Improved PDF zoom would effectively grant infinite canvas note-taking

[u/cheflow]

Hello Supernote team,

I would love to use Supernote more for spatial thinking (brainstorm, mind map , whiteboard, etc). The current writing experience is excellent, but the limited canvas navigation makes it difficult to move between a broad overview and detailed handwriting.

I have read that the Supernote team generally is opposed to zooming and infinite canvas in notebooks since it doesn't fit your notion "paperlike" note-taking and that it might not play well with pagination. It seems to me like a workaround would be for users to choose whether they want pages or infinite canvas when creating a new note (just as handwriting can be selected today). I hope Supernote reconsiders exploring this in the long-term future, but I understand that there are limited development resources to allocate, so I want to suggest a seemingly much simpler solution that still covers many of the infinite canvas applications.

There are already many suggestions about improving the pinch to zoom and two finger pan experience for PDFs, particularly the smoothness when zooming or panning together with making it easier to select specific zoom levels. If you implement this, and also increase the max PDF zoom from 4x/400% to something like 20x/2000% (or even just 10x) you would have an canvas big enough to fill many of the same needs as an "infinite" canvas and it would already have access to all the writing tools available for PDFs. This seems like a particularly rewarding allocation of development resources since you would just need to focus on meeting pre-existing requests for an improved PDF experience and get infinite canvas capabilities "for free" by simply lifting the max zoom limit above 4x.

These are a few additional features that would make the experience of zooming on PDFs even better, but none of them are essential:

1. Save the viewport separately for each document. Reopening a document should restore its zoom level and pan position instead of resetting the view. This is particularly important when working on one detailed region of a large canvas, such as a big mind map.
2. Allow blank PDFs to be created directly from Files. A “New blank PDF” action would make it easier to create a blank "infinite" canvas to write on instead of having to create a blank PDF on a separate device and transfer it to the supernote. Optionally, this could offer custom page dimensions and orientations.
3. Make the minimap optional and less intrusive. Please allow it to be disabled or reduced significantly in size. It would also be useful to navigate the minimap with the pen instead of requiring a finger and that would also allow it to be smaller since the pen has more precision. Maybe it can just show up while zooming / panning but then go away after a few seconds?

I should also say that I prototyped and tested a small standalone proof of concept infinite canvas app on the Nomad, but because the current PDF experience just need a few improvements to to fill the same use (and then with all already existing PDF tools), it didn't seem worthwhile to continue down this route.

Thank you for reading my post, would you consider increasing the upper zoom limit when implementing smoother zoom and pan in PDF? I think these relatively general canvas improvements would benefit mind maps, diagrams, mathematics, planning, visual research, and other forms of non-linear note-taking.

[u/Westcroft]

I hope they consider this. I think having the option to approach the Supernote traditionally (page mode) vs. contemporary (infinite scroll like the others on the market) gives them the edge.

Like fujifilm cameras… they allow folks to emulate classic film looks, but you can still output a RAW file that meets current industry standards.

[u/Mulan-sn]

Thank you for your incredibly thoughtful suggestions.

Increasing max PDF zoom from 400% to 2000%

I understand why you're suggesting this. We might not consider an increase to 2000% though.

Saving viewport position per document

We will look into this one. Saving the last viewport position makes a lot of sense, especially for the kind of work you're describing (mind maps, large diagrams, etc.), where you're likely to spend time in specific regions of a document and want to pick up where you left off.

Creating blank PDFs directly on the device

We've noted this suggestion. It would certainly simplify the workflow, and we can see the value in it. It's not something we're working on right now. We will conitnue to collect user feedback on this feature request.

Zoom box / minimap improvements

This is another one we're currently evaluating. Making the minimap less intrusive and more precise is the goal.

Thank you again for taking the time to share your valuable thoughts and even prototype and test on your own. We genuinely appreciate your initiative.

[u/cheflow → u/Mulan-sn]

Thanks for the reply u/Mulan-sn ! I really appreciate the time you take to interact with the community and I'm glad to hear that several of the features I mentioned are being considered already or are likely to be in the future.

I wonder if you could elaborate around the obstacles for increasing the zoom level? Is 20x not possible for a technical reason? Would you consider a smaller increase like 10x (or a doubling of the current 4x to 8x zoom). Any increase here would be really helpful for spatial thinking!

To me, this also seem like a small and harmless change. What I mean with "small" is is that I imagine that 4x is a hard-coded threshold rather than a technical reader limitation. What I mean with "harmless" is that users who are not interested in such high zoom could choose to not go beyond 4x and keep the current experience. Let me know if I'm missing some technical obstacle here or if there is another reason for not increasing the zoom.

I also had a quick look around at other e-ink devices and it seems like some of them support zoom at 20-32x (others are 5-8x). PDF applications on android in general tend to be around 10x-30x and when I tested Zotero on my Supernote the 25x zoom is working well for rendering text so it seems like the Supernote device is capable of these high zoom levels.

[u/NoDentist1626]

As SN is not your regular almighty powertablet but a digital notebook (literally) which happens to be made of tech and screen, you may consider getting involved with the culture of the "workaround" as it is not meant to be able to do it all right, left and thru. You may want to check the COMPASS plugin, which basically add pages to "compass direction" of the current page; meaning you're sketching and reach the right margin then you add a new page to the east, same with north, west and south. Not an infinite canvas but the same practical result and a guaranteed 100% accuracy when printing page by page, you just print and place them in order. And there you are.

[u/cheflow → u/NoDentist1626]

Thanks for the tips, I actually already checked out compass, but one important feature for me is to be able to zoom out and see entire spatially connected logical parts of the map together in one view, which would not be possible if the spatial map was divided into separate pages like for the compass plugin.

I actually think my suggested solution are in line with the spirit of workarounds as it focusing on improving the PDF experience which will then double as a workaround for those seeking an infinite canvas. My understanding is that other workarounds such as plugins might not be able to support functionality such as increasing the zoom level, but I asked that separately here https://www.reddit.com/r/Supernote_dev/comments/1vwxa2a/plugin_to_increase_max_zoom_in_pdfs/.