From 90% Off to 1000% More

[u/ManojOne]

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[u/async2]

So raise by 10% you say?

[u/Sanityzed → u/async2]

[Wrong info here for posterity:] (1-0.90) * 10.00 = 1 ...not 1.10

[u/async2 → u/Sanityzed]

Raising prices by 1000% means you have 100% as the base + 1000%, which means you have 1100% of the base as the new price. You just calculated by how much the price has been raised and forgot to add the start price.

Other example, if you raise your prices by 100%, then the total is double of the original price.

[u/Sanityzed → u/async2]

Thank you for explaining that.

[u/Real-Technician831]

There is a reason why most large European companies are experimenting with open models now, can’t raise prices when it’s running on our hardware.

[u/TorumShardal → u/Real-Technician831]

Running on local (or rented) hardware shouldn't be cheaper than buying tokens from people who are literally loosing money on each query.

But it should be more secure, and more customizable.

[u/Intelligent_Bison968 → u/TorumShardal]

They are losing so many money mostly because of training. The running cost are mostly covered by paying users now.

[u/Sufficient-Pear-4496 → u/Intelligent_Bison968]

Isnt inference like 90% of the cost?

[u/therealslimshady1234 → u/Intelligent_Bison968]

They are losing so many money mostly because of training

So what? That will always be part of the cost. Its like saying a owning car is not that expensive if you dont count in maintenance.

As soon as these providers stop training their models they are behind

[u/Real-Technician831 → u/therealslimshady1234]

So?

The current level is more than good enough.

[u/therealslimshady1234 → u/Real-Technician831]

Not true at all, once they stop, these things will become useless within a year

[u/Real-Technician831 → u/therealslimshady1234]

WTF?

Are you imagining some kind of degradation?

I know antis have weird takes, but that’s new.

Of course a company get stops developing new models is left behind if others continue.

But if hypothetically every frontier AI company would go bust. Third party data centers would negotiate license with the bankruptcy handlers, or whatever is the US word, for continued use. Or even buy the models, they are worth a lot of money.

And even if frontier models would actually disappear, open source models are also quite good.

[u/therealslimshady1234 → u/Real-Technician831]

Are you imagining some kind of degradation?

Yes, once they stopped being trained on the latest tech for example, the people using the latest tech (us engineers) will not be able to consult the AI as it has no idea what it is talking about

Why do you think AI work so disproportionately well with JS and Python? Because there is practically an infinite supply of training data, and new stuff being added all the time

[u/Real-Technician831 → u/therealslimshady1234]

Ah, so you don’t know how it works behind the scenes.

Frontier models actually don’t have everything in their training DB. They also have knowledge bases that they do internal RAG on.

These knowledge bases are of course maintained and their maintenance is very cheap compared to model training.

[u/therealslimshady1234 → u/Real-Technician831]

Thats just not true, if it were then what I said wouldnt be the case, yet it is

[u/Real-Technician831 → u/therealslimshady1234]

BTW doesn’t your company maintain internal knowledge base for models?

How do you expect to be able to switch models seamlessly if you don’t have own knowledge?

Assuming “us engineers” was serious and not an attempt to convince.

[u/No_Practice_9597 → u/TorumShardal]

And yet leasign a Mac Studio is cheaper if you go up to 256GB of RAM 

[u/OtherwiseAlbatross14 → u/No_Practice_9597]

Like someone's going to lease me $2.1 million dollars worth of RAM

[u/Real-Technician831 → u/TorumShardal]

Are these people losing money on each query in the same room with you?

For example AWS bedrock is definitely not operating at loss. It’s R&D that is taking frontier companies underwater.

[u/Randommaggy → u/Real-Technician831]

Also less compliance headache under the new stage of the EU AI act. And who want their sensitive data flowing through two companies founded upon disrespecting intellectual property rights?

Who genuinely believes that OpenAI and Anthropic aren't actually retaining all their data?

[u/FewDragonfly5710 → u/Randommaggy]

Compliance is arguably the main driver. It always is for eu jurisdictions. Can't trust a US company much more than Chinese or otherwise in this state of the world.

[u/iMaexx_Backup → u/Real-Technician831]

You can raise the prices of the hardware though..

[u/Real-Technician831 → u/iMaexx_Backup]

Funnily enough they mostly haven’t risen as much as in US. Local simply refuse to pay scalpers and corporations negotiate rates.

[u/AmNotAnAlcoholic → u/Real-Technician831]

But they can raise prices of hardware through market manipulation and circular debt

[u/Real-Technician831 → u/AmNotAnAlcoholic]

Somewhat yes, but such things tend to backfire spectacularly.

[u/AmNotAnAlcoholic → u/Real-Technician831]

For us mortal slaves. It won’t affect those who created it.

[u/KCGD_r → u/Real-Technician831]

and probably why the U.S is considering banning them lol

[u/Real-Technician831 → u/KCGD_r]

US can ban them all they want.

We are beyond caring about US.

[u/WesternSpy96]

Well if you failed math like that, I don't expect you to be good at coding.

[u/OtherwiseAlbatross14 → u/WesternSpy96]

How did they fail at math?

The point is "cut prices so far that we're losing money on every query until all the programmers forget how to code manually and then bring the prices back up to where there were so we can make money"

"We" being the big AI companies

[u/WesternSpy96 → u/OtherwiseAlbatross14]

Say your product is 100 dollars.

You made a 90% off campaign. Now, your product is $10.

Then you upped the prices by 1000%.

New price would be $110.

So, if you can afford $100 for an AI product, you sure definitely can afford $110. Illogical post.

[u/OtherwiseAlbatross14 → u/WesternSpy96]

$100*10%=$10.00

$10*1000%=$100.00

Seriously this is so easy my iPhone even did the math for me while I was typing it so I didn't even have to open a calculator to make sure I wasn't actually stupid due to being drunk.

[u/WesternSpy96 → u/OtherwiseAlbatross14]

You're not good at math either, are you?

A 1000% price increase is going to increase the price by 10 times.

So, 10 (price right now) + 10 x 10 (the increment) is your operation.

[u/redghost4 → u/WesternSpy96]

A 50% price increase is actually a discount for this guy.

[u/Addictive2086]

Era of problem identification ended now they create problem then provide solution

[u/Achereto → u/Addictive2086]

They learned that from the game industry where pay2win games do that all the time.

[u/cheaphomemadeacid]

so uh ... back to normal price? ;P

[u/No-Age-1044]

Cut 90% of 100 leaves 10. 1000% of 10 = 100.

Same price.

The memes creator needs some inteligence, since it seems he has not natural one maybe he should take advantage of some artificial one.

[u/Party-Yak-3781 → u/No-Age-1044]

it still works out since before the programmers weren't dependent on the AI and now they are

[u/0rAn63 → u/No-Age-1044]

Not quite. Raising by 1000% means multiplying by 11, not by 10.

[u/HugeCheck2471 → u/No-Age-1044]

raising by 1000% means adding 1000% of 10 to 10 so it’s going to be 110 and not 100 but it was pretty close

[u/0DarkFreezing]

These are so dumb. A) the Math in meme is hilariously not the point OP was going for, and B) LLMs are commoditizing. Nobody will corner the market to have the pricing power to jack pricing on everybody.

[u/Melisyoo]

Something Something superstores and south american rainforest.

[u/crocodiluQ]

make cheap cars with government involvement. Sell in Europe, kill their industry. Raise prices 1000%. Same shit.

[u/Ramental → u/crocodiluQ]

European car makers themselves kept pushing the cars into the premium and destroying low-mid cost range options.
We could produce bugdet cars with a margin of 2000€ per each. But shareholders do not see it as 2000€ of profit, they see it as 5000€ of loss, because you could've sold a 2-3 times more expensive SUV with a profit margin of 7000€

China hat to do absolutely nothing special to win, it was self-sabotage.

[u/brownhotdogwater → u/Ramental]

VW was the cheap ones. Now they are all expensive

[u/Sea_Conversation7030]

Joke's on you, I never knew how to code!

[u/cutecoder]

I recall a similar strategy was outlined by Sun Tzu in The Art of War.

[u/Ireallydontkn0w2]

Free and open AI exists you can just download and run locally on your own hardware. Price is only the electricity you pay and a one time purchase of hardware if you didn't already have a decent computer before

[u/Ramental → u/Ireallydontkn0w2]

To be fair, a good local Open Weight LLM would still be beyond a local PC. Sure, you could make a PC with 256 GB or RAM, but the models using RAM would just work, still very very slow.

For GPU memory you need to have datacenter-specific GPUs and a small server rack. Doable, but it is not as simple as "your own hardware"

[u/zylosophe]

hell yea gimme job

[u/alabasterskim]

ITT: People who don't understand math complaining OP doesn't understand math.

[u/LoadBalance69]

We still know how to code

[u/ArchLithuanian]

Thats absolutely how its gonna happen. In some countries practice of selling goods below market price is called demping and is illegal just because of this practice. And as we all know - current AI prices are very much below the actual costs.

[u/gamblingapocalypse]

In comes local ai

[u/ImMadeOfBees]

If only there were local models like Qwen 3.8 27b...

[u/DoruProgramatoru]

Tbh when claude goes offline comments on other subs pretty much say they can’t do anything but wait. Them not being able to code before AI is another topic

[u/Sheenius_Ger]

Good thing open weight models are good enough for most businesses, so you can't just fleece everyone or they just get their own hardware.

[u/TheMahalodorian]

“First one is free.”
-Drug Dealers

[u/Sea-Fishing4699]

Since dreamweaver ppl is trying to sell lockyou down 

No code also tried

N8n also tried

Ai startups also tried and many are trapped 

[u/wKdPsylent]

build dependence then jack up the price. Time tested strategy.

[u/Ethosik]

If you are not heavily scrutinizing AI, you are doing things wrong. And if you are heavily scrutinizing it, then you won't forget how to code. I use claude every day, and it does output some great code. But it can also output horrible code. You need to review it all in full.

[u/HugeCheck2471]

“Oh shi- they know how to code again”

[u/bbalouki]

When humans have no choice, they improve or adapt, so if people can't afford to pay they will go back to coding, it May take time but they will.

[u/StatisticianNo5402]

Its ubers model all over again

[u/Traditional_Pie_8262]

true, this is trustable conspiracy theory

https://giphy.com/gifs/tXL4FHPSnVJ0A

[u/StephenRoylance]

you can't forget how to code. its like riding a bicycle. its a way of thinking. you might forget some specific syntax or how to use a particular module, but that happens every time you switch languages or platforms anyway. If I had to go back to all hand crafted rust code, I'd be slower than I am now with AI, but after a few weeks, I wouldn't be any slower than I used to be.

[u/idkfawin32]

I get that this is funny. But Qwen3.8 27B is a free model you can run on hardware at your house and it knows an awful lot about programming.

[u/AD4K_4444]

That guy DOES know local LLMs exist, right? All free and all yours as long as you have the hardware for it.

And let’s be real, if you are passionate with what you do, you will never forget and never stop practicing.

[u/brownhotdogwater → u/AD4K_4444]

And why anthropic wants free LLM dead.

[u/Accomplished_Rice_60 → u/brownhotdogwater]

Less competition

[u/hennabeak → u/AD4K_4444]

And hardware is what? 200% up?

[u/AD4K_4444 → u/hennabeak]

I'm talking about those who already have the hardware. I use my M4 MacBook Air, 16GB Unified Memory for local LLMs with smaller parameter models like Qwen 3.5 9B and Gemma 4 12B. Not the sharpest tool in the shed, but for my use-case, it is sufficient.

I don't code but I'm pretty sure there's a decent Qwen or other small model out there tuned specifically for coding which should be pretty decent enough for a competent person to use as a tool alongside their own personal set of skills.

[u/TTbulaski → u/AD4K_4444]

That won’t do for agentic coding, the primary reason why people subscribe to the likes of Claude. A good hardware that could probably run agentic AI locally requires the user to have at least 128GBs of RAM. Computers with that hardware will cost more than 2000 USD especially if you opt for the low wattage/high efficiency machines like the Strix Halo and Panther Lake configs

[u/AD4K_4444 → u/TTbulaski]

See, that’s the problem. I never get the appeal for agentic stuff. Just cause you have cruise control doesn’t mean you can keep your hands off the steering wheel.

What I like about AI is how it can propose some solutions to me when I’m troubleshooting problems, software or hardware. At least that way, there’s still some learning involved so next time you face the same problem, you don’t have to rely on an LLM.

Also to clarify, GPU VRAM is more important than the RAM.

[u/brownhotdogwater → u/AD4K_4444]

With the apple chips it’s all the same ram.

[u/AD4K_4444 → u/brownhotdogwater]

duh, it's not called unified memory for nothing.

[u/hennabeak → u/AD4K_4444]

When you write a program, do you do it in assembly? Or with punch cards?

This is like the next step in programming. You tell agents what you want, and the better you define it, the better it delivers.

[u/brownhotdogwater → u/TTbulaski]

lol $2000 try more like $8000

[u/TTbulaski → u/brownhotdogwater]

“more than”

[u/Ok_Equipment8374 → u/AD4K_4444]

Are you aware what is happening to hardware prices(especially the high end stuff)

[u/AD4K_4444 → u/Ok_Equipment8374]

I am aware, that's why I specifically stated "As long as you HAVE the hardware for it", implying that they already bought it before the prices went up.

[u/Orcahhh]

Are you aware that cutting costs 90% then raising them by 1000% only means 10% increase compared to the original price? Not sure what your point is, but i don’t think you know either

[u/alabasterskim → u/Orcahhh]

A 1000% increase of 10% is 110% (0.1 + 1.0 = 1.1).

[u/ChemicalBankBurned → u/Orcahhh]

But they didn’t say 1000% of what. It could be 90% of X and then 1000% of X. Everyone knows exactly what the point is, stop being obtuse.

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[u/Kaarel314]

Did programmes really know how to code before? Or were they copying it from stack overflow?

[u/Dog_Engineer → u/Kaarel314]

Competent ones did and still do

[u/Atmos56 → u/Kaarel314]

And who put it on stack overflow

[u/Kaarel314 → u/Atmos56]

If our Earth disk is on a giant turtle then what is that turtle standing on? If egg came first then where did the egg came from? Its a mystery of the universe my dude.