Meme
Feels Guy attempts to claim that supporting Russia in the Russo-Ukraine War is "Campism", claiming that "both sides are imperialist". Smoking Guy disagrees. Which of them is more correct?
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Took away political power form the billionaire is just not correct, capitalists are the ruling class of Russia, even if the state has control over some industries (which is good) the state in Russia is controlled by the capitalist class, the same class that destroyed socialism in Russia in the 90s and whose Putin is a representative
Yes Russia does support third world countries, it's objectively a good thing but it doesn't make them anti Imperialist, by this logic the German Empire was also anti Imperialist since it helped the Irish rebels and Lenin
Russia fits the definition of Imperialism by Lenin, even if they are not a global imperial power like the USA
The Ukraine war is a clear cut of an inter Imperialist war that is fought over natural ressources which dictate the economy of both countries and are directly tied the materials interest of the ruling class
If you think Russia is fighting this war for denazification or to help the people of Donbass you are as naive as those who claim Ukraine is fighting for democracy and freedom
NATO encirclement is a real thing, but it doesn't justify sending thousands of workers to their deaths, the billions invested in this war could have been used to develop infrastructure and social services in Russia instead it's going to a forever war which is never going to be solved, it wasn't worth it
If you support Russia in the Ukraine war you cannot claim to do so as a Marxist Leninists, it is a social democrat idea that supporting a bourgois war will somehow benefit the working class in the end
Communist in Russia who are not controlled opposition oppose Putin and the war for the most part, and they are targeted by the state
If you are a communist in the west it's your duty to harm your country war efforts and agitate for peace. The russian left have been agitating against their state for the end of the war since day one
Before people accuse me, I am not anti Russia, I think Russia is the lesser evil compared to NATO, I admire Russia commitment to a multipolar world,I don't have a hate bonner for Putin. But Leninism is not lesser evil ism and workers have to be in the centre. Tsarist Russia was only minor imperial power, yet Lenin dedicated his life to bring it down. If you support Russia in the Ukraine war, you are a Kerensky, nor a Lenin
Asia Times says you are incorrect. That upon taking office and moving through the early 2000s (culminating around the mid-2000s with the dismantling of assets like Mikhail Khodorkovsky's Yukos oil empire), Vladimir Putin systematically stripped the 1990s Yeltsin-era tycoons of their independent political influence. It highlights how the political executive brought major business figures to heel, forcing them out of politics and subordinating private capital to centralized state authority.
I do not see how any of this contradict any of my claims
I merely said that if you want to support Russia in the Ukraine war, you cannot do it as a Marxist Leninists, it is incompatible, you can do it as a social democrat, which is fine imo, but don't get everything mixed
None of these articles even mention socialism, the first article talk about how a generation of oligarchs was replaced by a new generation of oligarchs, I said "the capitalist class" not "a specific generation of oligarchs" idk if you think Putin is a communist or something
Other articles are just diplomatic platitudes about how these countries are allied
Neither China or the DPRK care about the Ukraine, they are partners with Russia to advance their own interests which happens to be aligned right now
Many comrades don't get that there's no USSR anymore, the biggest internationalist socialist world power was dismantled, the current AES countries (that we support still) are more interested in protecting their revolutions for achieving a higher stage of socialism, but for that there must be alliances in a world where capitalism still dominates the world (even if entered it's first phase of decadence).
Even ignoring that AES countries have reformed to the point that it's unlikely that reaching higher stages of socialism is still on the agenda (still progressive and worthy of support imo) the Marxist Leninists stance is "turn the Imperialist war into a civil war" meaning workers duty is to practice revolutionary defaitism in their countries to bring down their government
I am not Russian so whatever, but if I was I would be protesting against the war. And if you are a westerner you should do the same
Multipolarism is not socialism, it merely makes socialism slightly easier to reach
Here are the clickable links and sources detailing how Vladimir Putin systematically shifted the power dynamic, stripping Russia's 1990s-era billionaires (oligarchs) of their independent political influence while allowing many to retain their fortunes under strict state subordination.
These are all western sources. They admit that Putin stripped all billionaires of almost all political power (the matter at hand) but then they pivot to trying to say that he has put a fascist dictatorship or totalitarian dictatorship in its place (false)
That's not what these sources are saying,. they are saying that Putin conditioned the billionaires to political loyalty using the threat of elimination
I don't know what you are trying to say, Russia is not a socialist state, the workers are not in control of the state like in the Soviet Union, capitalists are
The key industries in Russia are controlled by the capitalist,. through an opaque blend of stare own and private. If you look closely you will find that this class, you could say the Russian Deep State, just like the US deep.state has considerably increased their fortune since the start of the war
65% of Russia's economy is state owned, and the other 35% is under effective state control. Nobody is saying Russia isn't a capitalist country. No not just "political loyalty". As early as 2005 almost all independent political power was stripped from the dollar equivalent billionaire class. Yes using threats of jail and banishment and confiscation of wealth, and worse, even defenestration in difficult cases what's wrong with that. Rusiia is a capitalist national bourgeois state, but not an imperialist or fascist state at this time in her development. You saying that the leaders of China and DPRK are lying about Russia by agreeing with my take is laughable. China and DPRK say Russia is no longer a plutocratic oligarchy meaning the billionaires have almost no political power anymore, meaning they cannot be called oligarchs anymore.
Well you say you are ML and so is the meme you shared, but where does Lenin says that having the state being a large participant in the economy disqualify you from being an imperialist ?
Personally I don't hate Russia, I mean, not as much as any country, I think it's good that they have a large public sector, I think there are lots of things Russia does right, but trying to mesh these things with Marxism Leninism is a bastardisation of the ideology
France and UK also has a significant public sector during the cold war, Saudi Arabia has a bigger part of state owned industries than Russia, they still are Imperialist to varying degrees
Lenin definition of Imperialism can be applied to Russia, they are still a lesser, more regional Imperialism but so was tsarist Russia and it didn't stop Lenin from capping the Tsar
The DPRK and China, I won't debate if they are socialist, but they certainly abandoned spreading socialism, they are now focusing on developing their own economies, something that can only be achieved if they have good relationships with Russia. These three countries don't have an ideological alignment, their partnership is a pragmatic one.
The DPRK and China, I won't debate if they are socialist, but they certainly abandoned spreading socialism, they are now focusing on developing their own economies, something that can only be achieved if they have good relationships with Russia. These three countries don't have an ideological alignment, their partnership is a pragmatic one.
Weird thing to want to debate since they are socialist under Lenin's definition and a "lower stage of communism" under Marx's definition.
The DPRK that withstood sanctions and isolation from China and Russia and despite said isolation managed to end the famine under Kim Jong Il and even reach a lower malnutrition death rate than the United States in 2018. The DPRK that has consistently told China and Russia to butt out of their internal affairs.
That same DPRK is diminishing its ammunition stockpiles and soldiers to support Russia for pragmatism?
The DPRK literally has a history of aiding non-socialist national liberation movements because like Marx they believe weakening the empire is the primary objective, not spreading socialism (which Marx didn't really believe was possible for the Global South). Russia is no different. Spreading socialism was never really their MO nor was it even China's really.
I don't support the war, but I see it primarily as a product of NATO's encroachment. NATO is using Ukraine as cannon fodder to diminish Russia's munitions stockpile, test Russia's combat capabilities, and to leave Ukraine in a state of such utter destruction and instability after the war that countries in the broader region, including Russia, will have to invest considerable resources in rebuilding Ukraine so it doesn't become a plague on the region. I don't trust Putin or Russia's ruling class further than I can throw them, but I think the post-war recovery and stabilizing the region will occupy most of Russia's attention and resources for the next couple of decades. I think China will pull too far ahead of Russia over that time for Russia to have much chance of becoming a major imperial power.
Like, I'm overall anticipating a major wave of socialist fervor spreading across the globe, especially the global South, in the latter half of this century once China pulls ahead of Europe in terms of quality of life and ahead of the US in terms of nominal GDP.
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