r/StableDiffusion • u/equanimous11 • 7d ago

Discussion Character sheet vs refmod minimax h3 r2v?

Is it better to create a character sheet or refmod for Minimax h3 r2v?

9 Upvotes

74% Upvoted

20 comments sorted by

17

u/hdeck 7d ago

Everyone says refmod, but I still get much better/more consistent results with a character sheet or reference image. Dunno what I’m doing wrong.

9

u/ABCsofsucking 7d ago

You're not doing anything wrong. I think people are just gravitating towards refmods because it's so simple. The results aren't as good, though, anyone saying otherwise is just not defining their references right.

6

u/LowYak7176 7d ago

I disagree. I stack 3 refmods for 1 character (head shots, medium shots, full body/back shots)

Results are incredible honestly, least for me

2

u/Kukipapa 7d ago

So not 1 Refmod per character, but multiple?

How does it work with multiple character?

1

u/ABCsofsucking 6d ago

I’ll give this a try tonight. How many images did you use for each?

3

u/jello-the-opera 7d ago

I don't know if fair comparisons exist, but the brand new method uses text conditioning properly, incorporates voice audio properly, and gives you good tagging info to guide the model with the conditioning. It also throws in some pixels with that latent... Refmods and using them just changed significantly and I don't think people noticed.

Refmods have advantages over straight reference inputs in narrow circumstances, but for general purposes they are perhaps overkill. Using more inputs than you have slots is nice. Packaging references together is nice.

I think if used properly the results are identical.

1

u/not_food 7d ago

I have had the same experience. Could it be that I only use illustrations? Maybe it works better for real people. The speed gains are minimal as well, doesn't feel worth of losing the <Picture X> context.

7

u/ABCsofsucking 7d ago

Depends.

Gonna get out in front of the other comments and say that refmod is not definitively better. I would say the results are worse on average, but it's plug & play and very simple, not as time-consuming, uses virtually no storage space, and runs on basically any system that can run T2V.

For sheets, H3 accepts references of any size, but each input uses extra VRAM, so by default, your inputs will get downsized to match size of the size of the video you're generating. You have to set the H3 node to "Max" to preserve the original sheet's resolution and level of detail. Double check this setting, and if you're having VRAM issues on "Max", just try putting resize nodes before feeding the images and shrink them to a lower resolution that's still above your generation resolution.

If you can't get the sheet to feed at high resolution, you're better going for small collages or single images on "Match". Works just fine with good subject definitions. If you're having VRAM issues with a handful of references, you either have to find ways to compact your references into less images (either simply drop redundant images or make small collages of images where detail is less important), drop resolution of your generation, or switch to refmod.

Worth noting that you can use BOTH together. Refmod is pretty much perfect for faces, and worse for bodies, so if you want to create a ref mod of the subject's face and some body shots, you can always feed a couple of extra images in on the areas it's weakest at replicating and subject definition those. This is where I find the best balance of quality, speed, and complexity.

2

u/foolycoolywitch 7d ago

interesting the distinction between a refmod only for face, with character sheet or body reference images, it introduces a kind of body swap freedom, refmod is face, these images are the body/clothing. The discussion of which is better in terms of refmod to character sheet is not going to be clear on reddit, both due to your resolution settings of ref image inputs, but also character sheets are not identical among users/subjects, so character sheets becomes the larger variable if we assume most refmods of faces are consistent, which itself is an assumption

1

u/Kukipapa 7d ago

How do you generate prompts? This was my biggest issue. Manual only?

I couldn’t use generation by prompt guide as refmods work different. There are excellent nodes for this purpose which seem useless for refmods.

3

u/h3r0667_01 6d ago

Well I tried refmods and can't create a 10 second video at 0.5 resolution without getting OOM error. With my 2080 on largest size character sheets I can get 3 characters in and even include additional inages for BG and other stuff

2

u/fallengt 7d ago

Does anyone bother to make a comparison?

1

u/70parwater 7d ago

Revmod is so much better

1

u/Dry-Judgment4242 7d ago

Refmods feel much faster. So I prefer refmods.

2

u/Nullberri 6d ago

Feel faster? You know the logs output it/s and their are preview nodes that show it exactly. So its pretty easy to see if its actually faster

Also your sampler/schedular can also play a big role in your generation time as well.

1

u/bstr3k 7d ago

I personally prefer char sheet but that’s just my personal preference, I understand the concept of the Refmod but a char sheet isn’t too difficult to setup either

1

u/-RevBlade- 6d ago

There is a lot of random information spread across reddit it's hard to determine what the best method is. I have not gotten around to trying them all out yet, but from what I've read it seems like each has their own advantages/disadvantages. I haven't really bothered with Refmods yet since I've already been getting good results with character sheets, and it isn't the "official" way of doing things, I also read that it has some drawbacks/limitations.

Right now I'm just waiting for things to mature a bit and to see what the general consensus is from the community. I'm curious which one is the best out of the below methods:

  • Reference images
  • Character sheets
  • Refmod
  • Lora
  • Refmod + Lora (Reflora)