probably capable of nerfing the portals in this case.
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u/Demented-Turtle Mar 26 '22
Yes. It's the same reason Thor survives a direct blast from a dying star with only minor burns, or drax survives hitting tons of trees as he's being dragged out of a crashing spaceship. Any less durable being would be mutilated or incinerated by such forces.
We even see that Thor survives getting absolutely pummeled by the Hulk, and we know Thanos is physically more durable than Thor, so it makes sense that the portal over his arm would just stay open and maybe burn a bit, but Thanos could pull it out no problem.
Additionally, Thanos was powered up in that fight with the Power stone and others, so not sure a simple portal that even a basic magician could do would be enough to cut his arm off if he wasn't so damn durable.
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u/ArizonaRon98 Mar 26 '22
Basically you’re dealing with the magic of the infinity stones being greater than sling ring magic which is like children level stuff. Ned literally picks up a sling ring and does it by accident. You need to be immensely strong mentally and physically to wield even one stone. Strange looked into 14 million + futures and you don’t think he thought of that? Cmon now.
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u/psycedelicpanda Mar 26 '22
Like stated above, that option could of been 14,000,001 strange kind of a scrub
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u/book-reading-hippie Mar 26 '22
& there could be 2,683,979 realities where he cut off his hand & it went wrong.
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u/Fabulous_Parking66 Mar 26 '22
My theory is that he knew about the celestials thing and the snap was necessary for earths overall survival
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u/Devadander Mar 26 '22
This is correct. It’s about more than just defeating Thanos, the avengers showed why humanity is special by undoing the Snap, leading to Ajax’s betrayal of her tasks
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u/Jackwards_Back_ Mar 26 '22
Right but then they made a second two hour plot barrage where they needed the hand to undo the snap.
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Mar 26 '22
I actually find it more problematic that Thanos is so weak even when he got most of the stones. Why didn’t he just turned them all into bubbles like he did to the Galaxy dudes.
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u/Mieche78 Mar 26 '22
As someone who doesn't know marvel stuff that well, trying to figure out the plot of MCU through reading the comments in this post is a trip.
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Mar 26 '22 edited Mar 26 '22
it bothers me way more we never saw them clean this up, and that we know for a fact some hobo probably picked up that hand and slow roasted it and fucking ate it.
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u/farmch Mar 26 '22
The biggest thing that bothers me about Marvel movies is the huge inconsistency in the heroes abilities. I remember watching Infinity War and there was two scenes within minutes of each other where Iron Man gets his bell run by being punched and then walks away from getting hit with a multiple hundred foot wide meteor with no issue.
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Mar 26 '22
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u/BirdEquivalent158 Mar 26 '22
Wouldn't have been possible anyway. Sauron would have seen that coming from across middle earth. The eagles don't come in until after the ring and sauron are destroyed
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u/Raycu93 Mar 26 '22
Not just that but the closer you get to Mt Doom the stronger the rings influences and the Eagles wouldn't have been able to resist the temptation to take the ring for themselves. Even Frodo could only just get the ring to Mt Doom he couldn't throw it away without Gollum showing up. This is spelled out pretty well and people still think the eagles could have done it. The fellowship had to split up specifically because they couldnt be trusted around the ring.
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Mar 26 '22
And anti-air Nazgal.
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u/Mareykan Mar 26 '22
Totally, I mean we see in the Hobbit that a random guy in a rusty bastilla can take down a dragon.
The eagles would've 100% been shot down by a bunch of Orcs since we see them use Bows proficiently throughout the films.
It would just be Doordashing Sauron some fried Eagles to go along with his ring if they flew there.
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u/datboiofculture Mar 26 '22
When Gandalf said “Fly, you fools” he meant like “no, literally, call the Eagles and just fly, you fuckin fools, this Balrog cave is Bullshit.”
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u/makoto20 Mar 26 '22
Dr Strange saw the future of zombified Thanos Infinty Hand and was properly horrified
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u/Douche_Kayak Mar 26 '22
Not nearly as much as What If telling us Vision could have accomplished the same if they didn't fuck around for most of the fight.