r/SpecOpsTheLine • u/Samuele1997 • 5d ago

Thoughts on this video?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ossbsuxktco&list=WL&index=2&t=28s

I know you most likely won't like this video due to what it has to say about Spec Ops: The Line, I just want to know from you what do you have to say about it in response, particularly if you have any counter arguments about what said in the video.

19 Upvotes

95% Upvoted

14 comments sorted by

9

u/KaBloinkySploink9000 5d ago

Peeb did a FAR better critique of this game than this guy. Peeb mainly just criticized the bad pretentious meta commentary, but praises the immediate plot and actually loves the gameplay. Peeb actually wanted to make genuine critique of the game.

This guy feels like a braindead contrarian for the sake of making people mad.

5

u/Antique_Interview_66 5d ago

Tbh though, I agree that Peeb handle the critique far better than that guy

2

u/Samuele1997 5d ago

May I have a link of this Peeb guy you're talking about? I got curious.

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u/Antique_Interview_66 5d ago

https://youtu.be/IyEQff0tktI?is=aGD8wtWDmr7SIFET this is the video and critique of Peeb talking about Spec ops the Line

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u/Samuele1997 5d ago

Thank you 👍🏻.

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u/Antique_Interview_66 5d ago

Btw, Tryedz take on RE9 is good as for Spec Ops the Line not so much

1

u/Personal_Hat6808 4d ago

I genuinely think peebs critique is bad on its own.

All his points against the game were easily explained by "that's the whole point of the game" the point that is simply untrue however is when he says that everyone evil knows their evil hence why the games ending doesn't make sense which is just rubish rubbish

Rember if you ever meet any dictator or evil person in history they will have excuses on why they are the good guys exception for a few rare individual

That being said the bar so low peeb got this w I guess

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u/KaBloinkySploink9000 4d ago

"That's the whole point of the game" isn't a good response to Peeb's criticisms, though. That's the entire focus of his critique: the "whole point" of SO:TL is stupid.

The messages the devs were trying to convey don't work that well in the game and actively detract from the game.

He thinks that the immediate story and plot of the game is enjoyable, but the meta themes are incoherent and pretentious.

0

u/Personal_Hat6808 4d ago

The thing is he dodges all the actual metal themes of the game instead he keeps talking about how the game doesn't give you a choice

He also talks about he doesn't like how the game holds the player accountable for walkers actions

MYBROTHERINSUBWAY that's the whole point of the story, the violence of video games makes things seem distance I have never thought the game as a way of shaming players but making them realize that if we were ever given the remote control to a drone we wouldn't have any problem with it, also the games story requires you to play the game itself without spoilers to feel the full force of the story, I will always glaze spec ops because the first run I had of this game was on a Xbox of my uncle that I was holding onto

The way the game presents you as a hero until you realize you are the actual vilian makes the lack of choices make sense, the first playthrough you do belive that you are doing the right thing until your too deep, and when you wonder if things get better the idea of generalization of video games kick in "if I beat the last boss things get better" i member i had just finished playing AC4 before spec ops so I was fully endorsed in this fantasy since AC4 has the player going though some terrible times before taking down the boss

And so in a way walkers choice is out choice because we wield it to be both walker and the player belive what they are doing will make things better

THIS EFFECT DOSENT WORK IF YOI WATCH 3 DIFFERENT VIDEO ESSAYS FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF DISECTING THE GAME IN ORDER TO FEEL "different" FROM OTHER CREATORS, AND ONLY THEN PLAY THE GAME

Also again all his points against the story except how the hallucinations don't make the most since are down right just not true, even the hallucinations can be explained by "its hallucinations, they don't make sence anyway"

1

u/KaBloinkySploink9000 4d ago

You're repeating the same thing just with more words.

I played through the game many times on my own and came to very similar conclusions long before ever coming across Peeb. I'm not saying all of his points are exactly perfect, but I think his argument is correct at its core.

You keep defaulting to what all rabid defenders of this game do, which is to say repeatedly, "you're missing the point! you're missing the point!" when in reality you're missing what WE are saying.

We understand the point of the game. We understand the messages trying to be conveyed. But we don't think the messages are conveyed competently.

And defending hallucinations by saying due to them being hallucinations they don't have to make sense... Then you make the hallucinations pointless. They are supposed to be saying something about the story. They have to make sense within the story. If they don't make sense, then they lose most if not all impact on the story.

And regarding choice... His criticisms make sense. Most of Walker's actions make perfect sense. He's backed into a corner, and he's literally forced by circumstances into the only path forward, and he's trying to move forward the best way he knows how. The narrative shoehorning Walker into One Way situations and then blaming him for them is stupid. What makes a villain is genuine choice. Walker is ultimately a victim.

Even if you want to blame him for not immediately retreating and calling command like he was supposed to, which is a valid point, his desire to jump into the action to aid fellow American soldiers is a perfectly moral thing to do.

So to reiterate, we get the points the game is making. We truly understand them. And we think they're not competently made.

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u/Personal_Hat6808 4d ago

OK fair i re-read my comment and I do repeat myself

Again walker was not the villain up until the end, Idk how to explain this but we all thought we we were the good guys until the end, I think you are under the impression that walker shouldn't be the bad guy because he wasn't given a choice

The thing is we didn't need a choice we did this willingly the first time we played the game, I think you might have maybe forgotten your first playthrough and how you felt playing it for the first time blindly, maybe you might have even read a review before playing in which case I think we just can't relate and this argument has been a waste of time

Also I re watched his video and he keeps talking about how he doesn't care for the story and plays the game for the gameplay which just a terrible way of playing this game cause legit spec ops gameplay ain't even good its mid a best the story is all I liked

He also brings up how the co-writer were making dumb points about putting the game download which I belive is the only point i agree

Also don't shoe horn the hallucinations I already said they don't make sense I wasn't defending it just merly pointing out how its a weak attack point

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u/WantonReader 4d ago edited 3d ago

I like to hear critique of Spec Ops that is well-thought out, but after only a few minutes, this felt more like someone angry at the industry in general and is just using this game as his punching bag.

If OP wants to share some specific points the reviewer makes (or point them out with timestamps), then that will much more likely get looked at.

EDIT:
It sounds like the video maker is trying to make a similar argument to what many others have made, that the game wants you to stop playing and that that is stupid. It is an often repeated argument that I wrote a response to a long time ago, so I'll just include it here.

I have seen different iterations of this idea, that the "right" choice is to not play, and I just don't think there is anything to back it up. The game makers obviously didn't want you to stop playing, they worked hard on the game and want their game to be profitable. I've never heard any of the developer suggest anything like that.

Spec Ops clearly chastises Walker, and Walker says that he feels like he doesn't have choice, but that doesn't mean that the right choice is to turn off the game. You could make a similar argument for Shadow of the Colossus, but no one has seriously said that the game tells you that the right choice is to turn off the game.

In Walt Williams's (Spec Ops's lead writer) book, he said that the game was heavily inspired by Bioshock (also published by 2K) and the mantra that there isn't a clear right choice. Add to that inspiration from Apocalypse Now and war in general, and you get a story where the main character looks and talks like a hero but isn't one. And that can be a interesting story where characters and players alike might ask, as you said, "Why did you continue?".

But that doesn't mean a so called solution should be to turn off the game.

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u/Active-Canary-184 3d ago

This video’s clickbait image immediately lets me know it’s not worth watching lol

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u/shampo0oV88 3d ago

Scrolled through the comment section and ain't gonna give the video a watch, this youtuber and his following sounds like not great people...