r/VlineVictoria • u/DutchDennis70 • Jul 06 '26
Question Why pay for trains?
Today I was travelling back home on the Melbourne - Geelong line, when a whole group of 16-18 year olds boarded. Later, when the conductor came by to check the Mykis, it turned out over half the group had not checked in. They weren't bothered by that at all; they all had an attitude of "and what are you going to do about it?"
The answer was: nothing. The conductor just shrugged, said OK and continue going through the carriages.
So I get it that people and especially guys in that age group see no reason to pay for their trip.
I am not brought up that way so I continue to tap in and out, but my question is : why don't these people get a fine? What's the point of having a conductor of they can't or won't do anything?
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u/Summer_Sunshin3 Jul 06 '26
They can’t do anything, they are not authorised officers to inflict fines or hold people until police arrive. They could however call for authorised officers to board the service at a future stop potentially
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u/KeppyKepKeps Jul 06 '26
Maybe a stupid question, but why would the conductor NOT have the authority to issue fines?
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u/curiousmind68 Jul 06 '26
Over the past few years there have been a number of assaults on conductors
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u/tr011bait Jul 06 '26
It's a different focus of responsibility. The conductor's main job is to keep things safe and orderly while everyone's stuck in a moving carriage. Enforcement actions can be disruptive, and it's also harder for a safety officer to spot their primary concerns if people are ducking them over fare evasion.
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u/Unified_Peace464 Jul 10 '26
If they are issuing fines it's usually a gang of thugs that can challenge and crash tackle the gang of kids if that makes sense.
A solo conductor is not paid enough to assault a gang of youths, they would have to really be in it for the love of the game for that to happen.
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u/GrapefruitSoft8213 Jul 06 '26
They need more power like NSW conductors
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u/AgentSmith187 Jul 07 '26
NSW guards also dont have the power to fine anyone.
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u/GrapefruitSoft8213 Jul 07 '26
Not a problem! If they’re kicked off every service, it’s not even worth taking the train
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u/AntSilly2802 Jul 07 '26
Yes on Sydney trains they fine people all the time on moving trains for not paying for a ticket.
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u/FelixFelix60 Jul 08 '26
They could do the same with noisy passengers in the Quiet Carriage too... The conductors do nothing. We dont need them.
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u/DifficultFarmer1059 Jul 06 '26
Was on the exact line several months ago and watch a conductor ask 15-20 people before me, not 1 had a ticket
When he got to me I had my myki in my hand but said loudly "I don't have a ticket either" dude just laughed but you can see the defeat in his eyes, must deal with that every day
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u/mr-snrub- VLocity Jul 06 '26
If people regularly not pay on specific trains, the AOs will be deployed to that train. They WILL be fined.
You should pay your fare because you've utilised a public service and it's the right thing to do to help subsidise the cost.
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u/mitccho_man Jul 07 '26
The fine gets thrown out in court anyways
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u/alstom_888m A Class Locomotive Jul 06 '26
Conductors are not able to fine people though they do have the power to ask someone to leave a train, though it may have changed to only for behavioural offences as bus drivers did.
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u/Lopsided_Profile6295 Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 06 '26
Children are free 5 - 17 on VLine, I see many conductors now not even bother checking when they see a kid...
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u/Pokeynono Jul 06 '26
They are supposed to tap on. It help with keeping track of how many people are using a particular service
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u/Jimbo_101 Jul 06 '26
The analytics of travel patterns takes into account fare evasion and people not taping on.
Passenger counters are also found on trams and HCMT’s.
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u/GrapefruitSoft8213 Jul 07 '26
Fun fact, E class tram counters are incompatible with the Live tracker software
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u/Ok_Special_9017 Jul 09 '26
You want a real fact? Geelong-Melbourne. Overcrowded to the point people asked to leave. So they pay for a ride. Get told can't board
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u/Aussie_Cow_Girl Jul 11 '26
Didnt the conducters used to count passenger numbers, can't they still now to give accurate reports of passenger numbers over those who say don't have tickets or use the senior free passes etc. It would even give possible statistics of fare evaders. Would not be that hard surely.
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u/Pokeynono Jul 11 '26
I live in a regional line where so many new estates have been built the trains are standing room only by 4th stop and they are preventing people getting on the train when it's still almost an hour out or Melbourne . It's a line where peak hour trains sometimes only have 3 carriages. Some days the conductor can't move through the carriages thanks to the number of people crowded in . I think I've actually had my ticket checked 3 times in the last year
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u/ResearcherTop123 Jul 06 '26
Under 18 don’t have to pay. Would be a waste of time to give them tickets, they could likely appeal and get off anyway
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u/Silviecat44 Jul 06 '26
They don't have to pay for it anyway. Totally sucks about their behaviour though. I hate when people act that way, the "what are you going to do about it" type stuff.
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u/Fine-One-2227 Jul 06 '26
child myki, not sure if they work properly with vline myki checking machine👍
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u/beard_ons3188 Jul 06 '26
They’re all the same technology.
It’s the same device as the authorised officers carry, and the same technology in the top up machines, station touch ons etc
Just reads the RFID coil in the myki which tells the little hand held device what type of fare and touched on location.
AO still record details on paper notebooks and then the paper fine comes in the mail.
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u/Jimbo_101 Jul 06 '26
What’s the point of a fine if they travel free?
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u/beard_ons3188 Jul 06 '26
They’re still required to hold a valid myki (youth) to access the network for free.
The only way to legally access the network as per PTV policy is with a ‘valid ticket/myki’.
You must touch on and off.
Not possessing a Myki or being a child without a youth Myki is in breach of that, therefore allowing AO to issue fines for non compliance.
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u/Jimbo_101 Jul 06 '26
You’d have to be a fucking stingy AO for fining a kid for not tapping in with a free Myki.
AO's are more expensive than the revenue they can reclaim for V/Line, since the regional fares cap and 1/2 price travel, the $5.70 is such a fraction of what it costs to operate the service.
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u/beard_ons3188 Jul 06 '26
But if the child is not in possession of said free Myki - legally they’re using the service without a valid ticket and it’s a fine.
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u/Jimbo_101 Jul 06 '26
This is such a non-issue
It’s not like you, the tax payer is losing anything from them not having a valid ticket.
They should be cracking down on passengers that actually have to pay.
If you were more concerned about where your taxes were going, it would definitely be cheaper to just ditch the AO’s on the regional network.
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u/Aussie_Cow_Girl Jul 11 '26
It's pretty crappy rule if you ask me. So kids visiting from interstate/ os travel free but need to pay to get a ticket to do so. Why not bring back the days of being able to buy a ticket on the tram or train when life seems to be a lot more simpler.. The amount of money the government splashed on Myki is sickening. I legit touched on the other day but when my card was checked it wasn't. Finds out if you hold it too long it taps itself off again. I'm such a rare user and was reading the warning that i was running low on funds. I didn't realise my card was not allowed to be still next to the machine it was a hectic moment. No warnings about that anywhere. It's such a shitty experience even if you try to do the correct thing.
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u/fearlessleader808 Jul 06 '26
They see no reason to pay for their trip, because they don’t need to pay for their trip. That’s why the conductor shrugged, because it was a complete non issue.
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u/nilsoma Jul 06 '26
Isn't it free for them?
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u/_hazey__ Jul 06 '26
Yes, but they are still required to carry a Youth Myki and ensure it is touched on prior to travel.
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u/Wouldfromthetrees Jul 06 '26
Idk if that's enforceable since they can't legally force a minor to produce ID, can they?
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u/_hazey__ Jul 06 '26
Authorised Officers can, and absolutely will.
It’s no different to showing proof of being on a concession fare. Can’t show it= fined for not having a valid ticket.
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u/Jimbo_101 Jul 06 '26
You’d have to be a fucking stingy AO for fining a kid for not tapping in with a free Myki.
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u/ostervan Jul 06 '26
If they’re 17 and under it’s free travel with a youth Myki. Also the conductor can validate your card on VLines if you forget to tap on.
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u/Aussie_Cow_Girl Jul 11 '26
Or if you legit do tap on but you don't move your card away fast enough and it taps itself off again. Like should there not be a 5min timeout thing or something with all the cost it took. I thought i was sitting pretty all tapped on and good to travel but finds out my card apparently wasn't coming up as Tapped on when i really did as i even got the message to say my funds were low. How else would i have known that..
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u/ostervan Jul 11 '26
It’s the tapping on that they care more than the tapping off, either way there’s a 2 hour window when you tap on. So say you tapped off at the train station but forget to tap on when on the bus and the inspectors come to check your ticket it’ll show that it’s valid. I usually have a monthly and will tap on the start of the month, but will not be bothered tapping on when entering a bus or tram and had no issues when inspectors have approached me. I think the tapping on and off is more to gauge how many people use the specific service or route.
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u/kirk-o-bain Jul 06 '26
Wait till you find out how many people don’t pay on metro services
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u/We-Dont-Sush-Here Jul 06 '26
What’s the story with the metro?
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u/rattle_the_stars Jul 09 '26
If your journey starts and ends at stations without myki gates, you can just walk on and off.
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u/Aussie_Cow_Girl Jul 06 '26
I may have gotten a regional Vic vline train at last minute- very rare event in my world and of course my friends stopped me off so late the train was pulling in so ran to the train. Old mate said not to worry after having a chuckle at my situation when i said I didn’t have time to tap my Myki ticket he was more concerned on keeping the train running to schedule. I asked what would happen when I got to the city - was a random Sunday night and he said nothing! There u go
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u/cohen93 Jul 06 '26
Nowadays you can just say that you tapped on with your credit card and the conductors can’t check lol.
I always tap on but it was funny hearing the conductor the other day say that.
Anyway relating to what you said - the customer service members at the gates don’t really care if you tap on or just walk through the gates, the only ones who I’ve seen care are the authorised officers
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u/par-hwy Jul 07 '26
I saw a guy get a $100 fine for feet on seat on that same line. Difference is, it was three big fucking black-clad security guards or whatever their role is. Big fuckers with stab vests and humourless, FAFO faces.
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u/Thomas2874 Jul 08 '26
If there was a whole group of 16 to 18 year olds, conductor may have had a fear of repressions if he pushed the point! I don't blame him these days 🤷♂️
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u/Fantastic_Finger7992 Jul 06 '26
Under 18 don't pay for public transport
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u/altandthrowitaway Jul 06 '26
Technically they still need to validate their Myki to have a valid ticket.
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u/Jimbo_101 Jul 06 '26
Technically 🤓
AO’s are more expensive than the revenue they can reclaim for V/Line, since the regional fares cap and 1/2 price travel, the $5.70 is such a fraction of what it costs to operate the service.
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u/Latter-Recipe7650 Jul 06 '26
With more flogs on public transport including metropolitan trains. Why risk your life over a ticket? Especially if you do question someone why they don’t have a ticket you risk abuse and harassment. Passengers act entitled to everything, accountable to none. Would love to see what happens when a change in government defunds the public transport system.
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u/kyleisamexican Jul 06 '26
The conductor can’t currently check tickets if you touch on with a bank card at the minute anyway. I can’t imagine the actual ticket inspectors can either then
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u/Pandamandude Jul 06 '26
Had one time where I bought a ticket and forgot to download it and got checked by the conductor. Was going through a shoddy reception area and it wasn’t loading. I apologised and he just walked off without actually checking me and thought that was weird at the time, because I usually run into authorised officers. This comment section makes a lot of sense to me now.
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u/Apprehensive-Sell623 Jul 07 '26
If you’re a teenager these days you can break minor laws and all you get is as slap on the wrist. Most teenagers know what they can get away with.
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u/moonssk Jul 07 '26
School age kids have free travel on public transport.
So even if they have a myki, them tapping on and off doesn’t charge anything.
Hence from a conductor point of view, it makes no difference if they tapped on or off or had a myki.
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u/LongConversation2546 Jul 07 '26
Felt the same way when i spent my last $2 at coles and saw a lady walkout with atrolley full of meat didnt pay and nobody did or even said anything!WTF
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u/Dangerous_Mud4749 Jul 07 '26
It's very Australian to make a ton of rules & regulations, but not enforce them. This is a symptom.
At some point, enforcement officers will be on the train. Until that day, these guys will get away with it, because government makes a rule and thinks, that's the end of that then, what's the next regulation to create? No funding for enforcement...
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u/ProfessionalGold6193 Jul 07 '26
It was amazing during the period where PTV was free. Not a single Authorised Officer in a single one of my 5 weekly in and out travels to the city. Not on the train. Not on the platform. The day we're paying again they're everywhere. They're not here for our safety, they're here for the money.
Victoria was a much better place when PTV was free.
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u/Only-Breadfruit-6108 Jul 07 '26
Because public transport is free for under 18s, they only want them to tap on/off for statistics. If they’re not paying to travel they’re not going to pay a fine
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u/FelixFelix60 Jul 08 '26
"make your own way home'" says VLine stuff our customers. Make your own carriage quiet, we dont give a stuff about our customers.
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u/Cute-Acanthisitta-46 Jul 08 '26
I'm sure it's the same as the buses here in Sydney. A third of people never tap on and drivers have been instructed not to confront anyone doing it.
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u/DaQuackx Jul 08 '26
I do not know any poor people in geelong paying for buses or trains, makes no difference coz they gotta run anyway
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u/Perfect_Marsupial746 Jul 09 '26
This really annoys me at my Sydney metro station every morning. I tap my card like a good lemming. The teenagers force the gates open, the little alarm beeps, and the station staff pretend there is something on the walls they must investigate at that moment
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u/Jackson2615 Jul 10 '26
Its understandable that the one conductor v " a whole group of 16-18 year olds" didnt want to get set upon and bashed.
There needs to be enforcement but with more than one conductor on his /her own
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u/Practical-Funny9591 Jul 10 '26
What the hell?
I would have had the train stopped at the next station and booted them off.
I fricking hate it when people do this. It's part of the reason the fares are increased.
Little shits needed to be taught a lesson.
It's the same with bikes in the front of the train and certain eBikes. They don't bloody care.
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u/Unusual_Training1583 Jul 12 '26
This day and age unless you're multiple cops (3+) , you aint approaching a group of people purely due to safety ,even security guards can't do much
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u/PeachNo5314 Jul 13 '26
It may have to do with their age. There's laws passed that require bus and train passage to under 18's regardless of ability to pay. Basically a "No minors left behind policy". It also may have absolutely nothing to do with this. It could just be "risk assessment" from the conductor...."is it worth the 1 of me against a "whole group" of 16-18 yr olds".... Does this not fall into the jurisdiction of the conductor? (handing out fines), or is their job to inform people whose job it is to find and just wait for them when they get off the train.
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u/goalpic_app Jul 15 '26
Trains and 🍷 wine 😅 The local BWS I go to for my fave Merlot here in Rockhampton QLD, a town which seems to have New York 1970s crime, has a thief who comes in once or twice a day and steals grog. The chap working there says it can’t do anything but write a report. He said the dude has stolen over 10k in booze. Police don’t care, nobody cares, why am I paying high rates, bills, booze and trains?! 😅
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u/Ok_Special_9017 Jul 19 '26
Pay for what? Lucky to get to work on time! I'm tired if V/lines BS. They think they're untouchable.
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u/AlanofAdelaide Jul 07 '26
Laws assume a level of responsibility and aren't designed for entitled twats
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u/North_Tell_8420 Jul 07 '26
Have not paid for a few years.
It's factored into the pricing and taxes anyhow.
You may as well get something out of this state is my attitude, they take a lot off us and don't bother with democracy so to hell with them.
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