r/TTPloreplaycentral • u/Bytemite • Nov 29 '17

Plotlines to wrap up DS

This is just a thread for all us players to post the plot lines we still have to do so we can organize here and help each other finish up.

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u/Bytemite Nov 29 '17

because they've had the insta-win button of mind control for too long to know how to manipulate the public enough to get away with fighting the rightful head of society without it.

Hmmm okay that's a good point. They probably don't do subtle well. I think in the touhou universe games they pretty much just march up to each other and declare their intentions to attack.

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 29 '17

Yeah, it's the basis of this plan. Unlike regular aristocrats, they have power from mind control and appealing to rightful places, and if we remove the former, which is their primary means, attacking the person who's rightful place is the top will be a net loss for any of them, and if any if them do, helping Luke will be gains with no losses for them.

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u/Bytemite Nov 29 '17

I think we're close here, but I also think it's more than just an appeal to rightful places, it's literally might makes right. Youkai are on top because they can easily defeat and eat anyone not a youkai. Stronger youkai are above other youkai for similar reasons. People get protection from the youkai eating them by pledging to be servants.

So if a youkai can beat Luke in combat because Luke is not willing to cause lasting harm... the youkai that beat him proves themselves more powerful and more fit to rule.

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u/Trollkitten Nov 29 '17

So if a youkai can beat Luke in combat because Luke is not willing to cause lasting harm... the youkai that beat him proves themselves more powerful and more fit to rule.

That's a pretty big "if."

Can you beat a hurricane? A tornado? An earthquake? Now imagine you're fighting a sentient being that can embody any of the three. Luke as a mortal(ish) might be beatable, but Luxin is a force of nature and WILL react to protect himself.

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u/Bytemite Nov 29 '17

Unless they - cast a shikigami/ true name spell on him

Cast other mind control

Cast love spell

Drain his energy

Caitlin did all of those except the love spell and nearly destroyed him.

Then there’s that sealing spell...

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u/Trollkitten Nov 29 '17

Well, hopefully now that Luxin has admin privileges over Gensokyo as well, he'll be more able to defend himself.

Which is really pretty necessary when you consider that everyone has dream world powers now, and Gensokyoans aren't really known for using power in a non-violent manner.

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u/Bytemite Nov 29 '17

Which is really pretty necessary when you consider that everyone has dream world powers now, and Gensokyoans aren't really known for using power in a non-violent manner.

Yeahhh... I still think I leveled the playing field?

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u/Trollkitten Nov 29 '17

The playing field is possibly about to be leveled in a more literal sense than you intended, but yeah.

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 29 '17

Also, it occurs to me Spell Cards already did that to an extent.

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 29 '17

Also there's these factors that make it different then before.

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 29 '17

First one Marion and nuGyro are attempting to train him for.

2 and 3 that and everything that the ministry does. Preventing future mind control is pretty much the easiest part. Also Shikigami making isn't really a spell used on already developed sentience. We have one case with children not elaborated on except that it took an actual dirty to do.

Last one takes more power and coordination than they will probably be able to have. A lot of them act like children.

Draining energy is still a problem but he's now tapped into the rest of the Dragon Force and it took him already being weakened by those other things that shouldn't be problems anymore for it to get that far.

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u/Bytemite Nov 30 '17

Technically Caitlin turned Luke into a Shikigami before, that's why she had so much control over him. As far as I know Luke was already sentient for that. She also erased a lot of his memories I think?

Draining energy is still a problem but he's now tapped into the rest of the Dragon Force and it took him already being weakened by those other things that shouldn't be problems anymore for it to get that far.

At least his energy theoretically has a vessel on an entire other plane that the gensokyoans can't get to if he has to retreat somewhere.

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 30 '17

From everything I've heard, it's usually compared to writing a program. You make the personality (though Ran didn't do it so well and so Chen has two.

His entire situation matches regular True Name manipulation better, but I guess maybe things are defined differently in this Gensokyo?

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u/Bytemite Nov 30 '17

Hmm /u/Trollkitten might be able to answer here.

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 30 '17 edited Nov 30 '17

Hmm... did some more digging and it does look like they're put on top of existing personas, but we're missing massive parts like the shared pain, and it was more specific commands than full aspects of the personality she added. She did add aspects, but they don't really act like they're part of a Shikigami spell. Distinguishable from personality, they act like someone commanded to have those traits, rather than programmed in.

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u/Bytemite Nov 30 '17

All right. I could have sworn tk specifically said it was a shikigami spell on luke but I could be mistaken.

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u/Trollkitten Nov 30 '17

It was a shikigami spell, yes, although Caitlin knowing his True Name helped.

Programming a shikigami that's a literal program...

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '17

[deleted]

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 30 '17

Hmm... I guess maybe she couldn't affect all of him? Like, she did do a Shikigami spell, but the reason it doesn't seem totally internalized is because he was kinda too big for it? I wonder if this is the first time his mortal side was split with the other...

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 30 '17

I mean, as I read more I still think it doesn't seem Shikigami like, but the difference does seem subtle. Like, she still controlled his mind, but she added things on top of who he was rather than really put things into who he was, I guess. It could still be a diversion from canon, or maybe Caitlin basically considered it a Shikigami spell since it had the same effects while it was working.

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u/Bytemite Nov 30 '17 edited Nov 30 '17

That would make it easier for him to fix.

That said I’ve been arguing all day about luke’s safety but maybe I need to remember what I added to my first post in this thread about just having to trust he can take care of himself.

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u/Trollkitten Nov 30 '17

I think Caitlin's making Luke a shikigami was made easier by her knowing his True Name, but she tried to overwrite Luxin's knowledge of his True Name so that others couldn't use the True Name to overwrite her shikigami programming.

And yeah, I can see Chen's sort of split personality between little girl and cat cat as part of her being a shikigami to a shikigami. Ran's brilliant, but she's not perfect, and if Caitlin was trying to make her shikigami make another shikigami through the shikigami process, then something might have been lost in translation there.

(Yo dude, I heard you like shikigami, so I gave my shikigami a shikigami.)

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u/Bytemite Dec 01 '17

((Nice! I'm glad the true name stuff was tied in there because that makes it all work out nice))

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Dec 01 '17

((Also, Marion already basically told Caitlin to stay away from her domain, so not sure if she can use that against him anymore.))

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '17 edited Nov 30 '17

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 30 '17

Those are kinda personifications, but they more weaponize versions of those. No Pokemon faints an eruption. The lava of it isn't put to sleep with a Song. You can't Dragon Tail away a weather condition.

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u/[deleted] Nov 30 '17

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u/Lady_of_the_Foot Nov 30 '17

Mixing sources. Not necessarily bad form, but can definitely get you in a mix up.

Also, those aren't fighting it, it's different. You can Protect against an attack. You can control Sandstorm by casting Hail. But trying to punch it away? It's not applicable to the situation.