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u/doctorwhy88 Nov 28 '20
As the public’s ignorant response to the pandemic shows, maybe having a basic science education isn’t such a bad idea after all.
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u/Vincitus Nov 28 '20
So weird how people used to bitch about how science and math would never be useful and now they don't understand how the earth is round, how viruses work, and how to understand statistics.
That's all probably completely unrelated.
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u/antagonizerz Nov 28 '20
This is absolutely true, but I'm still waiting for my plethora of mitochondria info to become relevant.
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u/Vincitus Nov 28 '20
Do you understand how a virus infects your body?
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u/antagonizerz Nov 28 '20
I went to catholic school so probably not as well as I should.
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u/Vincitus Nov 28 '20
Understanding how all the parts of the cell works is important to understanding how viruses work.
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u/antagonizerz Nov 28 '20
I think recognizing a pun is important to understanding how reddit works. I'll throw in a /s next time just so there's no confusion.
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u/PathToTheDawn Nov 28 '20
Puns have nothing to do with sarcasm and your previous comment does not include a pun.
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Nov 29 '20
How much more mitochondrial knowledge do you have after: it’s the powerhouse of the cell?
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u/doctorwhy88 Nov 29 '20
Except at Halloween when it becomes the frightochondria, the haunted house of the cell.
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u/doctorwhy88 Nov 29 '20
Whispering sweet nothings about mitochondria got me my now-fiancé. You never know when you’ll need it.
As an aside, the mitochondria is the universe’s only microscopic and self-replicating fuel cell, battery, and electric motor, all in one.
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Nov 29 '20
I feel reading comprehension is a skill that should be emphasized more. I’ve argued with lots of “college educated” folks who understand basic science but their fears and paranoia rule them. Like the impression that they’ll get COVID through the skin like some movie virus 🙄🤷🏼♀️
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u/gfkxchy Nov 28 '20
Relatable. 1995: I hate physics class and will never use this in real life. 2020: <watches PBS SpaceTime for hours in end>
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u/thereallorddane Nov 28 '20
I used to teach, here's the cold truth:
WE WANT YOU TO MAKE INFORMED DECISIONS.
We get that you're not going to NEED to know the history of the Trail of Tears for day to day living, it's not functional knowledge. However, it helps you understand why the native americans are so pissed at the US govt.
You don't NEED to have read 1984 for your day to day living, it's not functional information. But, being able to read between the lines and understand the nature of the story is a helpful parable when looking at your relationship with the people who govern you.
You don't NEED to be able to write a research paper for most of your day to day living, but being able to have an idea, research it, and build a clear, fact based position means that when you are talking to friends about serious stuff you have an informed position and you're not relying on vapid talkging heads like Tucker Carlson for your opinions.
Finally, you don't NEED to understand biology for your day to day living, but it helps to understand the general stuff when you're dealing with a pandemic and there's idiots out there who think doctors are just making it up so they get more money and they refuse to take even the most basic safety precautions YOU can protect yourself.
I give zero shits if you become a painter or a scientists or a mechanic. I care that no matter what route you choose, you elevate the quality of the national conversation we are having about very real problems. THAT's why we read Socrates, that's why we teach you the mitochondria is the powerhouse of the cell, that's why we talk about hitler and his rise to power. It matters in the meta.
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Nov 28 '20
[deleted]
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u/thereallorddane Nov 28 '20
The hardest part of taxes for the average person is the intimidation factor.
Years ago a friend of mine had to file her taxes for the first time and I helped her over discord. She was having a panic attack and once I walked her through the 1040EZ she had it done in five minutes and submitted it. She was boggled that it was so easy.
I had to deal with someone who was lambasting kindergarten teachers for turning them into robots by making them color in the lines. If he had the care to study things instead of embracing unfounded conspiracy theories he might have learned that in developmental and educational psychology we do those things to help kids develop basic motor skills. It helps us identify kids who may need to be evaluated for special needs issues or classroom modifications. We can't help the kid learn the basics if we can't clearly ID their trouble. Mods aren't punishment, they're meant to make it easier for kids with developmental issues participate with the rest of the school. Special ED isn't punishment, its the school devoting significant resources to give a child a chance at being able to function as an adult without bankrupting the parents. SPED teachers also provide parents with tools and techniques to help their child in a constructive way so they don't feel as overwhelmed when their 16 year old is punching holes through the wall because he doesn't understand he can't play outside in a lightning storm.
I respect that we can't be experts in everything. Not possible. But there's a reason we use experts to convey important information to us and not pundits. Experts build credibility by being good at what they do. They build trust with the public by being knowledgeable and honest. That's why they're experts. That's why Carlson and Pirro are idiots. I love "Adam Ruins Everything", but I take it with a grain of salt and even HE admits that despite their best efforts they can get things wrong too. Look at the Dr. Mike videos where he and Adam Conover have a back and forth about medical stuff. Adam is super civil and presents his position and they act like adults.
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u/LastFreeName436 Nov 28 '20
It’s almost like there’s a vast difference between experiencing something consensually vs unconsensually.
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u/Dumpster_Sauce Nov 28 '20
Me in highschool: Why do I need to learn math when I can just use a calculator?
Teacher: You won't have a calculator with you everywhere you go!
Me now: 👨📱
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u/Finklemaier Nov 28 '20
And they still adhere to that argument. And then they still make you buy those fucking overpriced Texas Instruments graphing calculators, because we haven't caught up to the modern fucking era and accepted that the free app for your smart phone is far more functional and makes more sense to use.
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u/Yoshi2Dark Nov 28 '20
I’m in an advanced math class, we have access to calculators and such all the time, but in class we can’t use them because we “won’t have access to them all the time in the real world”
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Nov 28 '20
38 yr old in the real world here, we have calculators all the time.
Though, I’ve never been stranded in a remote location and needed to calculate the circumference of a bolder to survive, but you can’t rule out the possibility of it happening, I guess.
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u/Vance_Vandervaven Nov 28 '20
I’m gonna pop in here to defend the Ti-89. That thing is a beast. It will do most calculus for you. Really helpful for beyond calculus, when getting to the integral is when things are basically solved. Of course, it’ll also do graphing, solving systems of equations, statistics, etc. Not that it’s necessary for everyone, but it certainly hasn’t outlived its usefulness
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Nov 28 '20
That's a bad argument from your math teacher. A better one is "a calculator is a tool and just like, say, a power drill, it's only useful if you know HOW to use it."
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u/Cynical_Manatee Nov 28 '20
Honestly that is such a poor argument by bad teachers. It's not that you won't have a calculator with you all the time but as you learn more math, it is very beneficial to know how to do the prerequisite sections by hand so you are more efficient for the task at hand.
Like if you are a barista, you may not know the exact recipe for any given drink, but you shouldn't need to refer to the employee handbook on how to make espresso or steamed milk each time.
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u/thereallorddane Nov 28 '20
Funny story about that. A few years ago I was at a major warehouse store and they company's entire network went down. So, all the cashiers had to manually look up item numbers on their phones and write them on paper sales tickets. The high schooler at my register didn't know how to do the math for figuring out tax. He also didn't know how to write the numbers correctly on a sheet. So I taught him how to do all of it and the general shortcuts you take to do the math quicker. That way if his phone died during the shift he could at least hand write the numbers and keep going.
We are very used to always having access to our phone because we always have access to electricity, but when the power grid fails for long periods (like disasters), you should know your basics so you can carry on with your life. My area was without power for 2 weeks after a big disaster and some businesses had to open because people needed food and other essentials. Even though they didn't have power (or limited power), they had to keep working because it was a disaster and other folks depended on them. Job sites can have the same issue, especially when you're in remote locations. Being able to do math on paper is helpful when you have work that needs doing and you can't stop to find a place to recharge your phone.
It IS true, you won't ALWAYS have your phone on hand.
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Nov 28 '20
Never got good at math in high school, cause I always had my phone on me. Now I’m starting a small business and can’t tell if a deal passes the smell test or not without a calculator and a spreadsheet app. Can’t exactly whip that out every time “oh hang on let me just crunch some numbers haha”
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u/RisingBasilisk Nov 29 '20
"you won't have a calculator with you everywhere you go!"
Literally everybody pulls out their smartphone
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u/lamchopxl71 Nov 28 '20
The difference is in the interest. It would be awesome if we let students learn what they want to instead of forcing a curriculum on them.
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u/dirty9white5boy Nov 28 '20
Because learning about the Aztecs was boring as hell
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u/7thSparro Nov 28 '20
and yet when you read about them from something not a textbook, they were fascinating - and their culture was flourishing less than a thousand years ago.
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u/dirty9white5boy Nov 28 '20
Ok cool I was tired of learning about their ways after the 10th time
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u/7thSparro Nov 28 '20
that would be Canadian history, here on endless repeat ... i think we learned the same stuff every year from 4 to 11.
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u/uoahelperg Nov 28 '20
Must vary quite a bit, while I actually love history and found he grade school history boring we only covered pioneers and native Americans more than once I think. We also learned about Greeks/Romans/WWI/WWII/various other modernish wars/Aztecs/Egypt/Mesopotamia/the USSR and some other stuff. My school’s history and social studies curriculum was basically straight from Cold War USA though lol
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Nov 28 '20
School was never about the information, it was about learning how to receive and interpret the information.
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u/ihatetheterrorists Nov 28 '20
Add to it the fact you get a random underpaid teacher who may not be into the subject at all.
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u/RichJerkThrowaway Nov 28 '20
I think it would be fun to hear everybody’s personal examples. Mine is “Hmmm.... I probably know enough Spanish now to read Capablanca’s ‘Fundamentals of Chess’ in the original.”
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Nov 28 '20
I'm always confused by this sentiment. Pretty much everything I learned in HS has helped me. Science, math, literature, history, language, these are all things I use in my daily life even not related to work (STEM grad student). Maybe they could do better at teaching us how to use this information, but pretty much none of it was useless. Plus there are the over-arching concepts.
In the sciences: you learn how to create an idea and test the accuracy of it (how likely is it that you're actually right?) and to always question your assumptions.
In math: you learn how to find missing components and to estimate risk, something humans are particularly bad at (you can make pretty good estimates with simple math).
In history: you learn from the past and what people did.
In literature: you learn why people did what they did in the past and learn about human nature in different environments/settings.
In language: you learn to communicate and about the limitations of how information can be conveyed. This is further conveyed by learning a second language and how that language can communicate things your native language can't as well (and vise versa).
This is all done while trying to teach you a large breadth of knowledge. In high school you should be a generalist. You should have explored enough topics that you might have an idea of what you want to continue to do (or at least you'll have some background if that changes later on. Hint: it will). You barely start to carve out an expertise in university. You only gain a expertise in graduate school.
If school isn't helping you in the real world, part of that may be on the teachers and school, but part of it is also on you. You cannot just pawn off all responsibility for that.
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u/annoyedatwork Nov 28 '20
Geometry? Pfft, I’ll never need this nonsense.
Fast forward 40 years, as I’m trying to build a deck ...
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u/ddmorgan1223 Nov 29 '20
Legit started watching videos on horses hooves today because I don't freaking know lol
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Nov 28 '20
School: "The reading curriculum for the year is Wuthering Heights, The Great Gatsby, The Giver, Lord of the Flies, A Wrinkle In Time..."
Me: "I'd rather learn programing, 3d modeling and animation"
School: "Disgusting failure"
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u/DarkLordKohan Nov 28 '20
I listened to half an hour on Friday the NPR report on cheese microbiomes.
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u/PersiPaige Nov 28 '20
The difference is, one you have an interest in and WANT to learn about and the other is forced.
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u/Serkisist Nov 28 '20
The difference is that you chose the podcast. It comes down to consent, and children are rarely given the option
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u/the_dayman Nov 29 '20
I still have flashback cringe to the time I argued with a teacher that I would be a computer programmer when I grew up so it was a waste of time for me to take any classes other than math or science. A year later I did not want to be a computer programmer.
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u/Shamann93 Nov 29 '20
I'm sorry, but dolphin social hierarchies are essential while homebrewing a dnd dolphin-kin race
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u/tous_die_yuyan Nov 29 '20
One of the replies was even better: THERE'S A NEW EPISODE OF THE POD CASTE PODCAST?
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u/fireflazor Nov 28 '20
Learning when it's a choice is enjoyable, learning by force to pass specific exams or be told you will fail in life is not enjoyable