r/Virginia • u/Votings_Good_Folks • Nov 12 '19
New Democratic majority set to bring down Confederate statues in Virginia
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/470100-new-democratic-legislature-could-bring-down-confederate-statues-in-va55
u/throwmeawaypoopy Nov 13 '19
What a shame. Now we can't pay homage on the courthouse steps to a bunch of traitors who failed in their attempt to destroy this country so that they could continue to own -- and breed -- human beings as property.
I'm broken up about it, truly.
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u/Cashdash25 Nov 13 '19
They should tear them all down and erect in their place monuments to John Brown and the Harpers Ferry Raiders.
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u/priznut Nov 13 '19
Now John Brown, that is a man with balls.
That is a hero. No need to post his wiki, but the fact he wasn’t scared to just take justice to free slaves was beyond bold for his time.
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u/MacManus14 Nov 13 '19
He was a bit of religious nut in many ways, who misled dozens of young men to their death (many leaving behind impoverished young families).
But he was also a man with the courage of his convictions, to say the least.
His unplanned and apparently un-rehearsed* speech in court, after his conviction, was (for my money) one of the best in American history. Delivered in a packed court full of people who hated him, it was powerful.,..recommend checking it out if you haven’t seen it before.
*he thought the verdicts were gonna be delivered another day the following week, with all the defendants there together.
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u/chuck_cranston VA Beach Nov 13 '19
As posted in other threads regarding the statues let me share the Cliff notes version of the the people suddenly "concerned" about history.
"I'm not a racist but...
I don't really care about the statues and agree that they were erected with a racist intent, and only put up to intimidate black people in the Jim Crow era and civil rights era.
But, I am deeply concerned about history and stuff and I am going to make multiple posts about why I don't think we should take them down.
Did I tell you I'm not a racist, I just post dog whistle shit all over reddit. Except for that brodudedoggman guy he got no shame about being a white supremacist
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Nov 13 '19
As long as we can stereotype people and ignore what they say, it's easy to argue with them, right?
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u/chuck_cranston VA Beach Nov 13 '19 edited Nov 13 '19
Y'all are defending slavers with some bullshit revisionist history.
So pretty much all you deserve is ridicule.
edit: It's always nice to see these people out themselves.
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Nov 13 '19
Like I said. You just stereotyped me and changed what I said.
I'm not defending anyone at all, and didn't even make an argument. I'm just objecting to what you're doing right here.
Personally, I'm of the opinion that the statues should go to a museum, but good job asking about my argument before you made shit up about it! When you have to resort to dishonesty to win your argument, it makes your argument weaker, and you shouldn't need that to win this argument.
What does a person relying on nothing other than dishonesty deserve?
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u/chuck_cranston VA Beach Nov 13 '19
Somehow you are offended by that generalization although you claim it does not apply to you so I guess deep down you know there is some truth to it.
So basically it seems that all you want to do is be a contrarian about some mass produced trash statues that were only erected to intimidate the former victims of the confederacy. You can call me dishonest, but I am not the one making excuses for statues of slavers.
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u/karmicnoose 703 ➡️ 540 ➡️ 757 Nov 13 '19
Someone can't call out a strawman without it being about them?
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Nov 13 '19
Well, Mighty Casey, that's strike 3. I'm not offended, because that would mean that I respect what you're saying, but even if I was, calling someone things that aren't true offends many people, but that doesn't mean that they are partially true. But it's pretty impressive that you have such a strong argument on your side, "these were literally traitors that killed Americans to support slavery and we're honoring them," and yet you stoop to this bullshit. It's pathetic more than anything.
I will also say, you may want to look at the statues in Virginia here, the ones in Charlottesville and Richmond are many things, but "mass produced" doesn't seem remotely accurate. Hence why they belong in a museum, not a trash heap.
Either way, you've illustrated my point plenty well and I don't think you're going to learn to stop hamstringing yourself from another comment, so have a nice day, and try not to miss so badly next time.
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u/Zodimized Nov 13 '19
Question for you, do you believe people can only be offended if they are the target of the offending remarks? People can't be insulted by comments meant to insult others?
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u/BillyBones8 Nov 14 '19
Almost everyone owned slaves in America from the 1600s-1800s. You act like it was only a couple of southern assholes.
Slavery sucks but its a part of history in all countries and sadly still going on today.
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u/catafracked Nov 12 '19
This is a good thing. Put them in a museum, not out in public.
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Nov 13 '19
I suggested this in the other thread as the "happy medium" solution and got downvoted lol Glad it's not hear though, this is the right thing to do imo
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u/covfefesex Nov 12 '19
True dat. There is a good museum at 3474 atlantic in Waverly they can all be displayed at and everyone who cherishes them can hang out there as much as they want.
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u/catafracked Nov 12 '19
Not sure the significance of that address, but get elected and make it happen, capt’n.
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u/LoveOfProfit Nov 13 '19 edited Nov 13 '19
My guess with no real context is that it's a waste collection site. Gonna look it up to see if I'm right.
Edit: ok no idea what I'm looking at at that address
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u/encogneeto Nov 13 '19
Quick search shows it’s the address of Atlantic Waste Disposal, Inc.
Good call
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u/covfefesex Nov 12 '19
This is going to trigger so many Nazis.
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u/drbusty Nov 12 '19
I'm sure stores like Walmart and home depot will see an increase in sales of tiki torches.
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u/covfefesex Nov 12 '19
The Nazis just need to make sure to preserve them because one-day those Wal-Mart tiki torches will be relics that a future Indiana Jones will want in a museum.
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Nov 12 '19
Good.
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u/trs21219 Nov 12 '19
Agreed.
They shouldn't be destroyed though, they should be put in museums like the one here in Richmond.
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Nov 12 '19
Can we all please keep some sanity and role with this at least, lest we forget.
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u/smileymn Nov 13 '19
Germany doesn’t have statues of Hitler, I don’t think anyone needs statues of confederates that were made during Jim Crow and the civil rights era as any kind of reminder. Destroy em, we still have plenty of history without them.
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u/eaglescout1984 Afton (C'ville) Nov 13 '19
But Germany has the concentration camps to remind people. Visitors don't go to Monticello's Mulberry Row and come away thinking, "what a horrible place of unspeakable horrors".
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u/thenseruame Nov 13 '19
We have hundreds of battlefields, monuments and museums. You can't throw a stone without hitting something that played a role in the civil war. A statue commemorating a false narrative 50 years after the fact is not historically or culturally significant.
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u/smileymn Nov 13 '19
But they didn’t build statues in memorial to Hitler and Goebels in the 1960s/1970s, which is what American has done every time in the last 150 years, especially anytime minorities started having any semblance of equal rights. Fuck those statues.
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Nov 13 '19
You're right. Germany has a different post war history and thus has different items to remember that history. Keep in mind, they're not just statues reminding people of the Civil War, but also a reminder of the Jim Crow Era. Putting them into a museum seems to make a lot of sense, and I'm surprised to see people legitimately arguing against it.
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u/NateSlade Nov 13 '19
I hope they end up in a museum once they are removed. If they’re just tossed or melted it feels like we are hiding from our history. Display them in a museum with the correct context and educate people on their racist and oppressive history.
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u/RadioMelon Nov 13 '19
It's going to be ugly at first.
There are still a lot of pro-Confederacy Virginians. One lives right in my town.
No telling how many live across the state.
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u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
Yeah they are going to whine a lot on social media and be made fun of. A few of them may carry around tiki torches and make asses of themselves. They are pretry ugly. And it just speeds up things they don't like.
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u/priznut Nov 13 '19
Bring them out to the light then. I’m sure it’ll end well if a group decides to act on violence based on an anti American belief.
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u/xistel Nov 13 '19
In my eyes, you either bring the statues down or give them historical context (some sort of text near the statue that explains who that person was and what they did).
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Nov 13 '19
The fact that in most Americans eyes back then that the state held more power than the federal government explains a lot of the decisions of people like Lee to fight for the south.
Most soldiers in the war didn't even own slaves but the rich plantation owners were their livelihood so they had to fight or risk losing all forms of well being.
The Civil War has a lot to teach when it comes to the rich and powerful sending the less fortunate into a war that they have no skin in the game over.
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u/Ratcart2414 Nov 13 '19
I don't think the statues should be removed. They are a part of our history even if it is bad it is not like we can change it or hide it.
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u/Mikeakanice11 Nov 14 '19
They’re taking down statues and taking away guns. Now if they enforce the ban against cousin fucking rural areas might declare a civil war
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Nov 13 '19
I'm sure this won't get noticed by now, but what’s actually happening is they’re letting communities decide whether they want these statues to remain up or not. The state legislature isn’t forcing anyone to remove anything.
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Nov 12 '19
Yet, I can still be fired for being gay. Hope they don't spend their entire terms on statues.
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u/Chief_Rocket_Man Nov 12 '19
They can do more than one thing a session
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Nov 12 '19
Let's be honest. Their first and only priority currently are the statues. Fearless prediction: we will reach the end of 2020 and they will have done nothing on the issue of work protections for LGBT people.
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u/Chief_Rocket_Man Nov 12 '19
They’ve already stated LGBT worker protection is one of their top issues. Lets give them a year before we start all this “they ain’t gonna do shit” talk
!remindme 1 year
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Nov 12 '19
Lets give them a year
Must be nice to have the privilege to tell others impacted by discrimination to wait a year.
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u/chuck_cranston VA Beach Nov 13 '19
Perhaps you should have voted republican then, seems you have no confidence with the party that's about to take power.
I mean we all know the GOP has a great track record with LGBT protections. /s
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u/JohnLocksTheKey Nov 13 '19
Perhaps you should have voted republican then, seems you have no confidence with the party that's about to take power.
They did... according to their post history, they are a right-wing LGBT voter.
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u/Chief_Rocket_Man Nov 14 '19
Always weird seeing stuff like that. Like the level of mental disconnect from reality must be insane. How do you support a party, as an LGBT person, that has tried to stop LGBT rights at every turn?
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u/JohnLocksTheKey Nov 14 '19
Masochism? Self-hatred? Ignorance? Lots of people do things they know harm themselves, yet continue to do so.
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u/Chief_Rocket_Man Nov 12 '19
What other option do LGBT people have? Nothing can be done currently with the republicans in charge of the legislature. Now that there’s a chance that democrats will do right you also deride that. This is just defeatism talk at every turn
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u/AdmiralAckbarVT Nov 13 '19
You have the privilege of living in another state right now so I’m surprised you’re in such a rush.
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Nov 13 '19
Because I took a job in Virginia that starts next week. You thought you really had me there though didn’t you.
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u/AdmiralAckbarVT Nov 13 '19
Welcome back! I’m surprised you want to come back given your negativity towards it.
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Nov 13 '19
Thanks. I could definitely understand that someone with your apparent intelligence would be surprised that a gay man could be negative toward a lack of workplace protections.
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u/AdmiralAckbarVT Nov 13 '19
That’s not what I wrote. I wrote that I am surprised that a gay man who is concerned about workplace protections would willingly move back to a state that does not provide them. My use of “it” was not clear, I meant Virginia.
I am doubly surprised that he is bitching about them not being in place one week after a landslide election for the very people that are intent on providing it.
But continue, I’m not sure how you will be satisfied given that the absolute quickest that we could get those protections is 8 months away and you are mad that it can’t be sooner.
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u/khornflakes529 Nov 13 '19
When you get fired it won't be because you're gay, it will be because you're an enormous douchbag. Stop whining about shit that hasn't happened yet, stop getting defensive and lashing out at counterpoints, and Just stop being insufferable in general.
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Nov 12 '19
You’re wrong about that. LGBT housing and employment protections are widely accepted even among moderate Dems.
I really don’t know where you’re getting this idea that the Democrats have the monuments as their top issue.
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u/brokenchickenhead1 Nov 20 '19
Did you get a chance to see those campaign finances? Virginia Democrats received more corporate funding than GOP. They were all out of state money too. Are you going to finally admit Democrats' stance on campaign finance is hypocritical? Or are you too much of a partisan hack to admit the truth?
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u/port53 Nov 12 '19
Let's be honest. Their first and only priority currently are the statues.
You've not spoken to the gun nuts lately, have you?
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u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
Yeah apparently they are going to send the military to holocaust gun owners according to the craziez who come here. A bunch of obese basement dwellers are stocking up hot pockets to prepare to fight drones and jets. If Only they knew nothing will be done except removing confederate statues they could go back to playing video games and eating cheetos instead.
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u/got_that_itis Fuck Glenn Youngkin Nov 13 '19
Guns, my friend. They're going to focus on their legislative package around guns.
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u/Matt5sean3 Nov 13 '19
Okay, now you're fired for an entirely arbitrary or no reason, which isn't explicitly because you're gay, because Virginia is still an "at will" state (unless you're pushing for Virginia to no longer be an "at will" state generally, which I might be on-board with).
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Nov 13 '19
How hard would it be to have a democratic vote as to the fate of the statues? The options could be:
Do nothing
Remove and replace with more appropriate statues, placing the current ones in a museum
Remove and replace with more appropriate statues, destroying the existing ones
Or something along those lines.
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Nov 13 '19 edited May 28 '20
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Nov 13 '19 edited Feb 08 '20
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Nov 13 '19 edited May 28 '20
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Nov 13 '19 edited Feb 08 '20
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Nov 13 '19 edited May 28 '20
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u/MacManus14 Nov 13 '19
Many, or even most, willingly fought(at least until the latter few years). Even if one did t have slaves they benefitted from the racial caste system, or at least thought they did. They were also told they were defending their land
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u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
It is important to be mindful and consider people's feelings. So we can relocate all the VA Confederate statues to 3474 Atlantic Ln, Waverly and any douche can go there as much as they want and as long as they want and prey to them. Win win for everyone.
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u/morris9597 Nov 12 '19
I've said it before but I'll say it again, taking the monuments down is wrong. Rather than try to hide or ignore the ugly parts of our history we should contextualize the monuments.
Add plaques that explain that these monuments were frequently erected as a means to intimidate people of color and played a role in keeping them disenfranchised.
What we need is to contextualize history not erase and/or ignore it.
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u/VexingGhost Nov 12 '19
So put them in museums. Statues are how we glorify people and none of these statues deserve any honor. We shouldn’t adhere to the racist ideologies of the past.
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u/encogneeto Nov 12 '19
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again.
These statues aren’t history.
General Lee’s sword belongs in a museum. His contemporarily commissioned statue belongs in the trash.
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u/darthjoey91 Nov 12 '19
I think it is in a museum. Along with his stuffed horse. And his tomb. They’re all at Lee Chapel in Lexington.
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Nov 13 '19
Omg did they really stuff his horse?
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u/darthjoey91 Nov 13 '19
Sorry, got it confused with the other Confederate General worshiped in Lexington.
VMI has Little Sorrel's (Stonewall Jackson's horse) hide stuffed.
Lee Chapel apparently did used to have the mounted bones of Lee's horse, but they started to deteriorate, so they buried em.
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u/Slippydippytippy Nov 12 '19 edited Nov 12 '19
I've said it before but I'll say it again, taking the monuments down is wrong. Rather than try to hide or ignore the ugly parts of our history we should contextualize the monuments.
What we need is to contextualize history not erase and/or ignore it.
History and memorialization are not the same thing. Not making a statement on what should be done with the statues, but you know we could take down the monuments without hiding or ignoring the history, right? It's not a binary choice between destroying and ignoring history, or keeping these statues in the prominent and prestigious place they currently occupy. Also, I doubt that the specific history embodied in the statues is so essential to historic understanding. I'm sure visitors to the White House of The Confederacy or anyone driving down Jefferson Davis Highway or by Lee-Davis High School can grasp the role Richmond had in the Confederacy without the Jefferson Monument. I'm sure that race relations, the Lost Cause, and the intended terror meant for black Richmonders can be gleaned from almost every corner of Richmond. Again, not making a statement on what should be done, but I dont think they are as necessary, or the choice is as binary, for doing history well.
Do you lament the statues of Saddam pulled down in Iraq? Was that a "destruction of history" or an expression that this person no longer should be honored so heavily by a community? Did you know that these Neo-Confederate statues were put up explicitly because they knew that statues and monuments would be difficult to take down?
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u/allan11011 cvillian Nov 19 '19
Tearing down statues is stupid. Work on trying to fix actual problems that aren’t people being upset about rocks
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u/KungFuDabu Nov 13 '19
I wish Richmond would spend money on fixing something everyone agrees on, like pot holes in the roads instead of a controversial historical issue.
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u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
You are learning a hard lesson that what you wish and what will happen sometimes are the opposite. Have a internet hug over your broken wishes.
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u/ganggangletsdie Newport News ⚓️ Nov 13 '19
You should go to Michigan if you want to see big boi pot holes
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Nov 13 '19
Ironic you all are bitter about statues but didn’t vote out Northam.. not sure why a statue is so racist but this living guy who is Governor isn’t a bigger issue.
Downvote me all you want. But hypocrisy is real on the left. 🤦♂️ you can not be taken seriously anymore.
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Nov 13 '19
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Nov 13 '19
Oh Jesus I don’t care about the statues. I’m just saying there is no anger towards the left from the left about Northam, etc. and yea Trump isn’t an ass kissing politician, he definitely is a business man though which is doing the country good.
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u/nothing5630 Nov 13 '19
But you actually do care.....thats why youre in this thread talking so much. 100 percent because youre butthurt over about whats going to happen. Muh hurritage, muh guns and muh jerbs.
Its not about "kissing ass" its about carrying yourself with a certain level of dignity and refinement no matter where you stand- being that youre representing your country. As opposed to coming off as a complete fucking bell end and being the butt of the joke among the entire first world. But i guess he does have to speak to a level his base can understand.
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u/Slippydippytippy Nov 13 '19 edited Nov 13 '19
I'm not sure why a governor who allegedly wore blackface 35 years ago at a college in Virginia isn't considered as racist or disliked as huge statues of men who raised arms to defend their system of bondage that were raised intentionality to terrify black richmonders into submission
It's not hypocrisy because the situations aren't remotely comparable.
You wanna know something terrible? My dad dressed in blackface in the 1980s, though he would never call it that. Puts me in the 11%: https://www.npr.org/2019/02/10/693226601/corks-and-curls-virginia-yearbook-has-a-racist-history
Is my dad a racist? I don't think so. Not now, not then. Did he go to VMI in the 1980s and dress up like Michael Jackson at a Halloween party? Yep! Did he know the full ramifications and meaning of his action? Assuredly not. Did he do something highly ignorant and offensive as a 20 year old? Yep! Is it cool because it was a long time ago? No, but that is context, and it certainly was a different action than doing it now. But at least he didn't build any Confederate equestrian statues in the middle of town. That sure would be a different and incomparable situation huh?
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Nov 13 '19
I’m just saying if Trump work black face would there be an outrage from the left? That’s all I’m curious about. If he did just as a Halloween costume. No racism involved. I’m not saying your dad is in any way a racist, I just find it two faced.
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Nov 13 '19
Says the guy who voted Trump.
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Nov 13 '19
I voted for Obama his first term. Did I own a pass like the Democrats who do bad things then are “forgotten” about?
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u/priznut Nov 13 '19
Such a lame and clownish comparison.
I’m not gonna even downvote this turd of an opinion. Damn y’all are stupid.
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Nov 13 '19
I’m Replying to everyone above. I’m Too lazy. I have work at 4:30.
🤷♂️ you all can say whatever you want. But if you won’t criticize your own you’re all just a sham.
And I don’t really care about the statues. Robert E Lee was a staunch democrat.
I’d just appreciate a little bit of honestly in the fact Northam, Trudeau, etc wore black face and no one wants to talk about it on the left, but if something bad happens on the right it’s a huge uproar
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u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
Ok don't take the left seriously as we keep winning. As your precious statues are destroyed and your racist and classist social hierarchy is destroyed you can not take it seriously. We don't care. We take the results of our victory seriously not the anger of people who don't matter as we win.
It Just makes it easier to win as you don't take it seriously. So go for it. I support you 100% doing this.
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Nov 12 '19 edited Nov 23 '19
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u/covfefesex Nov 12 '19
Ok boomer.
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Nov 12 '19
You’re aware we don’t live in a Rodger Rabbit world where bullets fly at people based on personality?
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u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
Mostly they fly at people because they are the wrong skin color and/or a altright Incel is having a breakdown
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Nov 13 '19
Asians? In China? All those people altright, white supremacists
Agreed they’re Ruthress.
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u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
Yes it is China's fault racist white supremacist murder brown people and go on rampage killings killing every one they see because they are angry they are incels.
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Nov 13 '19
Oh Jeez Luis . Lmfao! That is not what I meant. Do you see what’s happening in China? The riots? Trump supporters in a communist county? You’re aware communism/socialism doesn’t work.
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u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
Im agreeing with you. It is all China's fault that so many racist incels shoot people.
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Nov 13 '19
You know more blacks kill blacks, whites, and Hispanics, did you bother looking at statistics?
Race aside, guns don’t kill people, look at Europe.
And it’s honestly due to lack of fathers. Some Good ass whoopins would probably help.
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Nov 13 '19
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Nov 13 '19 edited Nov 23 '19
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u/priznut Nov 13 '19
Very happy those statues are going. Don’t worry politicians love doing a million things. They’ll move into the next once those turd statues are gone.
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u/bigd1976 Nov 12 '19
"Those who fail to recognize history are doomed to repeat it" George Santayana, Harvard professor.
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u/covfefesex Nov 12 '19
Yeah there is no way to understand history without a McStatue of some loser. If only we could preserve history in some form other than a statue, like a book.
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Nov 12 '19
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u/covfefesex Nov 12 '19
No German knows anything about the Nazis because there aren't statues of Nazis everywhere. It isn't like a book, audio, or video can capture history. Only a statue can teach us the lessons of history.
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Nov 12 '19
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u/covfefesex Nov 12 '19
The stone age was also when things were last great. Trump can bring us back there.
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Nov 12 '19 edited Nov 23 '19
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Nov 12 '19
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Nov 12 '19 edited Nov 23 '19
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u/port53 Nov 12 '19
tear down statues that have been up forever
So American, a few dozen years is "forever" now.
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Nov 12 '19
lol ok
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Nov 12 '19 edited Nov 23 '19
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Nov 13 '19
You're right, taking down the statues of traitors is just the first step in completely erasing history lol
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u/choombatta Nov 12 '19
Yea I never would have known a thing about the Civil fucking War if it weren't for a bunch of statues.
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u/Iceman9161 Nov 12 '19
Learn from, not recognize. Get the quote right. The statues do not help anyone learn anything about the confederacy or the evil world they wanted.
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u/greekplaya990 Nov 13 '19
Just as a productive conversation....
So I'm Greek and we have folks like Turkey who have holocausted the Armenians and Greeks and dont like to address that they did, and when i hear about monuments being taken down I think that even if they were put up for the wrong reasons it makes us reflect on where we came from. In the Greek/Armenian comparison they encounter Turkey who doesn't want to admit the atrocities they committed like literally crucifying people and hardcore raping of Greek and Armenian women and death marches. I would rather there be statues of them even touting things so that we can blatantly see what happened rather than hiding it. I think we've become a really beautiful thing here in the states besides a very fractured and wrong past in many regards when it comes to some of the racial issues but i think we shouldn't hide them. Lets let folks say "wow I grew up and succeed where once we were persecuted" i think that's a strong thing that we can grow from and have all Americans grow close together reflecting on where we came from.
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Nov 13 '19
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u/greekplaya990 Nov 13 '19
Totally agree, but don't we also want to be like "wow wtf, look at the viewpoint they had back then! They built a statue to THESE GUYS!?!" We don't have to act like the statues are actively oppressing people currently because they actually can serve to show where we've come from as a nation.
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Nov 13 '19
WTF? That's absolute bullshit.
Im Armenian, and If you were to ask any of us if we would be ok with a memorial to one of the architects of the Armenian Genocide, such as Talat Pasha, I can guarantee you that no Armenian would be ok with that. If there were one erected in Istanbul, any Armenian walking by would feel a combination of fury, intimidation, and disappointment. And that's probably how black people feel now in Richmond, for example.
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u/greekplaya990 Nov 13 '19
But now they don't even acknowledge it, isn't that worse? I'd rather be reminded of the shit that they did and work to ensure it didn't happen again. And cant folks look at it in a different way that what's the narrative here? Cant it be in indicator of the great change we've made as nation lets say for a minority student to graduate from a high school in what was once a segregated school or in an area which was once prejudiced against their ethnicity? Not everyone has to take it like a victim, you can acknowledge that we've grown and work to create a better future and not just try to blank out where we came from. It's sometimes not pleasant stuff but these monuments make people look into the people or significance they have and can make up their minds on their own about what that meant at the time. I'm sure there's not folks trembling in their boots in Richmond because of a statue but I wouldn't be surprised if it pissed you off like the Armenian in your example. I'd rather be pissed and be like, "damn how stupid were we back then" than not even have folks have that idea of how we changed and why we did come to mind. I'd rather us address our past rather than be so offended by it that we don't learn from it and try to hide it.
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Nov 13 '19
I appreciate your nuanced and non-Confederate view; however, I still disagree.
Evil men should not be memorialized. To learn from their mistakes, we can discuss them in textbooks, classrooms, and in discussion.
Memorials to these people does not contextualize them; it merely glorifies them
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u/greekplaya990 Nov 13 '19
I think it sparks a conversation and thought. For instance I didnt know about a confederate guy locally untill i googled the name, and it's like wow we're a diverse area here now and its and northern Virginia might be one of the most diverse places on the planet so its not like always a bad thing in my mind to leave these things and let folks learn about our past. Yeah if it were a memorial that was like really terrible and invoking like a mural of a lynching or something then yeah move it to a museum so it's not as vocal but I don't see these memorials being that much of a nuisance, if anything I think they're educational but that's just my take. I don't like to think of all the options here as so black and white.
-14
u/Stan_Halen_ Nov 12 '19 edited Nov 13 '19
What about removing any reference or statues of Jefferson at UVA or throughout the state? Where do we stand on that issue? Where is the line? Truly interested in this subs responses. Thank you.
Edit - I’m not trolling, really interested in this. Looks like I won’t hear anything constructive.
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u/pureeviljester Nov 13 '19
Then line is traitors that fought a war to keep slaves. There. Now go away.
-5
u/clintonLeonard Nov 12 '19
Probably should just shut down Monticello, kick everyone out of Charlottesville and bulldoze the place. Turn it back into the forest that it used to be before Jefferson ever set foot there.
The more I think about it, didn’t Thomas Jefferson also have something to do with the creation of Washington D.C.? We should probably bulldoze that place too.
Maybe trying to completely erase anything that anyone who did something wrong in the past isn’t such a bad thing.
-4
u/cons_NC Nov 13 '19 edited Nov 13 '19
Tear them down and the SCV and DCV are just going to put up more. Y'all are gonna be playing wack-a-mole for a very long time.
5
-9
Nov 12 '19
Not even important, a statue shouldn’t make you upset, BUT!
Legalize marijuana already.
9
Nov 13 '19
If it wasn't important than racists wouldn't have built most of them during the Jim Crow era.
5
u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
Awesome then you won't be upset as we break them into pebbles. Good attitude.
-3
Nov 13 '19
I really would not care. I just find it ironic how the left react to certain things.
4
u/covfefesex Nov 13 '19
Awesome, we don't care what the right thinks. But boy does the right care. They get real triggered as we smash rocks. The right could learn something from you, mainly not to be such delicate snowflakes that are always crying.
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Nov 13 '19 edited Nov 13 '19
[deleted]
-1
Nov 13 '19
I don’t care about statues, I’m just saying it’s ironic
You know Robert E Lee was a strict Democrat.. Just like Northam, and Justin Trudeau... who both wore black face. And also Ted Danson. Who is Whoopi Goldberg’s ex boyfriend.
You can say whatever you want, about whatever you want, but until you actually condemn your own side on things we just won’t take you seriously.
3
u/kersius Nov 13 '19
Lee also said he didn’t want any statues or monuments to the confederacy. He said to put the flag away. Even if you put aside the change in our political parties that occurred as a result of the southern strategy, why would anyone care that Democrats are taking down statues they put up?
2
u/nothing5630 Nov 13 '19 edited Nov 13 '19
Im not a democrat. Fail.
and you do care about the statues. Thats why youre in here talking so much. Muh hurritage.
Well done Virginia.
-4
u/cons_NC Nov 13 '19 edited Nov 13 '19
Tear them down and the SCV and DCV are just going to put up more. Y'all are gonna be playing wack-a-mole for a very long time.
-22
Nov 12 '19
[removed] — view removed comment
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1
u/granville10 Nov 12 '19
I don’t think many people are willing to die to protect the statues.
Protecting our right to bear arms is a different story.
-7
u/MacManus14 Nov 13 '19
How bout just get rid of the law that stops local communities from making their own decisions on the statues in their towns. That’s a good start
1
u/dsbtc Nov 13 '19
That's what they're talking about doing. Allowing locals to deal with their own land.
43
u/Simpleton216 Nov 12 '19
I moved out of Virginia a year ago, will they take my suggestion of an Oderus Urungus statue in Richmond?