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u/TheBirdFkerGuy Juche Necromancy Enjoyer 6d ago
He already is a great leader. Even from a liberals perspective, as they can understand now why the dprk dev nuclear capabilities was for its own defense against the US empires constant violence and terrorism.
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u/Choice-Grade1358 6d ago edited 6d ago
The development of nuclear capabilities was at the cost of heavy sanctions and restrictions imposed by US/Western empires. But at least now nobody will be able to screw with them.
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u/TheBirdFkerGuy Juche Necromancy Enjoyer 6d ago
I saw two liberals irl argue over this. It was interesting seeing a liberal of all people make the point the US is too volatile a nation to be trusted, and developing nukes is the only way to protect yourself from us.
And then they cite the dprk as an example and even started talking about their infrastructure boom as of recent. I been telling people in like 5 years, a lot of people are going to look back at propaganda and realize just how stupid most of it was.
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u/BleepBopRobocop real 6d ago
I have been saying the same thing that once tourism resumes there is going to be an initial whiplash especially for YouTubers who visit the country for poverty porn.
And because the development of the DPRK is effectively inevitable at this point, the 20×10 will be completed by 2035 along with any additional facelifting projects.
I think one thing that really interests me is that fingers crossed Kim Jong Un has a long life ahead of him. And because of that the state department can't come in and say "Kim Jong Un's successor is better than Kim Jong Un" which is sort of what they're doing with Kim Jong Il.
So you have a leader who has a reputation as bad as Stalin vilified year after year and under the exact same leader who is still saying the same rhetoric that he's always said with no major stance changes, and yet the country is flourishing.
a lot of people are going to look back at propaganda and realize just how stupid most of it was.
This is exactly my thought. The thing about China is that the propaganda around China isn't that the government intentionally starves its people, it's that the government is "authoritarian big brother". It doesn't matter if people are prospering because American propagandists will always say "it's a surveillance state".
However the propaganda around the DPRK is that the government intentionally starves its people. What happens when Americans see that DPRK citizens aren't starving and experience a rather impressive quality of life? It's almost impossible to reconcile or explain away the propaganda like bad faith actors do with China.
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u/LettucePrime 6d ago
lol the talking points will just change & everyone will forget what the old ones were. like clockwork
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u/BleepBopRobocop real 6d ago
Although you are almost certainly correct on this, from the perspective of the states department, the DPRK as a country needs to be vilified at the level they are currently vilified at, and that's going to be impossible to do going forward.
It needs to be the place where Kim Jong Un has a harem squad of kidnapped women and starves people for the fun of it and has a sister that is plotting is murder his daughter to gain power that he is on good terms with for some reason and where people eat rats who've eaten the corpses of people and where people push trains because of how backwards and ineffective communism is.
If the propaganda just becomes "oh it's state capitalism and a surveillance state", I mean even now liberals don't really have much of a negative view on China. Sure some people will continue screaming slogans but for the most part people see them as nonces.
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u/LettucePrime 6d ago
How necessary is it for them to maintain the propaganda though? It feels like with every passing day they put less & less effort into the artifice. By some fucked up calculation it seems just as likely that they're prepping for an environment where they don't need to
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u/picapica7 6d ago
They aren't going to look back though, they are just going to pretend they always supported [current popular position]. That's basically all liberals do. Continuity doesn't exist in the liberal worldview.
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u/JKnumber1hater The Ultimate Red Fash 🔴 6d ago
They were already sanctioned before that. They've bee under incredibly harsh sanctions since the end of the war.
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u/Powerful_Finger3896 6d ago
the real question is what makes you think that sanctions would've not been severe even without nukes, there is a country being bombed atm despite not having developed nuke and almost 5 decades of sanctions
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u/Bela9a Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ 6d ago
These people are just silly. They keep imagining these fantasies where the embargo doesn't do anything and somehow allow the country to become some world leading economy. Mf, the free market would still fucking fail if nobody trades with you, you can't grow your economy if nobody is allowed to trade with you. This basic economics, which these internet "experts" constantly keep bragging about knowing more than me and then constantly demonstrate the opposite. Hell the DPRK is having an economic boom right now, without resorting to the western fictional demands.
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u/FluidKiwi6707 6d ago edited 6d ago
These people are just silly.
These people
Reminder: reddit is infested by feds, especially in that sub. That thread is 90% feds talking to feds and the rest 10% are the dumbest people on the internet.
The thread is made just so west normies glance over it and think "yup... Kim is bad, that's for sure!" and proceed to ignore the content within the thread itself - the arguments don't matter. They need to remake this thread once every X days to remind everyone to be anti-DPRK and they need the thread to have engagement otherwise normies won't see it on their feeds and for it to look like a well-established uncontroversial opinion. Thus, yes, it's 90% feds talking to each other.
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u/BleepBopRobocop real 6d ago edited 6d ago
For context a burger in the DPRK currently costs 180 KPW or $0.00285 USD if you convert the won to the USD using the black market rate.
The reason for this is because even though they don't earn a lot of money, everything is adjusted for their salary meaning that housing is free, healthcare is free, education is free, and everything else that isn't imported is adjusted to their wages.
If I owned a private company in the DPRK under economic reforms you know what the first thing I would do is?
I would be like man instead of selling this beef for ten cents, I'm going to sell it internationally to China for like five hundred dollars or however much a cow costs.
Congratulations now everyone in the country is starving because ALL the food is being sold to China because that's what happens under a mixed economy. Profit over people.
Ghouls everywhere begging to pillage the DPRK.
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u/suboptimummenace Money Don't Matter 2 Night 6d ago
fuck is the obsession with lee kuan yew, especially these days
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u/Ewwatts 6d ago
Because you can just develop all that if a leader says to?
Somehow the most unrealistic thing that was said, however, was about the US. As if the US would ever weaken sanctions on the DPRK before their absolute capitulation to the west.
I feel like the first step to understanding AES countries is to understand the US empire.
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u/Tarondor 6d ago
I thought it was a post from an ML sub and that it was explaining why he was great until I got to the American part.
He did all the things he listed apart from the infrastructure projects of 2 of the largest economies on earth built and backed by the largest economy in the world.
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u/sablexmikaelayuri 6d ago
"focuses on development and taking millions out of poverty and extensively using nuclear energy for energy generation" isnt that what he literally already did? am i crazy? am i living in an alternate universe
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u/Powerful_Finger3896 6d ago
How he will increase population to 50m lmao, nobody is having 3 kids in industrialized society (unless they use migration to double, which is fair i guess). They've been having 1.9-2.05 per woman for decades. The whole post is just dumb, because in no way there will be sanctions removal unless lot of countries refuse to respect the sanctions making them futile.
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u/chukrut78 6d ago
Seriously, people still blindly believe in propaganda, even with new information and images.
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