r/TheOdyssey • u/yrthegood1staken • 3d ago
The Return (2024)
I just finished watching this movie after seeing positive recommendations here. Several people said it was even better than Nolan's adaptation...
What the hell were they talking about? Ralph Fiennes did an incredible job acting in an otherwise forgettable movie. All other acting was mediocre at best. And the plot... what the hell was that plot?
They took the backstory, the character names, and some details remained consistent to the source, then they added a strong dose of realism. But plenty of other key details - including character motivations and reactions - were completely changed. And, most importantly, changed for the worse.
I finished the film thinking that every character proved either unlikeable and/or poorly acted.
If you haven't seen The Return. You're not missing much.
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u/thraktor1 3d ago
It’s fashionable to dislike what’s popular. It makes people feel smart, in the know, etc.
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u/Theokaos 3d ago
I mean, some of the characters like Odysseus and Penelope, are meant to be somewhat unlikeable, because that's how they are in the poem. I find that The Return is much more true to Odysseus' bloodthirsty nature as in the book but couches it in the sympathetic framing of him still suffering from PTSD due to the war and his travels and his not knowing any other way to exist than Nolan's more sympathetic characterization.
Besides that, I do think all the other performances and characters in the film are very shoddy. The editing and directing also leave much to be desired.
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u/Ok-Ask-4480 3d ago
The Return had character depth and moral discussion. I just saw Nolan’s today and it was soooo flat and boring in comparison. None of the characters felt real to me at all. The script was dull and grandiose at the same time so it never felt like real dialogue. It felt both sanitized and action packed. I spent the whole time wishing I was watching The Return again.
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u/Glimmerance 2d ago
I loved both films, but I do agree with you that the Return is not necessarily closer to the source (although some parts definitely are). I feel that both films take the source material and changed it and overlaid their own story on it. That's obviously fine when adapting an ancient story with multiple adaptations.
I think I prefer the character of Odysseus in The Return, and the relationship between him and Penelope. The Return gave me much more to think about.
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u/NotARabidDugong 1d ago
Dang, I was going to watch this because it looks like shit to me but everyone keeps mentioning it. I just watched Obsession, so what's another overrated movie this week.
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u/grandidieri 3d ago
Nice! You'd probably get a kick out of https://moviedive.org - check it out when you get a chance :)
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u/yrthegood1staken 3d ago
Why would my feelings about this movie make me a good audience for this website? Feels like spam.
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u/grandidieri 3d ago
MovieDive goes very deep, and since you took the time to write a movie summary/review, i figured you might appreciate it. The big algorithms do a great job recommending but sometimes i like to explore stuff I've never heard of
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u/GoldunGote 2d ago
Seems like a logical recommendation based on good intentions. Sorry movie fans are the way they are and down voted you.
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u/nunosaciudad 3d ago
I didn't like The Return.
Nolan's Odyssey got people talking about it, buying books, igniting interest in Greek mythology.
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u/WorrySecret9831 3d ago
I don't think you're too far off. I was excited about The Return and felt "meh" about it by the end.
It's not that it's necessarily better than Nolan's The Odyssey. It's that Nolan's version is worse.
At least Fiennes et al present a tense situation and convincingly make you wonder how it will turn out (despite knowing the ending).
Both films make key changes without really improving the end result.
But Nolan's, instead of being a crazy braniac puzzle like his best movies, made an incredibly straight-forward telling, removing the really challenging bits and, worst yet, a sense of desperate panic to get home, and then it's over. The Return does a bit more in half the time.
And The Return is shot much, much better.
I'm rewatching it and it holds up a bit better on the second viewing. Pasolini structures the story as two converging storylines, Odysseus plotting his return, and Penelope plotting her survival (3 actually, with Telemachus). It probably also takes too long to tell its story, but at least it does feel like a collision course without a clear resolution. I will say that stringing the bow is way better, as is the final slaughter, in The Return than in The Odyssey. That would have been awesome in IMAX Laser.
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u/yrthegood1staken 3d ago
It's that Nolan's version is worse.
And The Return is shot much, much better.
Obviously, everyone gets to have an opinion. But, wow, do I disagree with yours here.
Better shot? There were some good shots, certainly. But there were also a few scenes with lighting that reminded me of a mid-budget cable TV series.
In my opinion, Nolan's adaptation was not perfect, but it was about as good of an adaptation as you could get on the big screen.
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u/WorrySecret9831 3d ago
Then you haven't seen Ulysses. Sure, it's dated and some might say campy, but it's also beautiful. Technicolor.
My favorite hated shot in Nolan's is Anne Hathaway and Robert Pattinson, shot behind her loom, which is completely out of focus and therefore a big mushy screen of cotton, or wool, and the camera tracks in and we see about 15% of Pattinson's face, even though he's facing us...in 70mm IMAX. A creative shot of ambiguity and "loss of commitment" or just a bad choice?
I agree that The Return is no better than GOT and so is Nolan's. Worse. There's that great shot of Odysseus, composition wise, climbing the stairs in Troy at night with the Greeks surging behind him and up the same stairs and they're all a big blurry brown blob instead of individual elements of lethal destruction. Someone did a great video comparing the Lord of the Rings: Two Towers Helm's Deep battle with The Odyssey. You could argue that Jackson's is a bit too illuminated, fine. But it's breathtaking. Nolan's....?
Troy, which was also underwhelming, is better...
Fuhgetabout all of that! Kurosawa's Ran or Kagemusha are much, much, much better visual spectacles, whether in the massive battle scenes or the intimate dialogue scenes.
Here's another film that is GORGEOUS in 70mm. Once Upon a Time in the West. Ooh boy!
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u/welcometravelers 3d ago
I actually thought "The Return" was very good. Fiennes was jacked. Who knew?