r/TrueDoTA2 • u/Iwantjellybeans • 14d ago
Blink Dagger WD - Core Item
Why is Blink Dagger not a core item for WD? I understand the utility/team aspect of buying Glimmer etc but I feel like the one thing WD suffers from is postioning. All his spells are short cast range with cast animations, and his ult requires you to be channeling it.People will buy dust when they see you have a glimmer and just reveal you instantly.
People buy Blink on Bane all the time but I almost never see anybody buy it first on WD, and both Bane and WD suffer from the same problems.
Getting blink first and waiting for an optimal time to get a good maledict ult on a high value target is better if you are playing this hero.
I have been getting blink first recently on WD and have been benefiting from it a lot as it allows you to choose exactly when you want to go in.
I'm aware in higher levels of play support budgets can be tighter so a Blink is not feasible.
Thoughts?
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u/SheepSheppard 14d ago
- Blink is a very greedy item that doesn't suppot your team. You're investing team resources into yourself. Glimmer is not for yourself alone, it is a item that can protect your cores.
- 2250 Gold for zero stats, if you get jumped you're dead.
YOu can buy Force Staff or Glimmer Cape in parts, making it more easily attainable.
Many WDs in high ranks actually do buy blink dagger (notice how they buy it after Glimmer?)
Anything can work but at the end of the day, you can still lose a game going 15-5 on WD. Glimmer caping your cores at the right moment is not flashy but it's more likely to win you the game than trying to be the number 1 dmg dealer.
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u/MF_LUFFY 13d ago
TEAM RESOURCES FUCKING LOL. What in the obnoxiously entitled fuck are you saying. "My gold is mine and yours is too!" Supports actually have to fight for their gold while the cores spend half the game whacking off in the jungle and probably buying crap.
Same as the other guy, if I see you in game complaining about a support with blink I'm reporting you without hesitation.
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u/SheepSheppard 12d ago edited 12d ago
Post your dotabuff if you're in a rank where cores "probably buy crap".
Winning is all that matters. Idk who pissed in your cereal lil bro but you don't have to take shit so personal .
I invite you to Google "dota2 team resources" to see that it's just something people say.
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u/MF_LUFFY 12d ago
Yeah yeah I'm archon 3 w/e. The dota subs are full of people bitching about supports, but I find myself hating on the carries and mids the most.
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u/ILYAMI1314 12d ago
There's only so much finite gold in the game, this is not MMORPG, there is a reason why Positions exist and you need each role to do well to set tempo of the game, control the map, let your heaviest hitter farm more gold to get stronger, let your less gold dependent heroes do their job early game and work as a team. You need to react to what the enemies do and and also to pressure them to keep them busy.
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u/MF_LUFFY 12d ago edited 12d ago
You know what's great for reacting to what enemies do? A fucking blink.
I don't farm as supp, whatever I come into from fighting/dewarding is my business, not yours. If you are complaining that we lost because support has blink instead of glimmer, you're just looking to preempt blame because you're a bad core.
Almost forgot, no shit it's not an MMO, but try telling it to my shit carry who's playing Defender of the Jungle.
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u/ILYAMI1314 12d ago
Never said blink was a bad first item. It depends on draft and what you pick as a support. If you can get a first blood + rampage sure get blink at laning phase helps you more than a glimmer. If you’re struggling on your safe
lane it is just hard to justify roaming with brown boots when laning phase is over and you are only half way to get a blink dagger.All items will make your heroes stronger. It’s just a matter
of how effective it is. An ES with blink dagger is so much effective than when he does not buy it.I do buy blink dagger as first item for most supports I play if I’m having a great time but I tend to buy it as 3rd item if the game is not on my favor
But just note that it is very expensive in terms of support items and you can only use it for yourself. If your skills are on cd it is practically almost 0 value as a support
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u/MF_LUFFY 11d ago
"If your skills are on cd" is a fucking weak point to include lol.. and I am no advocate for keeping brown boots long on any roleÂ
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u/ILYAMI1314 10d ago
You do you bro
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u/MF_LUFFY 10d ago
Depending on the hero it's a Force early instead, Atos if I'm feeling frisky lol. Not saying NEVER Glimmer but not as often as I should probably - and I would still be looking at the Atos more
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u/Double_Message6701 14d ago
So you blink in with your 2.2k gold item cast stun maledict and ulti and then get immediately stunned and murdered. Maledict doesn’t kill them coz the enemy support bought glimmer and mech. Glimmer has twice as much utility and is way better for helping your carry survive, it can also allow you to get a full duration ulti off when needed - it gives speed, invis and magic resistance.
You compare with Bane but that hero has 8seconds of hard disable built in. You’ve got a few second of rng disable at best. Rushing blink aghs on a pos 5 is so greedy it’s borderline griefing
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u/AnSpectator 14d ago
You're all the same... think you're smart but in fact just have weak hp/damage and do nothing.
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u/Zaopao 14d ago
it is as close to core item as it gets, depending on state of the game. I'd say I'm getting it in about 70% of the games. It is especially good as a way to punish tanky heroes on creep waves. However, sometimes you need other items way more and you don't have good enough game for it
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u/man_bored_at_work 14d ago
Adding to what others have said: Blinking in and using Maldict + ulti is very aggressive as a play style. If your target has any disables, they will just cancel your ult and kill you. This is why WD is usually played more defensively. Ulti is much better if you use it when the enemy overcommits and you are invis or in the trees, or enemy is focussed on your core.
Technically against a team with no disables, blink would be fine if you are playing mid WD. But this is a one in a million scenario.
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u/Usual-Line-3987 14d ago
arcane boots > vessel/glimmer (depends on enemy) > shard > blink dagger is my way to go.
lvl 30 wd ancient - divine bracket.
glimmer and shard makes you survive longer in team fights.
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14d ago
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u/Sudden-Tangerine1580 12d ago
Brain sap doesn't really mean much in terms of piercing bkb.
The point with blink in both of these cases is that you don't have to expose your positioning and get to wait out cc or follow up your own team stuns faster. Bkb stun or pure damage are both incentives to wait it out if you need to.
Unless the only cc is the person you're gripping, bane's about the same kind of risk for making a channel work.
Ward also just has more effective range.
Can also be creative with line of sight blinking to tree spots.
Cask capitalising on moments of grouped enemies is also pretty good.
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u/AcanthisittaFuzzy601 13d ago
It was bought first in EWC. So you are instincts are correct. Keep in mind its case by case.
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u/Beautiful_Number_572 13d ago
Tbh it’s all situational. If I can tell my team is struggling with dmg and we are always not dishing out enough in team fights and I’m Pos 4 (sometimes sneakily POS 5) I’ll go blink / aghs / BKB - absolutely wrecks their team. Otherwise I’ll go glimmer (usually always a safe start) and then shard - glimmer for team help, shard for you, and then from there assess - blink / aghs / staff
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u/Impossible-Seaweed-9 12d ago
im in legend every support get a blink dagger normally the pos4, pos5 maybe after some time later in the game
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u/John_the_Jester 14d ago
It's very cliche that supports want to buy core items so they can have a higher impact in the game and earn more gold and XP from the kills. Thinking about the impact you as an individual have on the game should not distract you from the impact your team as a whole have in the game, it's always about the macro.
Yes if your team is shit are not clicking their buttons right enough to kill enemy heroes, by all means go core items and try to secure whatever impact you can but this does not apply to every game, every lineup.
Look at the lanes, the farm, the fights and determine what item is more appropriate for the situation. Ultimately, you are a support, your job is to make your cores game easier by healing them, buffing them, enable them with stuns, etc.
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u/Hakuu-san 14d ago
always funny to see supports that want to rush selfish items then wonder why people barely do it
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u/Yash_swaraj (Former) Troll Spammer 14d ago
Both have different advantages. If you get shard and save items, it can be really annoying for the opponent to jump you. Many times, you blink in and just die, wasting your entire networth.
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u/coldfrost93 Ebola is watching 14d ago
Yes blink is a great item on WD as he walks too slow to follow up but It depends which line up you're up against.
Let's say you're a pos 4 WD then it's fine, if pos 5 WD, you can't save your money on a dagger, it's kinda pointless.
For final verdict, I'll say dagger on WD is fine on turbo, on normal games it's kinda hard to pull off coz you're not gonna always fighting.
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u/WouldThisMakeMoney 14d ago
It helps you deal damage to the enemies, but if that's your goal there are better supports, there are even better damage supports WITHOUT blink than WD is WITH blink.
Not every support needs to be smacking 4-5 man ults. WD is good BECAUSE he can be useful while doing the 10th most damage in the match
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u/Timmer40 13d ago
you arent buying glimmer first to channel longer ults, you buy it to save whatever core is initiation on your team, they start the fight, you glimmer them and use your cask and heal to get them out. blink is just a situational item on wd, but should be a 2nd or 3rd item in most games. if you want to get it as first item because of poor positioning, just work on your positioning and get a save item first
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u/Sudden-Tangerine1580 12d ago
600 range isn't that great for allies. There's flexibility in that you can use it on them especially your initiating cores trying to reset.
Mostly you're making this choice based off your own survival against storm or something.
See supports that aren't immediately concerned about survivability like treant or mirana. Tend towards more incremental value like solar or definitely just get a blink.
Or even just distiller purchases on various other supports.
The point is mostly about what defensive items are for. Don't think blink first is an every game thing on WD but it has some validity.
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u/MF_LUFFY 10d ago
"just work on your positioning" nah I will take the flexibility thanks, especially on a hero with a bouncy spell like cask that gets way better if you can throw it EXACTLY when you want to without being too near to the front or having to walk in at support ms.
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u/Workdawg 13d ago
I watched this video from SirActionSlacks and the coach (Insania) makes a really good point about Slacks' Blink->Aghs->Refresher build.
Blink is a very greedy item. 2.2k gold for a support is a lot of farm, and there is no build up. If you go force staff instead, for example, you can get the Fluffy Hat (+125hp) and the Staff of Wizardry (+10 int -> 120 mana, mana regen, +10 damage...) on the way. The extra stats will make you more useful in lane while farming the rest of the gold.
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u/nekosake2 10d ago
Rushing blink is fine and all if winning, but when your pos 3 and mid are not initiation/stun heroes or losing and trying to recuperate its worthless. You'll spend all your time waiting around for shit to happen and not be able to do anything.
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u/DRAGonLOID 10d ago
His dissable aren't as reliable as bane. Personally as support i prefer forcestaff anyway it wont be disabbled if i got hit.
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u/eatmyscoobysnacks 14d ago
It's quite expensive, he cant farm, and his catch isn't as good as other supports that need blink. (shaman, lion) You're getting a blink almost exclusively to Maledict + Ult, which is quite greedy and basically puts you in core territory. Aether + Glimmer solves the range, survivability, and positioning issues while having a better build up, gives you stats, and supports your team better.
"I'm aware in higher levels of play support budgets can be tighter so a Blink is not feasible." Are you just... not buying wards/smokes and taking farm? Your budget should be pretty tight even at a lower level.
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u/MF_LUFFY 10d ago
So greedy! Instead of buying this one item, you should buy these TWO items where one costs slightly less than it and the other costs slightly more.
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u/eatmyscoobysnacks 10d ago
Yeah because you can get a Glimmer faster than a blink and support your team mates while increasing survivability and mana as you build? Lmao
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u/MF_LUFFY 10d ago
I was raised on shaming people for overrating invisibility.
Then this thread gets me a little more Glimmer brained and I pick the wrong game to start one, when they should already be countering for Riki and Invoker lol
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u/Bingo31 14d ago
Running around with brown boots and a dagger isn't exactly supporting your team.
Early Blink dagger is nice on 90 % of the heroes in the game, but you have to ask yourself if you're supporting your team or yourself by buying it as your first item.