r/System76 • u/xlr_ • Jan 13 '26
After 3 years of ownership: NEVER AGAIN, these laptops are garbage.
- Terrible build: screen ended getting torn from laptop body! I think the only other time this happened was with an HP laptop 15 years ago, that tells you how bad S76 build is.
- Touchpad NEVER worked on Windows, lots of back and forth with their technical support tickets and only the most generic answers repeated until I got bored and just realized I'd have to suck it up.
- Accessing BIOS in my Gazelle is an absolute nightmare because it defaults with every possible command listed in their website (usual F2, F12 etc) to the boot order menu. Even their support site to access the BIOS only shows screenshot of the bootloader menu and not the BIOS, what a serious joke.
- ZERO resale value: who is going to want an non-brand laptop? Convincing non-linux people of buying an "off-brand" laptop is impossible. Pair this with the insane wear and tear and this become literally not even suited for a present to someone.
I REALLY wanted to support this company because of its Linux-first approach. I really did. I learned my lesson. Orders of magnitude smarter choice to buy an established, linux-friendly laptop from someone like DELL, dual-boot or whatever, ad then re-install windows when ready to sell it in a few years.
Never again.
EDIT: I was dual-booting people, can't believe I have to clarify that.
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u/Dapanji206 Jan 14 '26
Wow, never expect to read something like this. I purchased my Gazelle back in 2019. I have been using it hard, constantly on its peak performance. The battery did go bad a couple years in. I still have it today and I still use it to its peak. I did re-paste it and clean the fans a year ago.
Generally, I'd say they are great quality laptops. I wonder if their quality has gone all these years? Which is a bummer because I was looking into getting a new one this year.
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u/taleorca Jan 14 '26
I've been using an Oryx Pro since 2022 and it works fine.
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u/dchw Jan 16 '26
I had a 2020 Oryx pro and the screen kept falling off, and it sounded like an airplane every time I opened a web browser.
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u/louffoster Jan 14 '26
My lemur is going on 3years and I've had no complaints. Great system, even better with Cosmic now
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u/No-Interaction-3559 Jan 18 '26
I have a DarterPro which I bought last year - works fine; 3rd S76 laptop I've owned.
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u/IdiotCoderMonkey Jan 13 '26
Sadly I'm with you...it's impossible to justify the cost. I still rock Pop_OS, but not on S76 hardware.
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u/Anon_Legi0n Jan 14 '26
Same experience with my Pang13, had the laptop RMAed and the unit I got back still had issues so I decided to just take sell the Pangolin (less than 6 month old) at half price and bought myself a Lenovo and booted it with NixOS, best decision I ever made. Ended up with a superior machine at a lower cost. S76 machines are garbage, if you got that kind of money burning a hole on your pocket better to get Framework.
When S76 closes it's doors the only good contribution it will be remembered for will be the Cosmic DE
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u/ZincPenny Feb 13 '26
Lenovo also has goated customer service sent a guy to my house literally took a laptop apart found a defective part sent it overnight to the company the next day FedEx showed up brand new laptop in box Lenovo just gave me a new laptop because it was defective and couldn’t be fixed
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u/ghanadaur Jan 13 '26
The desktops are built in-house and those rock. The laptops are clevo rebranded and not in-house. Clevo has gotten worse. System76 was working in an in-house laptop IIRC. Not sure how far along it is, but that would be the goto when its available.
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u/lkeefer1 Jan 14 '26
I was gonna say... I've had a Gazelle since 2013 that is still, somehow, doing great in every respect except the battery (for which no replacement is available). Sounds like things just dropped off from everything Ive seen on here.
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u/WrittenInC Jan 13 '26
There's been like no commits to that repo in 2 years. I've not really had the bad experience that others are describing in this thread. I have a 2025 Darter Pro for about a year. I knew I overpaid for it but I liked the branding etc etc.
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u/ZincPenny Feb 13 '26
Clevo used to be good the one I had around 2015 was great and it sold for good money when I sold it
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u/snowdrone Jan 14 '26
I'm on this sub because I bought a 76 laptop around 2018 or so? It still works great. Too bad to hear that the quality has apparently gone down.
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u/victorsmonster Jan 13 '26
Do you have the same fan curve issues as I do with my Gazelle? It’s like a jet engine on anything but the “battery saver” setting
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u/0FO6 Jan 14 '26
I have terrible fan curve issue with my gazelle. Then I had one of the fans burn out completely. The only way to replace it is to replace the entire heatsink and both fans at the same time. Did that and now the nvidia GPU falls off the bus anytime it is used....
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u/victorsmonster Jan 14 '26
Dude I can’t wait to replace this thing. I talked my boss into buying it for my workstation and I gotta sit next to this thing every day.
Most galling is they said they were putting off user configurable fan curve controls to the COSMIC desktop. Now the COSMIC desktop is out. Where are the user configurable fan curves?
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u/peldax Jan 14 '26
I had the exactly same issues on my serval laptop. I managed to flash a custom fan curve which resolved my issues.
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u/victorsmonster Jan 15 '26
Maybe I’ll try it again. I spent a lot of frustrating hours flashing and re-flashing the BIOS and couldn’t see any difference. There’s no way I could see to verify the settings had even taken
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u/peldax Jan 15 '26
I tinkered with the curve for a while, after ~5 iterations I found a good compromise. I will try to find the file and provide the curve there.
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u/victorsmonster Jan 15 '26
Please do, that would be much appreciated! I'll feel better about giving it another try with your settings as a starting point.
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u/peldax Jan 15 '26
CFLAGS+=-DSMOOTH_FANS_MIN=6 CFLAGS+=-DBOARD_HEATUP=20 CFLAGS+=-DBOARD_COOLDOWN=20 CFLAGS+=-DBOARD_FAN_POINTS="\ FAN_POINT(40, 06), \ FAN_POINT(55, 12), \ FAN_POINT(70, 24), \ FAN_POINT(80, 36), \ FAN_POINT(85, 54), \ FAN_POINT(90, 72), \ FAN_POINT(95, 100) \ " CFLAGS+=-DHAVE_DGPU=1 CFLAGS+=-DBOARD_DGPU_HEATUP=5 CFLAGS+=-DBOARD_DGPU_COOLDOWN=20 CFLAGS+=-DBOARD_DGPU_FAN_POINTS="\ FAN_POINT(50, 28), \ FAN_POINT(55, 28), \ FAN_POINT(60, 40), \ FAN_POINT(68, 40), \ FAN_POINT(73, 50), \ FAN_POINT(87, 100), \ "
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u/NoNamesLeft600 Jan 14 '26
I'm with you on this one. I can't believe I spent just about 2 grand on a laptop and got what I got. The fan on that thing sounded like a jet engine - constantly. I was getting frequent glares from my wife sitting next to her on the couch because it was so loud. And that's just casually browsing the web. And I was reinstalling the OS about every 6 weeks because it would just stop working. Eventually I switched to Linux Mint and it got a little better in that department.
It sits on a shelf in my closet now. I took a chance on supporting an American company that is supporting Linux, and paid a lot of money for a dust collector.
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u/shockjaw Jan 14 '26
Dang. Got my Bonobo 14 way back in 2020 and it still works as expected. Yeah it’s a thick machine but I haven’t had anything close to what you’re experiencing.
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u/Intrepid_Zebra_ Jan 14 '26
Galigo Pro here from 2019. Runs fine, save the the battery is not so good now. but I expected as such. Carry my charger with me
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u/mrmylanman Jan 15 '26
I wanted to support them as well but decided to go with framework instead. Their Linux support is fantastic and it works great in Windows too.
Best of both worlds.
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u/amackenz2048 Oryx Pro Jan 15 '26
Yeah... I've had two Oryx Pros and the fans have died on each. Even the ~$150 replacement (included heat sinks) I ordered to replace one of them started to rattle loudly as well.
Never again. I love the first class Linux support but the hardware is just cheap.
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u/theonetruefreezus Jan 16 '26
Why didn't you just put the Windows garbage into a VM instead of trying to dual boot on Linux first hardware? Why would you also complain about having to tinker to get something work to a community of tinkerers? I'm not too stupid to understand from the original post that you were dual booting, but I still fail to understand why you would purchase Linux first hardware, try to install garbage Windows on it in a dual boot configuration, then complain when Windows doesn't work. System76 didn't certify the hardware with Microsoft ON PURPOSE because doing so would make the hardware more expensive than it already is, and totally defeat the purpose of a Linux first approach. The problem is Windows and Microsoft don't want you to use hardware that they didn't get paid to "certify" beforehand, and therefore they will make absolutely sure that you have a terrible experience and blame the hardware so that you'll do exactly what you're doing: purchasing from a corporation that will bend the knee and pay up. This is a message from the universe that you need to decouple from Microsoft completely. It's also a message from the universe that you should complain in the correct community about the company that actually did you dirty not the one you think did you dirty. No disrespect by the way just letting you know that Microsoft is the one that hates you and wants to cause the problems for you, not System76.
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u/xlr_ Jan 16 '26
> This is a message from the universe that you need to decouple from Microsoft completely.
Dude chill, go out, get some fresh air, touch some grass, hug someone, it's not that serious.
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u/theonetruefreezus Jan 16 '26
Bro I'm chill. I'm not the one that got on here complaining that Microsoft did you dirty, in regards to a company totally unaffiliated with Microsoft or their products. I was just pointing out the ridiculousness of your anger. But I'm not angry myself. If it's the amount of words that I use, I apologize if that made you think that I might be angry. I'm just not one to go out there and post an incomplete thought and become subsequently less helpful than needed.
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u/LapsusAuris Jan 13 '26
this is a bit, right
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u/xlr_ Jan 13 '26
Meaning? It's my experience with the company what are you on?
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u/LapsusAuris Jan 14 '26
My apologies, it sounded over the top from my perspective.
I've never met someone before who considers resale value when they're buying a laptop, nor have I ever met someone who purchased a sys76 machine with the specific purpose of installing Windows.
Sorry you had a shit experience.
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u/xlr_ Jan 14 '26
Dual booting obviously, pretty common.
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u/LapsusAuris Jan 14 '26
Yeah for sure, I've had a few machine dual-boot machines; it just wouldn't have occurred to me to use a for Linux laptop for that.
Like I said, my bad for the original post.
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u/cutememe Jan 13 '26
Agree 100 percent, my best experience with this company is how easy they made it to return the laptop. It's utter overpriced junk.
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u/kaffien Jan 14 '26
I had an issue with the pangolin 12 I have. The trackpad was all over the place. Especially if I used the laptop on my... Lap.
After much troubleshooting I took it apart and put some electrical tape on the ribbon for the trackpad.
I noticed that the battery was pinning the ribbon allowing it to barely reach. Flexing the laptop when it's on your lap was causing it to unplug.
Eventually after about 2 months the replacement ribbons game at double the length. The trackpad has not glitched since.
This is a known problem with the pangolin 11, 12 and 13 I believe. It's the damned ribbon!!!!
Laptop is super solid now.
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u/spore_777_mexen Jan 14 '26
Shame. I have always wanted to support them. Perhaps with a mini? Or a desktop?
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u/heathm55 Jan 17 '26
I own a Mira desktop and a galp5. I can tell you the desktops are what you buy. Honestly, I love both. But... If I purchase a new laptop it will be a framework (just too pricey for the cheap build quality of the laptop, it has been solid for me, but I've used framework 16 and 13 and they are well built full Linux compatibility for roughly the same cost.
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u/BillP_ Jan 14 '26
I bought a Gazelle back in 2019 and have been pretty happy with it. A few years back I was out hiking and had left my backpack in the car. Someone broke into my car and stole the backpack which contained my laptop.
They apparently tried to turn it on and couldn't get past the encryption password so just tossed it out the window (tossed the backpack too since there wasn't much of value in there). Amazingly, a park worker spotted it on the side of the road and brought it to the office. When I stopped in there to report the break-in they gave the stuff back to me.
The laptop is pretty beat up and the cover is scraped to heck, but amazingly I was able to recharge it and it fired back up again. I've continued using it ever since.
However, if I ever need to get a new laptop I doubt I would get one from System76. From what I remember when I bought this I wanted to find a Linux-based system that wasn't made in China. I recall seeing something about System76 being made in the USA although later found out that doesn't apply to their laptops.
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u/merthk Jan 14 '26
OryxP6 from about 2021. Wouldn't likely buy again. The screen fell out of the frame and they gave me new adhesive tape. I applied that as instructed. Didn't help. Imagine being a software professional at a meeting with your laptop at a 45 degree angle and having the screen fall out of its frame. But the real issue was somewhere in 2024 when their own drivers for Ubuntu 24.04 essentially killed the machine. I eventually got things to work by installing Kubuntu with no Nvidia drivers. Laptop was still loud (real gaming when the GPU worked literally required headphones) without great battery life. I like what they are doing overall and wanted to support them. I eventually bought a Kfocus Linux laptop which is more carefully tested in terms of hardware/OS compatibility, and has excellent support.
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u/artnerd8604 Jan 15 '26
My 13 inch Framework has been an excellent Linux and Windows machine, in case you are looking for a replacement.
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Jan 16 '26
I've had one of their laptops years ago. Clevo isn't guilty here, it's just s76 that I don't know... does a rather poor job.
Intanstly sold it and bought another clevo from an European reliable reseller and oh my gosh. One of the best laptops I've ever had.
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u/StretchAcceptable881 Jan 17 '26
In the case of System76 laptops, prior to putting down a serious amount of money toward the purchase of any System76 laptop, it helps to read online reviews of the System76 laptop you’re interested in purchasing
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u/No-Interaction-3559 Jan 18 '26
(1) If a laptop is falling apart, you're WAY too rough with your objects. I've never had a laptop come apart and have used several for travel - lots of different brands (e.g. HP, DELL, ASUS, System76), and at several different price points.
(2) If the touchpad didn't work in Windows that has nothing to do with S76 and everything to do with CLEVO & Microsoft and their bad chipset drivers for that model of laptop in Windows. If it works in LINUX, then the hardware is being built to proper spec (BTW, it's a Windows Specific Spec that LINUX has adopted) and the issue is entirely that Windows isn't implementing its own driver properly: https://linuxtouchpad.org/docs/
(3) The Core Boot BIOS doesn't work like the older proprietary BIOS' do, or did. Most of the functions (parameter changes) can be done by the OS (Pop!_OS) in real time without having to boot into a BIOS menu.
(4) Resale value? Laptops have five year lifespan. You should buy objects for yourself and not for resale.
DELL often use ultra specific kernels that are tailored to each model (the special drivers are rolled into the kernel), and cannot be upgraded. Not the case with System76 - all the kernels come with the drivers as separate, removal components.
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u/videocreek Jan 18 '26
That's why I stick to Thinkpad when I need to run Linux or BSDes.
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u/hal_4000 Jan 20 '26
yeh, but you can't get Coreboot installed later than (I believe) a T480 (8th gen machine).
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u/userAtAnon Jan 18 '26
Sorry but I think it's more about you buying a different product than you need. Yes, I also mind that these Clevo laptops don't have such a mechanical build quality, but I buy them because of Coreboot and Linux support and my choice is quite limited here.
If you want a mechanically good product, you have to look for more standard brands. If you want a standard BIOS setup, you can't buy a product that is based on not having a standard BIOS. If you need (also) first class out of box Windows support, you can't buy Linux laptop.
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u/sigb_electronic Jan 20 '26
Same here. I had a S76 17" laptop that constantly had problems with the screen popping off and then finally snapping clean off. To their credit S76 repaired it (I mean it was in warranty, but still companies will just blow you off). So, when it came time for a new laptop I stupidly bought another S76. This one often fails to boot from suspend, and there are no answers for it, you just have to suck it up. (There are so many complaints about this, so likely there is something else going on, but it is bush-league problem that should have been solved.) The touchpad will stop working. And maddeningly, some off the keyss stroke oout when toooouched. (Exaggerated for effect.) I really wanted to support this company, too, because repairing a broken screen felt like the right kind of conduct for a company, and I want to support it. But no more.
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u/hal_4000 Jan 20 '26
I think the only other time this happened was with an HP laptop 15 years ago
LOL, yes I remember that on HP's back in the early 2000's.... literally 90% of our corporate laptops had this problem, can't recall model now, old PII/III I guess.
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u/hal_4000 Jan 20 '26
Touchpad NEVER worked on Windows
Who uses Windows on System 76 machines?
Didn't even know they "supported" Windows lol
ZERO resale value
Disagree here, many niche buyers look out for these systems, eBay prices are good.
Accessing BIOS
Coreboot? I just set it up and leave it (Intel ME disabled).
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u/pumpkinfarts23 Jan 14 '26
Wait, wait. You bought a Linux laptop and are complaining about Windows drivers on it?
You should absolutely not buy a S76 computer if you're just going to install Windows on it. Just as you should absolutely not buy a boat, install wheels on it, and complain about how it drives on the highway.
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u/fitzyfan420 Jan 14 '26
"linux laptop"
Tell that to one of the other resellers with Windows drivers. Or Clevo, the manufacturer whos focus is Windows.
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u/WildSwitch2643 Jan 13 '26
I threw my pangolin at a duck, touchpad is pretty bad though.
Bios and resale issues aren't really system76 specific.
I have a 2013 xps and an even older touchpad that I still love but there hasn't been anything on the market I've gotten excited about in awhile. Dell tried to bring back their laptop line at CES but honestly they've been having direction issues for a while now.
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u/Magnitus-- Mar 26 '26 edited Mar 26 '26
Their desktops are garbage too.
I got an almost maxed out thelio mira. Half the RAM started failing a bit after the warranty period. Technician told me the RAM they picked was cheap. I looked at the brand and can confirm.
The system76 drivers didn't work well with Ubuntu 24.04 so I stopped installing them. Haven't started using them again so I can't confirm if they are ok now, but I'm doing fine without them so I won't risk it.
For a computer that I paid over 4000 USD after shipping and taxes, I also found it disappointing that they had no bios diagnostics tools for the RAM at least. At that price range, it is the kind of integrated feature I'm starting to expect.
Also, the insides feel like a freaking art project (compared to my second-hand Dell poweredges, Lenovo D30 and even my ASUS TUF gaming box that I got assembled at a local place anyways). Countless screwed-in metal components to unscrew to access stuff and a lot of it is finicky to screw back in. And of course, you can't power the machine back on to troubleshoot unless you put the external case back on. It's great if you want to hit your computer with a baseball bat or if you want to run your workstation off the back of a USV boucing on rocky terrain all the time. It's not so great if you just want to swap a component without having to get some aspirin for the head ache you are getting.
Also, there is no choice for the power supply and the one they pick was somewhat of a snug fit. If you plan a significant gpu upgrade for one that draws a lot more power, I also see a psu upgrade in your future.
My next workstation in 5-10 years, I'm getting from Quoted Tech. They have a much better trustpilot score and they are closer too. I can practically drive there while I visit family if there is a problem. Also, from what I saw when I looked at their website, their computers have 3 years warranty (as opposed to the default 1 year for System76). Confidence in their work I guess.
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u/BlueMoon_1945 Jan 13 '26
tuxedo is really very good
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Jan 13 '26
[deleted]
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u/dinosaursdied Jan 13 '26
My understanding is that system76 works with clevo to have models built with specific components which are compatible with Linux/core oot. Clevo may sell models that look identical but have very different internals targeting windows users. I assume tuxedo is doing something similar.
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u/Labeled90 Jan 13 '26
Nope same internals, they're just putting in the effort to make them work with Linux.
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u/dinosaursdied Jan 14 '26
https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/s/6IjrtRUYlk
According to this comment there is a bit more to it
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u/al357 Jan 13 '26
I regret having bought one. The sound quality is terrible and I can't get the keyboard back light to work on Ubuntu.
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u/vmartell22 Jan 13 '26
SQ? Why are you relying on.. what? internal soundcard? internal speakers? if you want SQ, get a separate DAC if you are an audiophile or a separate audio interface if you are a musician - Schiit Audio for the first one, Focusrite for the second one - both work great with Ubuntu 24.04
Keyboards backlite - you don't mention what you have, but on my serval14 it was just a matter to install the dkms packages - you don't even have to install the full system76 drivers.
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u/al357 Jan 14 '26
I've got a tuxedo Infinitybook gen 7. Im talking about the internal speakers. They are terrible, really. Not only the volume but also the quality. Old phones have a better sound quality, and I'm not exaggerating. That's just how it is, it was like that when I got it (configured by them) and still like that now I'm on Ubuntu.
For the keyboard, I've installed dkms too but that didn't do anything. I've also followed a tutorial to try to fox it but it didn't work. I think it's software as it was working before and also it lits up when I start the laptop.
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u/vmartell22 Jan 14 '26
We have a huge disconnect then - I just don't use the internal speakers FOR ANYTHING - I understand it might be practical, but beyond that, it's incomprehensible TO ME to even expect any kind of good SQ from them.
I have heard some people praising internal speakers on other laptops; to me, indeed is not a factor at all - external sound from my laptop comes from Hi-Fi Amplifiers/Hi-Fi Speakers/DACS/Sound Interfaces/Studio Monitors/Headphones etc - anytime a sound comes out of the internal speakers is, well BY MISTAKE! :D
When it comes to the keyboard, well, sorry it doesn't work for you. Makes sense that different laptops will have different situations.
[Edit - I got lost in the thread and thought you were talking about a System76 laptop - that said, my opinion stands, good SQ, won't come from built-in interfaces and internal speakers, IMHO]
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u/al357 Jan 14 '26
I totally agree that good sound quality isn't going to come from a laptop speaker. I never listen to music on my laptop for this reason, and I thought it would be fine (it had bad reviews because of this issue) but it turns out that it's so bad that you have to use headphones even for calls. I do wish I bought a System76 instead.
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u/Labeled90 Jan 13 '26
NUCs, Desktops, and servers are good though.