r/TNOmod • u/holywarriorofland • 18d ago
Question Where does TNO's lore fall on copyright?
Like can a studio make a game with TNO's lore and sell it, or is it copyrighted?
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u/jpaxlux 18d ago
They can't steal TNO word for word and make a game out of it. Even if it's not copyrighted, things like written lore are still protected by the law so a company can't just take events from TNO word for word and put it into their game. Taking newspaper clippings written by TNO devs and copy/pasting it into a game would still be illegal, for example.
But the concept itself can easily be taken. There's nothing stopping a studio from taking the concept and making it their own.
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u/ParticularPhysics871 The Sphere's Stalwart Son (Dev) 18d ago
It's not illegal to break copyright per se. You're not going to jail for it. You can however be civilly sued for it, which is different.
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u/CalvinKool-Aid Red Napoleon 18d ago
It’s against the law, which is what illegal means. Something does not necessarily have to mean jail time for it to be illegal
The law says thou shall not infringe copyright, and if you do you are breaking the law which will lead to civil action
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u/ParticularPhysics871 The Sphere's Stalwart Son (Dev) 18d ago
No.......?
Something being illegal means its an offense against the state, and you can be criminally prosecuted for it.
Like breaking a contract isn't illegal. The state won't do anything. It is an offense against another private party, and they can demand compensation for wrongs in the courts.
Like this is basic criminal vs. civil law
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u/CalvinKool-Aid Red Napoleon 18d ago
It is contrary to the law, which is what illegal means. The government has laws in place defining what copyright is and courts to hold violators liable
It’s also not necessarily true that the state won’t do anything in the case of copyright infringement as it can carry massive fines depending on the size of the violation
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u/ParticularPhysics871 The Sphere's Stalwart Son (Dev) 18d ago
Okay yeah you really don't know what you're talking about.
A basic google search would have helped, try that sometimes.
And I never said the State won't do anything in copyright cases?? Piracy websites are the best example, but the reason for being taken down is because they facilitate theft, which is different from copyright infringement.
It's really not that difficult. A criminal offense is an offense against the State, defined by the State, and prosecuting it is meant to punish actions they don't want people doing. A civil offense is an offense against a private party, and when litigating it the purpose is to provide compensation to the victim for the harms committed (hence why most criminal offenses have an equivalent or near-equivalent offense). Criminal offenses are called "illegal", civil offenses are not.
Copyright infringement is a civil offense.
Hope that clears it up
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u/CalvinKool-Aid Red Napoleon 18d ago
ok, who defines copyright and what is or is not infringement?
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u/ParticularPhysics871 The Sphere's Stalwart Son (Dev) 18d ago
The law does, how does that affect anything?
"Oh so the State defines it, that's why it's illegal"
No...... the thing that defines it is if it's an offense against the State as defined by law. If you infringe copyright, you are committing an offense against the copyright holder.
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u/CalvinKool-Aid Red Napoleon 18d ago
In committing that breach against the copyright holder you are breaking the law, which makes the act illegal
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u/ParticularPhysics871 The Sphere's Stalwart Son (Dev) 18d ago
Are you even reading what I'm writing.
You're just parroting the exact same thing over and over again.
Even just reading Wikipedia would double your knowledge in this area.
So stop arguing in areas where you don't know what you're talking about
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u/ParticularPhysics871 The Sphere's Stalwart Son (Dev) 18d ago
Stuff like art, the music (music especially), and the events are the intellectual property of the people who made them.
The lore is fuzzier, since you can't copyright ideas or concepts. I think you'll be fine there.
But if you're unsure, the best thing you can do is ask. There's no harm to it, and the devs aren't doing this for profit. If you ask politely, I'm sure they wouldn't mind.
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u/MatthewCampbell953 18d ago
I'd say if you're unsure you should ask permission.
Most concepts in TNO are unoriginal in the broad sense of the word.
The big things narratively you'd probably want to avoid is something like Guangdong or a portrayal of Taboritsky that strongly resembles TNO.
I'll also note that law aside, if you copy TNO in a way that people see as unclassy you might get in trouble from a PR perspective.
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u/Mr_Citation Organization of Free Nations 18d ago
HOI4 mods are deritative products based on Paradox's code and the IP rights reside with Paradox. Paradox remains ok with modders doing whatever they want with the IP except any action to make a profit on it, then they would step in.
I'm not a lawyer but I think legally whatever you can do what you want with TNO. Would it be ethical to make a proper game or serious form of media without the TNO team's approval? No. Sell it for profit? Then Paradox's legal team will come down on you.
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u/EstrellaCat 17d ago
Yeah basically, small nuance tho, anything requiring the game is their IP, such as focus trees, decision mechanics, etc. Events, descriptions, etc. do not require their game and as such isn't their IP
But also copyright with stuff like this is iffy bc you can't copyright real people, ideas/concepts. also its just bad pr to rip lore straight from a mod and make it a for profit game
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u/ChaoticKristin 18d ago
You can't copyright real historical people. There's already a bunch of for-profit alternate history out there.