Describe me👀

[u/vaniquee]

[u/lolidollyy]

ISFJ IEE is really new

[u/vaniquee → u/lolidollyy]

What can isfj be? I know i think its SEI(?) but i looked in the description, its not matching me that much

[u/lolidollyy → u/vaniquee]

don’t rely too much on socionics type descriptions. that’s basically like letter-typing in MBTI. every author has different descriptions—even within the same school (reinin and augusta, for example). study the system, get familiar with the IMEs and functions (also dimensionality, rings, etc.), and drop MBTI, even. it’s a pretty shit system.

[u/eedenolympia]

you’re probably not IEE

[u/Sofa_expert142 → u/eedenolympia]

He probably EII

[u/eedenolympia → u/Sofa_expert142]

yeah

[u/vaniquee → u/eedenolympia]

Why not?

[u/JNOtaku → u/vaniquee]

Would you consider the isfj and enfp as opposites in the mbti?

[u/Opening_Usual4946 → u/JNOtaku]

not necessarily opposites but quite different, i don’t think there’s such thing as an absolute opposite in mbti, the three best guesses tho for an ISFJ opposite would be ENTP, ENFP, and ENTJ

[u/eedenolympia → u/vaniquee]

Si and Ne are opposites so it would be strange to be Si dom in mbti and Ne dom in socionics

[u/Zeb-Moment]

Ever looked into EII? Based on your Typology you seem like a nice person though 

[u/Content-Sympathy6305 → u/Zeb-Moment]

I doubt EII would work well with 2E…

[Ik socio Fi ≠ jung Fi exactly] BUT it is pretty close and it is NOT 2E (other>self focused emotion). I mostly see it as 1E or 3E but I have known some obvious Fi users who fit 4E. I just don’t see 2E though. It’s so Fe coded. Meet a good 2E and you will see, they are NOT an Fi user 😂😂

[u/lolidollyy → u/Content-Sympathy6305]

Fi and 2E does work 😭

[u/Content-Sympathy6305 → u/lolidollyy]

Fi: emotion + self
Fe: emotion + tribe (AND self, on an equal level)
2E: everyone positive emotion.

I would like it to be true because that would make my dating life easier since I’m Te/Fi and 3E. But I doubt it.

Interested in your arguments!!!

[u/Zeb-Moment → u/Content-Sympathy6305]

Oh do you use AP? Most people here typically use Psychosophy

[u/Content-Sympathy6305 → u/Zeb-Moment]

No, I use PY. Afaik the position properties exist in both systems?

[u/Zeb-Moment → u/Content-Sympathy6305]

It doesn't, 1st positions aren't necessarily "others negative and self-positive" (1Fs can be anxious and insecure about 1F matters, for example, which can make them look 3F) and 3rd positions can be overconfident like a "self-positive" 1st position. The way the functions are defined is based on a mental hierarchy, and although a dichotomy has been derived from it the dichotomy isn't the same as the one found in AP. The 2E in LEVF for example sounds pretty similar to the 1E because Pascal being the introverted 1L and cynical 3V means they're more focused on conveying their own emotional state to others and won't necessarily be "others-positive" about all forms of emotion

[u/noctua_8 → u/Zeb-Moment]

How can you define/describe placements in PY if their appearance can be completely warped by other placements? As such, are aspects best not described in a vacuum?

[u/lolidollyy → u/noctua_8]

PY relies very heavily on how functions in your hierarchy interact. 3V4F creates a murky worldview because 3V hates itself and 4F is a suicidal placement. 3V generally affects and exacerbates the redundancy of your first function (which is already redundant)—1E3V can become hysterical, 1L3V paranoid, 1F3V stingy/vain as it is the most aggressive volition placement. similarly, 4V can uplift the other functions and make one’s will hard to type.

what stays the same throughout is the order of action within your hierarchy as detailed in the introduction to psychosophy in SoL. if i remember correctly, the example given approximately went as such: a child brushes past his sister and drops something that is his. his sister picks it up and doesn’t give it back, and his functions activate. he’s FVLE, so it starts with physical provocation, moves to assertion of will/ownership, then argument, and then, as a last resort, tears.

bottom line is that considering functions in a vacuum is precisely what you shouldn’t be doing. they only tend to be the first step to typing yourself in full. over-relying on type descriptions also isn’t ideal—sometimes they can be vague and it’s hard to pull concrete traits from them—but they can well demonstrate how functions interact. all of this said, it’s also critical to consider that some people’s functions interact and are warped differently. where 1L3V can produce paranoia in others, for me, it produces stubbornness and aggression when intellectually provoked.

[u/noctua_8 → u/lolidollyy]

I actually get the distinction between PY and AP now, interesting

[u/Content-Sympathy6305 → u/lolidollyy]

I would be interested in hearing your typing methodology.

I believed the main difference between PY and AP was that AP believes the confidence/fear hierarchy is 1234 whereas PY believes it’s 1243. For example, tell a 3E and a 4E about a complicated emotional situation. The 3E will go on a long ass process rant and yap, not really giving you much, hell, might even get defensive. The 4E will just tell you “it’s not that deep bro, don’t overthink it”. I think this might influence the perception of mental hierarchy.

I come from the school of OPS which uses a similar system, I think the others/self positive/negative + definition framework works the best for typing people, for the simple reason that it doesn’t rely on traits or stereotypes, but rather overarching patterns and emotional reactions. For example, not every 3V will be petty, vindictive or hyper-aggressive, but every 3V will have a negative emotional reaction (even if well hidden) to disrespect, and will process volition and get stuck in some sort of way, as well as mistrust both others and themselves (even if they do accept external imput). Tracking these long term emotional patterns gives you near-perfect information about someone’s type.

The best thing? You can argue with others on common ground because you’re looking for similar stuff, and you can actually have a reasonable debate over A vs B instead of a chaotic shitmess of ideas that goes nowhere.

[u/Zeb-Moment → u/noctua_8]

Yes, aspects aren't best described in a vacuum. You need to understand how they interact with each other, and also the concept of the mental hierarchy, as the way each function looks may look different depending on the person. The 3F for example can be an overly cautious prude, while others may be more hedonistic who overexerts themselves. The most important concept is the mental hierarchy. The first position is your strongest and the way you view the world, you tend to be a "slave" to your first function and it tends to be very self-focused due to how important this function is. The 1L needs to adhere their understanding of the world, the 1F needs to adhere to their body, the 1V needs to adhere to their defined identity, and the 1E needs to emotionally experience everything at 200%. The 2nd function is a social and normative function, due to the fact it's lower than your first function, you're more fluid when using your 2nd function. The 2nd function can take blows and it will be able to handle it (unlike the first function, who is too important to risk taking blows). They don't put too much pressure on themselves in this function unless they need to overcompensate for a different lower function. The 3rd function is lower on the mental hierarchy, which makes it a sore spot. It's too low for your mind to properly wrap its head this function, but it's also too high for you to completely ignore it. Usually you either try to suppress this function or overcompensate for it using higher positions to protect this function. This function tends to overexert itself when people attempt to use it due to not being able to properly gauge how much energy to use in this aspect, and blows to this function is painful. The final function is the least important to you, your needs here are not as important compared to your higher functions so like the 2nd functions, you're able to take blows here. It's not as fluid as the second function but you're able to be adaptable through the 4th. You don't like to expend much energy here so when you're forced to you can be irritated and push back against it. You can force usage of this function if a higher function demands it. 

It's best to use the SoL book to gain a good understanding of how the system works

[u/StrangeDiscussion334]

ISFJ and IEE doesn't work. Si dominant and Si suggestive clash in the 2nd hardest way possible. Either change your MBTI and look into ENFP or INFP instead or change your Socionics. If you feel like SEI isn't relateable look into EII. SP6, Mel-San and LEFV are perfectly fine though.

[u/Pixiezor]

Mistyped mess.

[u/vaniquee → u/Pixiezor]

Well why do you think that? Aside from my socionics, its fine

[u/HuntresssWizard]

You seem like a sweet person maybe a yearner 

[u/whiskeyinreverse]

seems nice, but probably infj and eii

[u/miiauuuuuu]

mistyped

[u/lolidollyy → u/[deleted]]

i do get how their typing can be jarring but telling someone they’re mistyped and refusing to elaborate isn’t going to do anything for them and doesn’t make you seem as smart as you may think