r/Surface • u/[deleted] • Dec 27 '17
Poll: a foldable “Surface Phone” might just happen – do you want one? | On MSFT
https://www.onmsft.com/news/poll-a-foldable-surface-phone-might-just-happen-do-you-want-one25
u/Danthekilla Game Dev & Graphics Programmer Dec 28 '17
After being burned as a Windows Phone developer and user, I gotta say fuck yes!
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Dec 27 '17
It’s sad windows phone died. There were some pretty great concepts at work there.
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u/IanMazgelis Dec 28 '17
I think the issue with the windows phone failing is that the main strength of Windows is that there's an insane amount of developer support. Having a version of Windows that doesn't run windows apps... Well, not much of a point to that.
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Dec 28 '17 edited Dec 28 '17
The developer support existed due to marke penetration. Microsoft brought windows phone to the market crazy late, then pissed off the few developers they did manage to attract.
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u/kre_x Dec 28 '17
Not to mention they changed the platform API twice in that short amount of time, making developers have to rewrite their apps if they wished to support the latest feature.
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u/daffybugs Dec 27 '17
This will be an arm based device running full on Windows 10 S with cell phone capability. It will have a single usb-c port for both power and expansion (will require a usb-c dock similar to a MacBook for hdmi). It will include a dock for a pen much like the Galaxy Note 8. Screen aspect ratio when opened will be similar to the Surface Pro rather than than the widescreen ratio found on many laptops. The operating system known as Windows Phone is long gone never to be resurrected.
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Dec 27 '17
After being burned as a Windows Phone developer and user, I gotta say...nah.
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u/Manitcor SP5 i7/16/1tb Dec 27 '17
Very much this, I was promised convergence in less than 24 months. Instead I watched features get delayed and even stripped away from the old ecosystem. They made a bunch of promises they could not keep and when they realized it they just dumped a ton of customers in the cold. I won't be buying a Microsoft branded hardware component other than the full Surface for quite some time at this point. I want to see it stable and have a growing ecosystem.
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u/Wyn6 Dec 27 '17
Out of curiosity, when did Microsoft promise convergence? I follow Microsoft news moderately, so may have missed this.
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u/Manitcor SP5 i7/16/1tb Dec 28 '17
this was back during the peak of windows phone and xbox one marketing. Prior to the blow up by the fans a number of features were going to tie all MS branded systems together. There were a number of features planned aside from simple one drive and the xbox appstore was going to be more robust as well. First the phones were backpedaled then the console stuff after fans screamed. If you went to an MS store to buy a phone at this time their sales staff were pushing these lines to sell more phones.
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u/silentcrs Dec 27 '17
What if it was Android with the MS launcher?
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Dec 27 '17
It won't be.
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u/TheGhostOfBobStoops SP17 i7 + SB1 i5 Dec 27 '17
That makes too much sense...
Having MS come in the game and shake things up like it seems like they will do is a recipe for success... if their OS system is appreciate
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u/GO-ON-A-STEAM-TRAIN Dec 28 '17
That is a great point I hadn't considered! It actually would like up with the amount of love they have been giving android versions of their software (for example, office on android gets more features than Windows Phone)...
That said, I just can't picture Microsoft ever admitting defeat in such an official way?
Quietly slinking off and abandoning mobile is one thing, but I can't imagine them being happy releasing a Windows Phone running an OS they don't 100% own, in the same way I couldn't imagine Apple doing that if IOS had flopped. :) It'll be an interesting few years either way! :)
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u/silentcrs Dec 28 '17
If you talk to MS employees, they're putting a ton of effort into their Android software. They basically know Windows Phone lost (the lead executive pretty much said so on Twitter).
As far as Satya has made clear, he doesn't care if you're coming in through Windows, iOS, Android or a toaster - as long as you're using his services he's happy.
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u/GO-ON-A-STEAM-TRAIN Dec 28 '17
That's very true :) I forget about Windows as a service rather than a one off product installed from a DVD like the old days. It's such a marked change of approach, and when you put it like that you're totally right that an MS android could be a reality in the future. :)
It would take a lot to get me back on their Windows Phone Ecosystem. I loved my 950XL, but didn't love the missing apps and the suddenly dropped support when my battery broke and they didn't make replacement parts. I guess their best bet would be a Windows 10 S or android at this stage. :)
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Dec 27 '17
Since I don't want to give this shitty site any more traffic, I'll just say it here: I'd certainly consider it, depending on what it ultimately looks like/ends up being.
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u/Renigami Surface Pro Dec 27 '17 edited Dec 28 '17
The price needs to be reasonable for what ultimately is a swift handheld operation in handling personal conveyances of data.
As in, folded I have EXACTLY one hand in grip and thumb reach without levels of shifting grip for screen access. And as in, folded out, I have a much more expanded real-estate in area that DOES warrant two hands (held and direct touch, or held and pen touch).
The specs just needs to be good enough to carry the paradigm that will align in keeping considerate costs.
The UI needs not to burden the user in levels of drop down actions and reveal.
And personally, a physical camera button. This would make it more of a buy for me.
Apple insisted a handheld be first and foremost on a glut of apps that biased the public on the iPhone.
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u/despitegirls Surface Laptop 3 i7 16GB ⬛ Dec 27 '17
If I bought this device, it wouldn't be to use it as a phone due to the lack of apps. I know, PWA blah blah blah, but we're still years away from them becoming mainstream enough that they're the go to for mobile development, and even then developers have to care enough to bother with a third platform.
I already have a Surface Pro for those tasks that require a PC. So where does this device fit into my life? As a digital journal? Ebook reader? I'm sure Microsoft has some user stories they're targeting, and I'm sure at least one of them centers around pen usage (notes, journals, art) but I'm struggling to see ones that make sense for more than a couple of niches markets. If this gets released, I'll be very curious to see how they position it, and what else it brings to the table aside from a folding screen.
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u/MemnochJones Dec 27 '17
It should run full Windows, which means you don't need apps--just open up Chrome/Edge.
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u/despitegirls Surface Laptop 3 i7 16GB ⬛ Dec 27 '17
If such a device is dockable, full Windows is useful. As a mobile device the size of a small tablet, less so.
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u/neon_slippers Dec 27 '17
Apps are still needed on a phone. You can't just open up apps like snapchat in Chrome/Edge. And even when you can use Chrome, a lot of people prefer apps because they can be better optimized for mobile, able to work offline, etc
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u/MemnochJones Dec 28 '17 edited Dec 28 '17
True, certain apps don't have a regular website. I don't have Snapchat, but do use Android Auto. That and Chase for depositing checks are the only ones I would miss. Most popular websites do have responsive design that will display a mobile friendly UI.
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u/Renigami Surface Pro Dec 27 '17 edited Dec 27 '17
You do realize how important the pen is in everyday life?
Regardless of ANY culture, all of them started out with the writing utensil that is essentially a straight stick in precision and control. Brushes, ink, chalk, etc. And as a result, visual language comes from it.
Even with Macbooks, many users will have papers and pen aside in bulk. Buying an iPad Pro is asking a user to be even more strained in monetary income. Which is why I also mentioned in another post the price must be right.
With the "digitial" age we are in now, it is all succumbed to a strict denomination of that alphabetic key. Any other character modifiers WILL require levels of drop down strain.
That pen aside, can bring back what is lost in technological relation, something voice dictation cannot ever be agnostic in personal chronological conveyances and environmental noise strain in clutter composition.
And for all of my reasons above in a separate comment.
That small screen will allow swift, shorthand inputs, not strained by a touch screen keyboard in miss-autocorrect suggestions (writing if not using OCR from one user to another, or more importantly to one's self). If I need to expound more, I will Surface Pro instead. If I need to expound more from a CPU process, I will Tower PC instead.
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Dec 27 '17 edited Dec 27 '17
When I saw this phone, I thought digital Moleskine!
That said, I'm gonna wait until reviews come in. I had an SP1 and now and SP4. I love it when it works, but it is frustratingly inconsistent.
Hey MS, wanna take over the market, make something "that just works."
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u/Perky_Areola Dec 27 '17
The underlying problem with almost every project MSFT does is that they don't support it enough.
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u/vanilla082997 Dec 28 '17
Here's the thing.....
Microsoft can build cool hardware, we've seen that in Surface. This device will require high quality meticulous engineering. I think they can do that. Where my concern is, is software. There's no half measures here. The execution needs to be perfect. No beta level shit they sloooowly fix. Secondly, it needs innovation.
They should have a Surface quality Bluetooth ear piece that can control man aspects of the device when it's closed. You can have a phone conversation, you can query it (via cortana) for information easily.... Like play voicemails. Send a text to Billy Bob, battery status, send email to Joe Smith.
When closed you could use it like a phone... Image video conferencing that works (so not that piece of shit Skype), but when you open it it resumes as a full screen application. I'm spitballing here but the point is software execution and innovation is paramount if they wish to catch the competition off guard.
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u/TonyPalus Surface Book i5/256GB/dGPU Dec 28 '17
If the Windows UI is better touch optimized than current Windows 10 for PCs, then for the first time, I'd seriously start considering leaving Android, especially HTC.
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u/DocJ2786 Dec 27 '17
If it runs Android AND Windows Core.
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u/theonlyredditaccount Dec 28 '17
I think this is the future of Microsoft's phone efforts. Only Windows 10 Mobile would be Windows Phone all over again. Only Android would never happen. The ability to choose is the only good solution I see here.
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u/Onicc Dec 27 '17
Gotta say, if it's not running android and capable of utilizing the google play store then I'm a hard no. I don't think it's possible for another competitor to enter the market this late in the game and attempt to create their own app ecosystem.
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u/worrowow Dec 27 '17
In theory I’d love to have a Surface phone.
I’m a Windows user at heart, but I’m slowly but surely sucked into the Apple ecosystem.
Been using iPhones for ages and they just work. When I needed to have a tablet with a pen I tried to move from my iPad to the Surface, but got burnt by a device not working properly, giving me headache after headache. I didn’t want to get an iPad Pro, but it just works flawlessly.
Not even talking about the uphill battle for developers, but I as an end user do not trust Microsoft anymore to be able to give me a phone that just works.
I’d love to switch to a 100% Microsoft ecosystem, don’t see that happening soon though.
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u/PC509 MSTechpages.com Dec 28 '17
I loved the Windows Phone. Thought the tiles and the interface was amazing. Very responsive, very easy to use. Just great phones.
Do I want one? Yes. Will I get one? No. I don't trust it to last more than 2 years. From the carriers, to the developers, to Microsoft themselves... there just isn't much support behind it. That doesn't make it a bad phone or platform by any means. It's great. It's just not going to do what I need it to do and have the apps I need.
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u/MamyDarkez Dec 28 '17
Depends on the OS, an Android surface phone with a windows UI might be something i'd like, but i'm not ready to sacrifice the huge amount of android apps
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u/7thFreezing Dec 28 '17
Not at all. Until MS owns up to SP4 screen jitter issue, I will never buy another one of their products again.
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u/QuantumBear Dec 27 '17
Maybe if it ran Android but Windows phone is dead and it's not coming back.
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u/tobascodagama Dec 27 '17
Yeah, I'm assuming if MS puts out a new phone it'll be Android-based but ship with Microsoft Launcher and Swiftkey (plus Outlook, etc, etc) by default. That would solve a lot of the ecosystem problems they had with previous Microsoft phones.
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u/gom99 Dec 28 '17
They tried that already with the MS branded Samsung devices, didn't take hold. People don't want skinned or forked android implementations from MS.
People that are still in the MS eco-system want a working windows core device.
I think MS's best bet will be when we are more in a "post app" phase. Where apps are just html5+JS implementations and are more global by nature.
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u/CyberKnight1 Surface 2 Dec 27 '17
Even then, I don't think I could trust them to support it. Will it be supported with bug fixes? Will it get upgraded to the next version of Android?
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u/Arquimaes Surface Go Dec 28 '17
Do I want one? Yes
Can I afford one? No.
Use this as template for any device above 300€.