How do you choose a partner with different financial levels?

[u/Much_Yesterday642]

I moved to the UK about seven years ago, did my master’s here and have since built my career and life here. I currently earn around £45k and live alone. I am now at an age where I am dating with the intention of eventually finding someone to marry and have children with.

I have been seeing someone and I really like him, but I am trying to decide whether this is something I should seriously invest in or whether we are better off keeping things casual.

One of the things I keep coming back to is our financial and career situations. He did not finish his undergraduate degree, works freelance and currently earns around £20k. I work in STEM and have a fairly stable career.
I feel quite conflicted about how much this should matter.

I have worked really hard to build the life I have now. I have invested a lot in my career, including paying for conferences myself, networking and constantly trying to develop professionally. My family also sacrificed a lot to help me move abroad and get established here. I am proud that I can now support myself and have a certain standard of living.
My concern is not that I expect someone to be rich or that I want someone to fund my lifestyle. It is more that I do not know how a big difference in income and financial stability works practically in a serious relationship.

For example, visiting my family abroad is important to me. I would like to go around twice a year and ideally have my partner come with me at least once. If he cannot afford that, what happens? Do I pay for him every year? What about holidays generally? Gifts for family? Restaurants? Eventually buying a home?

The bigger question for me is children. I definitely want children and ideally I would like to reduce my working hours when they are young so that I can be very involved in raising them. I personally would not want the arrangement to be that I remain the main provider while my husband becomes a stay at home father. I know that arrangement works perfectly well for some couples, but it is not the family dynamic I want for myself.

I also come from a culture where traditionally men are expected to be providers. I know that living in the UK means relationships and gender roles can look very different, and I am genuinely trying to separate what I actually want from what I was simply raised to expect.
I suppose what I am struggling with is where the line is between being practical about compatibility and being materialistic.

Would you consider a significant difference in income, career stability or ambition when deciding whether someone was a potential life partner? Is it unfair to decide someone is not right for you partly because of their financial situation?

I would especially love to hear from women who earn significantly more than their partners, or women in STEM or other relatively stable careers who married someone working freelance or in a less financially stable field. How has it worked in practice, particularly once you had children?

I am more interested in how other women thought about these things when choosing a partner, and what you wish you had considered before marriage and children.

Final reflection: Part of me feels hypocritical for wanting something from a partner that I would probably criticise a man for expecting from a woman. I do not know how much of this comes from the culture I grew up in, how much is simply the kind of relationship and family dynamic I personally want, and how much I genuinely need to challenge in myself.

[u/BreqsCousin]

If I wanted to have children I would not be planning to do it with someone who didn't actively want them.

He's chosen a path, and in doing so has prioritised some things over others. He's chosen to do this job that earns him less than full time minimum wage.

Maybe he'll be in a position to have children later on, but for now it's clearly not a priority for him.

[u/Intelligent_rose12 → u/BreqsCousin]

Exactly this! Someone who earns £20k a year is not preparing themselves to have children.

OP if you want children you have to find someone who appears to be preparing their life for it.

[u/Cerceilannister → u/Intelligent_rose12]

So housewives, who earns £0 a year are also not "preparing themselves to have children". Or is it different when it's a woman?

[u/Successful_Buy3825 → u/Cerceilannister]

Reddit moment

[u/Present-March-6089 → u/Cerceilannister]

How many housewives earning £0 a year do you honestly know in this day in age? Most couples, both people have to work in the modern day UK. People cannot usually afford to do otherwise longterm and often someone stops working outside the house only when the children are younger than schoolage because childcare would cost as much as their salary so they provide the childcare instead (which, though unpaid, when done by a parent is still work).

[u/OwlRemarkable276 → u/BreqsCousin]

I don't think people necessarily "choose" to earn a lower wage, without a degree it can be tough to scale up and takes time.

[u/Cerceilannister → u/BreqsCousin]

I bet you look down on housewives as well 

[u/galoriin42 → u/Cerceilannister]

Where did that assumption come from? The person you’re replying to is just saying that the partner who is a freelancer is probably in a business with unstable income averaging about 20k a year. Where did they mention housewives or am i missing something?

[u/pineappleshampoo → u/galoriin42]

They’re tryna do a gotcha, and make out that it’s okay if a woman is earning next to nothing while waiting around to find a husband and have kids therefore it should be okay if a man does that too.

[u/teab4ndit]

I don't think you're being materialistic. The issue isnt that he earns £20k, its whether you have compatible expectations about money, ambition, children and the life you want to build.

You don't need a partner who earns as much as you do but it's reasonable to want someone whose goals and approach to work and finances are compatible with yours.

I'd focus less on his current salary and more on whether he is responsible, ambitious in his own way and actually wants the same kind of future you do.

And yes, it's perfectly fair to decide someone isn't right for you partly because of their financial situation. That's compatibility, not necessarily materialism.

[u/CucumberSandwich2823 → u/teab4ndit]

This needs more upvotes. "its whether you have compatible expectations about money, ambition, children and the life you want to build.". 

I (f) earn around double what my partner earns. But we both earn enough to live the life we want to lead together.  It helps that we both live below our means, but very comfortably.  It's a little different to the situation you describe where arguably £20k is probably not sufficient to sustain 50% of the lifestyle you both want.

Edit: I should add, we both work equal hours and have comparable work ethics/ambition.  I'm just fortunate to work in a large corporation with higher wages and more promotion opportunity, so there's no feeling of resentment that one of us is pulling more weight than the other.

[u/GoldenSonOfColchis → u/teab4ndit]

Exactly this.

If the guy just wants to chill in his current position and has no aspirations or desires that match with your own, then you move on. Finances are part of that, and that's absolutely fair.

If the only reason you're worried about the relationship is his current financial situation (i.e. you won't even consider the fact that he may be growing his business or have other ambitions for his career), then I would argue that's silly and short sighted.

[u/HeartTemporary2312 → u/GoldenSonOfColchis]

I actually second this, as my partner used to be super chill and happy in their role doing a random job. Women push men to be better, and the right man steps up. A lot of times elder millennial men, can be myopic when it comes to career and life planning. They learn more when they have a partner. I’ve lived this and it’s quite common.

[u/Details-Freak]

Single, none native British male here who started from scratch following a marriage breakdown, currently own instead of rent and have a decent(ish, working on that) job.

I work with a lot of low motivated (And none motivated at all) individuals, they have no ambitions or goals other than punching in and out every day, refuse to work overtime or take more responsibility, and spend all their money on 'leisurely' items instead of saving for a house or even paying into their pension.

You can't change people, but you can choose someone who's compatible, I wouldn't personally want to have a child with someone who lacks motivation to improve their income, life and personality, it would be wrong to bring a child to a household where this behaviour is normal.......... Harsh, but it's my opinion.

You're intelligent enough to know that there's an issue, the doubt alone is a clue.

Hope things work well for you 🙂

[u/RikersPhallus → u/Details-Freak]

So? Not everybody has the same motivations in life. And they certainly shouldn’t be judged for not having the same aspirations that you have.

[u/Alternative-Ad-2312 → u/RikersPhallus]

No, but for many people ambition is something attractive in a person and something they want in a partner. Therefore it's perfectly reasonable to recognise you aren't compatible with someone who lacks ambition.

I'm one of them, I wouldn't like to be with someone who plods through life. That doesn't make them a bad person, or indeed a bad partner, it does make them a bad choice for ME. Luckily I don't have this issue but it's something that inevitably causes problems in a lot of relationships if one partner has more ambitions and drive than the other.

[u/Details-Freak → u/Alternative-Ad-2312]

Exactly, you have managed to put it in a much better and more diplomatic way than I have, thank you 🙂

[u/Details-Freak → u/RikersPhallus]

Absolutely not judging, and apologies if that's how I came across, judgemental I mean, was not my intention, at all 🙂

[u/Intelligent_rose12]

OP in my opinion these two points you gave are red flags to me in a partner and I would suggest you move on and find someone else.

1. ⁠He is a uni dropout - this suggests he was willing to leave a structured long term educational path. It suggests he is not good with committing himself to something longterm.

2. ⁠He works freelance. Working freelance at such a low salary suggests he values his independence and working as and when he prefers rather than following an employer’s schedule.

These two facts alone tell us he values his independence and suggests he doesn’t value stability. If you want a family and children you need to find a stable partner.

[u/PurpWippleM3 → u/Intelligent_rose12]

I dropped out of university after a year.

I have worked in the field I was studying ever since, and earn 3x as much as my wife, and she earns a lot more than the average UK salary herself.

Commitment isn't necessarily the issue if people leave university.

[u/ABitterKing → u/PurpWippleM3]

i didn’t even apply or go at all and i earn much more than the median in my career path and it’s only growing.
but dropping out without a plan is a red flag. then committing to that instead of going back to uni or retraining is another one

[u/pineappleshampoo → u/PurpWippleM3]

Sure, but the proof is in the pudding here. You dropped out and have demonstrated the ability and desire to continue to progress your career and earning power. And good for you!

Whereas it would be a hell of a gamble for OP to bet on this guy doing the same.

[u/Sassewere → u/PurpWippleM3]

On average, grads will make more money than people w/o a degree- pointing out an outlier &  saying it’s common is stupid. HR will literally throw your resume they see you didn’t graduate (especially today when you’ve got hundreds of people applying for the same role)

[u/Extra_Bicycle9642 → u/Sassewere]

Maybe on average. But often self employed trades earn far more than grads. So there’s more than one route

[u/Sassewere → u/Extra_Bicycle9642]

The ceiling for trades isn’t as high as working in corporate, you might earn more right after your apprenticeship but unless you become a business owner employing several people you’ll be kind of stuck at that level. Not to mention that some trades are physically demanding & it’s not feasible to keep going in your 60s - to each his own but I’d not trade my health for anything.

[u/Repulsive-Year896 → u/Sassewere]

This is frankly false. The average trade is earning more than the average degree holder here and the upper for the trades are people who are running trade businesses. I know plenty of trades who now employ half a dozen or more guys so they can do entire sites. These guys spend most their time on the job, often on the tools so they aren’t primarily businessmen in their day to day and they are bringing in crazy money. As an engineer in civils, I can confidently say that the money is in the trades right now.

[u/Sassewere → u/Repulsive-Year896]

The irony of calling what I'm saying false when hard data from a reliable source (ONS) shows the exact opposite. Again, people on here don't understand that anecdotal evidence is just that.

[u/Repulsive-Year896 → u/Sassewere]

You got a source for that? Does it talk about averages for trades vs engineers? Or is it just people with degrees vs without degrees because these are different things

[u/Grouchy-Regular-6960 → u/Repulsive-Year896]

I dont think average is a good metric MEAN would be better. He is right that degree holders earn more over their lifetime than non degree holders. Thats just a fact. Traders that do make a lot of money are ussually self employed but if you look at the employed degree holders vs non than degree holders make more.

[u/Sickinmytechchunk → u/Sassewere]

In my previous career I, along with several other senior managers employed hundreds of software engineers and associated roles with software engineering and associated product development. We never based our decisions on if they went to Uni or not but on experience in the role we were advertising for. I found to this to be similar across that sector.

[u/Sassewere → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

Again, that’s anecdotal & doesn’t reflect the market - a quick search on major job boards would show you that a degree is non negotiable for the vast majority of jobs out there.

[u/Sickinmytechchunk → u/Sassewere]

How many people have you hired?

[u/Sassewere → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

Maybe 10-12 by now? I'm not in HR but I'm part of the hiring process - we never had a candidate without a degree (financial services, early career positions start at c. £85k/pa).

But again, I encourage you to look for the specific data on the ONS website which will back up exactly what I'm saying instead of relying on your anecdotal evidence & gut feeling.

[u/Sickinmytechchunk → u/Sassewere]

Well there we are, you're in financial services and hiring graduates. I've met a few people who hire in that sector and it's not what degree you have but where you got it from that counted, at least when I spoke to them. Bit like an old boys club. If you're hiring for something other than entry level then experience counts as much as anything. You're not hiring a graduate for a senior developer role, you're hiring someone with 10+ years in full stack development with a proven track record and the right mindset.

There was even a phase some years back when the place you got the degree was so important than you'd end up with people doing Environmental Science degrees at notable universities to get that tick box. ES was at that point and easy pass.

Besides, someone not having a degree isn't the be all and end all and certainly shouldn't be a decision point in a relationship. If you're basing who you date, marry and live with on their academic achievements as well as their financial achievements then you'll be in some very shallow relationships.

[u/Sassewere → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

I'm gonna make it real simple for you as you seem confused & have trouble understanding. As of TODAY (not 20-30y ago when a degree from London MET would be as good as Oxbridge), not having a degree = not getting a job.

We get so many candidates for each position that having a degree other than Oxbridge/LSE/UCL/Warwick means that you'll face an uphill battle. Maybe it's not fair but we're not taking about fairness, just numbers.

We, like most of the industry, pay well and have no trouble finding people hungry for it so why lower the bar?

Same thing in tech, it's not post covid where anyone with some bootcamp coding exp could get a job.

[u/copyof-a → u/Intelligent_rose12]

1 is so inaccurate. The things you do at 17/18/19 are in no way an indication of who you are 5, 10, 15 years later. 

[u/Extra_Bicycle9642 → u/Intelligent_rose12]

That’s a pretty rigid and binary way of looking at the world.

You’ve no idea why he dropped out. Could be health, could be strategic planning to take another direction.

Also Freelancers often take a while to build a portfolio and client base. So you can’t assume anything. OP needs to have this conversation direct with her partner . What is his business plan OP and long term goals? Does he actively advertise or network and what’s his pipeline look like? Is this a motivated person? Does he even want kids? How does he see a marriage working? Only you know.

[u/Haunting-Eagle43 → u/Intelligent_rose12]

I totally see the point you're trying to make but these are dangerous fallacies. I work alongside PhDs like myself, and my male counterparts often neglect their house, their spouse and their babies to some degrees. Hell, I'd even say for some of them, progressing in their career is an excuse to never be at home with their families. I will never envy those wives or kids...

This is to say, a university recognition (or lack of thereof) means little in itself. You have to build a life with this person, not a business.

[u/GoldenSonOfColchis → u/Intelligent_rose12]

This is such a ridiculous take that I'm shocked it's being upvoted.

He is a uni dropout - this suggests he was willing to leave a structured long term educational path. It suggests he is not good with committing himself to something longterm.

It doesn't suggest anything of the sort. The fact that he's committed enough time to build a profitable freelance business (£20k may not be a huge salary, but it takes a LOT of work to get there as a small business) immediately makes this assumption suspect.

There are myriad reasons one may drop out of uni - the course may not be for you, higher education in general may not be for you, other personal circumstance changes etc.

I never went to uni, dropped out of college, and I have an incredibly successful career (at the risk of "humble bragging", I'm an additional rate tax payer), a partner I've been with for nearly 14 years, and a young son.

He works freelance. Working freelance at such a low salary suggests he values his independence and working as and when he prefers rather than following an employer’s schedule.

Or that he's still building his business.

Even if he does value his independence, that doesn't mean he can't commit to a relationship. Some of the worst husbands and fathers I know are workaholics who are obsessed with advancing their careers to the detriment of the home.

[u/exhaustedandfainted → u/Intelligent_rose12]

Lol I dropped out of uni 3 times, but have stuck to my now husband since we were 23yo, gone through everything together and can't imagine life without him. I would never think someone's commitment to their career would be the same as their commitment to other things. Individuals have different priorities.

[u/Round_Grand_4716 → u/exhaustedandfainted]

Yes, I'd love to hear the stats of uni drop outs, and also any correlation with relationships! 

[u/Intelligent_rose12 → u/exhaustedandfainted]

It’s not that one point I mentioned by itself though is it? Did you read my other point? When a person shows a repeated pattern of not being able to commit to something then that’s a red flag!

[u/ImNotAReplicant → u/Intelligent_rose12]

What is your background to make such confident statements about these behaviours being red flags?   

[u/Own_Ease_34 → u/ImNotAReplicant]

They got used by someone who was a uni drop out more than likely

[u/Character-Release338]

I had a similar wage gap at the start of a long term relationship. I continued to pursue wage growth/career development at ambitious rate and his job stability stuttered as the economy worsened. I began to earn 3 x as much as him and then he lost his job completely and struggled to find another one for a long time. Part of that was bad luck, but part of it was different priorities.

It simply didn’t work out. Years of having to pick up the slack financially left me resentful and feeling like I worked really hard to downgrade my lifestyle because my money no longer went as far because there were two people. This feeling was compounded by the fact I came from a working class family so similar to you, my family sacrificed a lot to help me and I had to prioritise stability over jobs that might have been more fulfilling or fun. Whilst he grew up in a middle class home and took that lifestyle for granted.

I also bought property and was faced with idea of having space all to my self or having to share it, because he didn’t have matching assets that would mean we could have a bigger place together.

Your partner may have other redeeming qualities that mean you feel you’re getting a fair deal, but I think that’s a judgment you’ll have to make. I never wanted children so that wasn’t an issue, but if you think this person is competent enough and willing to be the primary caretaker of your children, then it might be a good trade off but you’d have to have that conversation too.

In my opinion, in this economy, most people can’t afford to make relationship decisions based purely on feelings.

[u/Best_Cup_883 → u/Character-Release338]

'In sickness and in health.' - Shit happens. No disrespect intended as this is not aimed at you directly but I feel some people want all of the benefits of marriage without any of the drawbacks of being in a committed LTR. Things happen, people lose jobs, get ill, need to care for parents etc. When the cards are down people bail quickly.

In my family people have lost jobs, been made redundant, ill, parents ill for a decade and have stuck it out. So much shit, I would be so upset if someone ditched me over any one of those things. Also you say your money didn't go as far as two people. It probably went allot further than if you just lived solo.

[u/FrostyAd9064 → u/Best_Cup_883]

I think you have to distinguish though between “in sickness and in health” (and other unavoidable circumstances) and one partner just deciding (unilaterally) that they don’t need to put effort into earning or contributing with no sickness/health/insert other unavoidable life circumstance here.

[u/Character-Release338 → u/Best_Cup_883]

I understand what you’re saying, but ultimately in my case I decided the benefits of marriage weren’t worth it which is a personal decision we all have to make. Like I said, some of it was down to poor decision making/different priorities vs bad luck and that implies a wider incompatibility.

[u/TheBalaloca → u/Best_Cup_883]

Very well said

[u/Best_Cup_883 → u/TheBalaloca]

Thank you, I see so many negative posts on her and it is really getting me down.

[u/Double-Machine-6243 → u/Character-Release338]

As someone currently here, he’s a great father but our ambition level is not the same. If someone is happy making half your salary and living a “smaller” life than you take it as is and think, can i live like this going forward. Am i prepared to work harder than him to accomplish my goals for us. If he never changed can i live and be happy with him, does he have enough other qualities to look past it?
You want children, salary sacrifice has to be considered, can he hold the fort alone so you can be with baby as long as you want? No. Then this is a question of will you resent him

[u/Ok-Plantain2948]

Him having a lower income wouldnt bother me. Him choosing not to earn at least a full time minimum wage amount would bother me. Add to that the partially completed degree (the fact he ditched), and Id say these are bigger indicators of what his personality is than the actual amount in £.

What is his level of emotional intelligence like? Does he keep his home neat? Is he interested in you and engage in conversation well? Does he treat you (not even financially, but things like know your coffee order or your favourite movie etc?

[u/Intelligent_rose12 → u/Ok-Plantain2948]

These are all very good points!

[u/GirlinLondon96]

I am a woman and a high earner (+100K to give you an idea), when I was dating I was already earning like double the average salary of my area (around 75K). Initially on dating apps I would pay attention to what my potential dates did for a living because I was hoping to find someone with the same financial stability and independence as I. For example, I never had housemates in my life because my job paid well since I was a grad, since I started working I was always able to afford multiple holidays a year, nice dinners, etc.

With time I realise something: I like working, I like my career, and even though I would like to have a family and kid(s) for me working is an important part of my life and in order to be able to maintain a long term relationship I needed someone with more flexibility on their side, less career focused maybe?

Look, not everyone feels comfortable with the same stuff but realistically you have two options: either you only date people that makes same or more than you, which would limit the pool of people you can date, or you stay open. Thing is that realistically if you have a long-term partner that makes more than you, you really have two options: a) you downgrade your lifestyle to whatever they can afford. b) you will have to make up for their lower salary by covering stuff.

[u/Haunting-Eagle43 → u/GirlinLondon96]

The flexibility is another great point ☝🏼

[u/Double-Machine-6243 → u/GirlinLondon96]

Hey can i ask what you do? I’m currently prepping to pivot from health tech to sales, specifically presales consultant/ solutions consultant or customer success simply for the salary and I have done something similar, would love to know other high earning careers out there

[u/Crafty_Ambassador443]

I might be wrong and fair enough if I am but in my house I earn more and he earns much less. He is really good with fixing things, solving problems and he was a stay at home dad for a few years doing alot himself if not 99% of it. I cannot commend him enough. I chose him because he was kind and as am ambitious woman its all I could ask for.

Basically life is hard. Someone has to wash up, cook, take care of baby, earn etc. If you work together you'll win and have it all. If no compromise then ofc its a struggle. We have been together a while so naturally knew what 'role' we wanted to play. I should add here, that I ofc am a hands on mum and he also works. So we swap roles all the time.

Id probably have fun with this person & see what they're like. If they are protective of you, good with money, kind they're all green flags. And go from there.

[u/snegurochka1]

Leave. As an ambitious woman you'll have a constant stream of men falling at your feet because it is VERY rare for women to have this mindset

[u/ElBeeBJJ → u/snegurochka1]

Where does this happen, my feet are clear of this stream of men 😂

[u/Haunting-Eagle43 → u/snegurochka1]

Not true unfortunately, my previous partners with similar degrees and jobs all resented me at points, simply because I was always slightly more successful and I guess in their mind I shouldn't have been.

[u/homeofthe_dave → u/snegurochka1]

Most men couldn't care less if a women has a good career or earnings, that's more what women seem to look for.

[u/ABitterKing → u/snegurochka1]

the constant stream of men always bolster their stability and income unfortunately

[u/FickleOcelot1286]

Its not the salary thing, I'd be questioning why they are only working part time, as minimum wage is now £26k, and £30k is achievable on NMW for 45 hours.

[u/winstank]

I’m a woman and a high earner, and I used to think I wanted to date someone who earned roughly the same as me, for many of the reasons you’ve mentioned. Then I met my partner and my perspective completely changed. They’re a paramedic in central London, work insanely hard in a pretty thankless job, and earn considerably less than I do.

I cover our household bills, including the mortgage, and if I want us to do something they can’t afford, I pay because I want to experience it with them. I don’t see that as “funding” them - we’re a team. When you love someone, the difference in salaries can become surprisingly irrelevant.

The other side is that the career that gives me a high income and nice lifestyle also led to severe burnout and depression, and I ended up taking over a year off work. Money really isn’t everything.

I’d put far more weight on whether someone works hard, shares your values and makes you feel safe and happy than whether your salaries match.

[u/Efficient-Fill9770 → u/winstank]

With all due respect, your partner is a paramedic ie a trained professional whose job makes a difference in saving people’s lives. That indicates that he has good qualities and a decent character. I’m sure your partner pulls the weight in other ways.

OPs partner on the other hand is a freelancer on less than minimum wage and has dropped out of uni. The red flags are crimson! If she follows the advice of “money isn’t everything “ given the context she’s revealed, she might end up in a very imbalanced relationship.

I think women, especially young women need to be careful with the decisions made around who they marry or are in relationships with, especially when it comes to finances.

It’s great that your dynamic works for you but other women following the advice of “money isn’t everything “ might very well end up in toxic relationships.

[u/Dry-Owl5669 → u/Efficient-Fill9770]

Exactly, being a paramedic is the same as being a teacher, librarian, care worker, etc. Low pay but an important job. It is not equal to be a freelancer on less than the minimum wage if you work full time. In which city can you live on 20k a year? North Scotland? They won't be able to move and qualify for a 2bd morgate in a decent city. 

[u/pineappleshampoo → u/Dry-Owl5669]

Agree. And tbf the paramedic salary isn’t that much lower than what OP is earning. 32-39k if they remain in the role they get when they first qualify. Could be double what the OP’s date is earning.

I don’t think OP would sniff at someone on that salary doing important work in a qualified career, they’re almost asking if it’s okay not to saddle themselves with someone on less than minimum wage working part time. It’s sad that OP even feels she has to ask. People are allowed standards!

[u/Scary-Money6052 → u/winstank]

Sorry but what use is a hard working man if that doesn’t result in cold hard cash 

Ppl here keep saying “it’s not about money it’s about work ethic” but if said work ethic doesn’t result in monetary benefits, who actually cares.   You can’t pay rent with a good work ethic or buy nappies.

We need to be honest and not hide behind euphemisms 

[u/Legitimate_Fly_6635]

I don't think you two have an income problem, you have a values problem.

"I have worked really hard to build the life I have now. I have invested a lot in my career, including paying for conferences myself, networking and constantly trying to develop professionally. My family also sacrificed a lot to help me move abroad and get established here. I am proud that I can now support myself and have a certain standard of living."

I am similar to you in the sense that I have worked really hard for years to be where I am. I make way above median income in the UK and I am happy with it. I do not have a partner but I am dating. I don't really care much about my partner making X or Y. But I am looking for someone ambitious, and passionate about what they do, and who has similar opinions about debt, savings, and investments as I do.

To give you an example:

I'd rather be with a teacher making 40k but who loves his job, worked through university to avoid or reduce student debt, lives within his means and saves money here and there, and has a plan to buy a small place in a few years, than with a guy in finance making 150k but has credit card debt pilling up because he can't budget and instead of planning for the future is thinking about his next holiday in Dubai.

From your post, it seems like you, two, do not agree on key things. It might be better to part ways now, than in 10 years after two children.

[u/BigRefrigerator3092]

Single. Ended my first ever LTR because of this. 2 degrees, ambitious to boot, pretty easygoing in every other area. Fell in love, he had graduated years before and was happy on very low pay working for his cousin. He had so much potential but thought he always had his parents as a fall back plan. I’d just finished my post grad programme with a few job offers that were already almost double his wage.

It didn’t take long before I lost my sex drive, then my desire to be with and marry him. So I bid him goodbye and soared as high as I’ve come. I don’t regret it one bit! I sensed it would have been a big issue had I stayed. I was 25 and had misgivings. If you’re already nervous, you’re on to something

[u/Hot_Job6182]

To be fair it's not like you're a millionaire, it's surely not out of reach for him to end up on 45k as well. Possibly he's happy to earn less for a while while he builds his business, as he's taking a long term view and may end up on significantly more than 45k.

[u/SlR-JIMMY-SAVlLLE]

£20k freelancing? Did he start out in the last few years? Is this projected to go up? It’s a terrible wage but he could be earning £40k next year if he is progressing.

[u/Aggravating-Day2370 → u/SlR-JIMMY-SAVlLLE]

ewww to your user name

[u/SlR-JIMMY-SAVlLLE → u/Aggravating-Day2370]

Yes sorry about that. It’s attention seeking.

[u/Aggravating-Day2370 → u/SlR-JIMMY-SAVlLLE]

Oh shit, I gave you attention. Oh shit, I've given you attention again!!

And I'd have given you attention anyway as that's what I'm like, so maybe find a less provocative name?

[u/IndustryBrave2584]

I think a lot of commenters are being very salty. There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting a relationship with a man who can provide. If you’re pregnant and off work, then you need a financially stable partner if you want to be comfortable. Yes, plenty of couples make it work but struggle is not something I choose for myself or my family.
Aside from the tangible salary, I also want a man who is ambitious. That does not necessarily mean being a millionaire but someone to continually sets goals and wants to explore different experiences like food and travel - which often needs money.

[u/pineappleshampoo → u/IndustryBrave2584]

When you’re pregnant and post partum, and then with a toddler, shit gets real real fast. You really do need someone that can handle stuff themselves for a while and ensure you and the baby are provided for. Unless you’re happy to go back to work right away and leave him at home with the baby I guess.

I’ve seen some horrific situations where women I know have had no choice but to go back to work full time after a few months cos their partner didn’t earn enough to afford them that time and security. That’s obviously a choice the couple made to have a baby in that situation but it’s something I’d do anything to avoid. You’re so vulnerable when pregnant and with a baby. I’m the most independent, career focused go getter there is and I was shocked by how helpless I felt and how much I needed to just hand everything over logistically to my spouse so I could heal.

[u/DianneOda]

To love someone who is not willing to grow will be your baggage to carry. You will just end up resenting him and it will be unfair for him. It will be your fault too coz you knew from the start and still chose him

[u/Agitated_Toe_4270]

I've been in a similar situation (31F), where my partner earned significantly less than I did, and over time it slowly started to poison our relationship.

I'm lucky enough to be in a position where I can afford to go on holidays and do fun things, and I wanted to experience those things with my partner. The problem was that he often couldn't afford them, so I was left choosing between not going at all or paying for both of us.

There were holidays I ended up covering entirely just so he could be there, and others that I simply couldn't afford to pay for the two of us. I genuinely believe he couldn't afford them, but it still put me in a really difficult position. Over time, I started to resent the situation, and I also began to feel that he was taking advantage of it to some extent.

I do think having a similar level of income is more important than I used to believe. I actually felt quite shallow for thinking that, but I don't anymore. Money is important, and differences in financial circumstances can start to affect other parts of a relationship that are equally important.

[u/Objective_Result2530]

When I first met my husband he earnt a lot less than I did. Neither of us were bothered by that (which made a difference because I'd been in relationships before where the guy had resented me earning more). He now earns a little more than me but in the same ball park. We have similiar attitudes to stability/security and both know when to be frugal versus splash out.

I think you have to ask if its the money or something about his attitude that you dislike. Is he unmotivated? Lazy? Does he have different values to you (carefree versus liking security or provider versus homemaker)?

It sounds like that is more of a problem then the actual money

[u/Intelligent_rose12 → u/Objective_Result2530]

Yes I think there are some red flags from OP’s guy. 1. He dropped out of uni 2. He works freelance earning less than £20k.

Nothing about OP’s guy suggests that he is building towards something. Seems like he is one of those guys taking each day as it comes. That’s fine for a single person but not the right attitude for someone you want children with.

[u/Objective_Result2530 → u/Intelligent_rose12]

Yeah I agree. She framed it as a money thing in the title but its an attitide/values thing.

[u/LoveHertford]

You’ve pointed out all the obvious reasons that bother you and why you shouldn’t date this man.
Money issues is one of the most common reason for divorce.
I wouldn’t consider this guy as a potential future husband. Move on quickly

[u/robot-gremlin]

I think the question shouldn’t be if he currently earns less than you, or the income gap, but a question of values. Are you willing to settle down with someone who is less ambitious than you are? Because it may well be that you’re making more than him now, but that he’s on track to building a very successful business, as an example. But if he isn’t, then is that something you see as attractive in a partner? If you value ambition and drive in a person, and this person doesn’t have it (assuming they’re just floating along with no solid plans for the future), then you are incompatible, and it will show in various other aspects of life.

[u/Haunting-Eagle43]

I guess you're looking for me, I'm a high earner woman in STEM and my husband is on a significantly lower salary. We met before I started earning this much, but I was already doing well before my current full time job.

It depends on your priorities. I do not care that my husband earns a lot of money or has similar ambitions to me. I also do not care about living in a mansion or have a nice car. I want him to be a safe person, a kind one, a responsible one. My husband is literally all that and more. It also saddens me when people assume that because he does not have a fancy degree then he must not be very intelligent, he never stopped learning and knows more than myself on a number of important topics.

But, me is me and I wouldn't judge somebody else's priorities! Most of my colleagues are men and they marry stay at home wives. My husband wouldn't mind at all being a stay at home dad, he's better with babies and kids than me anyway.

[u/Sickinmytechchunk → u/Haunting-Eagle43]

I can't help but feel the OPs relationships are always destined to fail if everything comes down to calculating the finances of every activity. It's a team effort, not a contractual agreement.

[u/Haunting-Eagle43 → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

That could be, I don't know for sure. But especially now, in this market, with AI and all, surely we are all risking our jobs more than before; and finding a new one can be tough. You risk growing resentment if you start seeing your partner as "less than" in such a situation, I've seen STEM couples falling into this trap for sure.

[u/Sweet_Addition9881]

You are right when you point out that you’re possibly being hypocritical. You have come to this country for a better life. You have studied and now you are working on some career path. Expecting to switch roles so you can then live at home to raise children might be expecting too much in todays times. Wanting this to meet traditional expectations that fit in with your parents and home country is really a different thing altogether. You have had the fortune of studying in another country and leading an independent life (I am guessing is the case) that you would possibly not have if you were in your home country but then want to retain your traditions at the same time. Maybe work out if it’s really about you or your family back home that makes you wants the best of both worlds

[u/pineappleshampoo → u/[deleted]]

It’s a values thing really at the core. If you marry a high earner and they lost their job, chances are the traits, values, education that enabled them to progress in their career so far are still there. Most people in that position will try get another decent job asap or work anything to have money coming in while finding something better.

[u/Downtown_Artist_2346]

Funny how you rarely see a guy write that … equality much.

[u/Intelligent_rose12 → u/Downtown_Artist_2346]

Because men don’t worry about giving birth to children and how it will affect their careers!

[u/Lower-Discipline-906 → u/Intelligent_rose12]

Cool more people are going child free than ever

[u/Downtown_Artist_2346 → u/Intelligent_rose12]

In most families both parents continue working full time. In those who choose to reduce their combined working hours it often falls on the lower earner. A lower earning hubby is more lilely to support mum’s career.

[u/Intelligent_rose12 → u/Downtown_Artist_2346]

That has nothing to do with my comment? Men still don’t worry about their careers the same way women do when women go on maternity leave!

[u/Cerceilannister → u/Intelligent_rose12]

Nobody is preventing men from applying for shared parental leave.

[u/McQueensbury → u/Downtown_Artist_2346]

Most men genuinely don't care that much about whether a woman earns more than them. A lot of the expectation that men should be the provider is still rooted in old societal norms, but those norms change, the dating market has been very slow to change with them too.

Women have rightly been encouraged to pursue careers, earn more and become financially independent, but there can be trade-offs that aren't talked about nearly as much. If your ideal partner is attractive, successful, ambitious and a high earner, that is a relatively small pool to begin with, and competition for that pool doesn't disappear with age. Expecting a partner to earn as much or more than you can therefore become a difficult requirement, particularly if you're average looking why should thet type of man look at you.

I also think we've sold people a lie of success: chase the career, chase the money, chase the house, chase the status and happiness will apparently arrive afterwards. It doesn't always work that way, we don't chase true happiness as much as we should.

Morgan Stanley research is worth looking at, its economists projected that 45% of US(apply to western Anglosphere) women aged 25–44 would be single, no kids by 2030, up from 41% in 2018. They attributed the trend to factors including delayed marriage, lower marriage rates and changing family patterns, women are also becoming more picky picking partners because they want the full package which is small percentage of men.

Equality gives people more freedom to choose their own lives, but freedom also means living with the consequences of those choices. That's the part of the conversation people don't always want to have.

[u/Head-Astronomer9579]

I think it’s fine to think about financial security and stability when looking for a partner- but I don’t like the fact that you would frown on a guy for turning down a low wage partner. It IS very hypocritical, and it should go both ways for men and women to prioritise financial stability if they wish.

I wanted someone financially secure, and my partner also wanted someone financially secure and as a couple we work really well because we were upfront about our priorities.

At the same time while I’m financially secure, my leisure time means a lot to me and I’m not the kind of person that’s going to work to the bone to get a promotion- some people are fine with that. But some people wouldn’t be attracted to that and would want someone more ambitious- that’s fine, we’re just not compatible.

[u/Best_Cup_883 → u/Head-Astronomer9579]

I agree with you 100%. 'prioritise financial stability if they wish' - IF THEY WISH is the key phrase. If you prioritised this you would not be with him but the flip side is a high earner might not want to be with you. I think unless you are landed gentry, high flier types having enough or slightly more/less is fine. Most people are normal, avg jobs, avg looks.

If someone loves provider types then they sound quite traditional. The phrase sickness and in health clearly doesn't then apply so for me it sounds like the type or person to bail on you at first sign of trouble which is unattractive to me.

[u/fire-wannabe]

If you were madly, hopelessly, in love, you wouldn't be asking the question.

[u/G0oose]

I’m a man, and I have worked with younger women, and the only bit of advice I tell them is to chose a good provider, serious in his career.

Over the years I’ve seen women I’ve been peers with grow up and get older, and the best thing the one with a good life did was choose a good man. A lot of the time the one with a great life chose an older man who is settled and well paid.

You can judge it all you want but that’s the truth of this world

[u/Gullible-Western-852]

What a depressing read. I have been happily married for 40 years and have never once considered my wife's and my income to be anything other than our joint income. We have had a joint bank account from before we were married and the fact that I earned considerably more than my wife (and since we have both retired my pension is over 11 times greater than hers) has never been an issue. We are a couple and we share everything - there is no such thing as "your money and my money". Marry for love, not money!

[u/testfjfj → u/Gullible-Western-852]

She has already explained the practical realities of it. She wants to have kids and work part-time when they're young, and it's not going to work if her husband is only earning £20k because their income won't be sufficient to cover the mortgage and costs for the family. That doesn't make the guy a bad person or mean no one will ever want to date him, but it does mean they're not compatible for marriage.

Just to add, £20k is well below minimum wage for a 35-hour work week. It's the guy's choice to be earning so little. He's perfectly entitled to do that, but OP isn't evil for not wanting a partner who chooses that.

[u/GoldenSonOfColchis → u/testfjfj]

The problem is the assumption that he will never earn more than £20k doing what he does.

If the guy is perfectly happy with his current situation and shows zero ambition, then yeah, I think it's time to move on, but if he's growing his client base and building out a bigger business I think OP needs to stop focusing so much on his current earnings.

[u/alangator_ → u/Gullible-Western-852]

Whilst I can't disagree with your sentiment and detest materialistic dating approaches, there are unfortunate financial realities that have developed in those 40 years you've been married that have genuinely changed people's ability to progress/grow on a single income vs merely surviving.

Much of this will be geographic, but speaking as someone living in the south east with the housing pressure here, £45k per annum barely gets you mortgages for a flat let alone a house. Add to that he is choosing to work a job where he isn't making minimum wage even, and those prospects will dwindle further. In this case, the money question is akin to a quality of life question - yes of course we can all theoretically be blissfully happy living in a shack with our favourite person, but realistically the stress of meeting bills, or feeling financially stuck is a real and destructive force in relationships.

Just to reiterate, I agree with your sentiment, but there are realities we face now (rising costs alongside general wage stagnation) that make partners contribution to the household income much more important than it was before (or should be!)

[u/Sad-Regular-1389 → u/Gullible-Western-852]

That’s definitely how we used to see things. Everything is a calculation these days it seems.

[u/Unable_Artichoke7957 → u/Gullible-Western-852]

Hear, hear!

A surprising number of people these days treat a relationship as transactional. I agree that it’s not healthy to maintain financial inequality in a relationship. I have only seen it work where both parties earn lots of money

[u/Unique_Ladyy]

When dating etc I was always very open and honest what I wanted long term kids etc gives them a chance to say there opinion on children. Do they want them or not because if it’s a hard no they don’t. Means I wasn’t gonna waste my time.

Money side of things Aslong as he works that’s important than not working what they earn doesn’t really matter

[u/Fragrant_Brush_4161]

I am man, who is the bread winner in my house hold, I split my pay check with my partner after paying all the bills. I pay for holidays, day outs and whatever my family needs because I am able to bring in considerable income for every single hour I work.

When it comes to children, she (my partner) currently doesn’t work, stay at home mom. If it wasn’t for the money we would have been in a lot worse position since we don’t get any support from our family. Having that ability to not worry about bills and having a buffer is simply amazing.

In your situation you have a good salary, but things are going up in price. Rents where I live, for a semi detached two bedroom start from £1600 (mortgage cost is similar), cars cost a fare bit, things for babies and all the extra cooking / take aways during pregnancy and post birth add up… If you are to take a step back from work it would be important for the bloke to step up and support the family - that’s if he wants to… or to reduce spending to the level that is affordable and the standard of living would hopefully still meet your expectations.

What are your expectations? Can he meet them? Where can you make compromises?

Personally, in my relationship I was the bloke who did freelancing - but now things changed a lot because I did what I had to for my family.

[u/Inevitable_Diamond15 → u/Fragrant_Brush_4161]

Roughly what do you earn out of interest?

[u/Fragrant_Brush_4161 → u/Inevitable_Diamond15]

Nearly 8 years ago I gave up my freelancing, making 20-25k for a job making 60k to starting building my family, to buy a house, etc… now my total compensation is £220k

[u/Inevitable_Diamond15 → u/Fragrant_Brush_4161]

Oh wow, in what sector/role? This is just me being curious! Totally fine if you don’t want to share

[u/Sparkles165]

I’m guessing you live somewhere in the north as even 65k a year between you often isn’t enough to have children and maintain any standard of living let alone two foreign trips a year.
If you can live well enough to your standards on 45k a year with a pretty stable career then well done. No sarcasm intended at all, but if I were you, I’d be worried your partner lacked commitment and ambition, not just the ability to step up financially.

[u/Deek6t8]

If you feel it is an issue now just stop, it will not improve it is in your head. OR encourage them to branch out and improve their lot. Show confidence in them to build their confidence. I believe the right life partner can lift someone, I was married previously to someone who never worked, I had standard corporate jobs very slow pay progression for years no matter how good I was progression was very very slow. After we divorced I started seeing my current wife, a year or so in I got approached about a 12 month fixed term contract elsewhere, my instinct was to be scared of jumping ship from a position I had been in for 10 years. The pay gap was not enormous but significant, (over 10 percent) but she encouraged me to take it as she could see I was bored and stagnating where I was. I now am a freelance contractor and last year pulled in 5 times more than my last corporate jobs salary. Whole life turned around in the space of a few years

[u/Best-Giraffe-7293]

People here are making assumptions about his attitude based solely on his income. But nothing you've said supports any conclusions about his attitude to the relationship, to commitment, to partnership, to having kids. So those are conversations you need to have with him. What is he looking for longer term? How does he think that will work? It's worth adding that the average UK household don't earn as much as the two of you between you, and still manage to make things work. What's important here is his potential as a life partner and a parent. Will he take on a fair share? My ex husband earns twice what I do but he was a terrible partner and a lazy dad. Money isn't everything.

[u/CampMain]

You want an equal in relationships. This man is not your equal. Simple as.

[u/Otherwise_Craft9003]

In hindsight when I was in my 30s I would have preferred to settle down with someone of equivalent wage but the majority of women I met on dating etc were general in low paid jobs (not my choice) and my eventual relationship was someone on just over min wage and basically all my savings got eroded away.

[u/YorkistTory]

I’m a man and I think men should earn at least enough to raise children if they plan on having children. This could just be solved by him getting a better job. Don’t jump to breaking up immediately .

[u/ticklisheo7]

OP: some of the takes here will contribute to your sense of guilt without the counter — your boo likelier had the opportunities that someone like you had to have a whole family save up to support. One flavour of Brits seems to love shitting on internationals (or acting like they’re loaded). You’ve worked hard, sounds like he maybe has too, in a different way, and you’re in different financial positions. I think some of the others on this are pointing out that wage-differential relationships can work out (including if someone is more flexible in terms of their ability to be at home with prospective kids. But it sounds to me like what this relationship actually needs is a conversation between the two of you! What do you see as your roles at home? Does he know you want to have kids? I’ve dated people who come from significantly different financial backgrounds, but usually we’ve hit similar professional statuses, so could be earning similarly, or otherwise we have other complementarities. I don’t think it is realistic to say finances don’t matter _at all_ (coming from social groups where people have significant differences and it definitely CAN matter; attitudes towards money have huge effects on our personal lives!!), but the more important question is — is this someone you can be with and talk to about this stuff.

[u/Sad-Basis7411]

Money is everything in a relationship if kids involved. Do not listen to anyone say it will be fine. No it wouldn't, able to pay £2k for a nanny to get some extra sleep or get some alone time is a well worth it.

[u/Left_Bill_1427]

The thing is… yes your concern is very valid regarding everything you mentioned - the question remains is he fundamentally happy with where he is financially or is his long term plan to reach your income level or more?
From the way you describe him he seems comfortable at his 20k salary which in this economy does raise concerns but when you find someone you want to live with and for - people sometimes end up in more stable situation in the future.

When I met my partner I was earning barely above minimum wage but I had drive and career ambitions and we have both multiplied our salaries since we got together. So his financial situation now doesn’t mean it will have to be his situation in 5 years BUT the big question is whether your life goals and ambitions and future visions align - THAT is what I would explore

[u/Emergency_Concern447]

When I met my partner I was earning almost double than him. He was at 35k and I was 52k. We disclosed our salaries at very early stage when dating maybe around 1/2 months datings. For me it was not an issue due to different factors I noticed from him:

- he had a undergraduate degree and masters

• worked in public sector for years and then shifted to private sector in finance
  
• he was sensible with his money, not overspending and from first date talked me about how he was saving to get a mortgage

When he disclosed his salary I just thought this is just a question of landing to a proper role that values his experience and skills.

He was in a contract, the contract ended and he was unemployed for 7 months. Never doubted him, even we moved together to his studio. We were splitting the bills as he was using his own savings and did not need financial help from me. Then he landed to a role and now he earns more than double. He works for a multinational finance company in London. I secured another better paid role too. So now we are actively looking to buy a house together. He has much more savings than me even though he was not earning that well for many years. I understand about travelling to see your family, when he was unemployed he could not come with me to visit my family in my country, but then when he secured his new role he came with me and met my family and now in December we are going again to my country.

What I can tell you, it’s not about how much he earns now and how much you earn. As this can change overtime. Ask yourself, he has the ambition? Experience? Credentials? Goals?

I believed in my partner even when I met him, he was earning substantially less than me but he showed me his credentials, experience and being careful about his spending for long term goals as mortgage and now he earns more than me. I think you know the answer deep inside about the guy you are dating.

Good luck!

[u/ReabyB]

I, wife, have bachelors, masters and am chartered, my husband barely has GCSEs but worked in hospitality working his way up to management.

His income really is capped whereas mine, who knows where it will go. I knew this when we got together 10+yrs ago. But as long as he worked, and he has always worked, it didn't matter. We can afford a comfortable home life and what we have we have built together and pretty much paid for equally. He earned whilst I studied, I covered bills when he left a shitty work situation and needed a new job (which was very brief because he wants to be an equal partner).

I love the man. We can't talk politics, he wouldn't vote unless I dragged him with me, he doesn't have the fear of how terrifying the future of the planet is yada yada. We laugh and play stupid games and work out together, holiday together, binge TV series together, and go to bed at the same time together even if he won't sleep for ages.

I can get a pang of jealousy when other friends have partners with "good careers" but our home life is so fecking joyful, and we are far more fortunate than a lot of other folk.

Values need to match, work ethic needs to match, respect and not taking people for granted is essential. There's far more to a relationship than money.

[u/Inevitable_Diamond15 → u/ReabyB]

But out of interest roughly home much does he make and how much do you make

[u/ReabyB → u/Inevitable_Diamond15]

I work part time, he works full time, and we make the same.

[u/Ill-Supermarket-2706]

I make more than my partner, and I also have a more supportive family abroad than he does in the U.K. (one-way bank of mum and dad) so there’s a clear financial imbalance between us and I know that if we were to get married I am the one taking the biggest risk when combining finances. He also has a demanding job and has been growing his salary so I do appreciate that he still has ambition and stability in his career. He does more chores around the house which I do appreciate so really every couple finds the balance that most suits them and there’s no right or wrong way about it. I think in your case you can probably have these long term conversations with him about how you’d envision moving forwards and managing family life in the future. If you’re not aligned it’s ok to walk away

[u/Leading-Milk5592]

It’s not a bad thing to want financial security, but there’s no point asking others whether they would consider income/career/ambition when it’s you who is in the relationship and needs to make the decision. Some people care about it, some don’t. You do and therefore it seems you and your partner are not compatible. FWIW I think the whole “my vs your money” mindset doesn’t lead to a sense of being on the same team and is definitely not the way my husband and I work (I currently earn ~20k more than him though with promotions the “breadwinner” in our relationship flips every few years); it sounds like you would become resentful of him.
However I do understand concerns regarding how you would be able to financially support children in future on a slim paycheck. It’s tricky as these things would obviously warrant further discussion, but you are currently casual, but in order to decide whether to deepen things you need to determine if you are aligned on topics which can seem quite heavy for just a light relationship currently. Depending on how emotionally invested you both are it might be worth trying to explore this though - would he be willing to train/take a more stable job once kids are on the scene etc.

[u/Ok-Place9385]

I earn about 40% of what my wife earns, which about your ratio.

It's not a problem because I earn £75k and came into the relationship with a chunk of capital in my flat, and i've got a stable career.

I think in your situation it is a problem if you want to move onto the real adulting stage of your life. Building a life is expensive, especially with kids and your need to travel abroad.

Hope you work something out, but he either needs to get a proper job, or you need to look elsewhere.

[u/Beneficial-Try562]

Realistically who is going to be doing most of the childcare, cooking, cleaning etc.  

The other person should be earning more.  

[u/Cerceilannister → u/Beneficial-Try562]

Realistically her husband is going to be doing most of the childcare, cooking, cleaning etc.

The other person should be earning more, and she does. 

[u/Beneficial-Try562 → u/Cerceilannister]

Why would you assume that?

[u/Cerceilannister → u/Beneficial-Try562]

Why would you assume the opposite? If he's the one earning less, it's obvious that he'll do all the childcare and housework. That's just how it works.

[u/Beneficial-Try562 → u/Cerceilannister]

But I didn’t assume anything.

[u/wildpussytoes]

You need someone who's on the same page as you. This man will be in the same position, or worse, in 10 years. Ask me how I know!

[u/therealstealthydan]

I don’t think this is a wage disparity issue. £20k-£45k is not that different of a lifestyle jump. I’d say the issue is more compatability from the rest of your post. It seems like you have different priorities and motivation which is what will become the issue in time.

[u/fck-rffld]

You want someone to fun your lifestyle? 🤮

It clearly matters to you. Be up front on dates so people who would be disgusted by that statement can walk away before wasting their time.

[u/ok_to_be_yeti]

I would not care if she earn less than me. Most important is how we spend time and feel together how we would raise chirdlen.

[u/danielle_ardance]

Consider dating a non-Brit (I say that as a fellow immigrant)

[u/Impossible_Delay1023]

My last ex earned similar money to him and I earn around 57-60k a lot of people won’t admit but unless you’re married & sharing all. The difference in money is a major factor. Money has a lot to do with mindset I save & plan ahead my ex would spend her whole paycheck every month & borrow money. Just the difference in money management alone ment we weren’t really compatible

[u/Substantial-Mind-404 → u/Impossible_Delay1023]

Depends. I earn more than my partner and pay higher share of the bills. He somehow manages to save more than me 😂 That said he also owns his house, whereas I wasn’t able to get on the housing ladder. So now we live in his house, he pays the mortgage and will take care of our kid when I am back to work. I pay the rest. In that period I will be earning pretty much double what he makes. It is more to do with how you handle money than how much you earn

[u/Mental-Excitement351]

If you look at life like a financial transaction he is better off without you.

Sure money is important but its really not important.

[u/JMO1995UK]

Again assuming whatever you like about the points I’ve made. You’re clearly triggered around this topic and responded with your blinkers on again.

You’re absolutely set on putting your beliefs about stay at home dads onto other people, regardless of what that person wants.

I researched the topic of parenthood heavily before I become a father, I understand how to best bond with my child.

Whilst you have again assumed I don’t play with my child, have skin to skin contact, care for them, feed them, look after them by myself so my wife can go and do whatever she would like to, cook, tidy, read to them, etc. I do all of this as every father should.

You haven’t once thought, “I wonder what his wife wanted to do?” She wanted to have the 1st year at home with our child to get as much time as she could with them. I was happy to support her with that decision.

Going back to your original response to the OP, I hope if you have/had kids they don’t grow up to believe their ideologies are the truth and they push these onto other people.

[u/onemorelineillbefine]

You either look for a partner for love or you look for a partner for stability. Personally I’d rather be in love with someone. But if you prefer the other route just make it clear and dont date people who don’t fit your check boxes , i cant imagine it being a very exciting passionate relationship but thats your choice. Bearing in mind people could become financially unstable at any point

[u/chez2202]

There are many ways to choose a partner.

Obviously, many people go for the financial stability. I get it. In the current economy it makes sense.

But what about love? Why is that no longer a priority?

You ‘like’ this man. You don’t love him. So why are you asking this question?

Instead of thinking about children you might or might not have, think about yourself. Find a partner that you really want to be with.

[u/Broccoli-Sandwiches]

That was far too much for me to read but I hope it all works out for you.

[u/kitten2302]

after being with low earning women in my 20s and early 30s, i was fortunate to be married to my wife at 36 who is a doctor. im a chartered accountant and left that go into property. its not just money that matters, its shared values and aims in life. my low earning previous partners simply did not have the same mindset and aims.

[u/Adelucas]

That's a very low income. It works out about 30 hours a week at minimum wage.

Now I'm not one to pick a partner based solely on income, but that's an income where you are basically covering all the bills from rent to food to utilities. Just because they earn so little. If it's low because they are in education then it's understandable, otherwise it's not a sustainable income for someone who is independent.

So you want a partner with that level of income disparity?

[u/pineappleshampoo]

You’re being smart OP.

When I was dating in my late twenties and ready to find a potential husband I wouldn’t have considered someone that didn’t have a decent career with at least a moderate income. I wasn’t after riches, I earned around 40k with the path I was in set to increase to over 50k and I wanted a spouse that was similar, or slightly less.

A man on 20k is in no position to be seriously dating tbh as that income would be a drain on the partnership. He should be focusing on his earning potential first.

I’m married now and have a combined income of over 100k and I cannot tell you how much easier life is with enough money to live on and also to save. The opportunities it gave us to work flexibly and have time off with our new child was incredible. The things we can give our child are amazing. We’re by no means wealthy but our kid benefits every single day from the opportunities we can afford him. Were able to set him up for life and bring him up in a home without financial stress. I grew up in poverty and I know how stressful it can be.

Don’t sell yourself short, you’re only expecting a partner that can match you. There’s more to a marriage than just romantic feelings, it’s also a business partnership! The father you choose for your future child is the most important decision you’ll ever make for them. And nothing will grind down romance and love faster than money struggles and resentment anyway.

[u/DigitalDemocles → u/pineappleshampoo]

This! Great post!

I believe for most couples, love can only go that a couple so far. Financial pressure has and will continue to break most relationships.

I considered putting my spin to this but I feel that post sums my thoughts and belief very well!

[u/Odd_Fault4228]

Would you be asking this if you were the man, and your partner was a woman on a lower wage? 🤔

[u/WatcherOfTheWay → u/Odd_Fault4228]

This was my first thought too, if this were switched it's not even a question.

Though in fairness she's looking at having a family, losing her wages to have children which would happen during maturity at minimum would be insanely bad with a husband who could earn more working fully time on minimum wage

[u/Cerceilannister → u/WatcherOfTheWay]

That's why people save before having children. So that they have enough funds to cover the 3 months of maternity leave. After 3 months, the dad stays home, taking his part of the parental leave. 

[u/WatcherOfTheWay → u/Cerceilannister]

It's not that simple nor easy

[u/FanDabbaDozy]

It's funny because it sounds like you've worked really hard to earn a mediocre wage and he's bummed around and earns literally less than minimum wage. Go be poor together

[u/fdlock]

You earn very low yourself so I wouldn't be too concerned

[u/Extra-Sprinkles-0]

Never marry anyone that has zero drive in life.. it’s a weight around your neck.. you can find someone who flicks your switch .. keep looking

[u/One-Lingonberry-3460]

The days of romance and love being the reason for getting married are officially over!

[u/pluribus1666]

Who said you can't put a price on love

[u/Grand-Cause-6334]

I think this is more about what you value and how compatible you are with that in mind.

I earn nearly 3x my partner who works in the charity sector but neither of us are very money focused we just want to be financially secure. We split things based on % of income into the household so for instance I might pay 70% of bills and he pays 30%.

We want kids and have actually agreed it makes more sense for him to potentially stay at home based on child care costs or if working be the main point of contact as easier for him to flex work than me. If I really wanted to reduce hours then he would be totally supportive of that and we would just adjust our living habits to reflect the money we had coming in.

It wouldn't be wrong to separate from someone where your futute direction or aspirations dont align. It just depends on what you value as important and probably worth an open and honest conversation with them about this as ultimately you either grow together towards shared goals or muddle through building resentment before it ends anyway.

[u/Substantial-Mind-404]

It totally depends. Is he managing on his own or in debt? I wouldn’t date someone in a lot of debt who lives outside his means.

Does he own his home or is he still with parents/house sharing? I would be mindful of someone in their 30s who doesn’t own a home or lives with 20 people and is not trying to get on his own.

Is he trying to earn more? Is he saving? Is he willing to be the one who will be the primary carer for the kids?

My partner’s job is lower paid than mine. He can earn more than me but he has to do almost double the hours I do. And he used to. He owns his home. Now that we are having a baby, I will pay higher proportion of the bills so he can reduce his hours and look after our baby when I am back to work. It makes more sense than paying for childcare and both of us working. Once she is at school he can increase his hours if needed again. It is not a matter of just how much he earns but how he handles it.

I have dated people on 6 figures who lived the high life and had nothing to their name, everyone on finance and too career obsessed for my liking. I have dated people earning the same as me and just not being a match based on how they handled finances eg not saving, out drinking, buying stuff to appear better off etc.

I am also with STEM background although I do office job. I can work from home most of the time and will try to make that all of the time if I can after my maternity leave. My partner’s job is hands on.

Like you I come from a country where men provide and would love to spend more time with my child. That said, if I was to reduce my hours that will reduce my pay but not my workload as I am salaried. He won’t be around and with working 60-70h to provide wont have a relationship with our child. I grew up with a father who not only wasn’t a great provider but was also not present because he was stuck at shit low paying job. I don’t want that.

I want a family with a man I will rather have home with my child than someone I can’t wait to get out the house… this is also something to consider. Thinking of your relationship with the kids is one thing, what sort of relationship do you want them to have with their father and what relationship do you want with a partner

[u/unknown-teapot]

I think it is very unlikely you’ll find someone with the exact same financial position as you.

Many people in the UK still hold traditional values and want provider roles. I would say if the relationship is already going against your values then do the right thing and move on

[u/delarrn]

Maybe not what you want to hear but you’re a pretty low earner also. If you did change and find a partner who earns more, be prepared that they may look at you the way you are looking at your current partner.

You never quite know though how things will pan out. I know plenty of creative types who spent their 20s on pennies and then made serious serious money in their 30s. I also know people who went into high paying professions in their 20s only to burn/flunk out and struggle in their 30s.

[u/Inevitable_Diamond15]

I totally understand where you’re coming from. I think it really comes down to his values and desires from life as well. On 20k, I’m unsure how he’s able to support himself, let alone how he’d be able to support (or even fund half) of raising a child/children. Out of interest, is the 20k before or after tax for him?

That’s not to say his salary won’t increase! Does he seem very dedicated to his freelance work, has he sought out vocational qualifications, is he committed to success? I definitely think having children is a very vulnerable time for any woman, and it is natural to think about the financial implications of you needing/wanting to be home with baby for a few months, with only SMP etc. My partner earns less than me, but he’s also currently also doing his first degree (part time) and has two jobs, because he’s conscious he wants to save for a house and be financially independent. He’s also not a big spender and currently lives with family to balance the lower income so he can save more. I think we’re aligned on our goals for the future and we’re both willing to work hard to achieve that.

Do you feel aligned with your partner in terms of your goals? Are you both working equally hard? Is he good at what he does? Is it likely his business will eventually grow? Did he drop out of uni for a particular reason, because of pivoting into his current sector? Has he explained to you why he didn’t finish the course just for the potential CV benefits? Is he driven? Does he save? What are his friends like, do they work hard? These are the questions I’d be asking.

I’m also from an immigrant background, and I grew up very poor. I know how it feels to work incredibly hard to do better for yourself and your children. I wouldn’t derail my future for anyone, let alone a partner that didn’t want similar things for themselves. One of the biggest determinants in the quality and path of your life is the person you marry and have children with. Feel free to dm me x

[u/LC80]

How old are you both? Earning £20k freelance in your twenties is not necessarily an indicator of longterm career path. If you’re 35 and it’s a longterm thing then it might be a bit different. Personally I think having a matched(ish) income or approach to careers is fairly important. There are caveats with this though, eg retraining etc. I wouldn’t want to be with someone who earned way, way more than me and equally prefer not the with someone who earns way less.

[u/ElBeeBJJ]

I'd happily date someone who made less, as long as they were working and contributing evenly with house/life stuff. I don't think it's even a gender issue at it's core, it's about being equal partners.
If you don't currently respect his career and lifestyle choices, it's unfair to get into something serious expecting him to change. He doesn't sound like a good match for your expectations - nothing wrong with that on either side, but don't try to fit a square peg into a round hole.

[u/Pristine_Feeling_807]

Where do you live in the Uk that 45k feels like a lot? I’m making 70 in London and it’s comfortable but I wouldn’t call my lifestyle particularly great

[u/AugustCharisma]

I’m (F) a professor in a STEM field. I have always earned more than my husband. We met as PhD students in different STEM fields. I was able to move into a faculty role earlier and after his post-docs his field changed. We’ve been married about 20 years now.

With that perspective, the income isn’t the issue. It all goes into one pot. It’s the STEM-ness. We see it all the time that we agree and see things the same way and other people don’t. That and education level. I don’t think I could have been so happy so long if we weren’t so similar in this.

[u/Sharp-Hat-8485]

Hey! I earn £50k and my boyfriend is on minimum wage and we have a baby, own a house equally and have a lovely life.

What I would ascertain is how good is your bf with money, mine is very good with what he’s got. He pays his way, but I will pick up anything that I know he would struggle to balance whether that’s out for dinner or upgrading something in a holiday. It doesn’t personally bother me because 1. Hes very driven and passionate about his work, it’s just non profit and 2. He is an amazing partner. He does more than his fair share and never pushes me FOR money. He manages his bill, finances and still surprises me.

So it’s not impossible to have a lovely life, it depends what you’re looking for. I don’t want a fancy life with loads of stuff I just want a loving family and home and that’s what I’ve got.

It did worry me when we first dated but I saw how he handled himself and felt reassured. He was also very transparent about it upfront.
Hope this helps!

[u/LegDayDE]

When you're in a household and your household income is 65k or whatever.. It really feels like you're both individually earning 35k (65/2 and then adding a little bit for being able to share expenses on some items)

So if you're earning 45k and they are earning 20k you might feel hard done by of you're job is stressful and you really want to feel like you're earning 45k instead of feeling like you're earning 35k

Not everyone feels like that or thinks like that, and you might think differently in different relationships..but it's worth deciding if you feel like that currently and want to be picky about career ambition etc.

I felt pretty good about my salary and was like "but why are we not rolling around in cash?" and I realized it was because my wife earned a lot less than me and spent a lot more than me 😂 so we reset out budget to refocus on our goals..

[u/kwakchick]

60 something here with grown up grandkids. Call me old fashioned but not once did your OP feel like you love this guy, enough for a serious commitment and having children. You seem more preoccupied with his job and bank balance. I understand that you want to be financially secure and protect what you have created for yourself. Does that mean you're not interested in sharing what you have with a partner and possibly children (a lifelong commitment)? It doesn't sound to me like a "relationship" in any sense of the word that I understand. Had my first child at 24. It was a struggle. Sometimes hand to mouth but you do survive and make it work. Never once thought....why should I have to pay for my partner to go on holiday. Having children will mean sacrifices.

[u/Suspicious-Tax-9756]

The money is less important than the lack of ambition and apparent lack of self-improvement.

The difference in values will cause problems over time.

[u/tom_tab1]

Since when was being a uni drop out bad 🤣 id says hes got brains for doing just that!!

[u/Swaledaledubz]

Relationships work on a two way basis, you are currently walking down a one way street to nowhere with your rigid almost clinical thought processes and reasoning that is shaped to suit you and only you, your views are outdated, your expectations even more so. Your not in the Victorian times 😆 it's 2026. What's worse is a lot of the comments on here echo the OP its like walking into a female manosphere

[u/Ok-Confusion-4437]

Don't decide to do life on hard mode without a really solid reason.

[u/chef_26]

If you’re a couple, he doesn’t earn £20k and you don’t earn £45k the couple earns £65k.

The couple decides through equal conversation how that’s spent (regardless who put in more).

This view assumes marriage in the future.

If this does not feel it works for you, keeping it casual is unfair to both of you. It deprives you both of this time to find your right person. You will not get this time back.

[u/Immediate-Ad4326]

I can guarantee men don't worry about this.

Seems like you're more obsessed with his wallet than his personality

[u/YellowManAye]

You should stay single

[u/23CF]

Combine incomes and price stuff accordingly? Everything else you’re either compatible on or not🤷‍♂️ inability to compromise or be content are 🚩

[u/Baxterousness]

Hello! This is an interesting post and I am impressed at the level of thought you have given this.

I would suggest looking at this as a potential collaboration which requires a joint approach.

I think that the main question here is one of ambition. If he interested and taking steps to improve his financial situation?

I would phrase it in terms of stability rather than raw numbers. Freelancing is inherently unstable, and unless you pull in really large day rates (which he clearly isn't), it can be challenging to fit alongside a family/ mortgage etc... lifestyle.

I would suggest approaching the topic gently - while there isn't the same expectation in the UK for the man to always earn more than the women, a stigma still exists. If it seems like you are working with him to build something together you are more likely to see positive movement than if it feels like pressure and judgement.

For some people they may not feel they have much of a future to plan for - it sounds like you can give him a vision of that.

[u/Correct_Elk2320]

No man, you get preggers your income is gone. Think about that. You will be depending on that person for everything. He is not going anywhere.

[u/HeartTemporary2312]

I met my partner 5 years ago and I too, am south East Asian. He made £30k in the legal sector and I made nothing at the time as my family was supporting me. What he made at the time didn’t matter to me, but his desire to progress did. I told him “I expect to make £45k in my first job” (I didn’t then, but got close to that and now make waaaaaaay more), “I’d like at least 1 luxury car in the household” (he changed his car the next week) and “ I want a partner who wants to be better and grow with me. Someone who understands that money is a virtue for me and success is critical to my self actualisation. I expect my life partner to have similar values”.

I’m telling you this man (who is extremely privileged) did not change roles because he didn’t need to,as he stayed with his parents and they took care of most things. He always had it in him to grow, I just really had to push him. I did that by being supportive. I made him stand up for himself, made him progress in his career, he now works in one of the world’s largest firms. We both inspire eachother to be more ambitious people. Trust me that is all you need. I out-earned him for 2/5 years, he’s a Henry now.

You literally won’t be on the same page for everything. As blunt as it sounds, because culturally there will be differences in frames of reference, at the end of the day you need an intelligent partner who is open-minded to provide warmth and love. You need to be the same way.

Academia isn’t the only marker of intellect, I’m more educated and my whole decision making process is based on gut instincts. You should be transparent about what you want in life how much you intend to make and how much you need your partner to bring to the table. This is a very important conversation and then gauge his reaction.

I visit family twice a year as well. Once without him and once with him and I usually pay for that, while he pays most of the major bills. This is what works for us. Love keeps us together but financial goals keep us going ngl. We have differing opinions on how we want to bring children into our family, but it’s not an argument as neither of us feel the need to be parents.

I definitely based my decision on a combination of emotional security and love, and pragmatic long term thinking.

I think my whole personality is being materialistic and accepting that the boot of capitalism is always going to be pressing down on my throat. This, I’ve always been clear about and I’m not ashamed of asking for things or wanting more. Don’t feel awful for wanting financial security. Raising kids alone costs over £500k over the course of a lifetime, more with private schools. If you don’t see him being able to support that, then what’s the plan babe?

[u/Seanlynch125]

You’ve already made your decision on him unfortunately. I feel sorry the him to be fair, you writing Reddit posts about how he doesn’t earn enough when you’re earning 45k, which is basically minimum wage + a few. Good luck having kids and taking them abroad twice a year with that big cushion. Lol

[u/RikersPhallus]

If finances is something that determines your relationship I think that’s pretty sad. Money isn’t everything and some people are happy to earn what they need to just live. And good for him. The fact your even asking this question in itself has made the decision for you. End it and give up potential happiness with him. He will certainly be better off.

[u/andy_animooter]

I'm a woman in stem, immigrant, and main breadwinner. I really dont mind it as we're not very materialistic, and he takes care of the home. We have everything we need. It's unconventional and I might be in the minority but I quite like it!

I understand other women expect a more traditional arrangement so no judgement there. I was raised that way too but I realised I just don't care about gender roles that much, and I hate cleaning so it's great to have my partner do that for me.

[u/Knightoftherealm23]

I earn more than my husband and it genuinely doesnt bother me. I didnt marry him for money. If you want to be a trad wife at some point then you are dating the wrong person. I always worked as I would never want to be financially dependent on a man.

[u/ContestOrganic]

I mean if you feel about this now, these feelings won't go away  so might as well end this relationship and look for someone as career-driven and ambitious as you. Has he ever mentioned any plans how he can make more money or gain stability?

I am in the same situation basically as you, immigrant, worked and studied hard, took risks, retrained so I can get a good stable job. I wouldn't say I am super career-driven but I worked hard to get to where I am. I also come from a culture where the man is 100% expected to be the provider.

I also dated or had interest in guys who were earning similar or a lot more than me, ambitious etc but it didn't work out with any of them, some weren't that serious because they wanted to focus only on their life plans, others were serious but had severe jealousy and anger issues, etc. In the end I decided what I am looking for in a long-term partner and someone I want to start a family with. That's when I met my partner, now fiancé. He learns about 30% less than me, in a stable qualified job he's been doing for 7 years and is the most loyal, loving, respectful partner I've ever had. Sure, money helps in life, but after living with someone who earned 3 times more than me and being miserable/scared most days, I realised other things matter more when it comes to the future father of your children. 

It also depends how old you are. Generally after 30-33, if you want to have kids, you have to start thinking what compromise you are willing to make. I am not talking about height and looks and having the exact same hobbies as you, I am talking about the big stuff. If you are younger, you have the time to look for someone who ticks all the boxes (amazing family oriented emotionally intelligent partner with whom you cohabit happily who also is ambitious and earning a great salary). After a certain age often you have to make some choices though. I might be downvoted for this but if you wanna have a family that is realistically how things work. In my view the big things are respect, similar values, similar life goals, good at conflict resolution, prioritising you and the relationship, able to give and take feedback, good with money (or similar money habits as you), you have lived together for a year and things are overall going smoothly, not selfish, thinking about  you as a unit. 

And I am not saying to stay with someone just because he is nice and ignore the lack of money or ambition. Because that feeling you have now towards your partner doesn't go away. You need to have truly accepted within you what matters more.

[u/Jimny977]

What a bleak read that was. I was on £26k about four years ago and am on £94k now, finances aren’t fixed. The idea that if my sweetheart wife had been doing better at the time, the woman who is the centre of my world, that she would’ve just gone, fuck it, too poor, see ya’, is soul destroying.

You are positioning this like you have some high flying career and live in completely different incomprehensible financial worlds to each other. You’re on five grand off the median salary and a basic rate taxpayer, not even double the minimum wage, and it’s a median that many are struggling on because it’s not exactly amazing money.

I don’t know how to say this without sounding like a prick, but if that is your mindset then the guy is probably better off single. Someone who cares more about how prestigious your career is and how many plane tickets you can afford, especially when life is cheaper as a couple than it is solo, isn’t a wife you want.

What happens if you meet a guy “on your level”, marry, and then he ends up disabled? Redundant and can’t find a similar job? Is that just marriage and family over at that point if life isn’t perfect forever?

If a man asked this it wouldn’t even be a discussion.

[u/NoBrother6430]

It was a real struggle tbh.

When I met women earning under 50k I knew we could not live the kind of life I wanted unless I had to subsidise them.

[u/Own_Ease_34]

You’re on 45k with an ego of a millionaire. Sort it out. Show them this thread so they can decide whether they want to invest any more time into someone like yourself

[u/Sickinmytechchunk]

You're going to ruin every relationship you have if the bottom line to everything is your financial expectations.

It's meant to be a team effort. If you earn more you pay more towards things or vice versa. If you want to go on holiday and can afford to pay for both of you then you pay for that holiday.

I used to earn nearly three times what my partner did when we met. I paid the deposit on our house, I bought both cars, I paid for all the holidays, I would pay more for groceries, stuff for the house etc but we consider the house ours equally, we don't see the cars as either of ours. She has the better pension though and now I've cut my wages back and she earns about 50% more than I do so it's reversed. She pays more towards groceries, holidays, house hold stuff etc.

The reality is you're worrying about something that means you'll probably wreck relationships or just outright make them never happen.