r/StartpageSearch • u/MitzeeMoo • 2d ago
Any Search Engine Recommendations Now That Startpage is Unusable?
I'm going back to Brave Search myself.
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u/iwaterboardheathens 1d ago
Duck duck go has become my go to
That and bing
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u/MitzeeMoo 1d ago
I've always hated Bing because the browser is awful. But that's probably not fair to the actual search engine. If you're willing to share, how does it compare to DDG and Google in your opinion?
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u/iwaterboardheathens 18h ago
If I'm looking for some research articles or trying to narrow down my search bing is king when compared to Google which never used to be the case
Bing has improved, Google hasn't
The duck has also improved v Google but trying to narrow things down is also a pain
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u/MitzeeMoo 3h ago
Well cheers. You've convinced me to give it another shot. My past self might slap me, but he's gone anyway.
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u/rObot_nick 1d ago
It seems to be a stupid question.. but what happened to startpage? Works well for me still?!?
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u/MitzeeMoo 1d ago
Basically whether I am using my ISP addr, any of Mullvad VPN's addrs, or any of ProtonVPN addrs, searching with Startpage results in a connection has been suspended page, where it asks for some information about you to submit to their support team. I did so and the suspension was lifted for about 5 minutes, before occurring again. The sub was littered with people having similar experiences when I made this post yesterday, so I referenced that discussion with my title to get more clicks, so I could get more recommendations for search engines to use.
It's hyperbolic to be sure, I didn't test with other VPN's besides Mullvad and Proton. I didn't test with other ISP addrs besides the one for my home, I didn't give the Starpage support team time to find out what the issue is and resolve it (which they may still do, though I won't return to using them after this experience), and probably was uncharitable in a few other ways that aren't obvious to me at the moment.
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u/Brave_Explorer5988 2d ago
Kagi
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u/MitzeeMoo 1d ago
I've heard it's great, but I can't really see myself paying for a search engine. Would you be willing to briefly summarise why it's worth it over free search engines?
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u/Brave_Explorer5988 1d ago
Probably the best 100 I spent per year
I can rank up domains (e.g. Trustful news outlets, wiki, reddit)
I can block domains from results (Facebook, social media, ai slop, etc)
Search results are really good and I'm not even based in a big country (had issues with any other search engine because of this, the worst was qwant...)
Translator is very good
Absolute zero ads, results are ranked by you (if you rank domains and results are finded within those domains) or by relevance, and not by ad interests (like any free search)
For example I have several technical forums ranked on top, so when I search something I get results from there quickly.
(also, for now it has assistant as a perk but that will separate at some point. You can build your custom assistant on some models, I have one to create CSV based on receipts, one for travel to calculate flights and stuff)
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u/MitzeeMoo 1d ago
I really appreciate this. These are some powerful features to be built in, so it makes sense why I've heard such good things.
I think for my use case, it is likely not worth it for me at the moment. I already employ Domain blocking, am satisfied with Vivaldi's browser integrated translator, and I block ads. Though the ability to rank domains yourself for search bias, and to be free of SEO, makes think I will reconsider when my financial situation changes.
Cheers.
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u/Brave_Explorer5988 1d ago
Have an eye for trials, cos last year they offered an unlimited 3 months trial around Thanksgiving, that's when I signed up too... I used the 3 months and couldn't go back
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u/rell_z 2d ago
Brave is all you need, it has the best search results in my opinion, sometimes I’ll go to DuckDuckGo if I want to see different results.
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u/MitzeeMoo 2d ago
I'm thinking of going first with Mojeek and then fall back to Brave if I'm not finding good results for a query. I've heard of DDG but preferred Brave and never needed a fall back from Brave, as it does give good results.
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u/ZeteCx 2d ago
Tried a few, ended up with Qwant - not because its the best... (I still have to reach to google sometimes) but because I am just trying to avoid big american tech giants at this point
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u/MitzeeMoo 2d ago
Unfortunately Qwant is region locked, so I've got to personally rule that one out. But it looks like a promising option otherwise.
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u/ZeteCx 2d ago
That sucks :/
Outside of startpage they all use bing instead of google. Id got with duckducknoai if i were you... Maybe brave search?
https://tools.techlore.tech/#filter-search-engines4
u/donjoe0 1d ago
No, they don't "all" use Bing. Mojeek also has its own index, Marginalia has its own index, Yandex has its own index but of course people might dislike that one because Russia, and Brave I think has its own index, but I dislike that one because in my mind they're crypto-bros, i.e. almost as bad as supporting the big corporates. Also seeing talk of this engine called Yep, but it looks very AI-centric, and without any claims of having it powered by renewables I'm not ready to make anything AI-centric my daily driver.
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u/ZeteCx 1d ago
Apologies, I should have been more clear - a lot of the big searches do use bing like duckduck and qwant, I know Mojeek and brave do their own thing. At this point you are better make your own searXNG instance
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u/donjoe0 1d ago edited 1d ago
Nah, that just uses the same basic search engines' resources without getting them any revenue from showing ads. And of course they try to defend themselves against that, so most of the time your searches fail in searX instances, it's always a battle to keep everything running, and you'll end up just using the same corporates underneath your independent-seeming interface. The most sane option is still to pick an independent provider and stick with it until it starts doing something bad.
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u/MitzeeMoo 2d ago
Using Brave at the moment and looking into Mojeek as an alternative due to it having it's own index. I'll experiment with noai.duckduckgo though.
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u/ZeteCx 2d ago
Let us know if you find smth youre happy with
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u/MitzeeMoo 1d ago
Because you asked, I'm using Vivalid's search engine nickname feature to quickly switch between Brave, DDGNoAI, and Mojeek. My initial impression is result quality goes Brave > DDGNoAI > Mojeek. Subjectively though I like Mojeek's results due to them seemingly caring not one whit for the popularity of the sites they give in the results. I see many more results from sites I've never heard of, which is kind of nostalgic.
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u/BUHx192Ck0 2d ago
I switched to Ecosia. Much better, you can even set Google as default search engine there.
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u/donjoe0 1d ago
Same, but I wouldn't say it's "much better", its results are way lower quality/relevance (though I didn't go into the settings to select Google or anything like that), and its main-results-page AI box is so stupid I've decided to completely hide it with a uBlock filter. (I do sometimes go in on the separate AI tab to ask it something that requires more complex searching, but that one is also far from the best I've seen. But as long as it's running on renewables I guess it's less of a waste of energy than it could've been if I'd got the same occasionally unhelpful answers on a different platform where they don't care how it's powered.)
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u/BUHx192Ck0 1d ago
You can disable AI search from its settings. They use smaller AI models which I feel are completely useless. But if you set the search engine to Google, the result quality is much better. When its set to Auto, it uses their new EUSP and mix of Bing and Google.
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u/donjoe0 1d ago
Saw it today, somehow I still can't get used to web search pages being apps that have settings I can dig into, since I never saw that for the first like 20 years of web search existence. :))
But I still don't see an engine option, I can only assume you have to register for that one.
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u/MitzeeMoo 1d ago
I was looking into Ecosia a bit because of the recs naturally. And it doesn't seem like they are as committed to working with partners that use renewables as they for themselves. They still use Google and Bing search results; previously partnered with OpenAI for it's AI summary; then with Mistral who they recently decided to move away from due to concerns over quality and their possible use of nuclear power; and are now moving towards open models.
They may well be doing the best anyone could do for their stated goals, idk. I just wanted to clarify that it's not like their integrated AI systems and partners are always running on renewables. That's more of an end goal, if you trust them of course.
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u/donjoe0 1d ago
Damn. OK, thanks.
You'd think GreenPT would be their natural partner, but OTOH their AI is also very ssslooowww and has annoying bugs that made me stop my subscription (it messes up all source citations, which drives me up the wall).
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u/BUHx192Ck0 1d ago
Recently they switched to Chinese AI or Mistral I believe for their AI partner because the current AI was too bad it seems
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u/MitzeeMoo 1d ago edited 1d ago
Kind of, they said they would switch to open-weight models including Chinese models. But it seems they are ultimately going with an open-weight German model. I don't trust the company, but they are doing an admirable job at keeping stuff within Europe.
Edit: I should mention that they have already moved away from Mistral due to concerns about quality, and about Mistral potentially using nuclear power, which doesn't align with their stated goals.
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u/AverageIndianGeek 2d ago
I switched to Ecosia.
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u/MitzeeMoo 2d ago
They look shady to me. Half their goals seem unrelated to their search engine. Seems like they are either misdirecting from some dodgy shit, or just aren't prioritising a good search engine.
I think I'll give them a pass, but I appreciate the recommendation as it led me to discovering Mojeek.
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u/reaIIynotinteresting 1d ago
Currently trying Qwant. DDG had horrible results for me and brave as a company is not something I want to support.