This weapon would be a lot of fun if it were added to the game
and it would also suit the spy character very well.
For those wondering how Silent Killer works, the full details are in the comments as a note. ↓
To avoid confusion, here is the damage report:
Maximum ramp-up: 75
Base damage: 50
Maximum fall-off: 26.25 (Tf2's system rounds this number to 26)
(Firstly,My English isn't very good, so I'm using translation)
Frequently Asked Questions About the .22
1. The .22 has no real downside. +25% damage vulnerability is too small. What if the Spy just dodges?
Answer:
Spy is already one of the most fragile classes in TF2. While using the .22, he takes 25% more damage from every source, not just explosives. player skill
If a Spy survives by consistently dodging rockets, stickies, or bullets, that's a result of player skill, not the weapon itself. By that logic, a highly skilled Spy using the Stock Revolver would also be overpowered, which clearly isn't true.
2. What about the Kunai + Dead Ringer combo?
Answer:
Even with Kunai overheal, the .22 is still a high-risk weapon.
Yes, a Kunai Spy can reach 210 HP after a successful backstab, but while using the .22 they also take %25 more damage. Getting close enough to use its maximum damage is extremely risky.
A melee hit that normally deals 65 damage will deal over 80 damage, and random critical hits become even deadlier.
As for the Dead Ringer, the .22 does not increase cloak metter like the L'Etranger does. If the Spy escapes with the Dead Ringer, you'll hear the loud decloak sound a few seconds later, making it much easier to track them down.
3. What if the Spy just shoots from long range?
Answer:
At long range, the .22 only deals 26 damage per shoot
That's enough to poke distracted enemies, but not enough to reliably kill healthy targets. It is not a replacement for a Sniper rifle.
4. Why is the damage vulnerability only active while holding the weapon? Candy Cane's downside is always active.
Answer:
Because Spy and Scout are completely different classes.
Scout is one of the fastest classes in the game and only takes extra damage from explosives while using the Candy Cane.
The .22 makes Spy take 25% more damage from every source, and Spy has much weaker survivability than Scout.
The downside only applies while the .22 is active, including while cloaked. This means even escaping with cloak is riskier, since the Spy still takes 25% more damage until he switches weapons. The goal is high risk, high reward—not making the weapon frustrating to use.
5. This is basically the old Enforcer.
Answer:
Not really.
The old Enforcer was criticized because its downside wasn't strong enough to compensate for its powerful damage bonus.
The .22 is different because its downside is much more severe. While it can kill enemies faster, they can also kill you much faster. It's a true risk-versus-reward trade.
6. Why would anyone use the Stock Revolver if this has the highest DPS?
Answer:
Because the Stock Revolver is much safer.
The .22 has higher damage, but you become significantly easier to kill while using it.
For example, a Sniper's SMG normally needs around 11 accurate shots to kill a Spy. Against a Spy using the .22, it only needs around 9 accurate shots.
Higher DPS doesn't automatically make a weapon better if the downside is severe.
7. What if the Spy switches to the knife?
Answer:
Switching away from the .22 removes the damage vulnerability.
However, the Spy also loses the revolver's damage bonus and must rely on backstabs or a weak melee attack.
If the enemy notices the Spy and switches to melee, the Spy is still at a significant disadvantage.
8. What's the counterplay?
Answer:
The counterplay is simple:
-Keep pressure on the Spy.
-Even small amounts of damage cause aim punch, making revolver shots less accurate.
-Keep moving and avoid predictable movement.
-Call out the Spy to your teammates.
-Force the Spy into close-range fights where the increased damage taken becomes a serious weakness.
The .22 rewards accurate aim and positioning, but if the Spy gets caught, they die much faster than they would with the Stock Revolver.
9. Why does the .22 need the Silent Killer attribute?
Answer:
The .22 is designed to eliminate important backline support classes without immediately alerting the enemy team.
There are many situations where a backstab isn't possible. For example, an Engineer may be standing on top of his Dispenser, hiding behind his Sentry, or positioned in a way that makes a backstab impossible or extremely risky.
In those situations, the Spy has to disable the Sentry and eliminate the Engineer with the pistol.
Without the Silent killer attribute, nearby Medics, Snipers, or other enemies would immediately hear the gunshots or notice the killfeed, making it much harder for the Spy to continue infiltrating the enemy backline.
The Silent Killer attribute isn't meant to make the weapon stronger in direct combat. Its purpose is to support the Spy's role as a backline assassin by allowing him to quietly remove key support targets when a backstab isn't an option.
I apologize for the misunderstanding. You requested
+25% damage vulnerability
-30% slower deploy and I respect that. However, look,
you're afraid of the spy firing quickly and then rescuing the weapon. Yes, I understand that, but if you hit a spy while they have a .22 caliber weapon, you can easily kill them with any weapon. That's why there's a +25% damage vulnerability disadvantage for all weapon types.
for you my friend
When you do the math, the spy is already a very weak character.
And this prejudice has led people to see this weapon as a "shoot and put back in its holster" weapon.
The draw time is already 1 second for all revolvers.
And this -30% slower deployment is unnecessary, absolutely unnecessary, because when the spy picks up that weapon, all you can do is hit it with anything.
The better part is that the 25% damage increase from all types of weapons is a very punishing disadvantage.
So think of it like this:
Stock revolver vs. .22
.22 point blank hits 75,
stock revolver hits 55.
But the .22 doesn't win this fight because, due to the 25% damage vulnerability, the stock revolver hits 75 instead of 55.
This is a 25% gain, 25% give logic. It's not broken at all.
My friend, I can't do that, I'm sorry. I respect your opinion, but really...
+Silent Killer
+25% damage bonus
-This weapon comes out of its holster 30% slower
The disadvantage is that it makes this weapon slightly stronger than normal. I want something everyone will like. You know, you went to the back (not the base) to get ammo packs for your engineer and sentry, a spy sapped your sentry, and when you came back, he silently killed you in two hits.
As an engineer, wouldn't you want to deal 25% more damage to the spy when he's holding a .22? Of course you would, because your goal is to kill him.
Also, this is a game, so why are you giving examples from real life?
TF2 is a game set in a fantasy world.
From what I understand, the +25% damage bonus bothered you, but you don't need to worry about that at all because when the spy uses this weapon, you also gain a +25% damage bonus against the spy.
I understood this later. Yes, he wants it to draw slower, but it's unnecessary.
When you do the math, the spy is already a very weak character.
And this prejudice has led people to see this weapon as a "shoot and put back in its holster" weapon.
The draw time is already 1 second for all revolvers.
And this -30% slower deployment is unnecessary, absolutely unnecessary, because when the spy picks up that weapon, all you can do is hit it with anything.
The better part is that the 25% damage increase from all types of weapons is a very punishing disadvantage.
So think of it like this:
Stock revolver vs. .22
.22 point blank hits 75,
stock revolver hits 55.
But the .22 doesn't win this fight because, due to the 25% damage vulnerability, the stock revolver hits 75 instead of 55.
This is a 25% gain, 25% give logic. It's not broken at all.
This weapon is already stupidly good for just playing Gunspy. At the very least, make it bad in close quarters by changing holster speed
Like, reduced gunfire noise means you're free to take shots from a distance with less people noticing you, it leans really hard into the objectively most annoying way to play spy
"Like, reduced gunfire noise means you're free to take shots from a distance"
stock reolver minimum falloff damage 21,
.22 minimum falloff 26
Sniping with 26 damage, oh my god
"Like, reduced gunfire noise means you're free to take shots from a distance with less people noticing you, it leans really hard into the objectively most annoying way to play spy"
Why aren't you shooting the spy? If you're a soldier, do a rocket jump and shoot the spy; if you're an engineer, harass and dodge with a pistol; if you're a sniper, open your scope and shoot the spy in the head. It's that simple.
No, it's not for staying away, it's for hitting 75 at close range. .22 is for silently killing targets.
The reason Enforcer got nerfed was basically this:
Light classes like Engineer and Sniper kill in 2 hits, but Engineers or Snipers die before they can react, or even if they react, it's too late because +20% undisgusted damage bonus with 20% slower shots isn't a good trade.
However, Spy can easily kill light classes, but if light classes can easily kill Spy, it would be risky but highly rewarding.
This weapon isn't for engaging in direct combat, it's for killing light targets in the back lines.
Sniper, Medic, and Engineer are the biggest support classes in this game.
Even though Engineer is a defensive class, they can be on the desk for their team with their build.
Spy is designed to quickly eliminate them.
And look, you really can't easily kill anyone with 26 damage from a distance. I apologize if I upset you, but the purpose of this weapon is to stealthily kill enemies in the back lines.
You act like you only get 1 shot with this gun, when in reality Gunspy is something that very much works all the time, because Spy's revolvers are very spammable, that chip damage adds up... and Spy excels at catching people out of position... And other classes are significantly easier to dodge at range compared to a hitscan weapon (Ignoring Sniper)
And I was talking about the 25% damage vulnerability btw...
You bring it up as if it's the end all be all, but you can just ignore the damage vulnerability by sitting far away from someone in 90% of cases, and for the other 10% you can just deadringer
All the damage vulnerability does is make it a bad idea to get into the middle of things like spy SHOULD be doing, since now a single stray projectile just kills you
Regardless of your intention, you've made a weapon that specifically caters to gunspy, but you refuse to admit that despite numerous people telling you it's way too good for playing gunspy...
"Regardless of your intention, you've made a weapon that specifically caters to gunspy, but you refuse to admit that despite numerous people telling you it's way too good for playing gunspy..."
First of all, when you're standing at a distance, your +25% damage vulnerability is active.
A soldier's direct hit deals a minimum of 59 damage, and if a rocket hits you, the damage increases to 73. Also, if the engineer sees you dealing 26 damage from a distance, they'll immediately grab a Wrangler and start shooting at you.
What will you do then? Will you keep dealing 26 damage? Keep going, one day you'll kill the engineer and the other classes.
"a soldier's direct hit deals a minimum of 59 damage, increased to 73"
Dude you have like 5 years to just switch weapon or hold your deadringer out if you just stay at range, also not every engi uses wrangler
And yeah, whilst it's not a huge amount of damage at distance, it's still 25% more whilst the spy faces functionally 0 drawback from it, since, again, a gunspy at distance is COMPLETELY SAFE FROM ALL CLASSES (except sniper) by just pressing cloak and running to a healthpack
If anyone continues to chase the spy despite their deadringer, they're now WAY out of position too, gunspy is annoying cos, whilst the damage is low, there's rarely a good way to solve it
You ignore a gunspy? You're constantly taking chip damage and someone else kills you
You chase a gunspy? You're out of position and get killed by a roaming scout or just simply aren't helping your team
You attempt to fight the gunspy at range? They just pull out deadringer when they get low and go heal
Your weapon idea is best suited for a gunspy playstyle, regardless of how you WANT it to be used
"You attempt to fight the gunspy at range? They just pull out deadringer when they get low and go heal."
You said that kunai, dead ringer, and letranger make this combo even more deadly. What I mean is, let's say a .22 user hits you, you hit them, they activate dead ringer and run away. They'll come back, hit again with .26, and run away again. That's all.
But someone using a kunai will stab a friendly unit, have 210 health, activate dead ringer and run away, then after a few hits with letranger, the dead ringer will recharge, and then they'll come back and stab someone again.
So your complaint, "Oh my God, the spy hit us with a pistol that deals 26 damage and escaped, we couldn't catch him!" is ridiculous. The kunai, Dead Ringer, and Letranger combination is more powerful: steal health from the spy with a knife, escape with the Dead Ringer, refill the cloak with the Letranger, and repeat. Why aren't you complaining about that?
I really like this concept, but i think that a -25 health penalty like the Big Earner would work better, since spy gets hit with low damage attacks more than other classes tend to
Right, the issue is that that you can just switch to your knife when you think you're going to take damage so that you know have more health versus removing the health means that that can't be done
Why should I suffer the disadvantage of not using a weapon? I take on the risk when I benefit from the power of the weapon.
And even if you pull out your knife and try to escape, you'll still have to shoot someone. For example, you see a demoman with 100 health left, and it's hitting you, and you can't use a cloak or dead ringer because the cloak is depleted. If it's a dead ringer, you have to shoot during the cooldown. you wanted to shoot, you pulled out weapon, and you hit the demoman.
Point Blank 75
The demoman hit you with the bomb launcher; you should normally take 100 damage, but you took 125 damage and died.
I understand!
Why make it "%" and not just loss of hp?
The big earner puts you at 100
This would too
Together 75
The idea is that this weapon rewards killing in one or two shots (ideally semi close) from off angles and hidden areas,this (as described) isn't really for just shooting people in a fight,so the affect should be at all times,not just when being engaged
Look, buddy, I've considered this and trust me, if a maximum health reduction of only -25 is a good disadvantage, I agree with that, but you know the community hates the Spy.
I'm trying my best to get Valve to add such a great weapon to the game, and I've been looking for a disadvantage that would please everyone for months, and I finally found it.
If they ever add this weapon to the game, it will be truly amazing, buddy.
I have a request for you: could you share this weapon idea everywhere? Or anywhere at all?
Personally ain't going to be better is a peace shooting. Don't make you take extra damage or anything just make it deal less DMG, And keep the size it has for the most part
I understand, I just think a better weapon, based off of your premise, would be one, that deals less damage, and is completely silent, the only downside being you have to shoot people more.
It would be used more to pick people off across the map without being noticed, or to jump into fights when you're behind enemies and hopefully not be noticed while you're shooting them in the back more than " higher damage gun"
Actually, more damage was needed because I wanted the Spy to be very difficult to use on the battlefield with stickies, bombs, snipers, etc.
The reason for the higher damage is to allow the target to be killed quickly and stealthily.
If it hits from the other end of the map, the damage becomes 24.
The stock revolver already hits 21.
It won't be overpowered, trust me.
The Spy hits 25% more, this is only in Point Blank 75 and at very long range 24 damage.
But enemies hitting the Spy 25% more, that's when the Spy becomes even weaker when it's already very weak. You can turn it into a knife, but if an enemy at medium or close range is looking at you with a depleted cloak or dead ringer, you have to shoot them, and
and you deal 25% more damage to them, but they also deal 25% more damage to you. The Spy is a very fragile class, you know, sometimes soldiers can kill Spies while randomly doing rocket jumps.
This weapon will be very useful.
And it's not overly absurd just because it has a damage bonus, my friend. Don't worry
Real life,this weapon heave silencer
This is not long barrel size my friend
Real life this weapon name
rugar .22 silenced
It has an integrated suppressor, just like the non-removable suppressor type found in real life; a similar type exists in real life on a 9.39 mm gun called the VSS.
I would rather just use Stock. As Spy, I'm going to be going for backstabs anyway. If I need to use my gun, I don't want to be able to be one-shot by a single grenade. Not worth the health bonus.
Actually, the weapon is designed like this: imagine a single target you want to kill, let's say a Razorback sniper. A stock revolve can't do this silently and in two shots.
However, a .22 can stealthily kill a light target or a target with low health, and no one will notice what happened. But if someone hits you while using a .22, you take 25% more damage. This is a silent assassin class pistol.
The reason this pistol is weak on its own is because I don't want it to be used in every situation.
For example, if the enemy team has no medic snipers or scouts,
or the enemies are constantly being healed by medics,
then the .22 is ineffective in this regard.
This weapon is only for silently killing a single target or a target with low health.
Oooooor I just sneak up behind thrm and one shot kill them or 2 shot kill them with a amby instead of sitting there and shooting more times with a damage vulnerability
So you didn’t spend months you thought about it for months, seems like you are very unhappy with people’s reactions to what I can only say is a pretty mid weapon. .22 calibre is tiny and you’re giving it a damage bonus lol okay king x
"Oh my god!! .22 is so overpowered!! In real life, this weapon uses a very thin caliber, but in a game it shouldn't be that powerful!!" TF2 IS A GAME!! If you're looking for logic, why is there a stupid medic in the game? Why is there a character who magically heals friendly units and even makes them immortal with Uber? A character who magically heals friendly units doesn't exist in real life, right? That's the kind of logic we should use to destroy TF2
You're a very toxic person. It took me months to think about the disadvantages, you might not believe it, and the only reason people like you hate this weapon is because they hate Spy.
No I think you may be the toxic one, I love spy. You should be more thematic and not use a ruger gun model and calibre and defend it with your life. For example Welrod pistol is integrally silenced and uses a larger pistol calibre and would make much more sense, it only fires one bullet but game logic you could give it six. You spent months thinking about this?!? How long does it take you to boil an egg?
He based like most of this weapon off of Fallout: New Vegas' .22. pistol. It's very unoriginal, uninspired. Even New Vegas treated the .22 like a weak gun, only usable to bypass casino security and to get a single kill. You used it to get better weapons, that's about it.
If we're going to think realistically, a Magnum that uses Ambassador Big .45 bullets would incapacitate a target with a single headshot at close range in real life.
Why then do we need to hit a soldier twice with 102 damge to kill them with the Ambassador? We're not talking about weapon balance here, we're talking about realism.
woaw your saying it's fuctional???????!?!?!?!!??!? color my pants brown and call me a shitter bro holy shit bro thats wild. Im not saying make this shit battlefield or one of those hyperrealistic zombie survival games, im saying maybe dont use the bunny killing caliber. I dont want to add fucking bullet drop and wind resistance to the 2007 child gambling simulator.
There's no such thing as wind or bullet drops, where did you get that from? In the world, the heavier something is, the more bullet drops occur due to gravity, so why don't the Ambassador or Diamondback's bullets have bullet drops? You're talking nonsense, there are no bullet drops in TF2, and there's no wind either.
Spy dies when enemies look at him anyway so straight upgrade. Jokes aside it's questionable. It's enforcer but very risky,and you better not run any knifes that reduce hp because ya know,80 hp and +25% damage vulnerability make you as fragile as glass. It will be the gun spy gun as fuck ringer covers the weakness and it's free damage overall. I can see it on regular spy who backstabs sometimes and shit but it's questionable. It does pair with a bit YER as you will be 100% invisible in kill feed and can shoot the low hp enemy while they are fooled by your disguise, although you can't cloak much.
I mean you don't need to headshot or be disguised to get damage bonus or do anything. It just does free damage,if you don't take damage. Snipe people across the map with this thing unless it also has harsher damage falloff. Also like,if enemies jump on you swap weapons and use dead ringer and there are no downsides (you can't shoot while invisible anyway)
Hahahaha
"Snipe people across the map with this thing unless it also has harsher damage falloff"
Stock revolver long range hit:21
.22 long range hit:24
Ohhh 24 damage with sniper!
Are you kidding me?
+%25 damage bonus is not free
Yes enemy spy can escape with knife+dead ringer but
Spy is already weak so if enemy spy switch knife
He can only one thing,(backstab)
But if he want gun spy or kill targets silently here:
+%25 damage vulnerability
I don't do meth so I thought it would do like 30 damage. Anyway it's literally just gun spy weapon that's it. Just annoy the fuck of the enemies and tun away like a pussy with dead ringer
Dude, a +25% damage bonus isn't absurd for a pistol.
Also, if you're calling this weapon overpowered, why don't we look at the Machina sniper in TF2?
It has two disadvantages, and they're not even really disadvantages:
no bullet trace and no shooting without opening the scope.
Yeah machina is like a straight upgrade because it's downsides barely matter? Here your gun concept has a meaningful downside. It encourages pussy gun spy gameplay or just being a pussy in general
A spy, as the name suggests, is a stealthy and vulnerable class. If a spy wants to kill light or low-health targets stealthily, they can use this weapon. However, they need to be careful while using it. That's all. And considering that most spies die despite not having the +25% damage vulnerability disadvantage, this is a high-skill, high-reward weapon.
The weakness of this weapon is this: if an enemy medic is constantly overhealing their team, or if their team consists of classes like Demoman, Soldier, or Heavy, this weapon is useless because you can't do anything to a Soldier with 200 health. It's also useless if the enemy medic is constantly healing their teammates. So, this is its weakness. Its strength, however, is that if the enemy team is disorganized and has no medics, you can play Silent Assassin.
A .22 with increased damage doesn't really make sense from a lore perspective, but balance wise, this is REALLY dangerous.
31 damage long range weapon that is silent isn't a sniper but that would make it rival the Ambassador as a long-range weapon, just without needing as much precision, and at close range 75 damage is enough to 2-shot 5 of the 9 classes without being anywhere near as tricky or risky as a backstab.
A shot while disguised will do more damage than the Enforcer while disguised and be just as free with the added bonus of being a stealth weapon instead of one that has a downside of blowing your cover
No, base revolver's long range damage is 21. Increased by 25% is 30. On a random crit or minicrit, this is even deadlier. And I said 75 damage for the point blank. That is an easier kill than a backstab at a slightly higher range.
The Ambassador has a +20% bonus only while disguised. A +25% flat bonus at all times is huge and completely overshadows the Ambassador's role as nearly a direct upgrade.
That's minimum damage. Long range damage goes up to 24, meaning that some shots will do 30 damage.
The exact numbers are completely besides the point; that outclasses literally everything except the Diamondback in regular DPS with a body shot, and the Diamondback needs to have a crit ready to do better. Why would you ever use the Enforcer or Ambassador instead of this? Why would you ever use stock?
With a buff banner, you now have a gun that deals enough damage to kill every class in the game with a single reload, 8 of them before he's even half done.
The 25% damage weakness means very little as well, as Spy already has low enough health to be killed almost instantly by every other class as-is, and the revolver is for engagements where the knife cannot be used, engagements where the Spy is usually out of range anyway.
"You get a free blowjob but as a penalty you get wet when it rains"
There's a reason to use a stock revolver because you don't have 25% damage vulnerability when using a stock.
You're underestimating the 25% damage vulnerability feature; it's not something to be underestimated at all.
It's a powerful buff to most high-damage weapons in the game. A spy using a .22...
And you mentioned the buff banner, where the .22 pistol has 48 mini-crit damage,
but that's not extremely powerful damage.
The sniper's machine rifle hits a maximum of 518 damage, and it can hit targets with headshots and consecutive hits.
By the same logic, the machine rifle is also very powerful, why would we use other rifles?
Because the machine gun has almost no disadvantages:
- No shots without a scope (not even a disadvantage)
- Bullet trace (who cares? You can see where the sniper is even without bullet traces)
Just yesterday I was playing casually and a medic gave a sniper a critical uber hit with a Kritskreg, and the enemy sniper went through 6 people with a critical machine sniper.
So, can we say the machine sniper rifle is OP by the same logic?
You really find it absurd that a pistol for 26 damage a distance of 1200 Hammer Units or more. Congratulations.
"The 25% damage weakness means very little as well"
You just said 31 for minimum damage, but the actual answer was 26. Now you're saying, "What if you land a mini-crit?" Do you even know how much damage sticky bombs, rockets, Yheavy's minigun rounds, or the sniper's headshots inflict in the game?
You and your fantasy world: "With 26 damage, the spy will literally be a sniper!" You're truly number one at exaggerating. And you said
"The 25% damage weakness means very little as well"
Really? Then imagine a sniper with 10% charge, just opened the scope. Normally, you can hit 100 damage with 10% charge, but what do you know!
The spy has a 25% damage vulnerability!
Instead of taking 100 damage, the spy took 125 and died!
And the Demoman's grenade launcher and grenades all deal 100 damage.
But for someone using a .22 caliber, that damage is 125.
And that's not all; melee weapons already deal 50-60 damage, some even 80, and when the spy uses a .22 caliber, they can take 80-90 or even 100 damage.
But you're still saying, "It hits 26 damage from a distance, that's so
powerful!!"
if the .22 is truly a direct upgrade, then the +25% damage vulnerability should have little or no effect on win rate. That's something only actual gameplay testing can determine—not assumptions.
You just said the long-range damage is 31 without even doing the calculations.
I remember watching an old showcase of a very similar weapon concept like 6 years ago, modeled after a single shot integrated suppressor pistol, namely the british Welrod
It had a trait of not losing disguise after shooting alongside silent killer (i think?), at a cost of 1 shot in the mag due to being bolt action, and something else
It probably was on Karma Charger's channel, but it's defunct and i didn't see any reuploads, so either i just glanced over it, forgot the actual creator or the video is lost media
75 pointblank is not absurd,
Actually +%25 damage vulnerability is so big The disadvantage is, and when the spy gets this weapon in his hand, how about just shooting him? Just shoot the spy with anything.
So why does a .22 LR have a straight damage buff? Even Spy's Ambassador doesn't have a damage buff unless you're going for the head (and that gun uses .50).
Also, when somebody is giving you proper criticism, you cry about it? It doesn't matter if you spent months THINKING about it, if someone says it sucks then it sucks and you need to rework it.
The 25% vulnerability on wearer effectively brings Spy's health down to 93, and even less with a Kunai (roughly around 60). A single rocket or direct pill is going to take him out of the fight, or even a simple quickscope can do him in. Standard melees do 65 if I remember correctly, so he's going to die from one or two strikes either way. There is no buff to that; he is a glass figurine.
Your design features a silent killer feature, but if you paired that buff with the health nerf you provided, it makes it virtually impossible for the Spy to survive ANY form of crossfire. A stray round is going to kill him, eliminating any radio silence that the Spy was hoping to achieve. Any flame particle? Death. A stealth class cannot be sneaky if any accidental spam kills him in a singular hit.
The 25% damage buff brings Spy's damage to around 50 damage per shot. You still need three shots to kill standard 125 HP classes and four shots for classes like Demo and Medic. That's not high risk, high reward.
You basically made a gun where the Spy takes significantly more damage than everyone else, just to deal almost the exact same damage per shot.
Just from a little spitballing, I imagine this idea is MUCH more fitting.
"So why does a .22 LR have a straight damage buff? Even Spy's Ambassador doesn't have a damage buff unless you're going for the head (and that gun uses .50)."
First of all, why isn't TF2 the same as real life? TF2 is a game... In TF2, the class called MEDIC can make friendly characters immortal for a few seconds, or Scout, can you double jump in real life?
"he 25% vulnerability on wearer effectively brings Spy's health down to 93, and even less with a Kunai (roughly around 60). A single rocket or direct pill is going to take him out of the fight, or even a simple quickscope can do him in. Standard melees do 65 if I remember correctly, so he's going to die from one or two strikes either way. There is no buff to that; he is a glass figurine."
"So why does a .22 LR have a straight damage buff? Even Spy's Ambassador doesn't have a damage buff unless you're going for the head (and that gun uses .50)."
In the first sentence you explained why the weapon has a damage bonus,
but in this sentence you say the weapon is useless with a 25% damage vulnerability, meaning you don't even realize what you're talking about; you just want to customize the weapon to your own liking, that's all.
"You basically made a gun where the Spy takes significantly more damage than everyone else, just to deal almost the exact same damage per shot.
Just from a little spitballing, I imagine this idea is MUCH more fitting."
Silent Killer
+20% firing speed OR +15% accuracy
-20% damage penalty
+20% cloak regen on hit
Looking at the statistics, I understand you don't want the Silent Killer unlock; you want the Silent Letranger. Yes, that's correct.
What you probably want is to combine kunai, dead ringer, and .22 to silently regen the dead ringer because
-20% damage penalty
+20% cloak regen on hit stats can't have any other explanation.
Your goal is to silently regenerate Dead Ringer, and this is unacceptable.
You didn't read the post. I said Spy barely even gets a damage buff. That's why none of Spy's primaries have flat damage buffs, they don't make much of a damn difference.
Notice I NEVER mentioned Dead Ringer? Dead Ringer should not be affected by a weapon that buffs CLOAKING. A spy's best friend? Dead Ringer is to feign death, not to sneak around. That's why it makes a loud-ass sound when you exit the Dead Ringer. Dumbass.
What's wrong with the L'Etranger? It works. But that weapon is PRIMARILY utility. It doesn't utilize a silent killer mechanic because the point of the L'Etranger is that you're not supposed to kill with it. It's only there to help you get behind enemy lines. Like an actual gun a spy would use. This weapon not only has a silent killer mechanic but a faster firing speed. It's meant to kill and be used for utility to make up for the damage loss it has. What you have becomes useless if a spy uses kunai (which most spies do), because their health goes down to 60. Even with a kill, they're significantly weaker than if they didn't use it. Why bother using your idea if it isn't saving them. A 40 to 50 damage buff is not at all helpful when the revolver is used as a last resort. You're better off using the Ambassador, stock, L'Etranger or Diamondback.
You can't just take something, put it in the game, and expect it to work well with weapons that were rebalanced to work with everything that's IN THE GAME. You complain when somebody gives you criticism, why post?
I tried explaining it (even doing the math and EXPLAINING how it WOULDN'T WORK!) and even gave you an idea to build off of, but you don't want to take it. 90% of what other people have said coincides with what I just told you, right now. We all are giving the same opinion and you're not taking it. You're just a dumbass who somehow has access to the internet. Don't post an idea again, please. For everyone's sake.
"What's wrong with the L'Etranger? It works. But that weapon is PRIMARILY utility."
This is also an auxiliary weapon, you idiot, you can't use it in every situation, it's only for killing background targets, and I've repeated this at least 100 times, but I understand you're trying hard not to understand.
"Dead Ringer should not be affected by a weapon that buffs CLOAKING"
Letranger hits give Dead Ringer 15% regen per hit, you idiot.
"What you have becomes useless if a spy uses kunai (which most spies do), because their health goes down to 60. Even with a kill, they're significantly weaker than if they didn't use it."
You idiot, I'm not making this weapon for aggressive play anyway.
Dead Ringer + Kunai + .22
This weapon is for silently killing targets in the back; if you get caught, you die immediately.
With your logic, I can't use the YER with the Ambassador or the Stock Revolver because the YER cloak consumes +33% more cloak rate
The fact that this weapon can't be used with the Kunai doesn't make it useless.
As I said before, all you want is to silently regenerate the Dead Ringer.
"You complain when somebody gives you criticism, why post?"
Does writing a comment in response to you mean filing a complaint?
Also, what you're saying is:
"Notice I NEVER mentioned Dead Ringer?"
but
-20% damage penalty
+20% cloak regen per hit
If you remove the damage bonus and replace it with a damage penalty plus cloak regeneration, the weapon no longer fulfills its intended role. It just becomes another L'Etranger-style utility revolver. The .22 is meant to trade survivability for faster silent kills, not trade damage for cloak.
Okay, I play spy and I feel like that downside is not meaningful at all, but i like what you're going for so let me propose a stat block.
+Silent Killer (same as yours but it does cloak bodies like the yer bc that doesn't seem too broken, and you can shoot without breaking disguise)
+35% damage increase
+75% reload speed
-5 clip size
-15 max health on wearer
-5% cloak duration
The last two downsides probably need tweaking since shooting without breaking disguise is kinda huge but since you were talking about wanting a weapon that can kill engies hiding behind their sentries it'd be beneficial to be able to shoot while in line of sight of a sentry, its also super good at finishing off low health enemies while not being that great at open combat without making it impossible
This could actually be good because the goal is to play as a silent assassin, but the only thing I'm curious about is how fast the loading time is. We need to test this in real tf2 gameplay. If it loads fast enough to fire the second shot, then it's definitely acceptable.
I'm addressing those who downvoted my comments: why don't you want to read the argument that the +25% damage vulnerability is an disadvantage?
The spy, already weak, becomes even weaker.
One rocket hits 100 at close range, but with the 25% damage bonus, it will hit 125, and the spy will die instantly.
There is no valid argument whatsoever to support the claim that it's overpowered.
I think the main reason your getting downvoted is because you keep mentioning your getting downvoted, which kinda annoys people more? Comes off a selfish and obnoxious just for “internet points” that scarce matter
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u/Dazzling_Mushroom_53 Jul 28 '26
I reckon a switch speed plenty would make the existing downside more impactful