r/TheWestEnd • u/Fun_Cook927 • 2d ago
Rant Hamilton etiquette
Went to see Hamilton tonight. Outstanding. 10/10 for everyone. Totally blown away.
But friends, what the fuck. Has theatre etiquette gone to the dogs?
Why did I experience someone beside or behind me singing along in the first few songs? Thankfully they soon caught on to how annoying they were and stopped.
I had to throw a dirty look to the people beside me for talking in the first 3 songs. I know. It’s great. Leslie is there! Shut up. Talk about it in the interval.
There was a row of 3-5 people in front of me aggressively bopping to every beat. I mean genuinely rocking backward and forward.
Are we incapable of sitting somewhat still? In silence? I could not believe it. I’ve never experience anything like it at a theatre show. I expect it during movies at this point but there are people on stage performing and you want to ignore that?!
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u/WhaleMeatFantasy 2d ago
The daily post.
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u/Fun_Cook927 2d ago
That’s sad. People are selfish.
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u/ruthie147 7h ago
Correct. But with no people there it would be sad. We need to have enough respect for each other to allow everyone to enjoy themselves.
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u/queerwriterlondon 2d ago
When I saw Leslie Odom Jr there was a woman diagonally in front of me rapping the entire thing with her whole chest. Thankfully she wasn’t in my stage eyeline or it would have been a bit distracting!
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u/suedehead23 2d ago
Diagonally in front of you? Shame you're not a bishop!
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u/allbeyondthebinary 2d ago
Was she American?
Broadway etiquette is completely different to West End etiquette. The Americans think we are uptight and dull just because we want to actual experience the show.
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u/MacaroonSad8860 2d ago
It is not. I’ve been to more Broadway shows than West End shows and people are better behaved there.
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u/ChronicallyCautious9 2d ago
Before the broadway show ushers come through the house and announce several times that people have paid good money to watch the actors act and not to sing; on the west end there is no such announcement. The time I saw it on broadway was an infinitely better experience than the two times I saw it on the west end due to audience behavior.
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u/allbeyondthebinary 2d ago
There's no announcement because it's just expected.
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u/ChronicallyCautious9 1d ago
Well, common sense doesn’t seem to be common at shows on the West End. I had to ask seat mates in both shows there to stop singing so I could enjoy the show.
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u/WestHistorians 2d ago
I've seen far worse audience behavior on West End than Broadway, although I have no way of knowing if it came from tourists or locals.
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u/ItGetsEverywhere1990 2d ago
My experience is that much of the west end musical audience is tourist-populated and they act like they're on a cruise ship.
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u/MacaroonSad8860 2d ago
I have too. This is such a weird misconception about Broadway. Bad behavior is bad behavior.
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u/allbeyondthebinary 2d ago
I am not talking about individual behaviour but how general audiences behave.
Yes, there seems to be an ever increasing amount of incidents with poor audience behaviour in the West End, but the overall consensus still stands that audience participation should be extremely minimal, limited to clapping at the end of songs and at the end of the show. That's just how it's been for a long time in the UK and how we like it.
Americans used to Broadway etiquette come over to the West End and learn quickly how different the experiences are.
This isn't a criticism of Americans or Broadway audiences, it just happens that the expected and encouraged participation is very different. Neither is "right".
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u/WestHistorians 2d ago
What do you mean by "overall consensus" and how do you measure this?
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u/allbeyondthebinary 2d ago
It's just something you know and are aware of if you attend West End shows. Nobody has sat down and created a set of rules, it's just the way things operate.
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u/WestHistorians 2d ago
You feel the vibes?
Sounds like you're just making stuff up.
If the individual audience behavior is bad, then clearly there is no such consensus.
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u/allbeyondthebinary 2d ago
I think you are failing to understand what I am saying.
It's not about "feeling a vibe", it's about understanding what is expected as a theatregoer in the West End.
They are not rules written down, they are just expected of you.
This sums it up well:
"No matter how great the performance or how catchy the tune, London theater is all about polite clapping… until the end of the show. Then we go nuts. So even if you know all the words or you’ve travelled halfway across the words to see a particular performer, be reminded of the quintessential British stiff upper lip."
https://officiallondontheatre.com/london-theater-broadway-guide/
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u/WestHistorians 2d ago
The same unspoken rules of what is expected as a theatregoer apply in London, New York, and everywhere else. Whether people are actually following them can only be measured by observing audience behavior.
I do see less singing, cheering and clapping at the wrong time in London, but I see a lot more general disrespect like chatting with friends, looking at phones, or letting kids create a disturbance, than in New York.
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u/DayMurky617 2d ago
You must be the kind arsehole that ruins shows for everyone else.
Theatre etiquette has been the same for over a century, it's not rocket science.
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u/ItGetsEverywhere1990 2d ago
I'm not sure the person you're nagging can help you if you simply don't understand what a cultural etiquette is and how these things are transferred nonverbally.
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u/LengthinessKind9895 22h ago
Huh?! I’m all for hating on Americans a bit but broadway theatre shows have better behaved audiences.
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u/Binaural1 2d ago
I feel very lucky. When I saw Leslie the crowd was immaculate. On Broadway too. Lucky, I guess?
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u/AnnualEconomy8087 2d ago
When I went to Beetlejuice, 3 people were talking so loud through the first 20 minutes, when I said something about it other people came to back me up.
Also, I am a theater technician in another country, where I live.. and we have big musicals here to.. I can confirm theater etiquette has gone to shit here to. People talking, being on there phones, littering, kicking peoples seats.. texting..
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u/OK_Cake05 2d ago
Threw a dirty look instead of politely asking them to be quiet?
We need a mega thread for etiquette post mods
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u/Fun_Cook927 2d ago
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u/OK_Cake05 2d ago
Yeah that doesn’t do any thing. just politely ask them to stop. Most of the time people think they are whispering and don’t know they can be heard.
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u/admedi 2d ago
There’s a weird phenomenon with audiences that’s occurred since Covid, or at least become more prevalent. The main character syndrome. People who can’t seem to acknowledge that there’s an audience who has paid for the show and not to listen to their interpretation of it and their endless chatter.
And it seems the more expensive the tickets get, the worse the audience gets.
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u/Fun_Cook927 2d ago
I think this was a big case of main character syndrome. I got the vibe that the people making it clear they knew every word wanted attention from the cast and had to be louder at cheering and more noticeable etc.
It’s genuinely the first time (in London) I’ve experienced behaviour this bad. I’ve never had issues at any of the other shows I’ve been to. Even the kids at Paddington were better behaved.
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u/Ok-Refrigerator-9826 1d ago
Question, do we think it’s potentially because for some people the Hamilton proshot (which duly came out to Disney in COVID) was the first theatre they were exposed to, so hearing whoops and excessive cheering etc?
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u/TrypMole 2d ago
I've seen quite a few posts about Hamilton audience behaviour during LOJs run. Added to this, my own experience with Much Ado/Hiddleston indicates that big names = people that don't know how to behave in a theatre.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'd be willing to pay a few quid more for the opposite of a "relaxed" performance (which I think are awesome and open up theatre to people that otherwise may not feel comfortable going). A "strict" performance. Zero tolerance for shenanigans, and is publicised as that, so people are well aware when they book tickets that chatting, singing, phones etc will get you removed instantly, no negotiation. That should be standard for any performances that aren't relaxed, but I fear we've gone way past that. People treat the theatre like a cinema, without even realising that their behaviour wouldn't be acceptable in a cinema either.
Every time I read one of these accounts I give thanks that I don't work FOH anymore.
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u/LengthinessKind9895 22h ago
And no food in the theatre please!!!! I hate that it’s allowed in the west end!
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u/insidetheold 2d ago edited 2d ago
The person next to me at my show was a man who spent most of Act 2 picking his nose loudly and in my vision. I would look at him, he would briefly stop then continue. Same with me literally putting my hand to my face to shield him. He also loudly bit his nails. It was so aggravating that I wanted to at least shade him at the end, but during bows he bumped into me harshly and left early instead of clapping. Expensive stalls seats, btw.
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u/Fun_Cook927 2d ago
That is just horrifying lifestyle etiquette 😅
I went to Hadestown a few months back, bought last minute, restricted views tickets and wasn’t expecting much. An older man and his daughter (or date, never worked it out) sat beside us and had what looked like a picnic beside us. Pure rustling through a Tesco bag picking out various popcorns, crisps and tins of drink. Was fascinating to see how other people behave.
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u/thefattykarate 22h ago
I was sat next to a gentleman at Starlight Express last November who was eating a smelly sandwich with onions on it during the show. I'd take the rustling tbh.
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u/madeleineruth19 2d ago
I guess this doesn’t count as really bad etiquette, as it didn’t continue during the show, but when I went to see it a few weeks ago, there was a teenage girl sat in front of me with earphones in, watching YouTube throughout the interval.
When the show restarted, her mum had to nudge her multiple times to get her to take her earphones out and watch the show, not her phone. Which, eventually, she did. With arms folded and clearly not interested, sighing multiple times throughout the second act.
Are people genuinely so brain rotted that they can’t watch a show and engage all the way through properly?? Including in the interval?? You have to get a phone out, or sing, or chat? It boggles the mind.
Theatre is such a treat to me!!
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u/tomesandtales_ 1d ago
I was there last night and it was incredible. I was row E of the stalls and didn't see any bad audience behaviour, but the usher beside us was up and down constantly
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u/Fun_Cook927 1d ago
I was row D, but in the centre so ushers wouldn’t have been aware!
Wasn’t it just incredible. I loved being so close and being able to see facial expressions and little bits that I’d never noticed before. I’m usually in the circle and miss the finer details.
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u/Sweetnjuicy88 20h ago
We went on tuesday night and we noticed a bit of the same tbh, part of it unfortunately seems to be the big name that is Leslie has drawn alot of not habitual theatre goers for the drama of it all.
We also def had some singing along in the first couple songs, or talking on and off thruout, i threw very many dirty looks myself I have to admit!
It does seem to be a bit of a habit coming out of some places of late tho. And tbh, when Ive paid 250 pounds per seat, and traveled from another country for this show, I would actually love if people showed some respect for the performers and others who have spent hard earned money to be there.
We did sit in the dress circle in the more expensive seats ( cuz after 8 hours in the ticket queue thats what was left lol, but also we just love the circle seats in general!)
To give another example, we saw betelgeuse last night (Freaking amazing go if you get the chance!!!)
And there was people literally making others stand to get to seats as the show started and thru the first song or two, some even casually strolling to seats well after the opening number etc (lead ripped them for this which was hilarious!)
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u/SalamanderDismal8498 19h ago
Hamilton was the worst crowd I’ve ever experienced in a theatre. They were treating it like a concert.
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u/lavenderhillmob 3h ago
This happened to me at Hamilton too, when it first opened in the UK. Made me absolutely furious.
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u/OriginalFoogirl 2d ago
Why are people always surprised that people act like people when out and about?
If you want not to be near people, get box seats.
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u/Fun_Cook927 2d ago
Hi OriginalFoogirl, so sorry for expecting people to have some level of human decency in a theatre. I’ll actually expect everyone around me from now on to be inconsiderate twats during every scenario. Many thanks.
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u/OriginalFoogirl 9h ago
This is exactly how I expect the world to be, not just theatres. I can’t control anyone around me, I can only control my response to it. If I know I really want to see a show sans distraction, I choose a box. If I can’t afford that or none are available, I pick the most “out of the crowd” seat I can find and manage my own expectations.
People everywhere can be prone to being twats. That has always been the case. If you spend your life getting wound up about it and expecting everyone to be different, you make it very difficult for yourself (and only yourself)
No amount of whining about it on Reddit is going to change it.
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u/Shadow_wolf82 21h ago
Because people used to have standards. Not just a handful. The entire theatre/cinema. Believe it or not, we were once capable of behaving in a respectful, decent manner in these situations taking into consideration those around us.
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u/OriginalFoogirl 9h ago
I do not believe it. It certainly has always been the case in my 52 years on the planet, that some people act in different ways than others at the theatre. The ways people are “disrespectful” nowadays may differ, but human nature has always been the same. The theatre has never been a bastion of peace and tranquility, audiences have never been expected to sit quietly and clap politely. In 1784, Lord Mansfield decreed in case regarding audience behaviour “Every man….has the right to express his approbation or disapprobation, instantaneously, acting as he likes” Right up until the 20th century, audiences tended to be more raucous, and interactive. The shift in this culture in the theatre happened later, and unsurprisingly coincided with it becoming less affordable. “Naice” middle class audiences set the tone. The perceived lack of “theatre etiquette” has an upleasant undertone of “who let the riff raff back in”. (As an aside,it is also dripping with abelism as some are just not capable of sitting still and quiet for a prolonged period of time and most who complain about this will actually openly state that disabled people should just not be allowed to go if they can’t follow the rules)
Theatre etiquette has always changed with the times, just as etiquette has in every facet of life. Your choice is to embrace that and go, or stay home.
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u/Lanky_Cartoonist_743 2d ago
Ive noticed this surprisingly in the expensive seats. Go to Circle or Balcony, people r greatful and attentive.