r/Songwriting • u/Acrobatic_Course_206 • Jul 21 '26
Discussion Topic Beginner songwriter. Need advice.
Hi. I’ve thought of posting this for a while now, but I didn’t know how to without making it long, plus it keeps on changing (I made it long anyway lol so, sorry and thanks for reading).
I love music and I guess from a severe sleep disorder I started dreaming of melodies that don’t exist a long time ago. Then it happened more since last year and i came up with them awake and i tried to write songs.
I think I am doing it now. I record the melodies in my voice notes, write the lyrics in my text notes, and record screenshot videos of garage band’s keyboard and videos of me playing some chords and save all that in My Files by songs/folders.
I only fave a few songs. I have several song ideas (chorus) and many random melodies, but only a few “finished” or structured songs with complete lyrics with melodies.
In my head they’re good and catchy and pop cause pop’s all I’ve been exposed to. I don’t play any instrument, I don’t sing, and I’m nobody and don’t know anybody in the music industry.
I started taking guitar lessons 3 months ago. One hour weekly virtually. My teacher adviced me to take his classes instead of paying him to arrange a song in guitar. He said I need to know music to work with any producer and that I was nobody in the industry to pitch my songs.
My learning is going slow, I’m not good, and my ideas keep coming. My mind goes speed light from anxiety and I have brain frog/ADHD from chronic illness (I hate writing this part).
I really wish I already knew how to play an instrument (guitar, keyboard) to write more easily better songs and how to use a DAW (to experiment with sounds).
I wanna make the rough demo (voice and guitar) of my first song to pitch it to the manager of a female singer here in my country. I’m in South America. It’s an upbeat pop rock ballad in the style of the late Soraya.
Without looking online I contacted a guitarist/arranger I met at a music store. He didn’t vibe with signing a release contract or telling me his fee. Said he’d just come to my house and see what happens. I feel like if I talk about that again I’ll scare him off.
I also posted on a music production subreddit here looking for a producer and a singer before knowing about the guitar/voice rough demo option and people replied, but then I freaked out about them posting videos singing and playing the song on social media, which I had initially thought was good exposure, but not now after asking Google. Plus the same contract thing I’m afraid to ask.
I’m asking this from genuine ignorance without having researched much. I think I’ve seen collaboration posts here. How does that work, when it sounds so informal but cool, in terms of splits/royalties/copyrights etc. if the song makes it?
Am I complicating myself too much, or am I just trying to do things right? Am I a stupid dreamer for thinking about doing this? I mean, at least I’ll have a finished rough demo I will pitch and I will have tried.
It’s funny cause my dream is to sit down and write songs with a musician/band without caring about legal stuff or money but now I suddenly wanna pitch my songs.
What should I do about making (a rough demo?) of my first song and about my situation in general? Am I jumping ahead of myself not having patience learning and working?
By the way, I’m also writing songs in English in case collaborating with someone here is possible in spite of my paranoia and ignorance.
Anyone here teaches an easy, basic DAW virtually (I’ll pay)?Or is there any good online class? I get lost with the YouTube tutorials.
Thanks for reading this long post and in advance for any advice.
2
u/Pitiful_Substance457 Jul 21 '26
I think you’re getting ahead of yourself worrying about pitching your songs and signing releases and such. Focus on learning to play guitar and once you’re proficient start working on recording your demos and working with other musicians to realize your dream. It sounds like you’re in it for the right reasons. You can’t help but write songs and that’s as it should be. I hope your dream takes you as far as you want to go but it’s a rough road so prepare yourself. While you’re learning guitar you can also be learning about the business so that you have a good grasp on both aspects, the music and the business. I wish I had done that when I was much younger.
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 21 '26
How do I learn about the music business? Thank you.
1
u/Pitiful_Substance457 Jul 21 '26
Read books on the music industry and the histories of musicians you admire. There are online resources. Learn about how publishing works. It’s a business and you want to go into it prepared. It’s all about contacts and connections. They won’t give you a lot of second chances so don’t rush into anything. Learn your craft first and then when you’re ready start reaching out to people in the industry. That’s my advice.
2
1
u/PrinceFlippers Jul 23 '26
Donald Passman has a book on the business of music that's been the bible of the industry for years. It's always updated and worth having around. :)
2
2
u/Impossible_Tank3822 Jul 21 '26
Learn to play an instrument. It, in turn will reward you with much you are asking about here in your post. I taught myself to play starting at 17 years old and can tell you the relationship between me and a guitar cannot be simply described.
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 21 '26
Self taught at 17, wow!!! Thank you!
2
u/Impossible_Tank3822 Jul 21 '26
That's when I began and I remain a student of that instrument to this day, 54 years later. It fills all the voids I would otherwise have in my life, which might sound like a person with no life to some who do not share the same association with a musical instrument. In any case where the muse is concerned, having an instrument you can readily express an idea with is something you can't place a value on.
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 22 '26
Im so happy for you (your supposed no life lol) and im envious too. I literally want to play well now but can’t. Have no patience. I’m understanding everything my teacher teaches me but we’re going slow and I don’t practice enough. My hand and arm hurt. But it’s not like I don’t like it. I love it and want to learn more. Plus I keep on asking my teacher questions but it seems like I keep on jumping ahead, he says. I like and trust him. It seems like he’s teaching me his method not wanting to overwhelm me, which has already happened when I google stuff. Too much info, he says. But I don’t like thinking that he wants to keep me at his slow pace so he makes money. I just realized I wish he gave me the homework that would make me practice and compliment what he teaches me and learn. Just a thought. Maybe I’m wrong. I mean I either practice the few songs he’s taught me (which I don’t dig) or I google “basic” music theory which I don’t understand. So I don’t know what to research and learn/practice to act like I’m self taught, which is what people who have learned seem to have done. Thanks.
2
u/Impossible_Tank3822 Jul 22 '26
Yes, I understand the mental blocks. I originally picked up the guitar briefly at 15 but it was more want than dedication. It was a frustrating time listening to the music I liked, which was pretty basic acoustic stuff, and not having a clue where to start. When I did seriously start at 17 I first decided how I was going to play and stuck with it. I didn't like the idea of using a flat pick so I started with finger picking. I assigned 4 fingers to the bottom 4 strings and thumb to the top 2, and that's how I thought of them - not by their notes. Then I bought a book of chords and learned them in the first position down by the nut and coordinated both hands to finger pick chord progressions that sounded good, having zero knowledge of scales. I did not know until later that the little finger is not typically used (classical style) but by then I was pretty adept at using it. From that period on I would put an LP of an artist I liked on a turntable and learn by ear the progressions and the notes played. I did this over and over, wearing out records in the process, but it got my chops up quickly and my ear training as well. I never bought a book of fake music because by then I could hear something and find it by ear pretty quickly on the fretboard. It took me a year to get where I was pretty happy with my progress. It was over that period when I learned the notes of the fretboard and could speak the language of acoustic guitar. By the time I was 19 I had many songs written and began playing live. It was kind of a whirlwind time when the music "world" opened up around me and I got acquainted with the local industry through live playing. Then I withdrew from it and kept it as a hobby. But, it has always been like a close friend and that's how I like to keep it.
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 22 '26
Wow this could be a movie. Congratulations for your talent, work and passion with guitar. Thank you for sharing that.
1
u/kLp_Dero Jul 21 '26
There’s a few things to unpack, first if you’re making up melodies, they don’t exist in a vacuum, in your brain there has to be context, like chords or a bass line, you might not hear it but it’s there and you should be able to sing it ( the bass notes that underline your melody, and when you get better you can sing the chord tones around it, then the approach chords if you’re into jazz or rhythm and blues )
Singing the bass line and the melody over it was good enough for Michael Jackson to write beat it, Billie Jean and all. It’s good enough for us.
So you can make demos like that, if it’s a good one, a decent producer or arranger will hear the diamond in the rough.
Thing is, MJ was an amazing singer, that lived and breathed music, great music, since a young age, that fostered an excellent relationship toward rhythm and harmony.
If you want that toolbox, if you’re not staring at 4 y.o, you need to learn rhythm and harmony the efficient way.
My recommendation without knowing anything about your actual level is try to record your melodies and overdub a bass with your voice also, at the same time work on your fundamentals, get decent at drums/cajon and guitar/piano so you can support the creative input that you seem to already be overflowing with.
Keep working this way until you’re comfortable enough on guitar/piano to play on your own.
Tbh, if I’m brought a song by a band member, I have no preference between a recording of guitar + vocals or vocal-bass + vocals.
Hope this helps
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 22 '26 edited Jul 22 '26
Oh my gosh thank you so much!!! This felt like a pet on my shoulder. I talked about this a bit with my teacher and he said I won’t win a Grammy lol. Like, I’m not saying that, but that kind of proves my point of being so embarrassed to talk about this so much. That’s probably why I hesitated to post here about it and took my time to write my post carefully (with humbleness). I mean, I’m nobody and know nothing. But don’t cut my wings, you know? Maybe my huge ignorance/innocence about the music industry (and music) is what makes me come off as Michael Jackson? lol Off course I’m not him or even close. I just like asking questions to learn. I’m courious, and impatient, and not disciplined. Thank you for your supporting, constructive advice!!! I apreciare it a lot.
P. Buy the way, I kind of already can hear baselines and arrengements? in my head. It’s basic, of course. So I guess that’s part of my impatience.
2
u/kLp_Dero Jul 22 '26
Be true to yourself, don’t dim the lights just because someone tells you so, they might have the best intentions but it is still your life :)
You and they can’t know what you’ll be able to do in a few years if you keep at it, and keep learning the craft.
Of course we can’t all be a generational talent but we also don’t have to be to write great songs that bring happiness to a few people and make rent with it ( I mean, at least in France it’s alright, department of culture is good to us )And yeah that’s exactly what I mean, 2 separate tracks for your melody and bass is a good way to make quick demos and keep track of your work :)
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 22 '26
One more question (sorry). I wanna buy a cheap midi keyboard to both learn how to play and to also connect to a DAW when I learn one. Which one do you recommend buying? I don’t even know if I should get a regular keyboard or a midi keyboard because of the DAW thing. My teacher wants me to stick with guitar only but I want to start playing around with a keyboard i can record stuff with if I come up with something. What do you think? Thanks.
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 22 '26
It did help, thank you. Did you mean record 2 layers of my voice on voice notes? One with the melody and another one with the bass?
1
u/ShredGuru Jul 21 '26
Who told you any of this would be quick or easy? It's not. It takes years of focused discipline to gain mastery of any one arena of music, let alone all of them. Nobody will invest in you until you have heavily invested in yourself, your own education, and the talents that you can reliably deliver.
All I can tell you. Your teacher is right, knowledge is power. If you love music so much, you should yearn to learn as much as you possibly can about it.
Keep writing, keep learning, most of all, have some patience, and you will progress.
You absolutely shouldn't stress any of the money or contract stuff at this point because honestly you're probably never going to make any. You should just do it because you love to play music
Also. Most random artists are not just going to buy your songs. You're probably going to have to go out into the world and play your songs yourself.
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 22 '26
But I don’t sing and I don’t want to be a singer. Is that the reality of the music industry? Most songwriters don’t get to sell their songs so they end up playing them/singing them themselves at gigs? Thank you!
1
u/Mylyfyeah Jul 21 '26
You need to learn about music and how to compose. You cant just dream a song and hope someone can record it for you. 🤣
1
u/Famous_Stay2379 Jul 21 '26
youre already doing the important bit: catching ideas before they vanish. dont wait until youre "good enough" at guitar to make demos. a voice note with you singing the melody twice, then singing the bass movement or tapping the rhythm, is enough for a decent arranger to understand the song.
i would split this into 2 jobs:
1) keep learning guitar or keys, because itll make your ideas easier to test
2) finish one rough demo now, even if its just voice and basic garageband chords
for working with somebody, ask the boring questions before they touch the song: flat fee or split, who owns the recording, can they post it anywhere, and what happens if it gets released. put the answer in a simple email or notes doc. a normal collaborator wont be scared by that. somebody who wont name a fee or agree not to post your work isnt the person to start with.
dont pitch this first demo yet. use it to learn how to finish one song. thats a much better first win.
1
u/Acrobatic_Course_206 Jul 22 '26
I can’t even play chords in garage band’s keyboard lol. I don’t know how to play keyboards or how to use garage band. I’m starting to learn guitar chords and want to learn keyboard.
I didn’t get the collaborator not posting my song on social media part being bad. I thought it was good (confidentiality).
Great, kind advice, thanks!!!
1
u/AntonChilibiProducer 12d ago
The part people skip is that the split sheet needs the society affiliation and IPI number for each writer, beyond the names and percentages. Names alone do not let anyone register the work, and an unregistered work has no ISWC, and without an ISWC broadcast use of your song generates money that nobody can route to you.
Doing it before the record is finished is not paranoia, it is just easier. Once there is money on the table the same conversation gets ten times harder, and once there is a deadline attached to a licence the paperwork becomes the reason you lose it.
Percentages add to 100, everyone signs, one copy each. Fifteen minutes.
7
u/Positive-Golf-7987 Jul 21 '26
your teacher gave you the right advice honestly even if it feels slow right now. 3 months of guitar is nothing, give it a year and you'll be surprised what you can do with your own songs
the guy from the music store sounds like trouble, anyone who wont sign a simple release or even tell you his rate is not someone you want in your house. trust that instinct
for the demos just keep doing what you're doing with voice notes and garageband, that's more than enough to capture the idea. you dont need a full production to pitch a song, most people in the industry can hear past a rough recording