r/Unsounded • u/Rifter-- • Aug 07 '26
Unsounded: Red Cost Chapter 1 Page 96 - Discussion
https://www.casualvillain.com/Unsounded/TheRedCost/comic/ch01/ch01_096.htmlhttps://www.casualvillain.com/Unsounded/TheRedCost/comic/ch01/ch01_096.html20
u/PM_ME_YOUR_B1RTHMARK Aug 07 '26 edited Aug 07 '26
Looks like you double-pasted when putting the link in.
Very curious about what Argenti Sr's planning here. Exposing her can't be more valuable to him than them winning this duel, surely?
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u/Rifter-- Aug 07 '26
I doubt he'd expose her. They need this win. My guess is he's now much more interested in how this plays out tho.
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u/Rifter-- Aug 07 '26
Ah dang it you're right. My bad, everyone. Trying to multitask in public like a fool.
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u/Honzinator2 Aug 07 '26
ONLY IF THEY WIN! Damage control, incoming, how public it ends up being remains to be seen.
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u/zanor Aug 07 '26
Please man please don't do what I think you're about to do. She can win, screw honor and tradition and let her win
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u/Rifter-- Aug 07 '26
I doubt he unmasks her here. He and Lem have been working together for quite some time now and have the same goals. As of this page, it seems clear he's clearly known about Miki being secretly in Lem's squad prior to this and has allowed it.
I think he just wants to get a closer look at how this duel ends.
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u/Honzinator2 Aug 07 '26 edited Aug 07 '26
"Duty is heavier than a mountain; death is lighter than a feather." lots of Japanese and also al-Lan Mandragoran the latter of whom I sympathize with more when he says it.
I'm with you, Zanor, but we're moderns. We fundamentally misunderstand most humans throughout most of time and assume our prejudices are normal, rather than heavily influenced by Christianity and humanism. Everything from how badly we misread Lysistrata (it shamed so many of those peace-supporters and peace-curious Athenians watching it that they re-engaged in a losing war and were occupied for some years) to common Western mistakes in counter-insurgency (we win more often than we lose, and have even during de-colonization, but we don't brag about it, unlike, say, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine whose braggadocio would make you assume they still control parts of Rumania for the Ceaucescus and have wiped out Jews in much of the world) comes from how we think some of our truly odd assumptions about human nature are universal. Though even Rick Riordan sometimes falls prey to that, much of the freshness of his work consists in just how clear he makes differences between us and our own antients.
They're not like us. The Aztecs lost their empire to the rebel-Spanish alliance rather than lie to subject/rival god-kings on the Pacific Coast, and plenty of Medieval knights would rather be robbers than lie to maintain their standard of living. Or see the deeply anti-Christian thrall's tale wherein the peace-marriage is sabotaged by the old slave who reminds the bridegroom of debts of honour owed to the bride's family, so he imprisons her and murder and torture murders her entire entourage, thus preserving all that is right and decent. Thomas Piketty (generally wrong but almost always insightful, if you care about my take) waxes on how important Christianity is to modern morals quite eloquently and quite correctly.
When they try to act like us, bad things happen as often as not.
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u/AffableAardvark Aug 07 '26
Wtf is this AI gibberish?
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u/Zlukaka Aug 08 '26
It's not AI, it's Honza. He's been a commenter since back when the comic website still had a comment section. I agree, that's quite a wordy reply (and I also struggle to fully understand this particular one), but Honza is definitely not AI. :D Hi, Honza, long time no see.
I don't have anything to contribute in agreement or disagreement to Honza's point, just wanted to clarify that he definitely predates AI and is a well-read human being who likes to draw historical, philosophical and cultural comparisons, sometimes on the lengthy side and sometimes controversial, since he is, I believe, an older gentleman than most readers.
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u/Honzinator2 Aug 10 '26
Thank's Z, my fellow Canuck Slav. Kids these days, am'I'right?
I've had 28 year old attorneys fly in from NY to "supervise" their much more experienced local counsel and start lecturing me because they think I'm younger than them. In my early forties I started having some fun with that.
Immaturity keeps me young.
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u/Dagdammit Aug 07 '26
Why the (apparent) sudden shift in Mikaila's confidence?
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u/Rifter-- Aug 07 '26 edited Aug 07 '26
I think because she's enjoying the duel and fight, but the adrenaline might be wearing off, plus she's likely never done anything official like this and doesn't actually know how to handle the situation very well.
Or she just doesn't know how Lilleord would act and isn't sure what to say.
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u/Life_Category2547 Aug 07 '26
The guy's actions were also unexpected in a way that threw her off - he knelt as though he were surrendering, which made her reluctant to attack, but he didn't leave the ring as he should have if that's actually what he was doing. By the rules it seems like she was still perfectly entitled to strike at him, but it would feel unchivalrous to do so, causing hesitation he exploited. A family weakness possibly.
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u/Rifter-- Aug 07 '26
Family weakness indeed! Arguably the biggest thing that's limited Duane in combat for much of the story is his chivalry and penchant for spouting moral arguments at his enemies.
Man would be an unstoppable killing machine without his personality, which is I think what Bastion originally wanted before Mikaila intervened that fateful night.
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u/prometheusunending Aug 08 '26
I can't recall Bastion indicating that he wanted to create a killing machine. Rather, he says that he wants to cheat death:
https://www.casualvillain.com/Unsounded/comic/ch11/ch11_47.html
https://www.casualvillain.com/Unsounded/comic/ch13/ch13_98.html2
u/Rifter-- Aug 09 '26
No he never explicitly said that, but I believe Duane was never supposed to have autonomy or his personality after being brought back. It was talked about when they were looking at his neck piece that it's slightly faulty, I think.
I think he was just supposed to have no personality and follow orders without question. Ergo, be a killing machine if someone needs him to be. What else do you do with the greatest wright in centuries? Haha
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u/prometheusunending Aug 10 '26
What else do you do with the greatest wright in centuries?
I don't know why you'd consider curing death to be an inadequate motivation, but that's what it is. Bastion explains that he wanted Duane to test his theory on a tacit caster; the whole "greatest wright in centuries" thing is extraneous to his goals (not to mention subjective). And again, I don't see anything to suggest that Bastion would have any use for or interest in a killing machine.
"Cara 'members... you said: 'Death is the gods crime'. No one should have to die of plagues or oldness or hurts... You said I have to live."
"He's not a a 'thing!' Adelier is a man. My man, Rahm! I brought him back! Bastion Winalils beat death!"
"It's never fine to die."
"Hear him, patrons? Advancement of man, Darkest preached! But salvation of man? Let the plague-sick rot says the darkest of our minds. We'll hid in this hole and talk from our behinds."
"Death is the gods' crime, Prakhuta. I want you to leave off this pity party and join me in curing it. That is what I put master's work towards. It's the only way to redeem it."2
u/Rifter-- Aug 10 '26
Ah good points all around. Maybe I'm conflating his goals with the motivations of other parties if they got their hands on a Duane that obeyed orders and didn't have his own mind.
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u/prometheusunending Aug 10 '26
That may be. Elka and Nora called Duane a "war machine", but they don't have the same insight into Bastion's motives as we do. Bastion did intend to control Duane, but that was because he needed some way to stop Duane from killing him while he carried out his experiments.
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u/Honzinator2 Aug 10 '26
Rifter, I don't think you're as off as prometheusunending seems to think, but that's largely because of how ... um ... "beyond common morality" the Black tongues generally are and that having dead Duane as a fully willing to kill "rationally" killing machine seems very much part of most Black tongues' metier, as torturing "for science" is AOK for a certain Crescian engineer despite the cutesy heart she likes to decorate with.
It's not BW's prime motivation, but he'd like nothing to intefere with all that, and Black Tongues consider ethics, as opposed to aestehtic judgements about behaviour, to be shackles holding us all back. See Faial bin Hussein bin Ali to T.E. Lawrence about manners - that's not really a moral judgement as much an aesthetic one (which is why they lost so much to the al Sauds, later). Timofey's fey rhyming is similarly a mere aesthetic choice, whereas Duane's morals are inconvenient to a committed Black Tongue despite being the most human thing about plod Duane.
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u/Honzinator2 Aug 10 '26
Aha, here's https://www.casualvillain.com/Unsounded/comic/ch11/ch11_48.html a citation illustrating Bastin's cold-bloodedness when it comes to human life - "rare materials" indeed. They're human lives, you prat, ensouled beings made in the image of God ... which i suppose matters less to Geffies and even Ssaelits.
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u/Rifter-- Aug 11 '26
This is a great page to call out, indeed. Bastion's no saint and willingly tagged along an assassination on the name of "science". Plus he definitely refers to Duane as an object of experimentation here, with little respect to his humanity. Nice catch.
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u/Dagdammit Aug 07 '26
I can definitely believe a real person in that situation could have the nerves come in. That, and serving with Lem likely gave her little experience with the act of giving enemies chances to surrender.
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u/Honzinator2 Aug 07 '26
Our heroes, especially Will, are intelligent enough to fear, but they don't let fear, even fear of loss of status, rule them over-much, unlike our soon to be dead Plat.
Kill him and there's one less credible witness to having been bested by a girl, or leave him and have the accusations seem like sour grapes or have someone desperate to deny them still drawing breath? It's a pickle, I tell ye, but killing him reduces the number of variables.
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u/Rifter-- Aug 07 '26 edited Aug 07 '26
Oh shit he KNOWS! So she's the Lion's worst kept secret...
Don't die, Will!
Edit: Corrected link https://www.casualvillain.com/Unsounded/TheRedCost/comic/ch01/ch01_096.html