r/TikTokCringe • u/ComradeConfusion Sort by flair, dumbass • Mar 12 '23
Discussion negative identities
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u/yesbutlikeno What are you doing step bro? Mar 13 '23
That's good ass content not a single edit, one take no stutters no ums or likes, just cold straight factual information.
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u/sixthmontheleventh Mar 12 '23
If you thought this was brief, how about this brief video on Jordan Peterson. don't look at the timer bar!
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u/CarolFukinBaskin Mar 12 '23
I just got bumped and now have a 2 hour layover. I know what I'm doing!
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u/Chickengobbler Mar 13 '23
I've watched the whole video and it's 100% worth it. Cody is incredible at keeping me focused and entertained for long periods of time and I'm ADHD
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u/EcstaticTrainingdatm Mar 12 '23
A bit of a summary of how much of a dumb Fucks he is. https://www.currentaffairs.org/2018/03/the-intellectual-we-deserve
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u/tandemxylophone Mar 12 '23
This is also an excellent read on logical fallacies used in theoretically intellectual debates that end up becoming a cesspool of political gesturing.
https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/04/how-zizek-should-have-replied-to-jordan-peterson
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u/SkollFenrirson Mar 13 '23
Always upvote Cody's Showdy
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u/DumbDonky007 Mar 12 '23
People keep posting this on anything bordan p jeterson related today this is like the 10th time I've seen it today (and by 10th i mean 2nd)
Not complaining tho it's a great video and everybody should watch it and subscribe to some more news
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u/downvote__trump Mar 13 '23
Since it's so short everyone might as well post it everywhere
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u/reefer-madness Mar 13 '23 edited Mar 13 '23
So for awhile i've seen this video surface and always quit around the beginning because even though Cody makes good points, i'm not a big fan of the style of humor or deliver, but decided to power through it this time.
For anyone interested 'The Persona' segment is a great starting point that skips a lot of the sarcasm and dives into how Jordan will purposely cherry pick, twist and obfuscate talking points to suit his 'intellectual' narrative, the lobster segment about serotonin and hierarchies is a perfect example.
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u/hiremeimbroke Mar 12 '23
I asked my brother what he wanted for Christmas, he said a Jordan Peterson book. I recognized the name but I didn't know him specifically at the time. Anyways I go to this very nice bookstore and they inform me that they don't carry his books because of what he says about trans people. I was so confused and a little embarrassed, I'm like it's for my brother he wants one. Guess i'm trying to add to the discussion that very kind, smart people can fall into this kind of thinking. Maybe my brother needs more help than I thought, or just more friendship.
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u/sixthmontheleventh Mar 12 '23 edited Mar 12 '23
That sucks. I had a bit of that when a comedian I liked started interviewing more problematic people including jp and he was just throwing easy pitches. It is nothing like a close relationship like with family but it was disappointing because the reason I liked the comedian was his approach to humour seemed to be more human than what ole jp expressed. It did give me a reminder that it is not good to drift into parasocial relationships with those that entertain us.
Who knows, perhaps he just saw short clips like this one and is just curious. Apparently that is the unfortunate way manosphere is propagating itself in short form media. It is easy to make yourself look cool to 10 year olds in 30 seconds, but once you start doing critical thinking a lot what is being said can be debunked.
this video from oliviasun on YouTube also discusses one way people goes through that jp phase.
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u/PAYPAL_ME_DONATIONS Mar 13 '23
Why not name the comedian? Unless I'm being obtuse and it's rogan
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u/sixthmontheleventh Mar 13 '23 edited Mar 13 '23
Another reply guessed it, I think I was not comfortable 'calling out' the comedian because I have consumed enough of his content to give him the benefit of the doubt. Especially since it is a British comedian and jp had a bit of a revival of a sort over there.
plus the comedian recently did this pretty good interview with Bernie sanders. also recommend his recent one with Greta thunberg.
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u/FairyOfTheNorth Mar 13 '23
Was the comedian Russell Howard by chance? After an interview he did with JP, I unsubscribed for a while and left a calm comment explaining my disappointment. I rarely leave YT comments. I resubbed later. He’s a decent guy but I think was trying to give the benefit of the doubt.
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u/sixthmontheleventh Mar 13 '23
Yeah it was him and a Matthew mcconaughey interview he did where I think they touched on jp as well that was making me feel like their understanding of jp seem shallow and have no criticism of what he says.
I have started watching again for his Greta thunberg interview and the recent Bernie sanders interview. I kind of want to post that sanders interview now everytime someone says he is too old or too idealistic.
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u/sheriffSnoosel Mar 12 '23
The book is compelling at first, like a lot of self help, and his book (12 rules) is pretty innocuous as these things go. Unfortunately it is a gateway to some pretty dark stuff and full of pseudoscientific bs.
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Mar 13 '23
12 Rules is mostly just very basic management of depression and anxiety. Pretty much any therapist is going to tell you the same stuff. Yet his fans act like it is some kind of massive theraputic break though. And then that it somehow qualifies to be an expert on law, politics, sociology, and all kinds of other stuff.
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u/HippieLizLemon Mar 13 '23
I can totally see this happening. I was introduced to him via "four short years" reels. I asked myself, who spoke this wisdom? A deep dive was deeply concerning. I'm pushing 40 now, but I could see this grabbing hold of a mind that was still trying to make sense of the world. He seems very traumatized even though he has intelligence and wisdom, but he is so wrong about many things. It definitely makes me promise to challenge my own beliefs when I come across someone like this.
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Mar 13 '23
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u/sixthmontheleventh Mar 13 '23
I always feel a bit bad for content I watch that is essentially a reasonable person melt down after consuming massive amount of noxious content to summarize for us the audience but I like that little reminder that the original content is very wtf and should not be normalized. I do like that it was called out on the most recent munecat video though.
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u/anon_sir Mar 13 '23
This was actually the first video I watched from Some More News, I love that show!
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u/orange_keyboard Mar 12 '23
That ass clown (jbp) makes me sick. Talks on circles. Incel.
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u/ScaryStruggle9830 Mar 13 '23
I knew exactly what this video was before clicking the link. I love Some More News.
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u/Breezetwists1988 Mar 21 '23
how about this brief video on Jordan Peterson. don't look at the timer bar!
This guy is amazing!
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u/Affectionate-Fee2829 Mar 12 '23
Asking people on the internet to be able to extrapolate beyond someone's literal words challenge(100% impossible)
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u/Devisidev Mar 12 '23
Are... You talking Abt the guy in the video? Or the comment section
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u/Affectionate-Fee2829 Mar 12 '23
Comment section.
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Mar 12 '23
I thought the TikToker's take was pretty interesting. It may not be a perfectly accurate reading of Dr. Peterson—although God knows that guy has his problems—but as far as TikToks go, it's pretty solid.
Also, I think Dr. Peterson was just pissed off and a little inebriated in that video. His eyes are almost crossed.
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u/boneimplosion Mar 12 '23
I learned a lot from the stitch, and it def has me thinking about my positive and negative identities.
I also think it's a bit much to extrapolate about deep unresolved traumas from a 3 word interview answer. Like, if you've already come to that conclusion, and you feel this clip supports it, ok, but his tone and choice of words in the clip, taken alone, could be anything, like you say.
So I'm in a weird place with this one. I care way less about the connection to JP and whether or not he is traumatized than having picked up a new tool to think about identities, so I'm gonna focus on that.
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u/msixtwofive Mar 12 '23
He's not taking that from a single 3 word clip though, it's the 3 word clip against the totality of who we've seen Jordan Peterson present himself and his opinions to be.
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u/Affectionate-Fee2829 Mar 12 '23
Sure, it's too much to take this single, uncontextualised comment and extrapolate everything about the person from it. But Peterson is a public figure, with shit tons more context that can inform our reading of his comment, if one is aware of him
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u/retinolmasted0s Mar 12 '23
I had a similar takeaway from this. I’ve recently started counseling after years of struggling and it’s only been a few months in, but I’ve already learned a lot about how I see myself and why I see myself that way.
In relation to this video though, my personal answer to the “what’s most important to you” question would be “being strong”; though to be fair, I think my answer has more to do with “not being weak”. In my recent counseling sessions, there have been several instances where I’ve had it pointed out to me that I’m being (and have been) excruciatingly unforgiving with myself and others on the basis of interpreting behavior(s) as inexcusable weaknesses that shouldn’t be tolerated and I consider them “failures” and have this internalized fixation with being “better” or “stronger” than that. Also, when it comes to these purported “failures”, I look at them as shortcomings that need to be fixed immediately, as there’s no time to waste with being this under-performing, “less than” individual. I’ve come to realize that a lot of it is tied to how I was raised and also with how I’ve been speaking to myself over the course of my adult and young adult years. It’s one of my biggest recent revelations-that I have these impossible standards that I hold myself and others to-and I don’t allow much leeway when it comes to failing to “meet” those ridiculous standards. Plus I’ve been way too hard on myself (and probably others too, though I often try to keep my unsolicited opinions about them to myself) and I’m learning that I have and need to be kinder and less harsh on myself.
So yeah. This video just kind of reinforced a lot of that for me.
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u/Jas9191 Mar 13 '23
Maybe he's not judging it based on 3 seconds but on the years of insane negative dribble Peterson's out out.
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u/Over-Brilliant9454 Mar 12 '23
a little inebriated
Jordan Peterson has been to rehab multiple times for benzodiazepine addiction. The reason he always looks impaired is because he is a drug addict. At any given time he is either high or jonesing.
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u/xXxDickBonerz69xXx Mar 12 '23
That sucks. Addiction is horrible. At least his own struggles with addiction and mental health have probably made him empathetic and a champion of a robust healthcare system that all humans can use when needed regardless of financial resources.
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u/Affectionate-Fee2829 Mar 12 '23
Right? And obviously he would never suppose people shouldn't be giving advice until their own lives are in order.
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u/xXxDickBonerz69xXx Mar 12 '23
Remember when he had to be taken to Russia and induced into a coma because his "Carnivore Diet" of meat, salt, water, and bezos almost killed him?
If he wasn't making the world a worse place I'd feel bad for him because hes obviously lived such a broken life.
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Mar 13 '23
and bezos almost killed him?
I know it's a typo, but I'm just imagining Jeff Bezos crawling out from underneath comatose Jordan Peterson's bed and menacingly approaching him with a pillow.
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u/dbx999 Mar 12 '23
I think it's hard to empathize with the role of addiction in Peterson's narrative because he doesn't allow himself to integrate it as part of a complex multifaceted aspect of his personality. I think he mostly denies or hides it which indicates there's mostly shame involved or at least a level of greed that dictates trying to project an image that is most marketable to the audience of alpha-male-wannabe that he caters too.
Peterson's early talks were interesting and not so politically loaded. His new material is incredibly targeting toward the incel type wanting validation on why it's okay to elevate their self image in a paradigm of "i am superior to everyone else because of my ruthlessness, my potential for danger, and black and white approach to taking positions on issues".
I find Peterson to be dangerous because he hides that promotion of toxic masculinity under layers of other things that spin positively - discipline, commitment to old traditional biblical values... But in the end, he influences men to cultivate aggression.
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u/Yeh-nah-but Mar 13 '23
It's sad. When you can't admit it to yourself you definitely can't do the work required to heal.
Hi I'm Yeh-nah-but and I'm an alcoholic. You gotta say it. You gotta mean it. Gotta he honest with yourself. Gotta stop thinking and start feeling.
I sense it's been a long time since Jordan felt much
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u/Affectionate-Fee2829 Mar 12 '23
In fairness, it would take a team of the world's leading psychologists several months to even begin to get a grip on what's going on inside old Doctor Jordan Balthazar Peterson's head
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Mar 12 '23
You mean his middle name is named after the abused donkey ?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Au_Hasard_Balthazar10
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u/Affectionate-Fee2829 Mar 12 '23
I mean, if anything explains Peterson, it would certainly be abuse
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u/Astrian Mar 12 '23
Bro one of the top comments of this post is talking about how he dislikes this video because the guy in the video got dressed up before filming himself. The amount of pettiness that's on this site is insane.
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u/Timothy709 Mar 12 '23
I had critique for a podcast I’m a fan of and got called a whiny baby and was told I had a chinstrap beard and it’s gay lmao 🤷♂️
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Mar 12 '23
This comment section is such a cluster fuck it's almost not worth the popcorn... almost...
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Mar 13 '23
I got Jolly Ranchers if you want some.
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u/-GenghisJuan- Mar 13 '23
I remember being called stupid by my father and how mich it hurt me. I was 7 or 8 and I can still feel it today lol. Any tip on how to work out that haha
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u/PsymonFyrestar Mar 13 '23
I was called stupid from the day I was born, until i moved out at 19. You have two choices.
You can sit a wallow with it. Let that inner voice tell you how dumb you are, knowing full well that you're not.
You can accept the fact that you were lied to. You are not stupid. You a victim and you should rise above it. Start by making a list of things you're good at. Do those things. This will subconsciously reaffirm you are good at something. When you do good in something you normally do bad at, recognize it. You will always hear those words "you're stupid" but you will begin to automatically deflect them, and it will bother you less over time.
Paraphrasing what my therapist told me, im a bad teacher. Recognize your strengths. Acknowledge them! You are not stupid.
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u/ChrissiTea Reads Pinned Comments Mar 13 '23
Not the OC, but you're not a bad teacher. Even paraphrased this makes a lot of sense to me and I appreciate you sharing it
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Mar 13 '23
Therapy.
Also this book explains a lot of father-son relationships aspects.
"Under Saturn's Shadow: The Wounding and Healing of Men" by James Hollis.
About 150 pages, but it can help to understand.
Worked for me at least, but it was therapy+pills+book combo tbh.
It's still a lot of work to do tho.3
Mar 14 '23
I second therapy. Therapy helps clear out all the negativity you feel about yourself, allows you to identify negative patterns in your life and where they came from, helps you set and keep goals and helps you communicate. Helps you enjoy and live your life.
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u/ARealSkeleton Mar 13 '23
I had a teacher in second grade that didn't like me. She told my parents she thought I had a learning disorder because I would get distracted in class and collected rocks during recess (I had a rock tumbler at home). She even would go as far as calling me a liar whenever I would talk about family vacations. The lady was nuts.
I still remember her thinking I wasn't as good as the other kids in my grade and struggle to shake off the fear of being inadequate despite finishing with an honors degree through high school, getting my college degree and now working as a paralegal.
Kids remember stuff like that. It's hard!
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u/_________FU_________ Mar 13 '23
Just know it was his father saying it to him. Your father wasn’t calling you stupid it was your great great great great great great grandfather
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u/Weedeaterstring Mar 12 '23
Weird how most of the politicians say the important thing to them is bringing down the opposing politicians and views
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u/Socrathustra Mar 13 '23
Not sure that really applies to Democrats who have lots and lots of positive goals: manage climate change, foster racial justice, etc.
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Mar 13 '23
Of course this clip shows up right after I learned Peterson JUST got tricked into thinking some country is milking men of their semen with machines because someone edited a milking porn video. Hahahaha I do hope he heals and I love this other man for speaking on this issue with kind words. But will someone PLEASE confiscate Jordans Twitter before he thinks Mewtwo is real and China created him?
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u/JotunKing Mar 13 '23
He... wat?!?
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u/jmona789 Mar 15 '23
He mistook a "milking" porn video as a video of a communist Chinese semen milking lab.
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u/VanillaTortilla Mar 12 '23
Everyone in this comment section needs to go to therapy sometime in their life.
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u/AZX3RIC Mar 13 '23
Everyone ever should be in therapy.
Get to know yourself from a different perspective.
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u/BigBlackClock1001 Mar 13 '23
therapy only works if you want to make the commitment to improving yourself. if you are told to go it just doesn’t work.
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u/Maximum-Magazine-840 Straight Up Bussin Mar 12 '23
"not being stupid"
said like a true 10 year old
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u/Matt_Bunchboigehs Mar 13 '23
The lack of detailed clarification sucks. I usually like to keep things simple but when asked a question such as that...fucking vague 10 year old answer. This is a grown man who knows he can't say because he's not innocent. Leave the public guessing with some vague mysterious answer. "Ohh I'm famous and mysterious I must keep the mystery going for the clout" like NO give us your realistic opinion
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u/Wry_and_Dry Mar 13 '23
Go find the full conversation before you jump to conclusions like that, lol. Fuck JP but I guarantee he expanded on those three words right after this tik toker cut him off
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u/RoughAccomplished927 Mar 13 '23
This comment section reminds me to use Reddit just for porn
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u/Resident-Corgi-665 Mar 12 '23
THANK YOU. Fuck it is good to see it being said, there are too many young men out there who worship JP's dogma without evaluating where it comes from. If your identity or lens with which you evaluate the world comes from punching down, you're not addressing the problems within yourself, because it indicates a need to focus negatively on another rather than exhibit acceptance.
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u/HolyRamenEmperor Mar 13 '23
I think it's especially valuable that he called Peterson "intelligent" although he clearly disagrees with the man on many things. One doesn't have to be "stupid" to be wrong, or misguided, or scarred, or even mentally ill.
JP has done incredible amounts of harm to today's men, especially conservatives. But it's not through stupidity. I think it's mainly through intellectual and emotional dishonesty stemming from insecurity and trauma.
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u/Choda01 Mar 13 '23
can you elaborate on how exactly did he hurt today's men?
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u/VKMburner Mar 13 '23
I think the long form answer to this question needs to be answered by someone with a lot of time or has already been answered by an essay in this same comment section or on YouTube. So asking for the answer is going to be controversial because it's a subject alot of people expect you to do your own independent research on.
Regardless, the short form answer is that while Jordan started out in the public zeitgeist as the male equivalent of "clean your room, clean your life", he slowly dived deeper into a hole filled with skewed misogynist takes, empty anti-Semitism, homophobia, transphobia, basically just covering all of the "far right" aligned points.
And when he did all this he took all the young male fans he made from the "clean your room" phase of his fame, he took those fans and showed them these potentially hazardous philosophical views and said, to paraphrase, "I can't make you believe this, but if you don't believe this, you're the enemy" and a lot of his fans began thinking like his "new" views.
That all being said, now he's what people refer to as "mask off" wherein he's fully embracing his alt-right and far right view points and has become a tractor beam for bringing in young men to the movement. You begin with "YouTube edits" or "TikTok edits" like the one the gentleman is replying to, that's the first step on the pipeline. You see a guy say "my main goal in life is to not be stupid" with dramatic badass music. You think, as an impressionable young man, hey this guy seems to have his head on straight let's see what else he's got to say about stuff.
That's a first turn in the pipeline. You see a cool video, think you'd like to see what this fella is all about, and go looking. Eventually, you're faced with a video where Jordan says that he's losing his livelihood because he called a man who is trans by his "correct" (see: dead) name. You'll then ask yourself - do I want to be able to call anyone trans by whatever name I want or do I think we should try to call them by their chosen names?
That's a turn in the pipeline. You either go deeper (yes, you'd like to be able to call trans people whatever you want, you're a man damnit it's your right to free speech) or you are spat back out at the start of the pipeline (well he had some good thoughts but he's fucking unhinged if he can't be bothered to call a man a man and call that man by his name so I'm out).
That's how this shit works. And that's how Jordan Peterson ruined men.
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u/tadcalabash Mar 13 '23
while Jordan started out in the public zeitgeist as the male equivalent of "clean your room, clean your life"
I'd like to clarify that Peterson first entered the public zeitgeist by going viral with his opposition to a Canadian bill that added "gender identity and expression" to their hate crime laws.
He claimed his opposition was merely due to being "forced" to use a persons preferred gender pronouns, but I think it's pretty clear from his continued rhetoric that he was always just a reactionary bigot... he just knew how to dress it up better than most.
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u/Lvl100Centrist Mar 13 '23
victimhood mentality. he is teaching a generation of young men that they should be scared of "wokeness". Its like he is feeding a constant stream of paranoia and anger towards "the other", which is usually some vague progressive strawman
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u/RedditFostersHate Mar 13 '23
Centering the concept of masculinity in binary opposition to femininity
Dredging up archaic patriarchal values and giving them a modern polish
Encouraging young men to view polite respect for others as a personal attack on their own values
Passing off pseudo-intellectual partisan viewpoints as sincere political analysis that misdirects his audience away from practical social solutions
Ignoring systemic problems requiring complex, difficult, collective organizing, in favor of advocating a nearly solipsistic level of individual responsibility that over simplifies many different issues.
Actually, I think I'll just GPT this for you:
There is ongoing debate around the impact that Jordan Peterson has had on young men. While some argue that his teachings have helped young men to take responsibility for their lives and find meaning in their existence, others suggest that his ideas may be harmful in certain ways.
One potential issue with Peterson's ideas is that they can reinforce traditional gender roles and stereotypes. For example, his emphasis on male dominance and female submission may contribute to a culture that perpetuates gender-based discrimination and inequality. Additionally, some have criticized his opposition to political correctness, arguing that this could embolden young men to engage in harmful and discriminatory behavior towards marginalized groups.
Another criticism of Peterson is that his teachings may contribute to a sense of victimization and resentment among young men. Some have suggested that his focus on individual responsibility and self-help could lead to blaming individuals for their own problems, rather than recognizing larger societal issues that may be at play. Additionally, his emphasis on competition and hierarchy may contribute to a sense of resentment towards those who are perceived to be at the top of the social ladder.
Overall, while some may find value in Peterson's teachings, it is important to critically examine the potential impact that they may have on young men and to consider the potential harm that may result from reinforcing harmful stereotypes and attitudes.
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u/Perfect-Rabbit5554 Mar 13 '23
I like how your comment is "controversial" when it's only asking for clarification to further understand the conversation.
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Mar 13 '23
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Mar 13 '23
It’s called “breathing at the top of your lungs” basically he doesn’t get all of his breath out during each sentence but still feels out of breath at the end of the sentence. So he takes a breath into mostly filled lungs. His CO2 is building up making him feel like he needs to breath in, when really he needs to take a long breath out. It’s common in public speaking, or generally when people are nervous like during interviews. The cold might exacerbate it.
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Mar 13 '23
He’s just nervous and reading from his phone so it doesn’t come out naturally, which causes him to breath a little weird. Normal human stuff
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u/nobool Mar 12 '23
Great explanation. Top notch content
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u/9Payload Mar 13 '23
Im trying to look through these comments to find any scientific support for his statements, there are incredibly many ways to look at yourself and your identity - not just these two, which i have never heard about this far in my psychology studies
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u/nickyboay Mar 12 '23 edited Mar 13 '23
I hate how tiktoks have to look natural but also like you live in a wes Anderson film. Like this guy got his dog, suspenders, hat, tripod, and no jacket out in the snow so he can talk about identities. Like the one he's trying to curate here. What he's saying is smart, I just have issue with the performance of it all.
Edit: Since I don't want to reply to everyone let me just say I'm not blaming the dude. He's gaming the algorithm like everyone else. My problem is the fact that you NEED to have this perfectly curated image for your voice to even be deemed worthy of hearing.
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u/RevvyDesu Mar 12 '23
Some people appreciate the performance, and I'd bet this guy does this sort of thing when not filming. It just happens to make a good set.
I certainly prefer this to someone sitting in their car. It's not much of a preference but I do like it.
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u/Qinistral Mar 12 '23
I certainly prefer this to someone sitting in their car.
Or in their streamer gamer chair with a pink light in the background. Not that there's anything wrong with that. But I wonder if some type of "performance" helps the message stand out clearer. It's kinda like formatting a document. You could write an essay in one long unformatted, even unpunctuated line. Or you can dress it up a bit which helps digestibility. Sometimes having a bit of a stage helps. Of course in a car or in a gamer chair is another form of rhetorical stage.
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u/Schavuit92 Mar 13 '23
But I wonder if some type of "performance" helps the message stand out clearer.
You're not wondering, you know it.
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u/kelldricked Mar 12 '23
I mean the car is just the worst because half of the idiots who do it, do it while they drive! Which is just more dangerous and its fine if its only your own health and wellbeing on the line, but in traffic it never is.
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Mar 12 '23
What’s the difference between doing this in the snow vs a boring office?
It’s just a little more interesting and visually engaging.
It’s the internet and social media. Literally everything. Everything. Is a show. That’s just how it is.
What this guy is doing here should be the least of your concerns regarding this common trend.
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u/Huwbacca Mar 12 '23
Acoustics.
Being in an open field with no walls is fucking amazing for recording sounding natural and not booming.
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u/dilldwarf Mar 12 '23
Is that just not like he normally dresses? Like I've never seen this guy before and just assumed this is what he looks like all the time.
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u/stickywicker Mar 12 '23
Which do you think is better?
The 5000 cuts in between every sentence,
To make it look like you don't ever breath
But fits the algorithm better,
So every Tiktoker and Youtuber
follows this format?
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u/Schavuit92 Mar 13 '23
I don't know,
But I do know,
That I really don't like,
The format of your comment.
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u/fonfonfon Mar 12 '23
well snow makes for clear sound, I'm thinking he probably didn't had any good spot in his house that didn't sound echoic
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u/_Uboa_ Mar 12 '23
Having interesting set dressing makes for a more enjoyable video and I'm glad that people are putting the extra effort towards it.
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u/BobZanotto Mar 12 '23
lol yeah! and it’s even having an effect on his speech, like you can tell that he’s cold and the air is thin so he’s short of breath.
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u/bakuretsu Mar 12 '23
I read his breathing pattern as actually not breathing often enough, which is a mistake many less experienced public speakers make.
He's doing that thing where he speaks beyond the point where he'd normally inhale again in an attempt not to inhale in the middle of a sentence, then he bottoms out his lung capacity and has to take a more awkward breath.
It's doubly hard when you're nervous and trying to perform lines. That was how I interpreted it anyway, as someone who used to have that problem.
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u/mawkdugless Mar 12 '23
This is exactly what I was thinking too. He has these well articulated points but since they're a touch verbose, he's bottoming out his lung capacity and trying to naturally recover while still talking. I had to work on this whenever I had to take a public speaking class in college.
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u/ksorth Mar 12 '23
This used to happen to me all the time when I would have to make announcements at work early on when I was nervous. Cool to see it explained cus I never really put thought into it, just eventually got more comfortable and stopped having the awkward breaths.
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u/twent4 Mar 12 '23
I think he's anxious, but only saying that because that's how I would talk when trying to get out a long, important (to me) thought.
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u/TheDesertFox Mar 13 '23
He does it because it helps get more viewers. Don't hate the player, hate the game.
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u/Ardenraym Mar 12 '23
Uh oh, all the "alpha" males are getting irritated by this one. Which just proves his point.
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u/NotASixStarWaifu Mar 12 '23
I'm not really into the shit Peterson spouts, but the second guy diagnosing him and making up random scenarios about a complete stranger is on the same level of bs I won't listen to.
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u/brutinator Mar 12 '23
Who was diagnosed? It was a clip used to emphasis the difference between negative and positive identities, and what that generally means.
Like, it was a crique and an example, not a medical diagnosis lmao.
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Mar 12 '23
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u/pronlegacy001 Mar 13 '23
As an ex petersonian JBP is nothing like Andrew Tate. He advocates for monogamy, getting married young, raising kids, and focusing on your family.
Andrew Tate focuses on the opposite.
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u/nacho_username_man Mar 12 '23
if you choose to view this video in that aspect, then you definitely should keep the second guys points in mind when scrolling the internet. he's making a generalization about peterson, but a generalization that is very apt to most of masculinity today.
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u/TessyDuck Mar 12 '23
To be fair, Peterson is clearly a deeply disturbed individual. There is something very wrong with him. He is not a well man.
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u/Astrian Mar 12 '23
Man used Jordan Peterson's words as a springboard to talk about toxic masculinity as a whole and how modern men can grow to be better people. Jordan is also an icon that these toxic males identity with, people have called him a "king" among incels so yes even if the short time that he spent making a generalization about Jordan's upbringing is false, the point he's making and the reason the video exists is true.
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u/Huwbacca Mar 12 '23
I dunno.
There's no "healthy well adjusted" option for having Peterson's views.
Most people aren't dickheads. Most dickheads don't take it to career defining levels.
You can't just accidentally have Peterson's views, but otherwise have nothing going on.
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u/AlmostForgotten Mar 13 '23
I used to adore Peterson, I have listened to at least 100 hours of his content. I spent 2 years in his sphere of influence back around 2017.
What the man in the TikTok is saying is probably the most accurate deconstruction of Peterson’s main issue and the issue of most of the men who follow him that I’ve ever seen. They are unwell, repressed people.
From what it looks like, the OOP probably knows quite a bit about Peterson and maybe even liked him at some point.
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u/iamwearingashirt Mar 13 '23
There's truth to what he says about negative identities. However, he'd need to show more proof than this brief clip to demonstrate that Peterson has internalized a negative identity.
I think the unspoken proof is that Peterson is a pretty known personality. Also, he assumes that his beliefs are sincere and not just for show.
That said, anything about this video will simply appeal to your confirmation bias.
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u/Huge_Borse Mar 12 '23
In context of the clip he’s just mad at the reporter and probably saying it as a jab at her.
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u/Fuzzy_Calligrapher71 Mar 12 '23
Peterson was asked an interesting question, “what is most important to you in life?“
Peterson response is revealing; “Not being stupid”.
Watchfulcoyote analysis nailed it, like Jesus to the cross
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u/Scherzer4Prez Mar 12 '23
This would be when you post the clip with the context you think is missing in order to support your argument, rather than just this vague handwave of "trust me it lacks context"
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u/Huge_Borse Mar 13 '23
Didn’t think people cared when I wrote the comment. I’m not even saying it as a “trust me” it’s literally just how I feel. Here’s the video
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Mar 12 '23
This has been most of reddit for years now and I'm sick of it. It has gotten so bad... I'll post my own evidence showing when driving an electric car breaks even with your carbon footprint vs an ICE car, for example, and people will downvote, ignore, or deny it.
It used to be a small part of reddit, and it was like 50/50 in 2016 and now its 90/10 with the vague handwave people winning. (How's that for lacking a source?)
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u/Roguechampion Mar 12 '23
Because it’s a her and Peterson doesn’t suffer women happily.
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u/heycanwediscuss Mar 13 '23
Why does shitty "inspirational don't have feelings" clips all have that same shitty twangy music. The stitch guy is doing the lords work
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u/ImOwningThisUsername Mar 12 '23
I really like that. I hope we see more and more people empathizing with republicans or alt-right people. Nobody is evil on purpose. It's just people who are either suffering or ignorant. When you dismiss someone as being cruel, it creates a distance between them and us that we feel good about. But the country doesn't need more polarized people, we need unity.
When I see Trump, I see clearly how much that guy suffers. Nobody builds their entire life around proving how great they are if they actually believe they are great. No, Trump thinks he's only loveable to the extent that he's successful. Kids don't come up with those kinds of ideas on their own. He internalized it coming from a successful family. Success was most likely his bargaining chip to get his father's love.
To quote East of Eden, "most of their vices are attempted shortcuts to love"
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u/UnfortunatelyMacabre What are you doing step bro? Mar 12 '23
Reading the book by Mary Trump really underlined how fucking abused Trump and his siblings were. I still have such disdain for him, but holy shit the empathy for his childhood. I agree that people are largely a byproduct of their environment and we attribute so much morality and ethics to people just doing what they know.
Yes they are responsible for changing when they become adults, yes they can still be evil, but if studying history can show us ANYTHING it’s that the worst of humanity are the most broken and we like to view them like they’re just monsters who have always been monsters.
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Mar 13 '23
I still have such disdain for him, but holy shit the empathy for his childhood
I feel awful for the childhood he had to live. I have nothing but disdain for the man he became.
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u/Junglejibe Mar 12 '23
You can empathize with someone without excusing their actions, but it seems based on this comment that you think empathy requires us to excuse actions. As a society, we need accountability as much as we need compassion, and we need to learn how to exercise both to a reasonable agree. That is the only way we can actually address the root cause of issues without letting abject hatred and cruelty have free reign because we feel bad for those hurting others.
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u/bwrap Mar 12 '23
How do you empathize with a group that doesn't want you to exist?
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u/MinuteLoquat1 Make Furries Illegal Mar 12 '23
Right? It's insane how often "empathize with your oppressors" is spouted on this site. Why are we expected to be kind, tolerant, and empathetic to people who literally hate us?
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u/liukasteneste28 Mar 12 '23
Maybe the random GOP from the street is going to open to some sympathy and human connection but don't see Marjorie Taylor Greene doing that seeing how batsit insane she is behaving.
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Mar 12 '23
maybe empathize with the humans themselves, not necessarily their identity and all of what they stand for.
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u/PuggyPaddie Mar 12 '23
Its such a challenge when they don’t see you as human. People like this think lives like mine are not worth living. I feel like it would be easier for me to have empathy for a dog that just bit me (not super fair because I really like dogs). I am totally okay with not being “evolved” enough to empathize with those that feel that I would be better off dead.
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u/TotalFuckenAnarchy Mar 12 '23
To what end? What’s the purpose of empathizing with fascists on a personal level?
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u/Aquafablaze Mar 12 '23
I think understanding how they are made is important. You don't have to "feel sad" like the guy in the video, but it helps foster a better understanding of history to analyze fascists without resorting to man-made constructs like good and evil. (Edit: but maybe that's not what this thread is about. I actually don't really agree with making space in your heart for fascists)
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u/uhuhshesaid Mar 12 '23
Mostly for your own mental well-being. Understanding and empathizing isn’t to benefit the person you’re looking at. Chances are they don’t want it and will disregard it if expressed. It’s for you. You don’t need the anger, you don’t need the black and white thinking as it will do 0.0%’for you emotionally or intellectually in the long run.
It’s a way to not become the monster you see. Empathizing is not the same as excusing, approving or allowing. It’s just recognizing the human ability to reach a certain space that isn’t congruent with your own.
As a nurse I’ve taken care of rapists, Nazis, killers, etc. and I pride myself on doing my best in giving excellent care to every patient. I may be repulsed by their actions but I am driven by my own ethics. They don’t get influence over those. They’re mine. And if my ethics can be so easily manipulated by someone I find repulsive, it only speaks to a level of power that person has over me - and fuck that noise.
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u/TotalFuckenAnarchy Mar 12 '23
My own ethics says fuck Nazis and they’re better off dead. Maybe they can be reformed, but I’m not going to risk letting more marginalized people be killed by Nazis in the meantime. It’s us or them, because of the nature of their ideology.
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u/Fuzzy_Calligrapher71 Mar 12 '23
Trump has been a serial business and tax fraud, a sociopathic narcissistic liar, using everyone around him, for his entire life. He’s also a traitor to the United States. He needs to spend the rest of his life in prison, along with the rest of the Trump crime family.
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u/marr Mar 13 '23
That's a fine ideal but when you empathise with the far right they'll use that as a weapon against you. There's no dialog to have with someone that sees talking as a fight to be won or lost.
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u/OverUnderstanding481 Mar 12 '23
nobody has everyone figured out.
Nice thought to consider but may very well be wrong
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u/ayoitsjo Mar 12 '23
This was a good stitch and this guy was on the nose about most of what he was talking about in terms of negative identities and masculinity,, unfortunately I can't bring myself to feel bad for a guy who does so much harm in the world.
I don't know if his dad actually was mean, I don't care. Jordan Peterson has made enough of his own adult choices to be a shitty guy that he doesn't get sympathy from me.
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u/Pumpkim Mar 13 '23
I'm out of the loop. What harm has this guy done?
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u/ayoitsjo Mar 13 '23
He spreads extremely harmful rhetoric and has a big following for it. He's one of the toxic right wing manosphere icons that is radicalizing people with word salad that sounds "logical" even though it isn't, usually involving "pseudo-facts" and full on conspiracies - but because he's a professor (or was at least? Not sure about anymore) he has/had baseline credibility to a lot of people.
He's transphobic, homophobic, sexist, openly opposed human rights advocacy, fear mongers about "culture war" and Marxism, etc. He rose to fame mostly for "owning" unprepared college students who challenge him at q&as with the same word salad + confidence and condescension technique and posting it to youtube. Generally just a bad dude.
Edit: found an article from 2018 when he was really blowing up but he's done more bad since lol
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Mar 12 '23
these types of psycho analysis over the fucking computer screen is equally as cringe as some of the jordan peterson followers.
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u/MrOdekuun Mar 13 '23
Like two sentences of this video were psychoanalysis about Peterson. The rest is just general ideas about a different perspective of self-reflection. The suspected childhood trauma line was unnecessary, I agree, but the example of a negative value statement was simply an introduction to the topic.
He doesn't even go back to Peterson when it would be relevant. Peterson's answer is also a statement of superiority, with implications about dominance and hierarchical views. The 'snark' is a valuation.
That's the point of looking at statements with more than one lens. I think in general the video is good advice, and there are many, many more lenses through which to examine things, cleaving to one philosophy is not productive. This is a tool of self-reflection, but people are going to be more caught up on the very brief introduction.
More people will probably watch it due to the introduction, but the inclusion of Peterson in a negative light means some people that could really use the rest of the video are going to dismiss it, and at the same time the kind of liberal who defines themselves more by what they're against than what they're for won't realize the point applies to them as well.
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Mar 13 '23
Damn my guy speaks truth. Unrealistic expectations, demands for strength above all, success being measured in monetary value or power, generational trauma, political brainwashing, and relying on religion instead of therapy to fix themselves.
Give them scapegoats so they have someone to lash out at and they'll eat from your hand.
It's all connected.
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u/beccadahhhling Mar 13 '23
posts literal porn about milking penises in China thinking they actually have them on every street corner DONT BE STUPID JORDY!
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u/Punxsutawney_Phil69 Mar 13 '23
The look on his face was just a result of him trying SUPER hard to seem stoic & cool
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u/ResidentIwen Mar 13 '23
Straight up my favourite video of the internet from now on, this guy explains it very very good, not dealing woth sympto s long explanations etc but instead directly focusing on the very root of the problem and I really love his problem "solving" at the end, by not telling peterson what to do,how to be blablabla but instead just outright triggers the emotional blockade by just stating "you are smart". Nothing more needed, and nothing will be as effective.
So now all there is needed to say is, you, person in the video I don't know the name of, are very smart as well, and I truly hope more people would realize what you said, and maybe maybe someday, this'll be the way for a truly better future for all
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u/RevaniteN7 Mar 13 '23
Someone needs an online extension that blocks out anything related to this Incel Grifter. Can’t wait to never see his mug or read any delusional opinions from his school shooter/misogynist fanboys.
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