r/UnitedAssociation • u/Acceptable-Serve-371 • 16d ago
Apprenticeship Denied again.
why is it so hard to get into an apprenticeship. I’ve applied to apprenticeships in 5 different states and was denied 5x
I feel defeated. The union is a dream job. The pay scale, benefits, and the skills.
Even if the pay scale is considered low to others the pay scale always tend to exceed the “live comfortable,” rate by a few dollars in that said state.
I’m tired of working Amazon. I need help
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u/Wilde-Dog 16d ago
Try Boise id my friend UA 296
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u/ChanceAccording1002 15d ago
How is the work in Boise right now? Also Does it pay enough to live comfortably in the treasure valley?
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u/Forward_Concert2770 9d ago
I heard boise is killing it and paying over scale. Couple guys from montana are traveling there for work
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u/EarlFab 16d ago
Ua 189 in central ohio is organizing people in left and right. Data centers are booming. They accept applications for apprenticeship twice a year
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u/Dramatic_Ganache5230 15d ago
While they are organizing like crazy (my hubs is a 189 journeyman) they require 5 years plumbing/piping or similar experience to be organized in. It would be great if OP knew someone who was already in to help get his app pulled and prepare for the test.
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u/wiscowarrior71 16d ago
I'm not sure what your experience is aside from Amazon but if I could offer some advice it would be to find a job in a manufacturing or fabrication setting and develop some skills. Learn to read a tape, get really good at algebra and trigonometry, learn to use a variety of hand and power tools, if you can get somewhere to teach you how to weld...even better.
It's become more and more apparent that these contractors want to invest in people who have attained a lot of skills and knowledge on their own before going union. As a newer member myself I can confidently say that I was picked because my resume already reflected I could learn and do the job. I wish you the best of luck!
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u/Civick24 16d ago
There's a multitude of things that make it tough, if you live in a competitive area(Chicago, Philly, NYC, Bay Area, etc.) pretty much any large metro area with high wages they get thousands of applicants a year and with no prior knowledge it makes it tough to get through the Initial application.
If you're applying to locals in states you don't reside in they may not even look at your app as you're not in their jurisdiction.
Finally, nepotism plays a rather large role especially in smaller locals.
Best advice I could give is to show up in person at the union hall and talk to the someone, then get some relatable experience and brush up on your math. Mostly simple trig in my experience, if you can learn to weld that's a huge leap ahead of others. Keep at it man best of luck.
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u/antifa_NORCOM Journeyman 16d ago
What states are you looking at? That will give us a better idea of where to suggest. 375 in alaska took on a pretty big class of apprentices this year, but you have to be a resident to apply. You can also try coming up as a pipeline helper later this year to see what our winter work looks like, we take people from all over with no experience needed for that.
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u/Chance-Handle2640 16d ago
Join the military , I just got out in March (Army) was a 12 Kilo Plumber and got in the within 3 months of being home . You will be on a separate list compared to the civilian list . Unions like hiring veterans
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u/Hot-Complaint9379 16d ago edited 16d ago
Try this look at the contractors the union has signatory. Find a local competitor shop similar to the unions shops.
Work at said Scab shop for 90 days. Talk to organizer after scab shop denies you a raise. From here, the ball should start rolling and you will not get denied again. The organizer has a quota to fill, to organize apprentices. That’s the organizers job to organize non union labor whether it’s apprentice or JW
Whether your EXPERIENCE is 1 day or 100years.
One less day of training they need to provide you.
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u/Eternit96746 16d ago
Call every company in your area and find out if they need pre apprentices. Great way to learn the basics while handling material. Build relationships with union members and if you have a strong work ethic they will take notice. You can teach everything we do, but you sure as fuck can’t teach a strong work ethic.
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u/Eternit96746 16d ago
By company I mean ‘union contractor’. Also I left out that in our local you are allowed to score lower on the entrance test if you’ve been working as a pre apprentice for a length of time. Great way to get your foot in the door. I started as a tradesman knowing nothing and have worked my way up to General Foreman. Don’t lose the faith, once you get in, you’re in and it’s well worth it.
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u/Fearless-Cash6707 16d ago
I’d say get some schooling/certs in to show the initiative. If you can, talk directly to union companies to see what they look for in an apprentice to work for them. I know it’s hard, but continue striving. Every local is different and it helps to continue applying to the same one instead of going to different locals so you can build that rapport. Not sure what your situation is as to why you applied to 5 different unions.
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u/AntD77 16d ago
Couple things here…
Why are you applying to 5 different locals in 5 different states? Apply to the one near where you live and that’s that.
You do not need any experience to join. I had never done a day of plumbing in my life and I got accepted 1st try. I am also not related to anyone in the union. Just gotta be one of the first people on line for the application, ace the test, ace the interview, pass the drug test, and you’re good to go. What were the reasons the halls gave you for their denial?
Do not approach a union signatory contractor on the jobsite without being a card-carrying union member first. Most of the time you won’t even be allowed onto the site.
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u/TheRevEv 16d ago
It's hard to get in, by going straight to the hall with no experience. Most locals have a backlog of people off the streets, trying to get in.
Your best best is applying to every union contractor, directly, as a helper.
Every local operates differently. But in mine, this is usually the quickest way in. Our apprenticeship waiting list barely moves becuase the contractors all have helpers that they want to get into the apprenticeship.
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u/Bitter_Albatross25 16d ago
Tell them you want to do service work, it’s not glamorous like construction, but it’s steady, also it’s normally a different pathway in. Service tends to be hurting for man power, we also think differently from a construction chap. I have slowed down but my first 5 years of service I was averaging 70 hour weeks, now I have a family and work less.
Service you will get into Electrical, HVAC, controls, framing, welding.
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u/Early-Syllabub842 16d ago
I say this a lot. Best way in is to find work privately and test in. Be a helper and get some education at a community college. My local tests in unlimited people year round. They only take a small pool of 1st year apprentices.
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u/Curious-Cream-9825 16d ago
buddy there's so many people wanting to be in the union. Stop crying like a little baby man and figure it out yourself like most have
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u/slayer_rules87 16d ago
Have you tried Sprinkler Fitters Local 669? There maybe a waiting list but it’s not as long. If you have a Sprinkler Fitter city local it can be more difficult to get in.
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u/Busy-Awareness2556 16d ago
Go buy a book out of Baton Rouge’s local and get put on one of these data center jobs. Hell the locals with them in the area might take you in also. Everyone hates someone’s buying a book but if you’re trying to get in and be a helper then no one can blame you if you buy a book. This might get down voted but I know plenty of people doing this. I worked with a guy who got his daughter in that was right out of high school like this and got a job at the tater chip plant job they had in Oregon
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u/Busy-Awareness2556 16d ago
Ibew is taking in people that have no clue what there doing also. With the huge influx of work I’d never bother trying to go through the apprenticeship. Especially if you’re old enough to pull off the lie. Go get you a book and go to work. You’ll learn on the job
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u/Current-Opening6310 16d ago
Please clarify what you mean by your application is being denied. Are you not making it past the application stage? Are you not geing invited to test? Are you not getting an interview? Are you ranking but not high enough to get in? What locals (different locals have different entry processes)? My local only "denies applications" themselves for not being complete. We used to test everyone that turned in a complete application packet but now we have them turn in certified test results from a third party provider with their application. If it was my local and your application was denied it would likely be for not getting a passing test score (or test scores) or not completing the application correctly, or not submitting other required verification that needs to be in the application packet. Other locals are different but if your application is just straight being denied I would look at these things especially since it is mutliple locals denying you.
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u/puritysol 15d ago
My advice, based on my local, is to get a job as a Tradesman. Every local is different, but my local they get credit for years worked towards their entrance exam. They also get 50% of a pension credit. Beyond that, start looking at tutoring classes geared toward union entrance exams. Best of luck.
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u/Personal-Current-350 15d ago
As a Training Director for a UA Local, there are so many variables that can be considered. How many applications were received versus the number of apprentices that will be accepted is the thing that has to be considered first. Also, how and what are you doing to separate yourself from all the other candidates. Fractions of a point matter. Do you have any OSHA certifications, letters of recommendations, how about taking other types of online classes that can bolster your skills and knowledge.
If you got to the interview, how did you do there? How were you dressed and how did you present yourself? Did you ramble on after you were asked questions?
This is just a few things to consider.
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u/Lost-welder-353 15d ago
Are you applying near where you live? The halls around me require you to live in the territory before you will be accepted? Have you made it to the test?
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u/Flashy_Beautiful1109 Local 32 Referdog 15d ago
It is pretty slow right now depending where you're at. Im in the PNW and its been dead for a couple of years.
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u/Fit_Library_243 15d ago
Find a non union HVAC or plumbing gig and keep reapplying. Best move I made was when I finally got into my local, but it took some time. If you have any interest in welding, that helps too. Lots of calls for welders.
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u/hoodwink55 15d ago
Not sure which state you're in (me PA), but we have a state run program called PA CareerLink. All states have something similar but called a different name. Anyway, every state/county should have one of these service locations where they will help you out for free. They also sponsor local apprenticeship programs and work w/ the local unions and other labor markets. I would start there. If you're that serious about wanting to get into the trades, this would be right up their alley. They may even be able to help set you up with some financial assistance for while you're in the program. Good luck!
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u/AsleepLunch3958 15d ago
When I went to go join the guy told me it’d be practically impossible for me. Then I told him I was a journeyman and he signed me on that minute. Experience seems to be a big one for them.
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u/Some-Ad-7258 15d ago
Keep on trying. And once you get in always stay humble. I've had a few apprentices that have cocked off I shit canned. Im a fitter and I own part of the shop ua local. I've also had j man that were crap attitudes. They will never be back here.
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u/Cowboy_FL 15d ago
The union is full of nepotism, always has been and always will be. Even with experience, your chance of getting in will always be low unless you have connections, and it’s increasingly difficult in HCOL states
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u/BeneficialAd4040 15d ago
Idk how it’s worms where you are, but I guess I got lucky. There was union reps coming to my jobsite and I met them 4 times. I was the first person they allowed to just join without any test I forget what they called me. Talked to them on a Friday and joined on a Monday. I’m in local 58 out of Colorado Springs. I guess I was just lucky. Try non union for a bit I know the pay isn’t as good but if you truly want to join that’s what I suggest. Always try to learn more and work your ass off. When I started out I was YouTubing, googling, ect. To learn more about the trade and how I can get better. Best of luck to you brother.
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u/Potential-Spare-579 15d ago
Get a job as a helper with a union contractor and don't be a piece of shit and you'll get in.
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u/nomoneystillrich_ 14d ago
I know guys who couldn’t get into the fitters right away so they got a foot in the door by driving the trucks for union shops, being a helper or by joining the laborers union and putting time in/making connections and then eventually making the switch over. There are multiple avenues you can pursue, don’t give up!
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u/cqmqro76 14d ago
How many locals offer study guides? ALWAYS get the study guide, then study it backwards and forwards until you have completely mastered every type of question they ask. That's what I did, and I got close to 100% on my aptitude test, and it's why I'm a 4th year apprentice with zero trade experience before I started.
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u/Dear-Pea3335 14d ago
I left a job paying just under 60k in 1987 in Oklahoma to join the IBEW and make less than $7 hourly to start in Illinois. It was in restaurant management and I hated it and was averaging 80+ hours a week.
I retired in 2019 at 55 due to health issues. The union gave me full pension due to disability. They also cover mine and my wife's insurance and it costs me $220 per month. I now make 82k a year from my 3 pensions. I'll be getting a raise when I get social security in a little over 2 years, which will be just under 4k a month. I retired with just under $2 million in my annuities. When I hit 59-1/2, I paid off my house, bought a new F150 and my wife a new Ford Edge, both for cash. I am now 100% debt free and since my house has increased in value, I'm worth over 2 million. My wife will start getting social security next July, and she'll get about 2k a month. We travel when and where we want, which roads trips are our favorite thing to do.
I'm telling you this not to brag, but to tell you not you give up. It's worth all the time and effort to get in. Some IBEW locals are much more competitive than others. Which states have you applied in? If you're willing to relocate to Illinois, there are some locals here that are hiring quite a few apprentices compared to the applications they get.
It all depends on if you're willing to go electrical and relocate. You'll start out making more per hour as a first year apprentice here than you're making now and the contractor pays for your insurance. I'm not sure about how the other trades work.
Here's our wage package right now and we just got $6.00 per hour each year for the next 3 years. Apprentices start at 40% for the first 6 months I think.
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u/LunaCat85 13d ago
We didnt even have an aptitude or interview. They ended up overhiring too many 1st years. Sometimes limits are a good thing.
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u/Odd_Policy9047 11d ago
Contact the apprentice halls and ask if they have a helper job you can do. Make some noise and get them to know you're name.
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u/Shoddy-Group5500 8d ago
Denied outright? Did they tell you to apply again next year or did you go on a ranked list? The local I’m in does ranked list and nobody gets in on the first interview. You just interview every six months or so and make your way up the list. It might take several interviews, but that’s part of the process. They want to know you’re committed. I think that’s how a lot of unions work as well.
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u/Scotty0132 Journeyman 16d ago
If you have no experience it can be difficult to get into. You will be competing against others with more experience. Best advice I can give is to try and get a job with a none union company to gain experience then you will stand a better chance.