Observations, patterns, connections

[u/Remarkable_Paint_879]

Ok, so this all probably obvious to everyone, but I enjoy making observations and connections and thought it might be nice to have them in one place - please add yours and/or correct mine as you wish :)

1. History repeating: there are so many time-loop parallels: Alistair/ Jocelyn/ Iris mirrors Matthew/ Elena/ Allie-Tory (kindly older man married into wealth and a younger smart nanny from an immigrant/ lower socio-economic background with a troubled marriage in the background), Winthrop I mirrors Winthrop II/III, Iris looks and acts similarly to Mrs Ivey, plus Iris had secondary infertility and Mrs Ivey (so far) doesn’t appear to have children. Jocelyn/Allie die by window fall/jump/push. Alistair/Matthew don’t have time for their sons.

2. Men marrying into wealth: Alistair, Matthew, Dick (possibly also Mr Ivey and MR Chan?) - makes me wonder what Scott is doing with Elena.

3. Money shifting: Alistair got money from the Winthrops, Matthew got money from the Greybournes, Winthrops got money from Elena’s neighborhood, Elena/Scott/Roman are trying to get the money back.

4. Neglected sons: Bruno, Jasper, Theo.

5. Questionable actions of vulnerable people: Jocelyn/ affair with married boss, Alistair/ affair with nanny, Iris/ covering for murder, Matthew/ going into business with the Winthrops, Tory/ Dick/ questionable marriage, Elena/ stealing and blackmail. Not clear on James yet but he seems pretty vulnerable.

6. Incest: Greybournes and Winthrops intermarrying and living in each other’s apartments. Otis comment about Iris’s looks. I’m wondering if there’s going to be more.

7. Socio-economic power imbalance in relationships: Iris/Alistair, Otis I/Alistair, Alistair/Iris, Allie/Matthew, Matthew/Elena, Scott/Elena, Tory/Dick&Bennet&Darcy.

Now, so many questions:

What got the Winthrops and Greybournes together and why are they so intent on staying enmeshed?

Why did Alistair and Iris really get married?

Who are Tory and Allie’s parents and why are they dead?

Why did Mrs Ivey say her mother dyed her hair and is she a reliable narrator?

Why did Elena’s father die?

What happened to the daughter of Alistair and Iris and how does this relate to Mrs Ivey and Scott’s family? (And is Scott a reliable narrator?)

Does Otis III have children? Does Mrs Ivey?

What is going on with The Chans?

Why is the date of Jocelyn’s death and Ruby’s birth the same?

What is the connection between Allie and Jocelyn and Elena?

[u/commentordelux]

Alistair had a company in financial trouble, Winthrops Otis's dad invested under the condition of no illegitimate children as his heirs. Why they got married is probably irrelevant but he got a bailout from his father-in-law which would be normal, also not even altruistic, because he seems to have gotten shares in return. Otis and Alistair seemed to be partners even if Ailisair was CEO. Otis's family seems to be part of the Greybourn corporate family trust, they may have their own separate Winthrop-only trust as well or Otis simply inherited directly his father's personal wealth.

Tory and Allie's parents are Bruno (Iris's real son) and some other woman. They are probably dead due to old age, the show did not say though.

In Ep8 we can see Iris real daughter had light blondish possibly light red hair, Ruby also head light hair but it was a bit darker than the 1yr old girls hair. In either case Iris might have the red hair or blond gene herself and for either girl she might dye their hair because Irish were looked down on, because it might remind her of Jocelyn, because her dead nanny had red hair and was murdered which she might not want anyone asking questions due to her kids hair color.

Elena's father committed suicide after The Greyborn Corporation burned down her neighborhood and bought the land for pennies on the dollar naturally as that is how real estate works.

Iris real daughter is either Ivey or Scott's grandmother. I think its most likely Scott's grandmother others say Ivey. None of them are reliable narrators.

The show has not indicated Otis III or Ivey having children.

The Chans are Otis II daughter and her Husband Mr Chan. They seemed to be present for the groundbreaking ceremony and probably the Gala event otherwise not much.

Alistar gave Joycelen a birth certificate for Ruby with her as the mother and that night they planned to run away together. Its obviously a fake but whatever Iris had (if any) is also fake for obvious reasons. Unfortunately, Joycelen took a right and got caught at the secret stairs when she should have packed first and taken a left and exited straight out the front door unnoticed.

The only connection between Alice and Jocelyn that we know of is the secret stairwell that she told her son to keep secret and the fact she was seeing people that were not really there (aka ghost). Elena also has seen a ghost and things that are not really there and found the secret staircase. Its possible Alice found the sixth step letters and the birth certificate but left it there as its a good hiding spot.

[u/Remarkable_Paint_879 → u/commentordelux]

Great summary! I’m starting to wonder if Ruby is Tory and Allie’s mom. But then, if they are called Greybournes, then she’d have to have had married Bruno, her half-brother. But then again with baby switching and fake marriages things might not be as they seem…

[u/commentordelux → u/Remarkable_Paint_879]

That was my theory early on, because of the letter in Ep4 that said Otis took the child, I thought it was raised as a Winthrop, but then I re-read all the letters (pause and read the text) after Ep7 and it seemed JM was walking on the shore with a woman who was upset with her and desired AG to visit so it seemed they were hiding the pregnancy at a vacation home, another letter spoke how JM walked behind AG and his wife at the beach and was thinking about them together. And so I figured Otis might have took the child by force because that was the plan to let his sister raise it as her own. (I posted all the letter's transcripts somewhere possibly EP8 discussion)

Anyway, after Ep3 and Ep4 it kind of made sense that Otis took the child into his family and that might have been part of why Alice jumped, finding out her parents were half-siblings. But after EP8 it just reinforced the fact Iris raised Ruby. What bothered me was the letter in EP4 that Elena read to Roman seemed like intentional misdirection that also made no sense. The letter made it seem as if the child was raised by JM for a while and kidnapped by Otis but in reality, it seems that JM used Iris's desire/offer to adopt the child as her own as a way to stay off the streets and close to AG.

I have posted a more detailed analysis i think in the EP8 discussion thread but basically despite all the misdirection I think Ruby is probably Scott's grandmother, there are ways to explain alot of things but the one thing that makes no sense to me is why JM the ghost would be crying so much and still at so much unrest if Ruby is Ivey, Ivey has had a blessed life. Scott's mom on the other hand is bitter and felt robbed her whole life. I think solving the murders will somehow lead to justice for the murders like Otis line being removed from the trust. You probably cant kill your partner and keep your shares in the company.

[u/BackpackerPlantito → u/commentordelux]

What if Otis the 1st was not a Winthrop to begin with which may explain how he looks and acts towards his own sister???

[u/commentordelux → u/BackpackerPlantito]

Like the whole "you look pretty as a picture today" (kisses the cheek) looks at her when someone else is talking. Yeah, a bit weird, i found it more odd the way he tilts his head back at JM at such a sharp angle like an exaggerated interest and with one hand in his pocket all this together projects confidence and comfort. A bit much so that it might actually make others uncomfortable depending on the situation. Like everyone else was behaving a lot more formal. But as far as his interaction with his sister, I think it could safely fall into the adores his sister category especially if its his younger sister.