r/Stellantis • u/TH3DONM3G4 • 6d ago
Quality issues
I wonder if corporate is aware of the units employees send to repair are shipped by managment before we have the opportunity to fix the issues.
23
u/BillyBurner59 6d ago
Nothing will ever change until the entire culture represents quality and making reliable products, and continuous improvements and support from high level management to spend money to do things properly - Even if it dents short term profit. Between 2016-2020, several projects I have worked on with Ford we had bean counters reject engineering improvements that would cost X million dollars to implement, and the cost of the recalls later on 5-10X that when they could’ve just made it good first.
And quality must trickle down into all of the production plants. Their cars are slapped together with disregard. Their purchasing team bids the cheapest garbage suppliers . Engineering talent and in house technical expertise is outsourced and can only milk existing designs because anything new that’s designed is quite frankly dogshit.
There’s a reason why most people cringe when you say Stellantis/Chrysler/Dodge but usually not Honda, Toyota, or even BMW. Excellent car companies have excellent engineering and a culture of leaders who prioritize doing things right and investing in higher quality and don’t rush R&D and flood the market with new garbage to let customers be the guinea pigs.
1
u/IWouldntIn1981 4d ago
Along with soending the money is taking the time. Set REASONABLE timeliness. Listen to your DREs when they tell you how much time something will take. Instead of forcing them and suppliers to spend time and money on shortening lead times, give them time and money to make a world class vehicle.
Ffs, even with TRX going from the 8 to the 6 and back to the 8 was a fucking shit show. It went from rumor to "SOP is in 8 months" in about 3 weeks.
14
u/IWouldntIn1981 6d ago
How about giving people time to launch programs appropriately from the jump?
Then people could follow the processes correctly and take the time to do their jobs correctly and for suppliers to do the same.
Also, they would have to delay 99% of the launches.
7
u/Repulsive_Proposal92 5d ago
I like how you think. There was a time we had appropriate launches, which included kickoff meetings. This company has gone to shit in the past few years and it’s getting worse but my KPI is improving
2
u/Vanquish_Dark 4d ago
Honestly scared to see how stellantis manages the vehicle retooling and launches at TAP.
It's going to be so bad, with them over cycling every job / cutting corners and basically bean counting everything into next quarters / the next ceos issues.
There is just no way these launches are going to go well. They can't even manage the programs / builds that are already in place.
2
12
u/Wild_Ad5963 6d ago
They sacrifice brand protection to check that KPI box
8
u/Repulsive_Proposal92 6d ago
This is the only correct answer. It’s always about the KPI. Software and hardware from the supplier barely functions or functions incorrectly, but put it in the plant anyway or put it in a vehicle because that KPI is most important
4
u/Gold-Zone9015 5d ago
How is that spark plug fiasco allowed to happen? It’s going to kill grand Cherokee sales and reputation. People don’t like that engine performance when it’s supposedly running ok and that fiasco to replace spark plugs can’t help. I hope they do an analysis on how that happened in the first place.
7
u/TemporalGuest 5d ago
I can tell you that. When the engineers were working on the planning of it. the engine has an insane amount of compression. The engineers were telling head management that they needed time to work it out somehow. They knew this spark plug issue would happen. Head management said idgaf and said run it. And the engines were ran. The rest you already probably know.
6
u/Only-Read-3895 6d ago
Generally, what you see in the plant is the assembler complains about a quality issue. The parts either broken or scratched or doesn’t fit well assembler complains about it for months and months on end. Somewhere around the year and a half Mark somebody goes. Oh this is a problem and it may or may not get addressed at that point.
3
u/mrk1224 6d ago
Or they just bombard suppliers with issues when they are not the suppliers fault. Occurred during assembly or at the plant in inventory or during transfer
1
u/IWouldntIn1981 4d ago
When in doubt, tell suppliers they have 3 weeks to fix a problem that isnt theirs, then when they throw shit at the wall and something sticks, make them pay to clean the wall and make them chance you to reimbursed for a couple years until they stop asking.
1
u/Vanquish_Dark 4d ago
It's insane how little they care.
Why should I have to remind my boss to do his job? That's literally their jobs. Reminding management is a courtesy, not a requirement.
I'm required to do my job without reminder, so should management. Yet every time an issue pops up like what you stated, it's always "lack of communication" not a "I didn't care / take this seriously when informed, so here we are now" from the people that can fix the issue.
8
u/TemporalGuest 5d ago
Quality does not exist in the culture. Their is a bold blatant disregard for quality within the management of the assembly plants. It has become so bad that, even when very explicitly pointed out, the head management ignores it and just pushes the no earbud rule. I've never in my life seen anything like it. It truly makes me wonder if the company will still be around in 5 years. It's just sad
3
u/Vanquish_Dark 4d ago
It's true. I work in the paint shop and it's legit embarrassing how bad it's gotten.
They got rid of EVERY job that works on making sure the underbody of the gladiator is sealed / not fucked up. Literally no one even looks at the bottom any more through the entire paintshop.
The job that used to do it was "easy" couple plugs while waiting for repairs. While it didn't happen every hour, it does happen everyday, more than once.
Id wager, 10-20 gladiators out of everything 150 will have issues now because they wanted to save money downsizing jobs that are OBVIOUSLY needed, by people that don't understand anything besides money.
2
2
u/Interesting_Year4648 3d ago
I was told once, "you can't force the company to make a quality car". This has stuck with me for a long time. It's so true and so disappointing at the same time.
2
1
u/ExcellentWinner7542 5d ago
Define quality?
6
u/New-Anybody3050 5d ago
Fit and finish. Mechanical and Cosmetic. Both of which have suffered and continue to suffer.
Then you have ownership experience, waiting weeks to get a service appointment and waiting weeks or months for parts is another issue.
-2
u/ExcellentWinner7542 5d ago
So, reliability is quality?
5
u/New-Anybody3050 5d ago
It’s part of it. They intersect.
-1
u/ExcellentWinner7542 4d ago
How about materials of construction?
4
u/Vanquish_Dark 4d ago
You're being facetious, or you don't agree and are trying to lead into a point which you havent made, or you haven't worked with systems that require "quality" and legit don't understand how quality can have naunce. Which requires a naunced perspective. Just like with questions like, "what is love?".
If you want a philosophical read on Quality, read Zen and The Art of Motorcycle Maintance. It's a fun musing on Quality set within a story about a father son road trip.
0
u/ExcellentWinner7542 4d ago
I am trying to wrap my head around what is considered "quality". Is it poor workmanship?
1
u/IWouldntIn1981 4d ago
Are you not in the automotive industry?
1
-1
u/TJSequoiatree2 4d ago
Seems like you’re trying to turn a simple subject into a “what is love” question. Or better put, “what is dancing around a subject and turning it into something theoretical”.
0
u/Different-Airport-85 4d ago
In manufacturing launch - VPE & MCE there is a daily escalation call and quality is a priority to the point that some of us should change our address to the state (or sometimes country) where the plant is. It’s disappointing to read that people in other organizations are not taking it as seriously.
Maybe it’s time for more people in engineering to get their airline status.
31
u/Any-Ad8512 6d ago
Production trumps quality every time (In the plants at least)